Why the rush to get the budget done?

Uuuh Patsy

Can someone explain to me why there is such a rush to get this budget through. Seems extremely dodgy to me? Are our leaders on a bonus? Can it not wait a week or two? Don't they want us to examine the details?

Permabear

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Uuuh Patsy

Uuuh Patsy wrote: »

Can someone explain to me why there is such a rush to get this budget through. Seems extremely dodgy to me? Are our leaders on a bonus? Can it not wait a week or two? Don't they want us to examine the details?

The bailout is dependent on the budget being passed by the 7th. Seems like a deadline to me. Why are the ramming it down our throats. Why are FF so intent on being the party to get this deal done. Its almost like they think it's some sort of achievement. What do they gain from seeing it through.

rumour

Everyone should start thinking about what happens if we don't do it.

FG and Labour are proving more incompetent than FF, putting parish pump politics first under the guish of the national interest. Fools if you believe otherwise.

Their actions are having today the effect of destabliilising the euro again. If we do not get a deal soon be prepared to be forgotten about when portugal and Spain run into trouble. Any deal then will be harder but FG and Lab don't care all they care about is POWER in whatever form.

This is turning into a tragedy.

Scofflaw

donegalfella wrote: »

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And the four year plan is now being published before the Donegal by-election, where it was originally scheduled for after it.

cordially,
Scofflaw

Henno30

Uuuh Patsy wrote: »

Can someone explain to me why there is such a rush to get this budget through. Seems extremely dodgy to me? Are our leaders on a bonus? Can it not wait a week or two? Don't they want us to examine the details?

The purpose, primarily, is to remove democracy from the decision making process. The constraints to a pre-budget election are in the main artificial constructs that could be changed if the political will existed. It clearly doesn't though.

The ECB/IMF don't want the Irish people interfering with their plans for the Irish people's own country, and the Labour/Fine Gael leadership don't want to take responsibility for the awful deal we are about to get. And there you have it.

Cannibal Ox

Uuuh Patsy wrote: »

Why are the ramming it down our throats. Why are FF so intent on being the party to get this deal done. Its almost like they think it's some sort of achievement. What do they gain from seeing it through.

Because...

Guardian wrote:

Irish bank shares fell again today 24 hours after the government announced restructuring was on the way and the governor of the central bank confirming the Irish banks are "for sale".

Shares in 36%-state owned Bank of Ireland fell 23% to 30c giving it a market capitalisation of around €1.77bn (£1.5bn), half what it was a month ago. Allied Irish Banks, whose government ownership will rise to around 95% after a planned rights issue, traded down 13% to 35c.

...delay the budget, leaves the IMF/ECB money in the air and the banks remain vulnerable to the market. Where vulnerable could rapidly be replaced by a much, much worse phrase soon. I don't like FF, hell I don't like FG or Labour either, but delaying the budget, and the IMF/ECB money, could have some seriously nasty consequences.

Jaysoose

I find it a tad disturbing that this budget is being prepared by people that have proven time and again that they are incompetent in all areas when it comes to fiscal policies.

Even more disturbing is the fact that they will not be around to face the music so have free reign without the consequence of facing the people after the upcoming election as they will not be in power.

Why this process is allowed to go ahead is very scary..they dont have a clue yet they are on the verge of signing away the irish people before heaidng off into the sunset.

Bob_Latchford

Jaysoose wrote: »

Why this process is allowed to go ahead is very scary..they dont have a clue yet they are on the verge of signing away the irish people before heaidng off into the sunset.

It really is awful when you think about it.

Its a lame duck government, no need for a budget, no need to pick the wallpaper in your office or no need to choose what car your want driven around in, just go

Jaysoose

Bob_Latchford wrote: »

It really is awful when you think about it.

Its a lame duck government, no need for a budget, no need to pick the wallpaper in your office or no need to choose what car your want driven around in, just go

Its just doesnt make any sense when you think about it. No way to stop it and the people involved are so far removed from reality they truly believe they are capable of dealing with the situation.

If this is democracy then Kim Jong Il must be one of Biffo's "advisors"

sarumite

Jaysoose wrote: »

I find it a tad disturbing that this budget is being prepared by people that have proven time and again that they are incompetent in all areas when it comes to fiscal policies.

Even more disturbing is the fact that they will not be around to face the music so have free reign without the consequence of facing the people after the upcoming election as they will not be in power.

Why this process is allowed to go ahead is very scary..they dont have a clue yet they are on the verge of signing away the irish people before heaidng off into the sunset.

I actually like this fact....they can now at least do what is right and not what is popular.

gazzer

I dont understand why each party dont do up their own 4 year plan and use this as their election campaign. There is nothing set in stone that the budget has to be on December 7th. Why not announce the election now for Dec and then as soon as that party get in put their budget plans through.

OMD

Jaysoose wrote: »

Even more disturbing is the fact that they will not be around to face the music so have free reign without the consequence of facing the people after the upcoming election as they will not be in power. .

Should be funny though if they do something sneaky to FG/Lab. Probably announce massive reductions in salaries and perks to Taoiseach and ministers, reduce ministers cars, government jet etc knowing it wont affect FF.

Jaysoose

sarumite wrote: »

I actually like this fact....they can now at least do what is right and not what is popular.

The reality is that they will make a bigger balls of it than usual safe in the knowledge that it wont be their problem.

I think its highly ambitious that they provide us with a credible budget at this stage as they are not suddenly going to become financial whizses overnight.

yom 1

OMD wrote: »

Should be funny though if they do something sneaky to FG/Lab. Probably announce massive reductions in salaries and perks to Taoiseach and ministers, reduce ministers cars, government jet etc knowing it wont affect FF.

It wouldn't be funny, it would be about time they did...........

dilallio

Uuuh Patsy wrote: »

The bailout is dependent on the budget being passed by the 7th. Seems like a deadline to me. Why are the ramming it down our throats. Why are FF so intent on being the party to get this deal done. Its almost like they think it's some sort of achievement. What do they gain from seeing it through.

Because they want to be able to tell the electorate in the general election AFTER the next one, that it was them who took the tough decisions and negotiated a 'good' deal for Ireland back in 2010.

They are hoping (probably correctly), that the Irish public will be equally pissed-off with the new ine Gael / Labour government, and will again vote for a 'rejuvinated' Fianna-Fail.

And the sad part is - they have a good chance.

flutered

the dffs biggest conundrum is how can the be fromt stage at the gpo come easter 1916, nothing else matters to them, well possibly their banker and developer buddys, please remember it is dff 1st, 2nd & 3rd.y

Cavehill Red

rumour wrote: »

Everyone should start thinking about what happens if we don't do it.

Damn right they should. This bailout is a national disaster. Anglo is not our debt and we should not be forced into paying it.

rumour wrote: »

FG and Labour are proving more incompetent than FF, putting parish pump politics first under the guish of the national interest. Fools if you believe otherwise.

Ah, get away out of that. We've had our fill of Fianna Fail blather and self-justification. Look where it's brought us.

rumour wrote: »

Their actions are having today the effect of destabliilising the euro again. If we do not get a deal soon be prepared to be forgotten about when portugal and Spain run into trouble. Any deal then will be harder but FG and Lab don't care all they care about is POWER in whatever form.

We don't NEED a deal and we don't WANT a deal. It's not Ireland being bailed out, it's the corrupt bankrupt gangrenous banks that Fianna Fail fostered over their years in power.

rumour wrote: »

This is turning into a tragedy.

And the biggest tragedy of all is that even now, so many people cannot see what is actually happening. We're being rushed into a bailout we don't need to ensure that zombie banks pay off their debts to billionaires.

mohawk

Cavehill Red wrote: »

Damn right they should. This bailout is a national disaster. Anglo is not our debt and we should not be forced into paying it.
Ah, get away out of that. We've had our fill of Fianna Fail blather and self-justification. Look where it's brought us.
We don't NEED a deal and we don't WANT a deal. It's not Ireland being bailed out, it's the corrupt bankrupt gangrenous banks that Fianna Fail fostered over their years in power.

And the biggest tragedy of all is that even now, so many people cannot see what is actually happening. We're being rushed into a bailout we don't need to ensure that zombie banks pay off their debts to billionaires.

Agree with alot of what you say. We rushed into a bailout and now we are being told we have to have the budget on the 7th.
Lets face it we are being forced to accept a bailout so the IMF/EU can't just withdraw the offer of money as they want us to take it.

Not mad on either FG/Lab but at least a general election will give us some political certainty for the near future.

flutered

we are being told we need to apply for a bail out similar to the one we gave to the banks, which is why we need this one, both of which we have no idea of the amounts required, well we do but not officially, we are being led around like a kid to santy, the future is a big place with lots of fancy lights, a few dreams, a magical land with no reality, this is definetly a trick of the loop job, can this not be properly debated in public, it is said a referendum is out of the question, as too many looneys would be putting forward their agenda, is it possible the looneys are telling us we need a bail out, but it needs discussion, our kids, their kids, our great grand kids are going to be affected.

lmaopml

With the Euro destabilising, and Portugal and Spain in trouble, the markets all over the place etc. and the single currency in very real jeopardy, what is the answer to 'no' bailout at the moment?

...and if there was no bailout, or the time to take it passes us by - can we have some guarantees that we'll be ok from Labour, FG and SF?

What are the opposition proposing at the moment to the electorate other than a GE? Didn't they all sit down today and discuss it together, except the Socialist guy who got the hump?

Seriously, as a person who's head is spinning with the best of em, almost excorcist style at this stage - What is the alternative plan? ...

...when markets don't wait around? Do we hold off or something and let Portugal get the bail - let them stabilise the currency and then hope we can go to the markets next year ourselves and all is rosey? or is a bailout on the cards anyway? The country's deposits seem to be down the proverbial sh*tter - and the speculation at the moment is making sure it's well and truely flushed! :eek:

It's terrifying. Should we leave the single currency - default? What happens then....

So many questions, so many economists, so little time, so little money

sollar

If the government want any money to be spent in the economy over the next 4 years they need to spell out the exact cuts to people and stick to them. Otherwise people are just going to hoard and save what they have.

All we've had for the last 2 years is threats of how tough the budgets are going to be and no details provided. So people live in fear and spend nothing - Are these people stupid!!

Tell us everything and fast!