ebrief.ie

JackCharlton

any one here using ebrief.ie?
or heard much about it

Mary Hairy

JackCharlton wrote: »

any one here using ebrief.ie?
or heard much about it

It looks dangerous. If there was a security problem it would be disastrous. details of numerous cases at various stages would be made public.

coylemj

Accident waiting to happen and I can't see any legal people entrusting confidential data to a third party no matter how much encryption they claim to have.

This is one of the reasons why remote backup to a commercial data centre has never taken off, the principal reason being that once you give data to a third party you have no control over what happens it or where it's stored.

All it takes is one p***d off employee of the data centre, all of a sudden your data is public property and your clients are suing your ass for breach of confidentiality.

dermot_sheehan

Document Exchange works fine

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

maidhc

coylemj wrote: »

This is one of the reasons why remote backup to a commercial data centre has never taken off, the principal reason being that once you give data to a third party you have no control over what happens it or where it's stored.

I think it has more to do with the cost of bandwith up to now. I think some services are doing quite well now. I don't know much about this service.

gabhain7 wrote:

Document Exchange works fine

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

If your horizons don't go further than Dublin 7, then perhaps.

The rest of the country would find life easier if the court service had things like e-filing such as is common in the developed world, and if everything could be done electronically from beginning to end.

hullaballoo

maidhc wrote: »

If your horizons don't go further than Dublin 7, then perhaps.

The rest of the country would find life easier if the court service had things like e-filing such as is common in the developed world, and if everything could be done electronically from beginning to end.

Most of the non-Dublin-based solicitors I communicate with have DX addresses and I've never had a problem. Maybe some firms won't pay the subscription, but that's really their loss.

On topic: there are massive problems with online communications where the information transferred is of such a sensitive nature. The real problem with trying to move court services and filing procedures onto an online footing lies with funding, since the online security expertise required would come at a huge cost. I would trust Google better than ebrief.ie on that front (rightly or wrongly.

Besides that, the system is so archaic at this stage that it would require a complete procedural overhaul for an Internet-based system to work. You can still walk into the Master's Court any given day and object to a summons on the basis that it's insufficiently stamped.

I saw him giving very real problems to someone who had sought to serve a summons on a lady called* "Ní Mhurchú". She had, apparently, left the jurisdiction, so an order was given that her brother could be served. Initially, his name was given, "Ní Mhurchú" as well, but on reflection, an order under the slip rule was sought and that the summons would read "Ó Mhurchú".

In the Master's words, anyone with the slightest familiarity with the Irish language would know that there should be no séimhiú and it should be "Ó Murchú". Well it was adjourned.


*I have not used the correct name but it is, by way of analogy, the same.

maidhc

hullaballoo wrote: »

Most of the non-Dublin-based solicitors I communicate with have DX addresses and I've never had a problem. Maybe some firms won't pay the subscription, but that's really their loss.

On topic: there are massive problems with online communications where the information transferred is of such a sensitive nature. The real problem with trying to move court services and filing procedures onto an online footing lies with funding, since the online security expertise required would come at a huge cost. I would trust Google better than ebrief.ie on that front (rightly or wrongly.

OpenPGP is free and far more secure than any post. There are no massive problems with transferring sensitive information online, you just need to encrypt it and people need to adopt the technology.

In any event most barristers tend to send unencrypted drafts of pleadings to solicitors to be marked up, so the information is being sent out there.

hullaballoo wrote: »

Besides that, the system is so archaic at this stage that it would require a complete procedural overhaul for an Internet-based system to work. You can still walk into the Master's Court any given day and object to a summons on the basis that it's insufficiently stamped.

I saw him giving very real problems to someone who had sought to serve a summons on a lady called* "Ní Mhurchú". She had, apparently, left the jurisdiction, so an order was given that her brother could be served. Initially, his name was given, "Ní Mhurchú" as well, but on reflection, an order under the slip rule was sought and that the summons would read "Ó Mhurchú".

In the Master's words, anyone with the slightest familiarity with the Irish language would know that there should be no séimhiú and it should be "Ó Murchú". Well it was adjourned.


*I have not used the correct name but it is, by way of analogy, the same.

Maybe a complete overhaul is needed. All that parties need is to get into court quickly, and argue the toss in front of the judge.

brian__foley

maidhc wrote: »

OpenPGP is free and far more secure than any post. There are no massive problems with transferring sensitive information online, you just need to encrypt it and people need to adopt the technology.

In any event most barristers tend to send unencrypted drafts of pleadings to solicitors to be marked up, so the information is being sent out there.




Maybe a complete overhaul is needed. All that parties need is to get into court quickly, and argue the toss in front of the judge.

Data Protection.

Information being handed over to a third party or held by a third party = problems.

maidhc

brian__foley wrote: »

Data Protection.

Information being handed over to a third party or held by a third party = problems.

Very simplistic view of two acts and half a dozen directives.

Everyone blames data protection for no good reason. There is nothing in the data protection acts in my opinion which would prevent the use of SaaS or cloud computing or using a service such as this one. The government have issued mixed messages on the issue, but what is new there.

brian__foley

maidhc wrote: »

Very simplistic view of two acts and half a dozen directives.

Everyone blames data protection for no good reason. There is nothing in the data protection acts in my opinion which would prevent the use of SaaS or cloud computing or using a service such as this one. The government have issued mixed messages on the issue, but what is new there.

Understood, but its the sort of thing that one may need to adopt a bright-line attitude. Given that there are, as you say, mixed messages on the topic, I'd just rather steer clear. It's a simplistic view because there isn't, as far as I can see, a simple answer and in the absence of a simple answer leaning towards the positive, I'd tend to veer over the bright-line into the negative.

dermot_sheehan

maidhc wrote: »

I think it has more to do with the cost of bandwith up to now. I think some services are doing quite well now. I don't know much about this service.



If your horizons don't go further than Dublin 7, then perhaps.

The rest of the country would find life easier if the court service had things like e-filing such as is common in the developed world, and if everything could be done electronically from beginning to end.

Not being a complete luddite, but some form of communications are appropriate for certain mediums.

Thus it is appropriate to send some form of communications by SMS but inappropriate for others.

Similarly for email, there are some things that ought to be sent hard copy.

I know the disadvantages with hard copy, namely there is at least an overnight time lag between sending and receipt.

The advantages are it is relatively secure, I know that electronic transmission can be theoretically encrypted but firstly there can be compromised machines at either end and secondly what every encryption that is secure today might be easily breakable in 5 to 10 years.

Secondly there is no risk of machine failure, if the documents are in hard copy, if they are delivered, they are readable.

Thirdly there is certainty as to what was written at a certain point of time.

Fourthly there is a degree of formality with written communications that is absent from email. When something is typed and printed in hard copy there is a degree of formality that is absent from email.


If you are sending hard copies Document Exchange is quick (overnight), cheap (it's an annual subscription as opposed to paying per sending), and secure.

hullaballoo

maidhc wrote: »

Very simplistic view of two acts and half a dozen directives.

Everyone blames data protection for no good reason. There is nothing in the data protection acts in my opinion which would prevent the use of SaaS or cloud computing or using a service such as this one. The government have issued mixed messages on the issue, but what is new there.

I think if you take a positivist approach to data protection, you might have a point in that sharing encrypted data with a server somewhere is not necessarily within the definitions but the point is that this information is often so sensitive that the utmost protection is required.

It's not just an issue of whether or not sending draft proceedings by email is against laws provided by a technologically inept legislature, it's whether the subject information is something with which zero risk should be taken.

maidhc

Encryption is secure enough for submitting your tax returns, paying your tax bill and transferring money from one account to another. Furthermore most large solicitors firms use corporate VPNs which allow offsite access to their server, again using encryption. Things which requre certainty as to time (e.g. tenders) can also be done online.

I would suggest (actually, I know) using an electronic medium is far more secure than carbon, dead trees and a Citroen Berlingo.

The technology is all there, and off the shelf and in many cases open source and free.