Basics.

Toft

Hi All.
I've been snooping through the stickys and past threads trying to educate myself on the free Tv set up but nothing seems to quite answer my questions, probably cos they're so basic.
My situation is I've had no Tv for years but I'm thinking about getting a freesat/freeview/freetoair box thingy. I've a hd ready Tv that says it can use free to air I've that been using for xbox games and the previous tenant left a sat dish on the house.

So
1 Which box would give the most (English language) channels, I don't care about sport so that's not an issue.
2 What box type/brand would allow me to record stuff I don't have time to watch on to a external hard drive(is that actually possible?)
3 Do any of the systems automatically find all channels or do I have to find out what channels there are and tune them in my self?
4 Are there picture quality differences, not a big deal for me but if I can have Hd quality that would be grand.
5 Do some boxes do freesat and free to view at the same time.
6 Aldi/Lidl worth it.
7 What would you recommend or what should I be thinking about.
8 oh what's the diff between free to air and free sat etc....

Hope I didn't drive you all mad with the questions
Thanks
Toft

Randyleprechaun

Get yourself a FREESAT HD+ box. All the best free channels and you can record, series link etc

Keep away from free to air receivers

STB

Stay away from LIDL aldi kits.

You will not get the Irish digital stations on a Freesat+ box.

You will on a

Ferguson Ariva HD Combo
or
Edision Argus mini 2n1

both €169 and allow you to record to an external drive.


Satellite dish and cables - €50

Aerial: €40.

Trevord

In answer to the OP


1 Which box would give the most (English language) channels, I don't care about sport so that's not an issue.

A1. A FreeSAT box (note this is not the same as a Freeview box)

2 What box type/brand would allow me to record stuff I don't have time to watch on to a external hard drive(is that actually possible?)

A2. A FreeSAT+ box. The best one is called the HUMAX Foxsat HDR. It now comes with a 500gb hard drive and can be bought online from Amazon etc.

3 Do any of the systems automatically find all channels or do I have to find out what channels there are and tune them in my self?

A3. The Freesat system takes care of tuning in the channels for you


4 Are there picture quality differences, not a big deal for me but if I can have Hd quality that would be grand.

A4. THe Humax Foxsat HRD above will give you High Definition channels for BBC1HD BBCHD and ITV1HD and probably some more down the line. Other channels broadcast in Standard Definition SD.

5 Do some boxes do freesat and free to view at the same time.

A5. A Freesat box can pick up most of the stuff that is Free to Air, but you will have to tune these channels in (there are only about 10max channels in english that most people would bother with). You wont get scrambled stuff like Sky Sports and sky movies


6 Aldi/Lidl worth it.

A6. No not really. Their dishes are poor and better quality is available online for similar prices.

7 What would you recommend or what should I be thinking about.

A7. The Freesat+ Humax Foxsat.

8 oh what's the diff between free to air and free sat etc....

A8. Freesat will give you a braod range of free to air channels in an organised menu and with progreamme information for 7 days. A free to air box will give you these channels also but it will be up to you to maintain the set up if channels move transponder and you won't have a 7 day guide.

Freesat is more or less a Plug n Play setup whereas generic Free to Air systems are a bit more fiddily. Both have the capacity to give you all the free to air stuff you will want.

Kristopherus

As others have said, stay away from Aldi/Lidl kits. But since you already hav a dish, you should have a look at Lidl's box offering next Thursday. Will not record, but will do everything else.

Toft

Trevord wrote: »

In answer to the OP




2 What box type/brand would allow me to record stuff I don't have time to watch on to a external hard drive(is that actually possible?)

A2. A FreeSAT+ box. The best one is called the HUMAX Foxsat HDR. It now comes with a 500gb hard drive and can be bought online from Amazon etc.




6 Aldi/Lidl worth it.

A6. No not really. Their dishes are poor and better quality is available online for similar prices.

Can I connect an external HD via a USB as well?

Will I be ok with any dish? or is there a type that works well or lasts?

watty

Kristopherus wrote: »

As others have said, stay away from Aldi/Lidl kits. But since you already hav a dish, you should have a look at Lidl's box offering next Thursday. Will not record, but will do everything else.

No, it won't. Far better a Freesat branded box, or better "Freesat HD".

Trevord

Toft wrote: »

Can I connect an external HD via a USB as well?

Will I be ok with any dish? or is there a type that works well or lasts?

Yes you can connect an external HD or USB and you can copy programmes from the box to these external drives once the drives are formatted correctly (not a big issue).

Dish needs to be bigger than the dishes used in England. If you want to get a Sky type dish then google "Raven Zone 2 dish". Some are critical of these as they are prone to rusting. Triax is another popular and possibly more durable brand.

If you are going for Freesat+ you will need at least two cables from the dish and this means your dish will need two connectors on the arm of the dish (called a dual LNB)

Best thing is to check back here with boards before you buy anything.

watty

Avoid perforated Sky Dish. Use Solid Triax. 60cm in East & Midlands and 80cm in extreme North West & South west if ever using content not on Astra 2D (Astra2A, 2B and Eurobird are all weaker to west).

byte

Gibertini solid dishes don't seem too bad either.

NewHillel

Trevord wrote: »

In answer to the OP
1 Which box would give the most (English language) channels, I don't care about sport so that's not an issue.

The most English Language Channels are given by the generic FTA Receivers. The Aldi/Lidl ones are just fine - though the recent dishes are poor. Unlike Freesat Receivers, you will only get "Now & Next" on the Electronic Program Guide.
Freesat Boxes are more user friendly for the mainstream UK Channels.
(I use both generic and Freesat.)

Trevord wrote: »

In answer to the OP

2 What box type/brand would allow me to record stuff I don't have time to watch on to a external hard drive(is that actually possible?)

A2. A FreeSAT+ box. The best one is called the HUMAX Foxsat HDR. It now comes with a 500gb hard drive and can be bought online from Amazon etc.

The Humax Box is good, but the live pause has a bug. (Humax have pretty much abandoned the box, despite this issue being a problem for two years. A long-promised software fix has never materialised) If you plan on using that functionality more recent boxes are, IMO, better.

Trevord wrote: »

In answer to the OP

4 Are there picture quality differences, not a big deal for me but if I can have Hd quality that would be grand.

A4. THe Humax Foxsat HRD above will give you High Definition channels for BBC1HD BBCHD and ITV1HD and probably some more down the line. Other channels broadcast in Standard Definition SD.

There is a substantial picture difference with HD - but only above about 37" screen size and a "Full HD" set.

Trevord wrote: »

In answer to the OP

6 Aldi/Lidl worth it.

A6. No not really. Their dishes are poor and better quality is available online for similar prices.

Aldi and LIDL are fine, other than their dishes. The Aldi 3-year guarantee is honored without quibble and is second to none. They are also a good source for coax cable, when they have it in stock. (I have used a full 20m length of cable, without problem, with a standard Sky Dish, on the west coast. The dish is now a rust bag, the cable is fine!)
Having said all that, the convenience offered by a Freesat Box shouldn't be underestimated. Also most receivers in Aldi/LIDL are standard definition, only.

Trevord wrote: »

7 What would you recommend or what should I be thinking about.

A7. The Freesat+ Humax Foxsat.

I've given up on Humax, because of the live pause bug. I'd recommend the Sagem.

Trevord wrote: »

8 oh what's the diff between free to air and free sat etc....

A8. Freesat will give you a braod range of free to air channels in an organised menu and with progreamme information for 7 days. A free to air box will give you these channels also but it will be up to you to maintain the set up if channels move transponder and you won't have a 7 day guide.

Freesat is more or less a Plug n Play setup whereas generic Free to Air systems are a bit more fiddily. Both have the capacity to give you all the free to air stuff you will want.

Freesat offers the functionality of Sky+, without the price tag. It really is very user friendly.

Joe7

NewHillel wrote: »

They are also a good source for coax cable . . . (I have used a full 20m length of cable, without problem, with a standard Sky Dish, on the west coast. The dish is now a rust bag, the cable is fine!)

The outer insulation is certainly tough (and a bitch to strip off). The braid & foil beneath wouldn't exactly be top quality though.

Trevord

NewHillel wrote: »

The Humax Box is good, but the live pause has a bug. (Humax have pretty much abandoned the box, despite this issue being a problem for two years. A long-promised software fix has never materialised) If you plan on using that functionality more recent boxes are, IMO, better.

Humax Foxsat software upgrade is imminent, as discussed here in recent weeks.

ozymandias10

can a freesat box be connected to a sky dish . I have sky in one room and would use the freesat in another

The Cush

ozymandias10 wrote: »

can a freesat box be connected to a sky dish . I have sky in one room and would use the freesat in another

Yes.

NewHillel

Joe7 wrote: »

The outer insulation is certainly tough (and a bitch to strip off). The braid & foil beneath wouldn't exactly be top quality though.

Why? I've seen nothing wrong with it. How do you define "top quality", in this context? It most certainly is fit for purpose, which is all that matters.

Trevord wrote: »

Humax Foxsat software upgrade is imminent, as discussed here in recent weeks.

I'm aware that Michael Caughey promised a HDR Firmware Upgrade on PVR Junction on Sept 12th. Bob Hannent, Chief Technologist at Humax, has stated that the release is delayed, as issues arose during non-functional testing. I expect it to ship this side of Christmas.

However, Humax have made no commitment to fix the pause bug - hence why I could no longer recommend the PVR.

Apogee

NewHillel wrote: »

Why? I've seen nothing wrong with it. How do you define "top quality", in this context?

Copper foil and copper braid.

ozymandias10

where is the best place to buy one of these freesat boxes..would be interested in the freesat + hd

NewHillel

Apogee wrote: »

Copper foil and copper braid.

And what advantage will this give a consumer?
(Answer, none.)

I don't have specs for the cable, nor easy access to the means of generating them. However, up to 20m, the cable works fine for satellite and terrestrial television.

Apogee

NewHillel wrote: »

And what advantage will this give a consumer?
(Answer, none.)

Why bother asking the question when you're not interested in the answer?

Preventing interference from DECT phones and other wireless devices, a problem which has been repeatedly reported on this forum when inferior cable is used. CT100 or equivalent cable also has a longer lifetime.

NewHillel wrote: »

I don't have specs for the cable, nor easy access to the means of generating them. However, up to 20m, the cable works fine for satellite and terrestrial television.

http://www.wrightsaerials.tv/articles/coax-cable-quality.shtml

Why save a few measly euro on the cheapest part in the installation, when you are potentially storing up problems for someone into the future? Even worse if it means they will have the problem of ripping out crap cable or trying to pull through new cable.

bazzman

I`m in the same boat, dont have a clue about these at all.

My apt in sky ready and has a connection so can I just use that instead of needing an actual satelite disk as some people already said you need?

what channels do you actually get with these?

and what are the best ones to get, am living in Dub and have a HD tv if that makes any difference.

cheers!

NewHillel

Apogee wrote: »

Why bother asking the question when you're not interested in the answer?

The question was rhetorical.

Apogee wrote: »

Preventing interference from DECT phones and other wireless devices, a problem which has been repeatedly reported on this forum when inferior cable is used.

Yes, interference can be a problem, when inferior cable is used.

Apogee wrote: »

CT100 or equivalent cable also has a longer lifetime.

I have no evidence to suggest that this is the case. Have you?

Apogee wrote: »

http://www.wrightsaerials.tv/articles/coax-cable-quality.shtml

As a (very) basic introduction to coaxial cables, the link is useful for general information. It may be useful for some casual readers.

Apogee wrote: »

Why save a few measly euro on the cheapest part in the installation, when you are potentially storing up problems for someone into the future? Even worse if it means they will have the problem of ripping out crap cable or trying to pull through new cable.

I agree.
(For my own part, I have never specified "crap" materials, cable or otherwise, for domestic or commercial use.)

ozymandias10

ozymandias10 wrote: »

where is the best place to buy one of these freesat boxes..would be interested in the freesat + hd

Any suggestions on this..or even a combo box

Joe7

There's a sticky thread with a list of shops, also one for FAQs.

ozymandias10

thanks joe

Joe7

No problem.

Apogee

NewHillel wrote: »

I have no evidence to suggest that this is the case. Have you?

Yes, have tried various types of cable down the years. The aluminium foil coax cable has a shorter lifetime and is more susceptible to water ingress.

NewHillel wrote: »

As a (very) basic introduction to coaxial cables, the link is useful for general information. It may be useful for some casual readers.

Regardless of whether it is for 'some casual readers' or not, it clearly demonstrates why aluminium foil coax cable is inferior.

NewHillel wrote: »

I agree.
(For my own part, I have never specified "crap" materials, cable or otherwise, for domestic or commercial use.)

The Lidl cable has copper foil and braid?

NewHillel

Apogee wrote: »

Yes, have tried various types of cable down the years. The aluminium foil coax cable has a shorter lifetime and is more susceptible to water ingress.

Water Ingress is via one of three mechanisms: i) via a poor termination, ii) micro-holes in the sheath, iii) damaged sheath. If the coax has been terminated correctly, eg. with with silicone grease, a proper sleeve and finished off with self-amalgamating tape, there should be no water ingress at the connection. Cable chafing, off a roof, or whatever, is a consequence of a poor quality installation. Water permeating the sheath happens with some lower quality coax's - both copper foil and aluminum foil. I have an an installation with LIDL coax that is now six years old with no evidence of a water ingress issue.

The reference you refer to clearly states "Foam dielectric with copper tape and copper braid....(of yesteryear) absorbed atmospheric and other moisture very readily." Not that it matters, it provides no evidence, good or bad. of the suitability of the LIDL coax!

Apogee wrote: »

Regardless of whether it is for 'some casual readers' or not, it clearly demonstrates why aluminium foil coax cable is inferior.

You are reading way too much into that article. Nor can you compare coax cables from different manufacturers, with different specifications, in the way you suggest. The second issue of concern, is the attenuation of the cable, accross the frequency band of interest. This is simple to measure, if you have a mind, and you could then compare it to the chart on your reference site.

Just to be clear, I'm not suggesting that the LIDL cable is better, or even as good, as some other brands. (I don't know, and have no need to carry out the comparative testing required.) However, I am certain that it is perfectly OK for standard domestic installations.

Joe7

I suppose some of us just take it for granted that one cable spec is better than another without really thinking about it, or having a really good reason for choosing one over the other.
It's easier to just take advice from people who should know what they're talking about.

NewHillel

Joe7 wrote: »

I suppose some of us just take it for granted that one cable spec is better than another without really thinking about it, or having a really good reason for choosing one over the other.
It's easier to just take advice from people who should know what they're talking about.

Indeed. There is a lot of well-intentioned, and valuable, advice on Boards. Much of it is accurate, and most well intentioned. However, all of us bring our backgrounds, and indeed prejudices, to the table. Some also bring a healthy dose of self-interest - such posts generally follow a set pattern and are fairly easy to spot. In this case, the criteria is simple - is the product "fit for purpose". The answer is yes.

(I have no personal axe to grind as I do not install systems for a living.)