is it in a mans human nature to want to sleep with many women and not committ to one?

emeraldgal

hi im amy- im 29 years of age and today i was discussing tiger woods with a friend of mine (we'll call him john) who is also 29.
john is engaged and soon to be married. when we were discussing tiger woods and his infidelity it all came around to guys cheating on their gfs/wives. he claims that most guys do cheat and then he told me that he has cheated on his fiance a few times in the past. he told me the other women meant nothing to him and he only did it in cases where she would NEVER find out (on foreign holidays etc). i just cant get my head around it. hes a really good guy and seems genuine and i cant believe that he is a cheater. it got me wondering if hes right.. he sees no problem with it whatsoever and says he loves his fiance but says that its human nature to want to sleep with other women. he says its extremely hard to not give in and that he doesnt even feel too guilty as he knows it means nothing.
when i asked him why he would cheat when he has a lovely fiance he says that its just guys need something different every once in a while.
he wants to get married as he loves his wife to be but in a physical sense he is not committed to her. (although he describes her as beautiful)
he is clearly able to separate his feelings from sex but is it true that all men feel this way? is it really hard to give up sex with other girls and settle for just one? do most of you guys cheat/would if you could get away with it/tempted to...

Standman

So basically what you are asking is are all men cheaters. The answer is no. This guy has a certain idea about this kind of behaviour which is handy for him because it justifies it in his mind. Not all men are like this.

Your friend john is an asshole and tries to justify it with "everyone else does it, I'm sure they do, because thinking that makes me feel better"

he doesnt even feel too guilty as he knows it means nothing.

Well if it means nothing he should have no problem telling her that too, right. because it means nothing.

Maguined

Yeah it's always someone who has cheated who says all men do it, just to justify their own misdeeds.

I am 28 and have never cheated and will never cheat, sure even in a relationship I would look at other woman and find them attractive but I would never cheat on someone.

Its the same selfish behaviour as usually a cheater will be appalled and offended if they found out their partner ever cheated on them, its okay for them to do it, but not for it to be done to them.

Bottle_of_Smoke

I'd say yes it is part of our nature to sleep with multiple women. Just as it is in our nature to steal, fight and murder.

It is also in women's nature to sleep with many men.

Of course all of these things being part of our nature do not justify them in a modern (or ancient historical) context. Much like Darwins theory of evolution being a scientific fact does not justify exterminating disabled people

Logical Fallacy

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

Of course all of these things being part of our nature do not justify them in a modern (or ancient historical) context. Much like Darwins theory of evolution being a scientific fact does not justify exterminating disabled people

Darwin's Theory would actually imply that disabilities should breed themselves out, which doesn't happen as things are a tad more complex than that.

On the topic at hand, nope, not all men are cheaters. The fact that it's "in our nature" has very little to do with it.

Poor men, victims of there genes and all that, if only we weren't all meant to be wanekrs etc.

Bottle_of_Smoke

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

Darwin's Theory would actually imply that disabilities should breed themselves out, which doesn't happen as things are a tad more complex than that.

Well you see my point it doesn't make it acceptable

On the topic at hand, nope, not all men are cheaters. The fact that it's "in our nature" has very little to do with it.

Poor men, victims of there genes and all that, if only we weren't all meant to be wanekrs etc.

Absolutely

Logical Fallacy

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

Well you see my point it doesn't make it acceptable

Agreed, on the subject i was reading an article about a tribe of early humans who were actually caring do a disabled member of the tribe. I must dig that up again.

F-Stop

If you had only one euro that you have to give away each month, you'ld chose very carefully who you gave it to. If you had millions of euro to give away everyday, you'd want to give them to as many people as you could. Same thing goes for ova and sperm.

However, not all humans are reduced to just their biological functions - hopefully. So save your eggs, but don't count your chickens.

minidazzler

If you wear a red t-shirt, you will walk around and think a larger proportion of people are wearing red.

If you cheat, you will think it's the norm, and a larger proportion than do, cheat.

If you beat your wife, you will think more people beat their wives than actually do.

I read a piece on this somewhere, can't remember where, but basically you think you are the normal one and that most people are like yourself.

This is how cheaters rationalise I think? I dunno TBH.

But I don't think it's in our nature to sleep with many women while commited, it is in out nature to WANT to.

Galvasean

Like has been said before, 'John' is just trying to justify his own nefarious actions. Tell a lie enough and you will start to believe it yourself.

Otis Driftwood

Well Im 31 and have never cheated despite having the opportunity to do so without the chance of ever being caught.Ive got a number of friends in LTR's or married that have never nor would they ever be unfaithful.To put the blame on genetic's,human nature or anything else like that is frankly bull crap.Being unfaithful is probably the second worst thing a person could do to a partner.Its disrespectful and proves how little one person thinks of their partner to do it.I wonder if your friend would have the same attitude if it was his fiance that had shagged random blokes but chalked it down to being just sex.

finbarrk

The other side of the coin is you won't get too many lads coming on here saying they have cheated.

Bottle_of_Smoke

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

Agreed, on the subject i was reading an article about a tribe of early humans who were actually caring do a disabled member of the tribe. I must dig that up again.

Read something similar actually. I think where they found a fossilized skull which showed evidence of such extensive dental infection the person must have survived for years with someone else chewing their food for them.

LegacyUser

finbarrk wrote: »

The other side of the coin is you won't get too many lads coming on here saying they have cheated.

True, I have cheated in every relationship I have ever been in. Have put it down to the fact that I am selfish and wanted the ego boost.

All these relationships I have been liked by my girlfriend more than I like her. (lack of self confidence probably)

I hope that if I'm ever in a relationship where I fall in love that I won't want to cheat. Or will at least resist the urge.

Yeah nature might make me want to knob around but it never forced me to.

LegacyUser

From a purely academic point of view, it is a part of the nature of a lot of mammals on this planet for a male to have multiple mates. In gorillas, for example, one male will mate with the most of the females until he becomes old enough to be bested by another male who will then take his place - referred to as the alpha male. Similarly instinct dictates that the females should only mate with the alpha male. The reason for this is because in species will low populations it's more important that there is a large percentage of females so that the population can grow than an even percentage which leads to greater diversity. Obviously there is an opportunity cost with this as it slows down evolution and may lead to extinction if the low population is due to anything beyond a lack of food, which is what this behavior is best suited to dealing with (hence why in a lot of species the female is the food gatherer, e.g. the loin, and the male is quite lazy).

Once the population grows beyond a certain level having a single mate becomes the better choice as this leads to better diversity and therefore a better ability to cope with disease. Natural selection will ensure that gradually this will become the dominant behavior, but obviously that takes time and the more primitive behavior will always be a part of the species, but in a smaller and smaller percentage unless an environmental change forces it to become dominant again.

Humans are mammals and our instincts are pretty close to those of other mammals. Assuming that humanity never faces extinction, eventually the instinctual need to cheat will be such a small part of out instinct that it will be pretty much unheard of. Though unfortunately we are talking on the scale of millions of years. Eventually it may be possible that we become a species that mate only once and then for life.

That being said its not an excuse for somebody to be cheating on their partner - ever. As a species we have long since passed the stage where we have to do everything our instincts tell us, it is instinct to get attracted to other women but it is a choice to act on those feelings and John made that choice and should face the consequences of it.

Galvasean

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

Read something similar actually. I think where they found a fossilized skull which showed evidence of such extensive dental infection the person must have survived for years with someone else chewing their food for them.

For those interested:
http://news.discovery.com/archaeology/disabled-elderly-human.html

Although caring for the sick/injured is not a uniquely human trait. Many animals do it.

La frog fairy

honestcheater wrote: »

True, I have cheated in every relationship I have ever been in. Have put it down to the fact that I am selfish and wanted the ego boost.

All these relationships I have been liked by my girlfriend more than I like her. (lack of self confidence probably)
.

Im confused, should it not be you want the ego boost by cheating cos you are not getting the attention you want - or love- from your own gf?

Not an accusation, just wondering..

In my opinion I think its simple, theres is the attraction and desired or be tempted to cheat, which I think can be normal, we are all human and find others attractive and wonder "what if", and then there is crossing the line and cheating...usually caused by insecurities and ego boost as some previously posted.
Its about choices simple as that
I think its sad more than anything, my view is if you want to sleep with others then just be single.

shawnee

Not all relationships run as planned. **** happens in life and sometimes it affects relationships and indeed sex. If for whatever reason one person decides they don't want sex anymore , what happens for his/her partner.
Break ups are not always easy , there may be kids involved.

Bottle_of_Smoke

Choice_over_instinct wrote: »

From a purely academic point of view, it is a part of the nature of a lot of mammals on this planet for a male to have multiple mates. In gorillas, for example, one male will mate with the most of the females until he becomes old enough to be bested by another male who will then take his place - referred to as the alpha male. Similarly instinct dictates that the females should only mate with the alpha male. The reason for this is because in species will low populations it's more important that there is a large percentage of females so that the population can grow than an even percentage which leads to greater diversity. Obviously there is an opportunity cost with this as it slows down evolution and may lead to extinction if the low population is due to anything beyond a lack of food, which is what this behavior is best suited to dealing with (hence why in a lot of species the female is the food gatherer, e.g. the loin, and the male is quite lazy).

To be honest that sounds very group selection to me

Once the population grows beyond a certain level having a single mate becomes the better choice as this leads to better diversity and therefore a better ability to cope with disease. Natural selection will ensure that gradually this will become the dominant behavior, but obviously that takes time and the more primitive behavior will always be a part of the species, but in a smaller and smaller percentage unless an environmental change forces it to become dominant again.

Again group selection. Whilst the results of everyone having a single mate might lead to more diversity in the species it doesn't mean an individual wouldn't benefit more from having multiple partners. People don't base their sexual behavior on the health of the species population.

Humans are mammals and our instincts are pretty close to those of other mammals. Assuming that humanity never faces extinction, eventually the instinctual need to cheat will be such a small part of out instinct that it will be pretty much unheard of. Though unfortunately we are talking on the scale of millions of years. Eventually it may be possible that we become a species that mate only once and then for life.

Well I'm glad you said millions of years as our thinking hasn't changed much in the last few hundred thousand. At the same time I don't see homosapien heading that direction to be honest

MPB

OK so heres my 2 cents.

I'm not with my current gf very long but shes incredible good looking, hot, sexy, attractive etcx. and thats jsut on the outside. She ahs the most amazing personality to go with it. She's exactly what I want in a girl. If I was blind and couldnt see her shes still what I would want. I'm absolutley crazy about her.

Would I cheat on her? Never! Why would I? I have what I want in a girl. As far as I'm concerned it cant get any better. Sure I see other girls and think "she's hot" or even might get a dirty thought about them but thats as far as it goes. I'm with the girl I want to be with so theres no room for any other woman in that and I dont want any otehr woman. Even if the opportunity presented itself I could walk away and it wouldnt cost me a thought. I dont think "she'd never find out and I could get away with it". I'm simply not interested in doing anything with anyone else.

Thats me. Not saying everyones like me. But certainly, we're not all cheaters either. Takes all kinds to make the world go round.

Wibbs

In my experience anyway most people don't cheat. I'd reckon if I was to put a figure on it I'd say two thirds don't. Some don't because they don't have the option to do so, but for the majority they don't because they simply don't want to.

Of the third that do? Pretty much both genders do it. Indeed again in my experience more women I've known have cheated than men. If you add in the overlap relationships where the person lines up and gets busy with someone new before leaving the old relationship and you consider that cheating that figure for the ladies would climb a lot higher.

Its also an age thing too I reckon. More cheating goes on in the 18 to 25 group. Its more the overlap stuff or snog on a night out rather than the longterm "bit on the side", so while all are hurtful I think there are different forms of infidelity.

In the older age groups 30+ there's less going on, but when it does it's more the mistress type scenario IME. I'd also say in the older age range the gender thing reverses and it's more men with mistresses going on. I'd defo say more married men cheat than married women do(especially those with families). The married bloke with the wedding ring mark on his finger trying to get into the younger woman's panties is far far more common than the married woman cruising for toyboys.

I would say opportunity comes into it especially with men. A socially successful attractive guy with more access to single women is more likely to fall than a guy who isn't like that.

Length and status of the relationship comes into it too. Very very few men or women cheat in the first year of being in love. They mostly can't even imagine being with another. Few would cheat after 15 years together. For the overlap type or the "why am I fancying other men/women" type the highest chance of that IMHO is around the 2 to 3 year mark in a relationship. It's the most common time for a breakup too. I noticed that very strong pattern when modding PI. You could damn near set your watch to it.

HavingCrack

My opinion on "cheating"(always found the word tries to lessen what you're doing ie. having sex with someone else) has always been if you want to have sex with as many people as possible remain single. If you want a monogamous relationship have one but don't try to continue having sex with other people as it defeats the point of a conventional relationship.

Nature can't make us do anything. We're advanced enough to choose what decisions we make in life. I could go out and rob a car right now but I would choose to do so, nature didn't make me. We don't have to do anything, we choose to.

midlandsmissus

Being totally honest, I've never cheated, but I was with a man one night who I knew had a girlfriend.
I agonised before, during and after, but I still wanted to and I did it. I beat myself up after it and so did he, but being honest now I don't feel guilty about it.

We all make mistakes and I've forgiven myself.

If that sounds bad, it is what it is, I'm being totally honest about how I feel here.

Audie

Some people are more prone to wanting to cheat than others. Some will do it, some won't, some won't even want to, but I reckon it's divided evenly between men and women. I have cheated in the past - I was in a relationship I felt I couldn't get out of and wanted a release - and that's how I justified it.

I'd never cheat on my current boyfriend, but that doesn't mean the thought hasn't crossed my mind. Self-discipline has to come into it for me! I'd almost be inclined to say that women are more likely to cheat if I had to choose!

It may in fact be in men’s nature to want to be with lots of girls but it is also in their nature to want to commit and gain all the benefits that being in a committed relationship brings. I see no reason to think girls are not exactly the same in this too.

I myself am in the unusual position of being in a committed relationship with 2 girls rather than 1, but the basics of the relationship are the same regardless in every other way.

Cheaters are just guys who are attempting to get the best of both worlds. To get all the pleasures of multiple girls coupled with the benefits and pleasures of being committed to someone. The problem is that the latter is a lie because you are engaging in the former behind the back of your partner(s). One must ask oneself how committed they actually are to the relationship, and why they have committed to a relationship that clearly is not fulfilling them enough to encourage full committment.

If they want to live a lie then so be it, and they may even have a point when they say all guys feel the urge to be the same way as them. The claim however that all guys are cheating and acting in the same way is fantasy and is just them justifying themselves to themselves.

I, for one, have never and would never cheat on any one. Of course I meet girls that make me think how much fun it would be to be with them and a rare few of them might even find ways to indicate they feel the same way, but I do not want to live a lie and the relationship I am in I am 100% committed to.

Boskowski

For starters I'm in a LTR and have never cheated on her and probably never will, but I always try to develop a rational that isn't blurred by emotions and social expectations.

I think the concept of monogamy is more that of a social contract that has evolved over time in certain cultures. If we're talking 'primal' then I would tend to think it's probably in the male genes to spread their genes as much as they can and so it is in the female instincts, but the female does require - at least for a limited time - a certain stability/security/safety for bearing and upbringing a child.

But of course as social beings we have developed at least to some extent from the primal days and we also have emotions of love and attachment which (probably) distincts us from most other animals.

However, as Terry Pratchett put it so eloquently, as a society we're really only three good meals away from mayhem and stoneage and that applies to our sexual instincts as well.

If you love someone and they love you there will be very little incentive for playing away. Especially while a love is fresh, hot, new and exciting most people wouldn't even look at other potential sex partners. But desire and lust wears off and relationships change (evolve hopefully) and desire and lust are very strong emotions and I don't care what anyone says - everybody feels desire or lust for others than their partners every now and again. Some more often and strongly, others hardly ever - like with everything else society has the whole spectrum.

Whether we act on it or not is than pretty much a function of the mutual (or not so mutual) understanding of the partnership agreement we have and how dependable we are in it or probably how dependable we are in agreement situations in general.

I totally reject the concept of morality in terms of sexuality. What I mean is that nobody becomes an immoral or 'dirty' person because they desire others. These concepts of morality and do's and dont's have evolved differently in different societies and while most of them have their place in a functioning society we all know that some rules we live by we only adhere to because 'we have always done it that way' and nobody remembers why we did it in the first place and it could all be down to some powerful dude 1000 years ago who had a certain misguided notion or due to some other hidden agenda. Celibacy for clerical people comes to mind for example. Anyway, we call cheaters dirty swines and all the other names under the sun but there really is no difference between honoring or not honoring a business contract or a partnership agreement. While a lot of people would feel a lot more strongly about the latter than the former funnily enough society seems to disagree with this since 'cheating' is not a crime while stealing in the supermarket can get you into prison.

Long story short. People don't cheat because they are in a contract and they want to honor it, also - since emotions are involved - they don't want to hurt their partners or they are afraid of the anguish and the hassle and the social stigma. But I firmly believe that leaving those things aside everybody feels desire for others at times. Survival is a very strong driver in an animals instincts and we are really only three meals away from smashing each others heads in over the same. Desire and lust are not too far behind survival since they are the foundation of survival as a species and I believe it's in all of us.

ceekay74

Interesting comments in this thread, especially in relation to evolutionary instincts.

I suspect it may be fair to say that a high proportion of users of boards.ie (or possibly internet users in general) either don't cheat on their partners, or won't admit to their guilt. What about all your past relationships? Were you always innocent?

In my experience, people cheat more when they're young, sick of the relationship they're in, are having a 'midlife crisis' or some similar thing, are on drugs, or are just acting like plain selfish b******s.

Let he without sin....

AbsoluteStress

No, it isn't.

I broke up with the love of my life two days ago. We were always fighting. (Irony)
I'm on facebook now at 03:51am She has loads of new photos up. (The gorgeous bitch :mad: )

I hate facebook, it breeds jealousy.

All I want is her back.

Goduznt Xzst

imo, it all comes down to opportunity and circumstance.

How does the adage go: "Regarding sex, men need a place, women need a reason"

Men want to sleep with other women, regardless of how long they have been in a relationship. It's always there. We don't need a reason. Which is why the porn industry is aimed mainly at men, rather than women. Porn aimed at women tends to be more story based as women require emotional or mental cues to be aroused. For men, we require little more than an image as we are mainly visually triggered regarding our sexual urges.

Women have to understand that a beautiful woman walking by in a tight red dress does to us in a second what it might take an evening with a handsome man to do to a woman. Every beautiful woman that walks by has effectively instantly gone on a date with us in our heads and we are now ready for sex, merely at the sight of them.

Now, I don't argue that men won't cheat. However the desire to cheat still remains, even if it is only for fleeting moments as we get the perfumed scent off attractive women as they pass us by.

Which is why I said it comes down to circumstance and opportunity. I'd wager that men who cheat are in situations more frequently where the opportunity to do it is higher. Most men, either consciously or otherwise, remove themselves from such situations to reduce the chances that they will be tempted.

Leelaa22

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

imo, it all comes down to opportunity and circumstance.

How does the adage go: "Regarding sex, men need a place, women need a reason"

Men want to sleep with other women, regardless of how long they have been in a relationship. It's always there. We don't need a reason. Which is why the porn industry is aimed mainly at men, rather than women. Porn aimed at women tends to be more story based as women require emotional or mental cues to be aroused. For men, we require little more than an image as we are mainly visually triggered regarding our sexual urges.

Women have to understand that a beautiful woman walking by in a tight red dress does to us in a second what it might take an evening with a handsome man to do to a woman. Every beautiful woman that walks by has effectively instantly gone on a date with us in our heads and we are now ready for sex, merely at the sight of them.

Now, I don't argue that men won't cheat. However the desire to cheat still remains, even if it is only for fleeting moments as we get the perfumed scent off attractive women as they pass us by.

Which is why I said it comes down to circumstance and opportunity. I'd wager that men who cheat are in situations more frequently where the opportunity to do it is higher. Most men, either consciously or otherwise, remove themselves from such situations to reduce the chances that they will be tempted.

so what your saying is to never trust a man because given the right situation enough times he will give in and cheat?

DOC09UNAM

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

imo, it all comes down to opportunity and circumstance.

How does the adage go: "Regarding sex, men need a place, women need a reason"

Men want to sleep with other women, regardless of how long they have been in a relationship. It's always there. We don't need a reason. Which is why the porn industry is aimed mainly at men, rather than women. Porn aimed at women tends to be more story based as women require emotional or mental cues to be aroused. For men, we require little more than an image as we are mainly visually triggered regarding our sexual urges.

I mean this in the nicest way, but please don't speak for all men, NOT ALL MEN wan't to sleep with other women if they are in a relationship, maybe you do, but you are not everyone.

Goduznt Xzst wrote:

Women have to understand that a beautiful woman walking by in a tight red dress does to us in a second what it might take an evening with a handsome man to do to a woman. Every beautiful woman that walks by has effectively instantly gone on a date with us in our heads and we are now ready for sex, merely at the sight of them.

So you're saying that men only want something to look at? I know myself that I enjoy being able to actually have a good conversation with a woman, it's not all about "image".

Goduznt Xzst wrote:

Now, I don't argue that men won't cheat. However the desire to cheat still remains, even if it is only for fleeting moments as we get the perfumed scent off attractive women as they pass us by.

This is simply not true at all, you are basically saying that every man has the desire to cheat?

Goduznt Xzst wrote:

Which is why I said it comes down to circumstance and opportunity. I'd wager that men who cheat are in situations more frequently where the opportunity to do it is higher. Most men, either consciously or otherwise, remove themselves from such situations to reduce the chances that they will be tempted.

You are assuming all men will cheat if the circumstances arise? Again, this is simply not true, while some men will cheat, a lot of men won't.

IMO You have some issues to deal with yourself regarding cheating, just because some men will if given the chance, doesn't mean all of us will.

Goduznt Xzst

Leelaa22 wrote: »

so what your saying is to never trust a man because given the right situation enough times he will give in and cheat?

No. I am not saying to never trust a man. But I am saying to never trust a man you are dating who frequently goes out drinking with single women he finds attractive without you. I believe this would set off alarm bells in any womans head, would it not?

I'm not saying it is an urge that can't be controlled. We all have weak instinctual urges to consume salt, sugar, fat... etc, but we can choose to control them. The urge to have sex with other women can just as easily be controlled (for most)

It is fairly pathetic for men to claim this urge somehow goes away when they are in a relationship with a woman, and somehow gets turned back on when they break out of that relationship. It's like saying that if your OH makes a pretty good steak dinner that when you pass by a restaurant with someone eating a steak that the smell of it no longer appeals to you because you can get that steak at home. BS tbh. The smell of that steak might whet our appetite to get home quicker to have some homecooked steak, but never the less, our appetites where initially triggered by the steak on somebody else's plate.

We can't control the urges, but we can control how we act on them.

Leelaa22

Goduznt Xzst wrote: »

No. I am not saying to never trust a man. But I am saying to never trust a man you are dating who frequently goes out drinking with single women he finds attractive without you. I believe this would set off alarm bells in any womans head, would it not?

I'm not saying it is an urge that can't be controlled. We all have weak instinctual urges to consume salt, sugar, fat... etc, but we can choose to control them. The urge to have sex with other women can just as easily be controlled (for most)

It is fairly pathetic for men to claim this urge somehow goes away when they are in a relationship with a woman, and somehow gets turned back on when they break out of that relationship. It's like saying that if your OH makes a pretty good steak dinner that when you pass by a restaurant with someone eating a steak that the smell of it no longer appeals to you because you can get that steak at home. BS tbh. The smell of that steak might whet our appetite to get home quicker to have some homecooked steak, but never the less, our appetites where initially triggered by the steak on somebody else's plate.

We can't control the urges, but we can control how we act on them.

I'd never EVER date a guy who would do that, thats a really rude thing to do to someone. Forget hearing alarm bells, even if he was the most trustworthy guy in the world and he didnt want me with him on a night out, Id get rid of him just for that.

And I agree you can find other people attractive while your in a relationship, Ive developed crushes while with someone, but they dont worry me because I know nothing would ever come of it.
Your right you cant control who you find attractive or how much your attracted to them, you can just control how you react to these feelings.
I know guys will always look at women in that way, I will always look at a guys that way, its how we are built. Just because I think a guy is hot and would like to sleep with him doesnt mean Im ever going to.
BTW its not just men who look at others and immeditely want to sleep with them, we do feel that way about men sometimes, we dont need to know them to want them.
But what you said before made it sound like if a man did delvelop a crush on someone else he wouldn't be able to control himself for long.
which I hope is not true.

I am clearly not understanding EITHER what Goduznt Xzst or what leelaa22 is saying because I am not sure I am seeing the problem.

I go out drinking all the time or I did when I was drinking which I am not until the end of this year when I will be back at it again.

Often the people I do it with are girls... often they are single girls.... and often they are attractive girls.... and often my own girlfriends are not there. Therefore I, like Goduznt Xzst said, often go out drinking with single girls I think are attractive without my partners there.

My GFs do not mind, I do not mind, the single girls do not mind. I am not understanding therefore what the "rude" thing I am meant to be doing actually is and I am pretty convinced it is just a break down in communication on this thread somewhere as I can see no reason why anything I am doing is rude or wrong.

Is it possible leelaa22 that what you mean is that it is rude and wrong if a guy is going out for drinks not with girls who are attractive and single... but going out with girls because they are attractive and single? This for me makes more sense and I would understand where you are coming from on it.

Leelaa22

Deleted User wrote: »

I am clearly not understanding EITHER what Goduznt Xzst or what leelaa22 is saying because I am not sure I am seeing the problem.

I go out drinking all the time or I did when I was drinking which I am not until the end of this year when I will be back at it again.

Often the people I do it with are girls... often they are single girls.... and often they are attractive girls.... and often my own girlfriends are not there. Therefore I, like Goduznt Xzst said, often go out drinking with single girls I think are attractive without my partners there.

My GFs do not mind, I do not mind, the single girls do not mind. I am not understanding therefore what the "rude" thing I am meant to be doing actually is and I am pretty convinced it is just a break down in communication on this thread somewhere as I can see no reason why anything I am doing is rude or wrong.

Is it possible leelaa22 that what you mean is that it is rude and wrong if a guy is going out for drinks not with girls who are attractive and single... but going out with girls because they are attractive and single? This for me makes more sense and I would understand where you are coming from on it.

No it has nothing to do with how attractive or single the girl is.
I think its rude if a guy is going out drinking with anyone and does not invite you out. that type of behaviour doesnt make sense to me, your with someone, why would you not invite them out with you?
Do you not what them to get to know your friends,
do you not want to them to be apart of your world?
Are you getting sick of them already?
Do you just not feel that strongly about the person you are with in the first place?

If you really love someone you want to be with them, esp when your going out to have a good time, you want them to enjoy the experince with you.

Its a different story if they invited you out, you didnt want to go out or couldnt make it. It wouldnt bother me if they went out with attractive singles girls, if i didnt trust the man im with, the I wouldnt be with him.

My point for bringing all this up is that Goduznt Xzst made it sound that ANY man who was out with an attractive woman enough times he would eventually give in. and there where my problem was I had hoped this wasnt true.

Then Goduznt Xzst asked if my bf was going out all the time with attractive single girls would alarm bells be ringing.
And they would, not because he is out with single girls but because he out in general and hasnt asked me to go too, I would take that as rudeness and a sign that he doesnt feel that strongly about me.

Leelaa22

Leelaa22 wrote: »

I think its rude if a guy is going out drinking with anyone and does not invite you out.

Ah this is different to what I first thought you were saying. I knew there was a break down in communication somewhere and you were not saying what it appeared you were.

In post #34 you appeared to say you had a problem with guys who go out with single women they find attractive. In THIS post you are saying you have a problem with guys who go out with single women they find attractive and do not invite you too.

There is a massive difference between the two and I welcome the clarification, thank you. I see your point better now.

However I still find I must disagree with you. Partners are not chained to you in that they need to go everywhere you do 24/7.

In fact quite the opposite… I consider it entirely unhealthy for partners to do everything together and in fact having nights out on your own with your own friends is not just something I would call healthy, but something I would suggest should be highly recommended. People need "me" time that is not connected to work and is not connected to the people they otherwise spend most of their time with.

Leelaa22

Deleted User wrote: »

Ah this is different to what I first thought you were saying. I knew there was a break down in communication somewhere and you were not saying what it appeared you were.

In post #34 you appeared to say you had a problem with guys who go out with single women they find attractive. In THIS post you are saying you have a problem with guys who go out with single women they find attractive and do not invite you too.

There is a massive difference between the two and I welcome the clarification, thank you. I see your point better now.

However I still find I must disagree with you. Partners are not chained to you in that they need to go everywhere you do 24/7.

In fact quite the opposite… I consider it entirely unhealthy for partners to do everything together and in fact having nights out on your own with your own friends is not just something I would call healthy, but something I would suggest should be highly recommended. People need "me" time that is not connected to work and is not connected to the people they otherwise spend most of their time with.

Im still not getting my thoughts into words correctly. I agree people shouldnt be chained to to the waist. Its the lack of invitation I have a problem with.
It is polite to ask and rude not too.
Like I said before just cause he would invite me out doesnt mean ill always go, I might have something on or just dont want to go. But its the lack of an offer than would cheese me off, I want to know that he would like me by his side (Im not going to be by his side all the time)

And also at this point id like to point out im not speaking of behalf of all women , this is just me.
I know Im a little OTT about these things, and naive to think a guy is always going to want me out with him. thats just the kinda girl I am, wanting the fairy tale romance and not settling for anything less.

My main question was are all men going to cheat if presented with the oppertunity enough times?

Diapason

Leelaa22 wrote: »

I know Im a little OTT about these things, and naive to think a guy is always going to want me out with him. thats just the kinda girl I am, wanting the fairy tale romance and not settling for anything less.

That is, of course, your prerogative, but you may be setting yourself up for disappointment. Are you young? You sound very young (not a criticism at all -- jealousy if anything). I think having hard-and-fast rules about what you expect is a bad idea.

Leelaa22 wrote: »

My main question was are all men going to cheat if presented with the oppertunity enough times?

No they're not. Some are, some aren't.

Leelaa22

Diapason wrote: »

That is, of course, your prerogative, but you may be setting yourself up for disappointment. Are you young? You sound very young (not a criticism at all -- jealousy if anything). I think having hard-and-fast rules about what you expect is a bad idea.

I dont think Im setting myself up for disappointment(heartbrakes along the way for sure).
I really believe anything can happen, but if I believe I wont find what I want, then Im obviously never going to.
There are good guys out there, they are just harder to find, but worth it when you find them.

I am young enough Im 22

Diapason

Leelaa22 wrote: »

I
There are good guys out there, they are just harder to find, but worth it when you find them.

Oh absolutely. What I meant is that lots of the good guys will have attractive female friends whose company they might enjoy, and who they may enjoy meeting up with from time to time. In some circumstances, due to shared past experiences or whatever, they may prefer to meet them alone. It's not a sexual thing, or a cheating thing, any more than it is meeting friends of the same sex.

For example, I went to a mixed secondary school and have lots of female friends from those days. Some of them my wife has got to know over the years and that's great, some of them she hasn't, so if I'm meeting up with them I'd probably prefer to meet them on my own. The evening will probably be spent talking about school days and reminiscing, and to be frank, that's just not too interesting to my wife!

Anyway, it's only if you believe that men can't be friends with women that you need to worry, and we're further along than that I hope!

And yes, you're definitely a young 'un!

Leelaa22

Diapason wrote: »

Oh absolutely. What I meant is that lots of the good guys will have attractive female friends whose company they might enjoy, and who they may enjoy meeting up with from time to time. In some circumstances, due to shared past experiences or whatever, they may prefer to meet them alone. It's not a sexual thing, or a cheating thing, any more than it is meeting friends of the same sex.

For example, I went to a mixed secondary school and have lots of female friends from those days. Some of them my wife has got to know over the years and that's great, some of them she hasn't, so if I'm meeting up with them I'd probably prefer to meet them on my own. The evening will probably be spent talking about school days and reminiscing, and to be frank, that's just not too interesting to my wife!

Anyway, it's only if you believe that men can't be friends with women that you need to worry, and we're further along than that I hope!

And yes, you're definitely a young 'un!

I know what your saying. I think men and women can be friends of course I've male friends that I wont be giving up when the next bf comes along.

I wouldnt have a problem if I was with someone and he said, hey me and Mary are meeting up for a coffee. Id say cool beans no worries tell mary I said hey. If he said to me, hey me and Mary are going out clubbing Id say hey wheres my invite. Likewise if he said to me, hey me and Tim are going clubbing id ask again where my invite was.

gillian1983

Leelaa22 wrote: »

I know what your saying. I think men and women can be friends of course I've male friends that I wont be giving up when the next bf comes along.

I wouldnt have a problem if I was with someone and he said, hey me and Mary are meeting up for a coffee. Id say cool beans no worries tell mary I said hey. If he said to me, hey me and Mary are going out clubbing Id say hey wheres my invite. Likewise if he said to me, hey me and Tim are going clubbing id ask again where my invite was.

leelaa, i completely agree and feel the same way as u do, but i have to say that it is very difficult to find a guy who wont go out clubbing without you.. so what if you're bf mentioned going clubbing with tim and you asked your bf where you're invite was and he said he didnt want you ther... then what do u do?

bear in mind you love the guy, what do u do? im asking because ive tried to stop my ex from going clubbing without inviting me but its just something he started doing then without even telling me (behind my back) so on fri/sat night then id always know he was out clubbing..

Nip The Tip

emeraldgal wrote: »

is it in a mans human nature to want to sleep with many women and not committ to one?

Yes.

/end of thread.

Leelaa22

gillian1983 wrote: »

leelaa, i completely agree and feel the same way as u do, but i have to say that it is very difficult to find a guy who wont go out clubbing without you.. so what if you're bf mentioned going clubbing with tim and you asked your bf where you're invite was and he said he didnt want you ther... then what do u do?

bear in mind you love the guy, what do u do? im asking because ive tried to stop my ex from going clubbing without inviting me but its just something he started doing then without even telling me (behind my back) so on fri/sat night then id always know he was out clubbing..

Firstly if I knew he was the type of man who would do that before I was his girlfriend. I wouldnt bother getting with him at all.
If it was something new that he was doing not letting me go with him. Id leave him. I wouldnt put up with that ****. Also I would wonder why the sudden change in pattern?
Thats just me though, I know most girls would let him go and feel bad that he is doing it.
My thoughts are life is too short to be feeling bad because of someone elses actions(it happened to me in the past). There are 3billion men on the planet and it is easy enough to fall in love its not a once in a lifetime thing. I wouldnt worry about leaving him. It would be hard to walk away, but to me it would be the right thing to do.

This is completely my own opinion, don't take it that Im saying that what you are doing is wrong. How you are dealing with your boyfriend must be the right thing for you, but it wouldnt be the right thing for me.

And dont worry men who want you by their side on a night out do exist, my last bf was like that, my best friends bf of 4 years is still like that. There is someone out there for you who will be like that.
Also I want to say in them situations we did not spend all our time together we had seperate lives but with going out, we would do that together.

Maguined

Do you never go for a girls night out? a bunch of girls going out for a few drinks and then dancing at a club?

Nearly every woman my age does this and does not invite their boyfriends as it supposed to be about bonding with the group of girlfriends.

Leelaa22

I have done but only when another girl is organising and inviting people. Honestly I dont see the point of girls nights out or lads nights out. At the end of the day its a night out.
Id never not invite a guy just because he is a guy. I know alot of people do the whole lads night and girls night, but tbh I really don't see the point.

Maguined

I don't see the point if it is everything a couple go out they do it separately but likewise I don't see the point of a couple only going out together, a nice healthy balance of going out with your girlfriend and going out with friends is the best for me anyway.

Leelaa22

Maguined wrote: »

I don't see the point if it is everything a couple go out they do it separately but likewise I don't see the point of a couple only going out together, a nice healthy balance of going out with your girlfriend and going out with friends is the best for me anyway.

Im not saying they always have to go out together.
Im saying the invite should always be there though. Its polite.
What im saying there is I dont see the point in making a night all girls or all men.

Otis Driftwood

In my last relationship myself and my GF used to always have our own night out,me with my mates,her with hers and this was the case nearly every Friday night.The rest of the weekend or during the week we did the coupley stuff.This idea that one cant go out without the other is mind boggling and it smacks of massive insecurity on both sides.A friend and his now wife were like that.They were joined at the friggin hip.I know when Im out with my male friends I wouldnt want my other half there all the time,sometimes blokes just have to be blokes.Likewise I wouldnt want to be out every night with a gaggle of women.I love female company but jeez louise there is only so much talk about x factor or whatever else is flavour of the month at any given time that one can tolerate.

Leelaa22

nedtheshed wrote: »

In my last relationship myself and my GF used to always have our own night out,me with my mates,her with hers and this was the case nearly every Friday night.The rest of the weekend or during the week we did the coupley stuff.This idea that one cant go out without the other is mind boggling and it smacks of massive insecurity on both sides.A friend and his now wife were like that.They were joined at the friggin hip.I know when Im out with my male friends I wouldnt want my other half there all the time,sometimes blokes just have to be blokes.Likewise I wouldnt want to be out every night with a gaggle of women.I love female company but jeez louise there is only so much talk about x factor or whatever else is flavour of the month at any given time that one can tolerate.

you really think all we do is gossip about things like x factor?