UK county council to outsource most services

rightwingdub

Just saw this article on the BBC site that Suffolk County council is to outsource most services in the next few years including the libary service, personally I think its a good idea and should be used here in Ireland in our overbloated local government system.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11398678

Koloman

Could save us a small fortune if it was properly implemented here.

rightwingdub

Koloman wrote: »

Could save us a small fortune if it was properly implemented here.

Agreed apparently Suffolk Co Council are planning to outsource most services over a 4 year period, I would be delighted if it was done here in Ireland.

Lenny Lovett

Most UK councils have already outsourced much of their services such as street cleansing, road/amenity maintainance, admin, rent/tax/rates collections, housing, leisure etc. They privatised the water services years ago. You'd be amazed how efficient they all became even though most of the private contractors hired the existing council staff. They just made them work instead of letting them laze around like here.

rightwingdub

Lenny Lovett wrote: »

Most UK councils have already outsourced much of their services such as street cleansing, road/amenity maintainance, admin, rent/tax/rates collections, housing, leisure etc. They privatised the water services years ago. You'd be amazed how efficient they all became even though most of the private contractors hired the existing council staff. They just made them work instead of letting them laze around like here.

Were the private contractors unionised, if they weren't unionised thats probably why all the workers actually worked in a more efficient manner.

Lenny Lovett

rightwingdub wrote: »

Were the private contractors unionised, if they weren't unionised thats probably why all the workers actually worked in a more efficient manner.

Yes. AFAIK they are unionised, however, the Unions don't have as much clout, as everyone was on new contracts with modern terms and conditions rather than the outdated ones they had. Also the jobs weren't guaranteed regardless of performance like Government ones would be.

rightwingdub

Lenny Lovett wrote: »

Yes. AFAIK they are unionised, however, the Unions don't have as much clout, as everyone was on new contracts with modern terms and conditions rather than the outdated ones they had. Also the jobs weren't guaranteed regardless of performance like Government ones would be.

In Ireland if such outsourcing was ever introduced then the workers would have to enter the real world even if they were unionised. All bin services should be outsourced, ditto with water services, same with welfare offices, libaries etc.

Lenny Lovett

rightwingdub wrote: »

In Ireland if such outsourcing was ever introduced then the workers would have to enter the real world even if they were unionised. All bin services should be outsourced, ditto with water services, same with welfare offices, libaries etc.

Michael O'Leary advocated it years ago. He suggested starting with the Passport office and Social Welfare Claims. His idea is that the contractor gets paid per Passport/Claim and only gets paid when a Social Welfare Claim is completed (or declined whichever) and, as he said, the days of a claimant waiting months would end overnight. Likewise,as he said with passports, they'd do them while you wait if it means getting paid by the turnaround.

Shea O'Meara

Most council work (maintenance etc.) in Ireland is already outsourced. If you call the council because work has not started on this that or the other you'll most often be told the job is with the contractor, in other words the Council, like you and I just have to wait on the contractor to turn up. And of course a contractor can tell you to go f*** yourself if you call with a complaint and there's nothing you can do about it.
The council depots are not teaming with tradesmen sitting about, doing crosswords, drinking tea etc.
By the way, if not for unions you'd be working twice as long for half as much. I guess you could always look to the government for assistance as they always favour the little guy over big business, like say banks.:rolleyes:

Shea O'Meara

rightwingdub wrote: »

In Ireland if such outsourcing was ever introduced then the workers would have to enter the real world even if they were unionised. All bin services should be outsourced, ditto with water services, same with welfare offices, libaries etc.

Look at London, privatising water was/is a disaster. Water loses due to unmaintained pipes and costs to the customer varying company to company. I thought all the recycling was already outsourced?
I believe the more we put into private hands the less recourse we have. Tax paying for infastructure, sold off to private enterprise. Eircom anybody?

Lenny Lovett

Shea O'Meara wrote: »

Most council work (maintenance etc.) in Ireland is already outsourced. If you call the council because work has not started on this that or the other you'll most often be told the job is with the contractor, in other words the Council, like you and I just have to wait on the contractor to turn up. And of course a contractor can tell you to go f*** yourself if you call with a complaint and there's nothing you can do about it.

Well, they need to sort that crap out fast!

Shea O'Meara wrote: »

The council depots are not teaming with tradesmen sitting about, doing crosswords, drinking tea etc.
By the way, if not for unions you'd be working twice as long for half as much.

Well, many of us work in the private sector and are glad of the jobs so long hours aren't an issue.

Shea O'Meara wrote: »

I guess you could always look to the government for assistance as they always favour the little guy over big business, like say banks.:rolleyes:

They have been known to bankroll the Unions too. Isn't there some question marks over a few million Euro "resting in the Union's bank account"?

flutered

Shea O'Meara wrote: »

Look at London, privatising water was/is a disaster. Water loses due to unmaintained pipes and costs to the customer varying company to company. I thought all the recycling was already outsourced?

so dublin is not looking to take water from the shannon because of all the waste and loss

Shea O'Meara

Lenny Lovett wrote: »

Well, they need to sort that crap out fast!

You see now you may have a gripe with a private firm who are not as beholding to the taxpayer. Private contractor put tenders in to councils and are used on that basis. If the economy is bad, you'll get a pretty good service. If the economy is good with plenty of jobs/work a contractor will put several jobs on the long finger.

Lenny Lovett wrote: »

Well, many of us work in the private sector and are glad of the jobs so long hours aren't an issue.

I work in the private sector and long hours are an issue. Quality of life is one of the reasons I work, but I do enjoy living outside of work.

Lenny Lovett wrote: »

They have been known to bankroll the Unions too. Isn't there some question marks over a few million Euro "resting in the Union's bank account"?

Yes. We also have corrupt politicians, should we do away with all governments too?

Fratton Fred

Shea O'Meara wrote: »

Look at London, privatising water was/is a disaster. Water loses due to unmaintained pipes and costs to the customer varying company to company. I thought all the recycling was already outsourced?
I believe the more we put into private hands the less recourse we have. Tax paying for infastructure, sold off to private enterprise. Eircom anybody?

the thing is, in London we know there is water loss, because the privately owned companies are monitored, their performance reported and, in the case of Thames water, they get penalised for falling short of targets.

If water was still state owned, no one would be any the wiser.

By the way, the thing holding eircom back is not the owners or the management, it is the ridiculous working practices in place there that they can't change because the people affected are on pre 1986 contracts.

Lenny Lovett

Shea O'Meara wrote: »

You see now you may have a gripe with a private firm who are not as beholding to the taxpayer. Private contractor put tenders in to councils and are used on that basis. If the economy is bad, you'll get a pretty good service. If the economy is good with plenty of jobs/work a contractor will put several jobs on the long finger.

Well from my experience in the UK, I have never had a problem that couldn't be sorted out by calling a Dept Manager. Have you ever tried addressing a problem with a council or civil service body here?:rolleyes:

Shea O'Meara wrote: »

I work in the private sector and long hours are an issue. Quality of life is one of the reasons I work, but I do enjoy living outside of work.

I enjoy a life outside work too and I work hard to be able to so do. I still do contract work for a major UK state sponsored body and they are just lazy!

Shea O'Meara wrote: »

Yes. We also have corrupt politicians, should we do away with all governments too?

OK, so you believe in Unions. I don't. We'll agree to differ? And Yes! I'd do away with many Governments given half a chance especially ours! Our esteemed (or should that be steamed;)) Government have been away for the past three months and the country is not much worse off now than when they left.

Shea O'Meara wrote: »

Look at London, privatising water was/is a disaster. Water loses due to unmaintained pipes and costs to the customer varying company to company.

And our system is better? Aren't our water pipes leaking all over the country and rather than repair them they want to rape the Shannon. FFS!

Shea O'Meara wrote: »

I thought all the recycling was already outsourced?

Some is, some is still processed by Councils.

Shea O'Meara wrote: »

I believe the more we put into private hands the less recourse we have. Tax paying for infastructure, sold off to private enterprise. Eircom anybody?

Not if done properly and a policing system put in place.