the nationatist paper carlow

steyrman2

things are changing big time

CJhaughey

I wonder are these chaps the same as the IWFCSS that Brocdubh posted about recently Fairly emotive language though, Disembowelled?
Thats gralloched in my book or gutted in everyday language.
I get the feeling the reporter doesn't like hunting.

kildare.17hmr

Lovely choice of words in the article makes them sound like monsters. Not condoning what they did but it could have been worded better

J. Ramone

Excellent, at last it's being seen for what it is - a dangerous crime carried out by ruthless idiots (no lights). That general area has a fair few pissed off farmers with jeeps travelling across their land, gates being left open and stock harried. Guys who like to do things right are the ones paying the price with permission being withdrawn.

poulo6.5

steyrman2 wrote: »

things are changing big time

thats great to see something being done about it. fair play to the gards and all involved.

i hope the public can see the differance between illegal poachers and genuine hunters

landkeeper

about feckin time, what alot of lads don't realise is they can lose guns jeep and deer if caught lamping as well as the fac

kildare.17hmr

landkeeper wrote: »

about feckin time, what alot of lads don't realise is they can lose guns jeep and deer if caught lamping as well as the fac

Ya would want to be sellin some amount of meat to make up for that loss

johngalway

Poaching, armed trespass?, breaking the wildlife act, breaking the terms of their firearms certs, driving dangerously.

Sod them.

The only objection I have is that they're described as "hunters".

CJhaughey

Now this is where the NARGC should step in to differentiate Real Hunters from these guys and make the distinction clear.
I don't want to be lumped in with these guys, nor do I wish to be accused of disembowelling deer.

mule2

I blame the game dealers, no one has a job these days and to offer some one E2.20 p/kg for a dear some of witch can weigh upto 150 kgs is about E330 per dear thats 1.5 times the dole for a single person, with xmas around the corner and kids wanting more and more its easy to see the attraction of a couple of easy deer :rolleyes:
however thats not to say i support wat they do or would do it myself i,m just looking at it from the fence. afterall when foxes were worth money every one was killing anything that was red and fluffy :eek:
thats my opinion anywho

landkeeper

time to bring back a tagging system for shot deer, that'll at least see who is bringing what into gamedealers at least they'd have to have a deer license to sell to a dealer

hawke eye

its the gards fault cause they give the licence to them..

the should do a full check befor it and if there caught take everything belong to them instead of a warning and lock them up its the same as killing a human deer still have a life like us..

kildare.17hmr

hawke eye wrote: »

its the gards fault cause they give the licence to them..

the should do a full check befor it and if there caught take everything belong to them instead of a warning and lock them up its the same as killing a human deer still have a life like us..

Wtf???? You cant get a licence to kill a human!! come on now seriously.. The guards do alot of backround checks before issuing licences some of the toughest in europe. Im guessing you havent gone through the procedure?

mule2

i thought it was against the law fo shoot any animal between the hours of sun set and sun rise , at least thats wat i was always told,

shooting a dear at night is the same as shooting a fox at night
it shooldnt be done but it does anyway.
its safe if done safley and you use your head as to were the shot will land if you miss, make sure you knw wat your shooting at (not a cow,or horse or dog)
afterall you are able to fet a section 42 to lamp deer and also to shoot deer out of season its free to get.

daithi55

landkeeper wrote: »

time to bring back a tagging system for shot deer, that'll at least see who is bringing what into gamedealers at least they'd have to have a deer license to sell to a dealer

ya can get a deer license without ever having a deer calibre its ridiculous
so they would still be able to get around it

meathshooter1

great to see the guards catching them.shame on the likes of these people hopefully they will never hold a rifle ever again

murtdono

yeah hope they never hold a rifle again , i have to get npws forms signed and folio nos every year , as do most of you lads , good on the gaurds , ps it's not illegal to lamp foxes , it's illegal to shoot them from the road !!

Cass

mule2 wrote:

E2.20 p/kg for a dear some of witch can weigh upto 150 kgs is about E330 per dear thats 1.5 times the dole for a single person

Its not that simple. Average weights are below.

Reds - Males up to 220kg, Females 140kg.

Fallow - Males 80-110kg, Females 40-55kg

Sika - Males 55-65kg, Females 30-40kg.

These are averages and whole weights. Meaning before they are skinned and grollached, etc. After which they become a little less. Its not as easy as going out, and shooting 3 big deer a week and living well of it.

hawke eye wrote:

its the gards fault cause they give the licence to them

Wrong. We have the stricted backround checks and firearm laws in probably the world. Also the applicant signs a declaration when applying for a firearm stating they are being truthful, and honest and will abide by all rules, conditions of their licenses. If these sort of people abuse and disregard these rules then having a firearm or not will not stop them.

mule2 wrote:

shooting a dear at night is the same as shooting a fox at night

Thats just plain wrong. Lamping of foxes is quite legal. Be sure of the law before using it as a basis for your argument.

daithi55 wrote:

ya can get a deer license without ever having a deer calibre its ridiculous

As with the FCA1 you declare that the rifle you are using will adhere to the legal minimum set out by the law and a requirment of the NPWS before a license is issued. They ask for make/model, serial number, caliber, and bullet weight. If you lie, get the license then get caught well i have no sympathy. If you are a hunter you will do what is necessary to abide by the rules/laws and protect the sport not abuse it.


I agree with johngalway that its a shame they have called these "men" hunters. I would also add that while the NARGC may make a comment it would make for a stronger sign of how all hunters feel about this if there was a joint statement released from the Irish Deer Society, NPWS and NARGC condemning these "mens" actions and re-affirming their commitment to stamp out this action completely.

hawke eye

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

Wtf???? You cant get a licence to kill a human!! come on now seriously.. The guards do alot of backround checks before issuing licences some of the toughest in europe. Im guessing you havent gone through the procedure?

kildare.17hmr

i dont think you under stud me and yes i do have a gun as a matter of fact and i went true the procedures just like you if you have one?..

you dont get a licence to kill people but you do for deer during sunrise and sunset so if you kill a deer at night you should be treated the same as if you killed a person get a life sentence..

you are still taking the life of a living animal and its not right its there time to come out dont you think they should be aloud to come out in peace???

dCorbus

if you kill a deer at night you should be treated the same as if you killed a person get a life sentence..

A bit of perspective wouldn't go astray, friend.
That's utter tosh IMO.
You cannot compare the life of a human and the life of a deer. If you truly believe what you have written, then I despair for your sense of reality and perspective and, quite frankly, would be concerned to hear you say you have a firearm.

as if you killed a person get a life sentence

Plus, for your information, no one around this island automatically gets a life sentence for killing a person - Would that they did TBH. But, I digress.....

its not right its there time to come out dont you think they should be aloud to come out in peace???

Eh?
Are these deer all gay or something that they have to be allowed to come out in peace? WTF are you talking about?

i went true the procedures just like you

Hmmmm......I wonder:D:rolleyes:

hawke eye

where do ya live i show you the gun and if you would read some of my treads you mite see:eek::eek::D??

em why dont the have the same life as a human the have a heart the walk we aint any better than them..

i just don see why a person gets a deer permit waits till the shooting and then shoots them at night why don they just shoot them all year round its the same thing like and i dont care if you disagree who are you to say anyway ha

dCorbus

where do you live ill show you my gun and licence you f**king f**L

where do ya live i show you the gun

Threats?

i just don see why a person gets a deer permit waits till the shooting and then shoots them at night why don they just shoot them all year round its the same thing like and i dont care if you disagree who are you to say anyway ha

What are you talking about?

hawke eye

i am saying its the same as shooting a deer out of season as it is to shoot at night..

can you not understand or what just read what i said :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Sparks

hawke eye permanently banned for threatening people.

Sika98k

hawke eye wrote: »

kildare.17hmr

i dont think you under stud me and yes i do have a gun as a matter of fact and i went true the procedures just like you if you have one?..

I honestly cant blame him:rolleyes:

BryanL

ezridax wrote: »

its a shame they have called these "men" hunters.

I would also add that while the NARGC may make a comment it would make for a stronger sign of how all hunters feel about this if there was a joint statement released from the Irish Deer Society, NPWS and NARGC condemning these "mens" actions and re-affirming their commitment to stamp out this action completely.

I think a lot of the public would see these guys as hunters.

It's a very fine line making statements condemning the immorality of lamping deer.
But promoting the lamaping of foxes?

Promoting the shooting of deer during the day from first to last light(but never ever after dark)
Well unless you've a section 42 , then it's perfectly fine.

How are you going to get that message out to the public?

Much better to watch your own lands and control deer numbers on any permission you have.

Bryan

Cass

BryanL wrote: »

How are you going to get that message out to the public?

As an individual person i don't think any message would carry weight, however the organisations need to get the finger out, come together and condemn these actions. If needs be take out adverts in the local rags, with a statment of condemnation and that they support the efforts of the Gardai, rangers and any other bodies in their effort to stamp out this unsavoury and illegal practice.

We all know Des Crofton is not afraid of the camera and at times i personally think the man gets involved too much in subjects that have no real bearing on him or the NARGC, but the one thing i will say is he meets the challenges. The NPWS, IDS, and other societies and associations need to get thier head out of the sand. I sometimes think they believe if they keep a low profile then the actual sport of deer stalking/hunting will go largely unnoticed, however the problem thats causes is when something like this comes up people are asking themselves ".... who are these, why haven't i heard from/of them before...."

We/they need to get out now. Make a premptive strike, so to speak, take the initiative and release statment(s) about such articles that would tarnish the name of hunters by being associated with the likes of the lads in the article.

BryanL

Ezridax ,

I hear what your saying, but the public aren't that pushed about poaching, they just see it as hunters complaining about hunters.

While those 3 episodes of lamping 13 deer in total made it into a provincal paper.

The harvesting of a trophy stag in England, on a managed shoot within the law made International headlines for days.

It's funny what the public care about? Seems to me they are more opposed to legal, managed deer culling than they are to wholesale slaughter and poaching for profit.

I'd be slow to get a mob rolling against shooting deer at night in case they lost sight of what we wanted them to oppose

rugerman

there not hunters there poachers and the people who take in these deer are worse the deer are going into the foodchain so only way to sort it is tags simple as that massive fine for them people taking the deer off these poachers:mad:

kildare.17hmr

Why is there not a tag system in place for deer? any video of deer hunting from the US they all use tags and it seem a very simple system, shoot a deer and stick a tag on his ear.

rugerman

we all as HUNTERS dont bring deer to these people because we only shoot what we need .if u brought a cow to the slaughter without the paper work garanteed u be in court the following week so same rule shud count its all going into the food chain

meathshooter1

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

Why is there not a tag system in place for deer? any video of deer hunting from the US they all use tags and it seem a very simple system, shoot a deer and stick a tag on his ear.

lads please remember this is Ireland not the US I remember a certain minister comparing us to the US not too long ago look what that cost us.Please remember that this is a small number of people poaching NOT HUNTING,poaching has gone on since Cromwell's time and the guards are more than capable of dealing with it I'm sure a look at a game dealers records would soon shine the light on some suspects pardon the pun.

dCorbus

we all as HUNTERS dont bring deer to these people because we only shoot what we need .if u brought a cow to the slaughter without the paper work garanteed u be in court the following week so same rule shud count its all going into the food chain

Obviously, there appears to be a market for animals poached illegally in this way. If they are being sold on to dealers who then sell on these illegally harvested deer to butchers, restaurants, and subsequently onto the public (i.e. me), I'd like to know who these dealers are TBH.

I'd also like to know that, when I'm ordering some venison in a restaurant or buying it in the butchers, that I'm not perpetuating and assisting in this crime and to some extent "recieving stolen goods".

Are we not entitled to know the traceability of such meat (i.e. venison)?

So, if anyone knows of dealers or restaurants or butchers selling this poached venison, I'd like to know as I'm sure would many others. Restaurants and Butchers can then be asked, by letter or in person, why they choose to sell untraceable and illegally obtained venison (usually at an extortionate price) to the public? And would they like their customers and clientele to be made aware of this fact, should they choose to continue to profit from criminal activities, such as poaching?

Just a thought. You'd probably get a more direct and instant result that way, than relying on Soundbite Des!:rolleyes::D

kildare.17hmr

meathshooter1 wrote: »

lads please remember this is Ireland not the US I remember a certain minister comparing us to the US not too long ago look what that cost us.Please remember that this is a small number of people poaching NOT HUNTING,poaching has gone on since Cromwell's time and the guards are more than capable of dealing with it I'm sure a look at a game dealers records would soon shine the light on some suspects pardon the pun.

I wasnt comparing us to the US i was just using their tagging system as an example because its the only one iv seen ya know

Cass

BryanL wrote: »

Ezridax ,

I hear what your saying, but the public aren't that pushed about poaching, they just see it as hunters complaining about hunters.

The public have 3 different views.

• They are anti hunting. In all forms regardless of the necessity, legitimacy of it. You cannot sway or change their mindset. They are influenced by some outside source, such as friends in an anti hunting group, or simply do not believe in the concept of killing another living animal/creature. Fair enough, they are entitled to their opinions. As am i though.
• They are indifferent to hunting in any form. Don't care what people do or do not do as long as it doesn't interfer with them. They may usually, but not lways, comsist of professionals, housewives, and general people with other interests and concerns that do not include hunting in any shape. They are not impartial, but can be swayed to support hunting activities by friends or family if only for piece of mind.
• They are pro hunting, and either play an active role in hunting or do not necessarily take part in hunting themselves. This kinda speaks for itself. Hunters, friends and family that support hunting or actively engage in it themselves.

Out of the three i listed above i wonder how many of each group has the best "PR". The antis are, if nothing else, well adapted/suited to creating negative media around any activity or event that involes or relates to hunting. The "middle ground people" will have no input either way. The hunting groups though shroud their sporting pursuits in a cloak of mystery and secrecy to such an extent (at times) that some members of the organisations do not even know about events, etc that are coming up. Our response to some negative publicity is to come onto boards.ie and other similar media networks and moan. Without belittling boards.ie (seriously, don't ban me - i'm sorry ) only a small number of hunters use/read it. You need not only a larger exposure to the public, but a more cohesive stand point from the groups/socities and bodies. ie - Take out ads.

The negative sentiment is already there and the refusal or lack of rebutal/condemnation to claims and events only act to reinforce people's beliefs or worse again that the negative media is correct.

While those 3 episodes of lamping 13 deer in total made it into a provincal paper.

The harvesting of a trophy stag in England, on a managed shoot within the law made International headlines for days.

Once again what rebutal or statment was issued to explain the situation. Was a local or county press release made to explain the event. Don't get me wrong i think the media attention was blown way out of proportion, but nothing was done to counteract the allegations that the Stag in question was "taken out in the prime of its life". Nothing about the 100's of young it has created over so many years of breeding and nothing about population control that is inherent within any society that is responsible for deer numbers and to maintain a healthy and broad based gene pool.

I know you will still have people arguing against it no matter what reasons are provided, but do not shy away or abstain from answering for fear it will "shine a light" on the activity of hunting deer. We do it, we do it legally, safely and above all wedo it responsibly.

It's funny what the public care about? Seems to me they are more opposed to legal, managed deer culling than they are to wholesale slaughter and poaching for profit.

This goes back to the theme of my responses above. No rebutals hence they go with the more widespread heard, seen or advertised articles which at times (more than not) is usually the negative or anti hunting theme.

I'd be slow to get a mob rolling against shooting deer at night in case they lost sight of what we wanted them to oppose

I made no mention of a mob, in fact i would oppose a "mob" or mob mentality. What we need is a "core" of predominant, well spoken, mannerly, and coherent speakers ready, willing and able to respond to any allegations against true hunters. They need to be able to put our case across and not be afraid to denounce the actions of those who would endanger our sport and by their actions destroy it.

brocdubh

CJhaughey wrote: »

I wonder are these chaps the same as the IWFCSS that Brocdubh posted about recently Fairly emotive language though, Disembowelled?
Thats gralloched in my book or gutted in everyday language.
I get the feeling the reporter doesn't like hunting.

i cant say if these are the same gougers, but the m o is the same,havn`t heard a thing about them lately,but one of them is driving a new landrover defender,not bad for a man who has been on the dole for ten years !:eek:

landkeeper

a simple tagging system would be easy to work i would think, after all we are supposed to fill an accurate report in for the npws when applying for this season as to what we shot last season are we not ??would this not give a base for the next season ???
ie if you shot 10 deer last season you would be issued with 12 tags this season with the proviso you can apply for more if needs be
i would suggest these are only attatched to deer that are SOLD ie a fallow buck heading into a game dealers would need to be tagged and a record kept by the game dealer of it who supplied it and when
any game dealer found with untagged deer would lose his liscence , no exceptions ,this at least would make sure that deer were only sold by registered deer stalkers and probably shot with a legal calibre :rolleyes: as at the moment deer are heading into game dealers shot by hornets and magnums by who know who and judging by some of the stories i have heard the national deer herd is getting slaughtered on a nightly basis

IceMaiden

Going on previous experiences with the anti fieldsports movements in the uk, im inclined to agree with much of what ezridax has said, ours & others livelihoods & free time was effected by these type of anti groups , most of the media in any format tends to be easily led by a story & these types have no problems inundating the media with facts or some not so true facts if they think it can serve there aims of bringing bad press & swinging the general publics opinion in there favour.

I have not read the article mentioned & yet I agree that these poachers should not be mixed up with genuine fieldsports people, any man/woman with a gun is not necessarily a fieldsports person & equally to take part in fieldsports not everyone needs a gun.

Genuine people who work or take some part in legitimate fieldsports should strive to make others aware that there are differences between law abiding fieldsports participants & illegal poachers.
If the antis can ever re-use any such bad press to there advantage by labelling all gun owners etc as one & the same then chances are eventually one day they surely will, its part of there mind set to taint & manipulate until the general public become more aware of the anti movement than what the true facts of living & working in the countryside & what responsible fieldsports people are actually about.

Say nothing do nothing is what the anti movement hope fieldsports attitude will be, it tends to play into there hands if the media only get reports & feedback from one section of society year after year it tends to assume that’s how things are & eventually when official fieldsports organisations do stand up its often to little to late . It has to be better to regulate from within the hunting community/organisations than have unworkable ideas imposed from outside.

rocketman3

Quote: from (dcorbus) So, if anyone knows of dealers or restaurants or butchers selling this poached venison, I'd like to know as I'm sure would many others.

try gamedealers.ie cause there is a lot of dealers selling poached venison id say a lot more than just the lads who was caught.

it makes it hard for the lad who shoot's 1 deer and just bringing the deer home and could still get questioned alot if stopped by garda

dCorbus

try gamedealers.ie cause there is a lot of dealers selling poached venison

Just tried that website address - Doesn't seem to exist.

Although, have to say, I wouldn't be happy assuming game dealers are all up to their necks in this lark. It's the ones that lads definitely know are taking in the poached venison that should be named and shamed.

(Obviously the libel laws may come into play on this, so the mods will need to decide what can and cannot be posted - but if someone is, and someone must be, providing these Cvnts with an outlet and income source, they should be named TBH).

Remove the source of the income and you remove the reasons for the poaching IMO.

Sparks

dCorbus wrote: »

(Obviously the libel laws may come into play on this, so the mods will need to decide what can and cannot be posted - but if someone is, and someone must be, providing these Cvnts with an outlet and income source, they should be named TBH).

They definitely should be named if someone has proof they're buying poached venison - to the Gardai. We can post up the results of the court case here afterwards. No point in posting them here before that point because (a) it's grounds for a defamation lawsuit and you'd have to prove truth of claims in court anyway so you might as well prove it to the Gardai, and (b) what can we do about it? You might socially ostracise them on an internet website, but it won't stop them making their mortgage payments with poached deer - you have to report them to the Gardai for that.

rocketman3

its not really the game dealers fault there just doing there job..

they can only say how many deer people drop in and who..

they dont no if the deer are poached it could be good shooting ground..

but tbh it would have to be very good ground to get alot of deer in 1 day..

zulu_dawn

we need to try and safe guard our collective hobbies and interests (if not just for us but for our children and others to come)

i believe the registered gamedealer need to be really tighten up - from a tax audit viewpoint (paying cash for sale of deer/venision - benefit in kind?) (A new black-economy....)

i am sure there is some SPH (semi-professional hunters) here in Ireland and sure they should not mind having to submit their PPSN number together with associated tagged deer to registered game dealers to sell what they have shot throughout the season.

as for the rest of us, we are just recreational occassional hunter/gatherers - trying to enjoy and avail of nature at its best for our own and our family consumption.

we need NARGC to take a open and public stance on it - are they not the Irish equivalent of the BASC?

taking a stance - suggestions -
[1] if any of these guys are members of NARGC, IDS, WDAI, Deer Alliance (HCAP) their continued membership of these esteemed organisations must be called into question?
[2] if any of these fellows have HCAP via the Deer Alliance, their certificates of competence MUST be revoked.
[3] i for one, would support the NPWS introducing a verifiable deer tagging system - in order to protect the national deer herd, recreational deer hunters in the truest sense, and the human food chain for food verification records from the field to the fork viewpoint.

---

thanks for posting this article - it sickens me, but it also enlightens me to know that the Guards are doing their bit in this one instance.

dCorbus

its not really the game dealers fault there just doing there job..

they can only say how many deer people drop in and who..

they dont no if the deer are poached it could be good shooting ground

Erm, not exactly - The Game Dealers have a few more obligations under the 1976 Wildlife Dealing Regulations to comply with, in addition to "just doing their job" as you put it:

- A licensed wildlife dealer shall keep at each premises specified in his wildlife dealer's license a register containing particulars of every receipt by purchase or otherwise and sale or other disposal involving a species of protected fauna.
- The species of protected fauna which may be sold or purchased for resale by a licensed wildlife dealer to whom this paragraph applies shall be, and shall only be, game species lawfully taken or killed pursuant to the Act.

So basically the onus is on the Game Dealer to, at the very least, ensure they have a record of each and every purchase they make and additionally make sure that the animal is "lawfully taken". (If these regulations have been revoked, I'll happily stand corrected).

So, they are as much a part of the problem as the poachers themselves IMO.

rob308

brocdubh wrote: »

i cant say if these are the same gougers, but the m o is the same,havn`t heard a thing about them lately,but one of them is driving a new landrover defender,not bad for a man who has been on the dole for ten years !:eek:

I would seriously doubt that they are the same guys to be honest

rob308

dCorbus wrote: »

So, they are as much a part of the problem as the poachers themselves IMO.

Especially when a guy is able to roll up to their doors with a trailer load of deer and steam still rising from most of them. You wouldn't have to be the sharpest tool in the box to know whats happening.

Something must be done as per previous comments to put more of an onus on the dealers. There is nothing wrong with legitimite hunters dropping a few deer over the season into a dealer. It's not about making money with the majority of lads that do this. Anyone who's into their stalking will know that you'll never recoup the expenses over the season(ammo,fuel,time & wear and tear to vehicle).

rocketman3

rob308 wrote: »

Especially when a guy is able to roll up to their doors with a trailer load of deer and steam still rising from most of them. You wouldn't have to be the sharpest tool in the box to know whats happening.

Something must be done as per previous comments to put more of an onus on the dealers. There is nothing wrong with legitimite hunters dropping a few deer over the season into a dealer. It's not about making money with the majority of lads that do this. Anyone who's into their stalking will know that you'll never recoup the expenses over the season(ammo,fuel,time & wear and tear to vehicle).

i agree with you 100%..

brocdubh

well said, i understand that there are at least two ads in the "irish shooters digest" from dealers looking for deer, one even stating "we do not condone head or neck shots"

Sparks

brocdubh wrote: »

well said, i understand that there are at least two ads in the "irish shooters digest" from dealers looking for deer, one even stating "we do not condone head or neck shots"

Yeah, but that's hardly proof of anything other than that they're game dealers looking to deal in game... which is sortof what game dealers do. And if they weren't there, you'd see a lot of meat go to waste as well, don't forget. There's only so much meat that even a stalker with a large family and lots of friends can go through; and it's not enough to cope with the amount that will be perfectly legitimately produced in some areas, especially in areas suffering overpopulation of deer.

brocdubh

landkeeper wrote: »

a simple tagging system would be easy to work i would think, after all we are supposed to fill an accurate report in for the npws when applying for this season as to what we shot last season are we not ??would this not give a base for the next season ???
ie if you shot 10 deer last season you would be issued with 12 tags this season with the proviso you can apply for more if needs be
i would suggest these are only attatched to deer that are SOLD ie a fallow buck heading into a game dealers would need to be tagged and a record kept by the game dealer of it who supplied it and when
any game dealer found with untagged deer would lose his liscence , no exceptions ,this at least would make sure that deer were only sold by registered deer stalkers and probably shot with a legal calibre :rolleyes: as at the moment deer are heading into game dealers shot by hornets and magnums by who know who and judging by some of the stories i have heard the national deer herd is getting slaughtered on a nightly basis

i agree with you 100%, a system along the same lines as salmon licences,say start off with ten tags and apply for more as needed,any dealer/butcher caught with untraceable venison is dealt with, but as you know there will always be those taking the easy way, i have come across a share of deer that have been shot with magnums,hornets etc i can recall an incident last year of a man in clare selling hunting tips for arrows

brocdubh

rugerman wrote: »

we all as HUNTERS dont bring deer to these people because we only shoot what we need .if u brought a cow to the slaughter without the paper work garanteed u be in court the following week so same rule shud count its all going into the food chain

well written sir:D thats what i have been on about all along:cool: