MX-5 - Oops (and I need tyre advice!)

Glowing

Hiya,

Was out driving my pride and joy yesterday in the torrential rain - roads were fairly slick. Did a hillstart at a junction followed by an immediate right hand turn, and gave myself the fright of my life by spinning out the back of the car - but managed to right myself quickly enough and continue on

Now, I did give it more power than it actually needed (still getting used to it!!) - but made me realise that I need to be accutely aware of the road surface and conditions esp with the rear wheel drive. (It did sound pretty cool though LOL )

Now, there is 1 odd tyre on the car - there are 3 Bridgestone Turanza's on it, but one of the rear ones is a Pirelli 6000. I think I need to sort this out asap, before the weather gets much worse (Edit: size is 195/50 R15)

What should I do? Replace them all or just the odd one? Where can I order tyres for the best price?

Thanks a mil for your advice (again) :pac:

jenizzle

I've done the same thing myself more than once - even going straight through lights, the wheels decide to go on a wheelspin adventure just to amuse me :rolleyes: It's an exciting world out there when yer driving the rain in an MX5. As for the tyres, haven't a clue but I'm sure someone else will step in!

Seth Brundle

What condition are they in?
Its best to keep both tyres on each axle the same in terms of condition, size and make/type.

Glowing

Actually just came across this blog http://www.atomineer.com/redmx5/mod_tyres.html - this bloke recommends the Goodyear Eagle F1 GSD3 - would they be a good choice?

@ Kbannon, the 3 Bridgestone are pretty good, I think the Pirelli definately needs to be replaced however.

Seth Brundle

Dunnon what the GSD3 part is but I've had Eagle F1s several times over the years and they were great in terms of adhesion but as a result, they lasted about 20k miles if I was lucky

Glowing

kbannon wrote: »

Dunnon what the GSD3 part is but I've had Eagle F1s several times over the years and they were great in terms of adhesion but as a result, they lasted about 20k miles if I was lucky

Thanks a mil - are they considered winter tyres or good for all year round? Also, would you suggest putting these on the rear of the car only?

Should I have 2 sets of wheels for the car, winter and rest-of-year?

Seth Brundle

We don't get weather that would justify a set of winter tyres IMO!

Tea 1000

Glowing wrote: »

Actually just came across this blog http://www.atomineer.com/redmx5/mod_tyres.html - this bloke recommends the Goodyear Eagle F1 GSD3 - would they be a good choice?

@ Kbannon, the 3 Bridgestone are pretty good, I think the Pirelli definately needs to be replaced however.

There's no way the Eagle F1's are €200 each, not at 195 50 R15's. You should get them for around €100 each. Maybe even less if you're lucky.
They're a great tyre.
Pirelli are good too, but the P6000's are their entry level really. OK at best.

You'll get very very good 195 50 15 tyres for quite small money (€60/€70 ish). I would have thought an MX5 would have wider rears than 195 though.

Tea 1000

Glowing wrote: »

Thanks a mil - are they considered winter tyres or good for all year round? Also, would you suggest putting these on the rear of the car only?

Should I have 2 sets of wheels for the car, winter and rest-of-year?

If the fronts are good, then you can just put the F1's on the rear. Bridgestone Turanza's are very good too, so leave them on the front if they're in good nick.
Worth bearing in mind that different brand tyres can behave differently with different sizes.

Glowing

Tea 1000 wrote: »

There's no way the Eagle F1's are €200 each, not at 195 50 R15's. You should get them for around €100 each.

Yeah DOH, I was looking at the wrong size!! I saw them on tyreshop.ie for 70 quid each.

Glowing

RoverJames wrote: »

You'll get very very good 195 50 15 tyres for quite small money (€60/€70 ish). I would have thought an MX5 would have wider rears than 195 though.

Here is where my complete lack of knowledge of tyres is starting to show through - what is the benefit of having wider tyres? Should I consider buying new wheels or just stick with the 195's?

Bonito

Get rid of the Pirelli, get 2 new turanzas for the rears and fit the current rear turanza to the spare wheel (if the mx5 have a spare wheel.)

Benefits of wider tyres is more tyre surface area on the road. Spreads the load more evenly and keeps the car more flat and through.

The alloys on your MX-5 should take up to a 215 but I wouldn't be the man to ask on how wide a tyre their standard alloys can take.

Tea 1000

Glowing wrote: »

Here is where my complete lack of knowledge of tyres is starting to show through - what is the benefit of having wider tyres? Should I consider buying new wheels or just stick with the 195's?

Wider tyres typically mean more grip, but your alloy will take a maximum of a certain size. It's very possible that the MX5 takes those size tyres, as Mazda deliberatly didn't want it to have too much grip as it took from the playfullness of the handling!
As well as good tyres, go to an empty car park on a rainy Sunday to practice getting the back out and catching it! Best do this with the old ones!

Glowing

Tea 1000 wrote: »

As well as good tyres, go to an empty car park on a rainy Sunday to practice getting the back out and catching it! Best do this with the old ones!

Not only is that a good idea, it sounds like FUN too

Bonito

Glowing wrote: »

Not only is that a good idea, it sounds like FUN too

For a real test, stick some McDonalds trays under the front tyres and hold the foot brake while doing it.

Glowing

Bonito wrote: »

For a real test, stick some McDonalds trays under the front tyres and hold the foot brake while doing it.

:eek:

Tell me you're joking?

Bonito

Glowing wrote: »

:eek:

Tell me you're joking?

OK, maybe a bit too advanced for you. :pac:

Glowing

Okay before I can become an advanced McDonald's tray driver, how I can tell the maximum width tyre that will fit on my wheels?

Bonito

Glowing wrote: »

Okay before I can become an advanced McDonald's tray driver, how I can tell the maximum width tyre that will fit on my wheels?

Are they standard alloys? Contact your local mazda dealers and ask for their service department and ask a mechanic.

Or, someone on here might be able to tell you.

Glowing

Bonito wrote: »

Are they standard alloys? Contact your local mazda dealers and ask for their service department and ask a mechanic.

Or, someone on here might be able to tell you.

This is them:



According to the Phoenix car site, they're Enkie 15's.

Bonito

If they are Enkei 15's then the base is 7 inches so they'll take any tyre width up to about 225.

A quick google reveals that 195 50 15 is the most popular size on MX5s (according to MX5 forums). Apparently 15s are the best wheel size, 16s and 17s are deemed too heavy and also the relative cheapness of excellent 195 50 15s makes 15s the way to go. Does an MX5 have much of a boot at all ? Years back folks used to throw a builders block in the boot of tail happy rwd little roadsters to reduce twitchiness. Puts a bit more weight over the the back wheels, although if you lose that it will make it harder to get back. Better scratch that idea so

Bonito

Weirdly enough, the P6000 in a 205 are coming back better than the Turanza's.

Glowing

The Goodyear F1's have gotten really good reviews too - are there any issues in having 2 different sets of tyres on the front and back?

The boot is not as bad as you'd expect, there is a teeny space saving tyre aka bicycle tyre in the back. I've heard about that idea re. the breezeblock alright, but tbh it'd just make me even more dangerous

Bonito

Glowing wrote: »

The Goodyear F1's have gotten really good reviews too - are there any issues in having 2 different sets of tyres on the front and back?

The boot is not as bad as you'd expect, there is a teeny space saving tyre aka bicycle tyre in the back. I've heard about that idea re. the breezeblock alright, but tbh it'd just make me even more dangerous

Nope. It's just not recommended to have different ones on the same axle. I.e. your one Turanza and one P6000 on the rear.

Some people do like mixing and matching their tyres. Some tyres are good at holding a straight line and some are good at holding a corner. Depending on what sort of power you're putting down and if your car is AWD, FWD or RWD it takes a couple sets sometimes to hit it right.

peasant

also worth checking how old the tyres are ..the older, the harder, the slippier in the wet

Reesy

I've Toyo T1Rs (14") on my MX5, and I'm very happy with them.

ps More MX5-specific advice & opinions at www.mx5ireland.com.

2 Espressi

I'd put the two best matched (and hopefully) less worn fronts on the back, unprovoked understeer being preferrable to oversteer.

Regarding the difference in wheel/tyre widths, I've two sets of wheels for the 5, the original daisies with 185 width tyres, and a set of 15" with 195 width tyres.

While the wider tyres has more grip, when they do let go, it's usually much snappier and harder to catch. There's more of a progression from grip to slip with the narrower tyres, which makes them a hell of a lot more fun!

I'd sooner have a decent set of 185s under me than a set of comedy donuts 205s.

Reesy, where did you get 14" T1Rs? The only Toyos I could find for the 14s last time were CF1s on camskills.

Ferris

OP, with all due respect it sounds like your incident was caused by you not being used to yuor car having RWD.

My car is similar to yours in that its rwd and has no traction control or anything to cut the power to stop a slide. Trust me when i say that autumn/winter is always going to catch your car out in this department, pretty much regardless of which tyres you use (although good tyres are always a must with rwd). Its simple really, when its wet/mucky/icy or there are leaves on the road, slow down to reasonable speeds and drive smoothly.

Also a driving course where they teach you how to steer into a slide and control a rear driven car would be a good idea - and good fun too. Hoodluming it up in a deserted carpark is not too bad an idea to learn where the cars limits are but make sure that there is nothing to hit and nobody will be disturbed by your antics.;)

Ferris

Ferris wrote: »

Hoodluming it up in a deserted carpark is not too bad an idea to learn where the cars limits are but make sure that there is nothing to hit and nobody will be disturbed by your antics.;)

folks have found themselves in court for that too, something to keep in mind.

Vertakill

Ferris wrote: »

OP, with all due respect it sounds like your incident was caused by you not being used to yuor car having RWD.

Was thinking the same myself but was debating whether to say it or not!
I'm sure the tyres, if they weren't quite right, didn't help either though!

The road surface doesn't even have to be that wet, it could just be an area that collects grease/oil and you'll find yourself in a world of hurt.

Without any disrespect OP, I would make 100% certain I knew the biting point of the clutch asap.
Pulling off at a junction or anywhere where you're a little bit at risk from other traffic, especially doing a hill start, to avoid cutting out you might be inclined to over rev it "to be sure to be sure" but that's when you can get caught out.

It takes different amounts of time for everyone to get completely at ease with their new cars.
Some RWD cars are more forgiving than others so be careful out there!

ytareh

In my humble opinion rear wheel drive with very few exceptions (Post 99 BMW 3 and maybe 5 series) should only be driven ON WET ROADS (ie Irish ones much of the time) by either very experienced or VERY cautious drivers .
Its as simple as this , the 'panic reflex' of taking foot off accelerator mid bend will put you in a ditch in most RWDs whereas in FWD it may keep on the road.
I recall a very humbling experience driving a 2.5 Merc 190 Cosworth and being passed and left for dead by a (FWD) Ford Transit!

ytareh

ytareh wrote: »

In my humble opinion rear wheel drive with very few exceptions (Post 99 BMW 3 and maybe 5 series) should only be driven ON WET ROADS

Include a 1993 520i in that Drove one for 4000 miles and she was very well planted, and she was wearing Accelera tyres :eek: (big no no on boards.ie according to the experts :pac: )

Glowing

Ferris wrote: »

OP, with all due respect it sounds like your incident was caused by you not being used to yuor car having RWD.

Duh!

Seriously though, I completely agree!! It's a whole different kettle of fish!!! I've gone from driving a 93 Golf for 7 years to this ... I knew that RWD cars were tail happy alright but never knew up to now what it's limits were. How are you supposed to get used to driving a RWD unless you acually drive a RWD!

You'll see I said in my first post that I need to ensure I'm accutely aware of road surface and conditions from now on. I'm a reasonably cautious driver in general (much to my husband's frustration), in particular when it was pouring down like on that day - so I hold my hands up and say I was caught out due to a number of different factors, mainly due to my inexperience in the car but the conditions certainly didn't help either. I'm hoping some new grippier tyres will help, but at least now I know how easily it can happen, and I can take precautions too.

(and as loads of other people have said, I'm not alone in spinning out the back of an MX-5 so please don't assume I'm a crap driver )

P.S I looked into doing an advanced driving course a few years ago and had no luck. Does anyone have any links or contacts? I did a Rally Driving course in a Subaru down in Waterford 2 years ago, that was a hell of a lot of fun! :pac:

P.P.S Fun and all as it sounds, I'm not really a car-park hoodlum kinda girl

galwaytt

RoverJames wrote: »

You'll get very very good 195 50 15 tyres for quite small money (€60/€70 ish). I would have thought an MX5 would have wider rears than 195 though.

..nope, thank god. One of the few cars that eschew's big rims and tyres. Bigger most assuredly is worse, in this case......

Glowing wrote: »

Here is where my complete lack of knowledge of tyres is starting to show through - what is the benefit of having wider tyres? Should I consider buying new wheels or just stick with the 195's?

Glowing, stick with the 195's, but go for a lightweight carcass - the Toyo's mentioned below, and on www.MX5ireland.com show that the car is too light to adequately heat a lot of the tyres out there. The Toyo's, though, respond well. There is a point at which bigger/fatter tyres work against you. Consider, my old Porsche uses 205 x 15's, and is comfortably rated to 156mph with them. My 1.9 Saab diesel uses 225 R 17's. Complete madness. They look great, but are a complete waste of money, imho. But a good quality, matching standard, tyre will perform perfectly well.

Reesy wrote: »

I've Toyo T1Rs (14") on my MX5, and I'm very happy with them.

ps More MX5-specific advice & opinions at www.mx5ireland.com.

+1

Vertakill

Well Glowing, the upside is, now you're very aware of what can happen and you've not sworn off RWD cars forever - which is always a good thing.

We've probably all done it at least once when starting off.
I know I did. Fish tailed off a greasy roundabout one afternoon... luckily the exit was wide enough for a few tail sweeps...

My sister drove her last car (FWD) for years and wasn't aware of what may happen when she fully locked her wheels one direction and then floored it... needless to say, luckily, she found out on a not-so-busy t-junction.

So, it's good that you now have first hand experience of what can happen if things go wrong!

Ferris

Glowing wrote: »

(and as loads of other people have said, I'm not alone in spinning out the back of an MX-5 so please don't assume I'm a crap driver )

I never did, sorry if it sounded like that. The fact that you are trying to find out how to drive a rwd car better shows how good a driver you are imo.

Glowing wrote: »

P.P.S Fun and all as it sounds, I'm not really a car-park hoodlum kinda girl

I'm not into it either but the point is that you if you could find a way of finding the grip limits of your car and know what to do when the rear pushes out that would prepare you for the unexpected.

challengemaster

Glowing wrote: »

The Goodyear F1's have gotten really good reviews too - are there any issues in having 2 different sets of tyres on the front and back?

Quite a lot of RWD cars do have different tyres front and back, mainly due to the back ones being much wider. I've even heard of the back wheels being 18's while the fronts are 16/17's, but definitely having wider tyres on the rear is a common thing