world champs standards

downwithfacses

the standards for korea are out

http://www.iaaf.org/mm/document/competitions/competition/05/87/48/20101119060839_httppostedfile_daegustandards_22853.pdf


who's going to make the team? remember kiddies...the changes in qualification means that all our athletes have to run the times during the 2011 calendar year so no times from last year count

thoughts?

BeepBeep67

Is there a typo in their rules so or is that just a rule for IE athletes?

Performances must be achieved during the qualification period from 1 October 2010 (1 January 2010 for the 10,000m, Marathon, Combined Events, Race Walks and Relays)

thirtyfoot

A quick scan would say

Smyth maybe for 100
Hession for 200 and maybe Colvert but he'd need the A
Gillick for 400
Campbell and Chamney for 800/1500
Cragg for 5000/10000
Ledwith maybe for 10000
Fagan maybe Marathon
The 3 male walkers
men 4 x 400 maybe
Ailis for 100 (maybe Brady)
Whelan for 200
Cuddihy for 400
Mageean maybe a B std for 8 or 15
Cullen for 5000
Derval
Ryan for HJ
Pena for vault
Proper for long
Olive for walk
Both women relays

Probably missed someone.

ecoli

Anyone know when the AAI release their standards will be interesting to see whether they increase the standards by much in order to be able to be eligible for selection.

YFlyer

The javelin indoor is allowed for qualification

Pherekydes

thirtyfoot wrote: »

Probably missed someone.

Eileen O'Keeffe in the Hammer. Perhaps.

ecoli wrote: »

Anyone know when the AAI release their standards will be interesting to see whether they increase the standards by much in order to be able to be eligible for selection.

AAI's standards will probably be equal to World top five ranking, and have to be achieved at the Nationals. Anyone lucky or good enough to go will be accompanied by 15 or 20 officials.

YFlyer wrote: »

The javelin indoor is allowed for qualification

Finland has a stadium where they hold Javelin competitions in the winter. Ireland's only indoor stadium is a cow shed in Nenagh. We've now taken the step of holding our national indoors in the UK. All that lovely lolly gone to waste.

ecoli

Pherekydes wrote: »

Finland has a stadium where they hold Javelin competitions in the winter. Ireland's only indoor stadium is a cow shed in Nenagh. We've now taken the step of holding our national indoors in the UK. All that lovely lolly gone to waste.

Hopefully the Athlone Facility will remedy that when (if) it is built though not holding my breath the way budgets are going these days:mad:

YFlyer

I'll be holding my breath as well. When you see that the Masters had to pay their own way at the home countries championships in Santry:mad:

ecoli

YFlyer wrote: »

I'll be holding my breath as well. When you see that the Masters had to pay their own way at the home countries championships in Santry:mad:

AFAIK that was the same regarding the XC last year in Dublin(except for the US based athletes????). That makes sense when its a domestic competition though given the finances of the AAI over the last few years and legal expenditures they need to tighten the belts where possible. Facilities are an area which i dont think we can afford to tighten our belts anymore however

YFlyer

ecoli wrote: »

AFAIK that was the same regarding the XC last year in Dublin(except for the US based athletes????). That makes sense when its a domestic competition though given the finances of the AAI over the last few years and legal expenditures they need to tighten the belts where possible. Facilities are an area which i dont think we can afford to tighten our belts anymore however

Will that be the same when they travel across the sea for next years Masters Championship?

Clum

YFlyer wrote: »

Will that be the same when they travel across the sea for next years Masters Championship?

Do you mean the Home Countries Masters? My mother has competed in the home countries cross country many a time now and I'm pretty sure she's always had to pay her own way.

YFlyer

Clum wrote: »

Do you mean the Home Countries Masters? My mother has competed in the home countries cross country many a time now and I'm pretty sure she's always had to pay her own way.

Yeah thats the one. So she gets no financial aid at all? Bit harsh.

Cool Running

Looking forward to this

I'm moving to Korea for a year in the next two weeks to teach English.

Have 20 days holidays so I'm gonna try and head to Daegu for this

Would be great to be there and also to meet all the Irish at it

Hopefully come next August i'll be giving updates from the track here:)

downwithfacses

thirtyfoot wrote: »

A quick scan would say

Smyth maybe for 100...does he have the A standard?
Hession for 200 and maybe Colvert but he'd need the A agree with hession...not so sure about colvert but hes untapped potential for sure
Gillick for 400 definite
Campbell and Chamney for 800/1500 not sure campbell can get back after his injury troubles to run what would be over 4 sec pb in the 1500 to make it...800 would be his better shot..same for chamney, 800m not 1500m
Cragg for 5000/10000 word from mammoth lakes is that cragg has moved to the marathon and will run his first one after xmas...no more track for him is confirmed although hes injured and not running right now
Ledwith maybe for 10000 inside info suggest ledwith has quit running all together and the irish indo story was inaccurate..even if he does come back he'll be running the roads, not track
Fagan maybe Marathon needs to fix hos body but by all accounts should make it
The 3 male walkers for sure
men 4 x 400 maybe
Ailis for 100 (maybe Brady) she should go and do well if she can push on just a fraction from last season
Whelan for 200 does she have the a standard?
Cuddihy for 400 on the comeback trail and her second year back should see massive improvements from last season
Mageean maybe a B std for 8 or 15 1500 she is a fraction off the b standard time
Cullen for 5000 get healthy and get lucky please...will certainly make it if she stays in one piece
Derval obviously
Ryan for HJ needs to be consistent and also break her national record to get a standard
Pena for vault a long way to go to the a standard but is training full time in cali for it
Proper for long also needs a PB to get a but is talented enough to do it
Olive for walk obvious
Both women relays good squads there, certainly 4x100

oters include, chesser, deirdra byrne, eileen

thoughts?

Milesandmiles

thirtyfoot wrote: »

A quick scan would say

Smyth maybe for 100
Hession for 200 and maybe Colvert but he'd need the A
Gillick for 400

Probably missed someone.

Situation re A and B standards changed before Osaka. Previously, if one athlete from a country had an A, 2nd and 3rd athletes had to have an A. Now countries can send one person on a B even if another qualifier has the A.....still subject to a max of 3 per country per event.

RealistSpy

ecoli wrote: »

Anyone know when the AAI release their standards will be interesting to see whether they increase the standards by much in order to be able to be eligible for selection.

Is that not always the same every year no?

Pisco Sour

Is it just me or are those standards higher than in recent years?

Also will the AAI send people on B-Standards?

woodchopper

Why would Martin Fagan want to run a marathon in Korea in late August. The heat and humility would suggest any athlete with aspirations of competing in a fall marathon would decline such an offer. I expect Martin if he stays injury free in the next three weeks to run 2:10 in Texas on Sunday January 30th.

robinph

Is the women's Marathon standard not a bit soft? Much bigger difference between the men's and women's A standards for the Marathon than there is for the 10k.

Ok, so Ms. Radcliffe messes up the numbers a bit, but is there not a lot more women capable of the 2:43 than there is men doing 2:17's?

ocnoc

woodchopper wrote: »

Why would Martin Fagan want to run a marathon in Korea in late August. The heat and humility would suggest any athlete with aspirations of competing in a fall marathon would decline such an offer. I expect Martin if he stays injury free in the next three weeks to run 2:10 in Texas on Sunday January 30th.

Em.... Its a World Champs!! Its not the time that matters at a championships, its position.

clubcard

he is a full time athlete with very little funding from AAI.he relys on apperance money and prize money from big city marathons.
Conditions wouldnt suit as previous poster pointed out and what would he have to gain.some people i know are going to jump on me here for eg not representing country and chasing money but fact is he needs it!!!

ecoli

clubcard wrote: »

he is a full time athlete with very little funding from AAI.he relys on apperance money and prize money from big city marathons.
Conditions wouldnt suit as previous poster pointed out and what would he have to gain.some people i know are going to jump on me here for eg not representing country and chasing money but fact is he needs it!!!

Fagan is also a professional athlete who is paid by Reebok. However i do agree with your point as the fact of the matter is that athletes don't exactly have financial security past their retirement.
The way things are at the moment the marathon has become the blue ribbon event in terms of money and at present is one of the only viable options for athletes to make a decent earning.
Remember reading a article i think it was from this years Dublin Marathon winner or in relation to him. He was talking about the comparison between marathon running and track running basically saying that a 13 min 5 k runner could earn around $300- $500 for winning a race (non high profile European Circuit) compared to the 20,000 for winning Dublin.
If we are expecting the lads to compete in global championships the must have the support to be able to fully focus on training for these races without have to worry about their long term financial security

woodchopper

ocnoc wrote: »

Em.... Its a World Champs!! Its not the time that matters at a championships, its position.

Em.... What good is done exactly running a marathon in 90 per cent humility and 40 degrees heat, when London is only a year away at that point. He can run the 10k provided he gets the standard. Oh by the way will you see Ryan Hall, Ritz, Meb, Sammy, Geb or Lel running the marathon in Korea.

Rineanna

This year is particularly exciting for a number of Irish athletes who made big leaps in 2010.

Ailis McSweeney ran wind-aided B standard last year at the European Champs: I've every confidence that she can run 11.3x legally, but will the B standard suffice for the AAI, and can she take a crack at the A standard?

Niamh Whelan was one my athletes of the season last year. Massive improvement, and got the B standard in Barcelona (but will likely have to match/beat that again this year). This year will be interesting to see if she can push on from there, but I would hope for a 23.2x at some stage. The Worlds may be out of reach, but she has a big target in the form of the Euro U23s, where she was ranked in the top 5 in the category last year.

My sincerest hope is that some of Ireland's perpetually injured elite stars can bounce back to FULL fitness. Joanne Cuddihy, I've always thought, has probably been one of Ireland's biggest athletics stars in the making. She showed promise last season by running 51.x in the early season, but didn't really push on afterwards. The Far East seems to sit well with her, having PR'd there in Osaka in '07. A repeat performance would be nice.

Eileen O' Keefe is another obvious athlete due for a big comeback. Has anyone heard anything from her camp lately?

Two athletes who really need to push on are Michelle Carey and Deirdre Ryan. Carey's been stuck running late 56.x/57.x for a couple of years now. Could 2011 with increased competition from Kinney and Furlong on the domestic scene push her sub 56? Ryan has also become lodged at 1.88m territory, with the odd 1.90/1.92. A 1.95m is in order this season

Brona Furlong will really need a breakthrough to even get near the B standard, but she's always improving in the event.

Could Mary Cullen, for God's sake, finally get a chance to demonstrate her true potential int he 5000m? The A standard should be a sinch if she can stay injury free.

I'm hoping this year is Robert Heffernan's medal winning year. Two fourth places in Barcelona was just cruel.

...and let's not forget the women's 4x100m team and the women's 4x400m team, who both ran under the prescribed standard last year.

The 4x1 team didn't even, in my opinion, have the strongest team out when they set the NR. We've got a nicely forming pool of athletes to choose from, with DO'R, Foster, McSweeney, Brady, Whelan, and Proper. I hope they're still doing relay camps, and if they can get a couple of good runs together at the Euro team champs and maybe in that Geneva meeting, a new NR and qualification for the Worlds are entirely possible.

The 4x4 team ran well inside the standard of 3.32.00 at the Euros. Cuddihy, Carey, Furlong, Andrews, and Kinney will hopefully combine in the optimum order at the team championships to qualify. Plus, the pool could be strengthened further if Whelan/Proper could be tempted (let's not start a Hession-will-never-run-a-4x4 debate!).

Can Project 400 be resurrected for the men's team? Gillick-Kennedy-Gregan-Murphy?

woodchopper

It would be good to see allistair cragg compete again for Ireland on the track. He's been a terrific servant for Irish athletics reaching two Olympic finals, two European finals whilst also winning the European indoors in 2005, without doubt Irelands most successful distance runner over the last decade.

Pisco Sour

Rineanna wrote: »

...and let's not forget the women's 4x100m team and the women's 4x400m team, who both ran under the prescribed standard last year.

The 4x1 team didn't even, in my opinion, have the strongest team out when they set the NR. We've got a nicely forming pool of athletes to choose from, with DO'R, Foster, McSweeney, Brady, Whelan, and Proper. I hope they're still doing relay camps, and if they can get a couple of good runs together at the Euro team champs and maybe in that Geneva meeting, a new NR and qualification for the Worlds are entirely possible.

The 4x4 team ran well inside the standard of 3.32.00 at the Euros. Cuddihy, Carey, Furlong, Andrews, and Kinney will hopefully combine in the optimum order at the team championships to qualify. Plus, the pool could be strengthened further if Whelan/Proper could be tempted (let's not start a Hession-will-never-run-a-4x4 debate!).

I thought the times during the Euro's qualified the relay teams already? I remember it being mentioned a lot that they had qualified for the Worlds.

You forgot to mention Derval, Gilly and Olive in your analysis. How do you see the 3 of them doing this season. Will Olive be able to replicate the form of 2009, can Derval run sub 12.6 and win a medal in Daegu (sub 12.6 will probably be whats needed though occasionally medals have been won with times slower than her current NR). Will Gillick push on this year or will he stagnate? Will Derval and Gillick go for the Euro Indoors? Both would be decent bets for gold you would imagine.

Exciting times ahead.

thirtyfoot

ecoli wrote: »

If we are expecting the lads to compete in global championships the must have the support to be able to fully focus on training for these races without have to worry about their long term financial security

All our big guns compete at majors and none of them are bringing in big bucks in circuits races. O' Rourke, Gillick, Hession, Loughnane and Heffernan are all full-time athletes, they all live off relatively modest incomes, they don't get big bucks at the meets yet they compete and peak (most of the time) at majors. If an athlete is in the sport to secure their long term financial security, they are in the wrong sport. Money is not the reason they do the sport. Hession could be a doctor yet he chooses athletics. Its medals and finals at majors.

Bottom line, all full-time athletes worry about their long term financial security but achieving glory at a majors is worth it to take on that uncertainty or risk. To miss a championship because you are chasing the $$$$$$ is bo$$ix. Medals and majors baby!!!! Its what defines our sport and what defines the great athletes, Irish and global.

bazman

thirtyfoot wrote: »

All our big guns compete at majors and none of them are bringing in big bucks in circuits races. O' Rourke, Gillick, Hession, Loughnane and Heffernan are all full-time athletes, they all live off relatively modest incomes, they don't get big bucks at the meets yet they compete and peak (most of the time) at majors. If an athlete is in the sport to secure their long term financial security, they are in the wrong sport. Money is not the reason they do the sport. Hession could be a doctor yet he chooses athletics. Its medals and finals at majors.

Bottom line, all full-time athletes worry about their long term financial security but achieving glory at a majors is worth it to take on that uncertainty or risk. To miss a championship because you are chasing the $$$$$$ is bo$$ix. Medals and majors baby!!!! Its what defines our sport and what defines the great athletes, Irish and global.

The marathon is a different game than track athletics and cannot be compared. You can only run one big race, max two really in a year. Unless you get a championship medal, you'll always be judged on times. Fagan has a chance of setting an Irish record at the marathon distance this year and doing well in the London Olympics next year. I would assume those objectives both take precedence over the worlds for someone like Fagan. Also, everyone needs money to survive so of course it comes into the equation. I doubt anyone knows the financial position and support network for our top athletes, so I don't think it's appropriate to comment or compare the commitment levels - fact is they're all in the game and you have to give 100% if you're at that level.

runjb

I completely agree with thirtyfoot and the above post. I would be very surprised to hear that an Irish athlete would put money before medals and major championships. While yes they have to live, and successful athletes certainly can make quite an amount of money from it, for the general international competitive athlete, it's not the money that drives them....the history books will tell us that those who are remembered the most are those who achieved at major championships, not those who ran some high profile marathons and take in 000's of euros.

Regarding Derval, I think she will def compete in the European Indoors. A medal is always a possibility and once she is running in or around 8/8.10 before the championships I would be very optimistic about her chances, because we all know what a big time competitor she is.

With Gillick, it is more complicated, we have to remember 10 months back when he was dis-qualified in the world indoors. The IAAF also stated at that time that they felt Gillick was not suited to indoor competition, citing his style or something. So now Gillick has 2 options, focus solely on the outdoors and avoid any complications that may arise on the indoor season or else aim for another European indoor gold medal. It'll be interesting to see what he does.

Hession will be focusing on the indoors initially. All three of these athletes obviously have the world champs as their main aim. All three will be looking to reach their respective finals. Hession will probably need to achieve a new PB to reach one, whereas Gillick and O'Rourke would both get through on their current PBs. For a medal Gillick needs maybe a 44.50, but more importantly he just needs things to go right in a final. Derval could undoubtedly snatch a medal at the champs. She is likely to come close to breaking 12.60 this year so once she does that a medal is possible.

ecoli

AAI have released their competition booklet

Interestingly on the mens side the only standard which is different is the marathon standard with the AAI's qualifying time a min quicker than the IAAF. Personally i would have thought there would be more than that.
The women's similarly only has one change as there is a five min difference in the qualifying times.

http://www.athleticsireland.ie/content/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/standards_document_for_web_2011_final.pdf

woodchopper

If the IAAF deem 2.17 is fast enough for a major championship then why are the AAI killing our marathon runners the chance to compete in a major championship. There are a few Irish athletes who could run near to 2.17 but 2.16 is asking a little bit too much of these guys. The climate conditions in Korea will mean it is a slow marathon anyway many athletes in the 2.20s which gives a 2.17 guy a crack of making the top 30. Of course one or two Kenyans will run 2.06-2.07, but wont feature in London

Christ compels you

David McCarthy could get the A standard in the 5000m. He ran 13:42.1 two years ago,his first ever 5000m and in April, in a race where he just sat behind the leaders and kicked the last 800m so definately capable of sub 13:20 in the summer.

woodchopper

Christ compels you wrote: »

David McCarthy could get the A standard in the 5000m. He ran 13:42.1 two years ago,his first ever 5000m and in April, in a race where he just sat behind the leaders and kicked the last 800m so definately capable of sub 13:20 in the summer.

Evan Jager has struggled to break this time and he is in the Oregon Elite Group, there are a lot of guys who have run 13.30s and struggled to get down to sub 13.20, it is a huge jump to make in one year maybe three years down the road.

DangerMouse27

i think b standards should be accepted in field events. Dont know where that came from..someone mentioned it above

TrackFan123

So am i right in saying now the rules have changed and one athlete can be entered on an A and one on a B?

I doubt the AAI would take a B standard all the way to Daegu but maybe in the case of a developing athlete like Steven Colvert it would be beneficial to take him there alongisde Hesh provided he gets the B standard

ecoli

TrackFan123 wrote: »

So am i right in saying now the rules have changed and one athlete can be entered on an A and one on a B?

I doubt the AAI would take a B standard all the way to Daegu but maybe in the case of a developing athlete like Steven Colvert it would be beneficial to take him there alongisde Hesh provided he gets the B standard

This is one possibility however I think that Colvert will be focusing on peaking for the Euro u23s. Looking back on last years rankings of the people who are eligible to run this year he is ranked 10th and with the likes of Lemaitre and Guiliyev most likely going for the seniors we could see a genuine finalist in the u23s. They may not want to send an athlete if he is trying to peak 6 weeks before hand all the way to Daegu unless of course he has a great performance at the Euros in which case they could see it as a great chance of development