Sean O Brien citing

ormondprop

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebmbo0KmqLY

whats your opinion on this, fairly stupid thing to do, probably get a few weeks ban

d'Oracle

Dumb bugger.
Even if he didn't mean to catch the lads eye, what the hell is hanging out of his Scrumcap supposed to achieve?

I'm getting mighty sick of this BS.

Otacon

Stupid thing to do but seeing as this is the Magner's League, he will get a two weeks ban, maximum.

ormondprop

Otacon wrote: »

Stupid thing to do but seeing as this is the Magner's League, he will get a two weeks ban, maximum.

thats a bit stupid if you can only get a maximum 2 week ban, when lads can get up to 12 weeks in the heiniken cup

outwest

its is a joke but the irfu will be giving the ban, they wont ban one of their players with the internationals coming up

thomond2006

ormondprop wrote: »

thats a bit stupid if you can only get a maximum 2 week ban, when lads can get up to 12 weeks in the heiniken cup

It is stupid but there's a valid reason that it happens.

In the Magners, the IRFU are the ones who hand out the ban. This is mindboggling, since the IRFU have a vested interest in the success of the provinces and the national team. Banning a good player like SOB goes against the above.

In the Heineken Cup, the ERC meet out the discipline. Since they aren't affiliated to any national association, they don't care what team does well or what player is in hot water. They are independent and impartial. Of course sometimes they can be too harsh, for example in Shane Jennings' case. However you can't really complain because they are consistent across the board from what I've seen, David Attoub got a huge ban for a very serious eye contact offence.

It beggars belief that the ML haven't brought in independent citing commissioners and independent 'judges' if you will. Perhaps it's a question of money.

Crash

I remember reading an interview with the guy who's now head of celtic rugby (head of the Lions as well, iirc) who said that they are planning on bringing it in, but it wasn't something that he could get through in time for the start of the new season.

Shelflife

that was a nasty bit of work there by o brien, no need to have his hand anywhere near his face.

it appears to me that contact was made with the eyes and that it was deliberate in the sense that there was no other reason for his fingers to be in that area.

It should be a 12 week ban if they want to be consistant.

d'Oracle

Shelflife wrote: »

that was a nasty bit of work there by o brien, no need to have his hand anywhere near his face.

it appears to me that contact was made with the eyes and that it was deliberate in the sense that there was no other reason for his fingers to be in that area.

It should be a 12 week ban if they want to be consistant.

I love the way some people talk about gouging like they are a press release by the citing commissioner.

phog

d'Oracle wrote: »

I love the way some people talk about gouging like they are a press release by the citing commissioner.

The only person that has mentioned gouging on this thread is yourself

What he did was pure stupid and he certainly meant to drag his hand along the players face but I dont for one minute think he ever intended any contact with the players eyes.

danthefan

Shelflife wrote: »

that was a nasty bit of work there by o brien, no need to have his hand anywhere near his face.

it appears to me that contact was made with the eyes and that it was deliberate in the sense that there was no other reason for his fingers to be in that area.

It should be a 12 week ban if they want to be consistant.

Pathetic, I don't like where rugby is going if that's worth a 3 month ban.

AdeT

danthefan wrote: »

Pathetic, I don't like where rugby is going if that's worth a 3 month ban.

It's a silly bit of carry on from SOB but not 3 months in my opinion

Does the player on the ground from Treviso get close the other leinster player's eye in the 2nd second of the video?

CatFromHue

its not a gouge, he isnt even looking at the guys faces as he drags his hand along it.

he is looking to pull him away by his scrum cap

its silly as its nothing to do with him and his leinster teammate is on top in the scuffle!

there is nothing in it

but who can guess what the ban of there is one will be!

danthefan

AdeT wrote: »

It's a silly bit of carry on from SOB but not 3 months in my opinion

Does the player on the ground from Treviso get close the other leinster player's eye in the 2nd second of the video?

It was silly alright but plenty of silly things happen on a rugby field.

And yes to the second bit but there's nothing in it.

thomond2006

Still no word according to RTE, the hearing was held today.

kensutz

O'Brien is cleared to play

d'Oracle

phog wrote: »

The only person that has mentioned gouging on this thread is yourself

What he did was pure stupid and he certainly meant to drag his hand along the players face but I dont for one minute think he ever intended any contact with the players eyes.

That is the most pedantic thing I have read in years.

outwest

as expected, if it was erc it would be a much differnet outcome,

he wont do it again tho, good news for ireland, but i dont like the look after your own attditude in terms of banning players,

B0X

I think this is genius, if he had gotten say 3 weeks people would be up in arms over inconsistency, however, by not banning him at all people may think that he actually didnt do anything in the first place.

phog

d'Oracle wrote: »

That is the most pedantic thing I have read in years.

Maybe but it was correct

Shelflife

danthefan wrote: »

Pathetic, I don't like where rugby is going if that's worth a 3 month ban.

i never said it was worth a three month ban, what i said was to be consistant it would warrant it.

danthefan you dont have to shove your fingers into the socket to damage the eye a nail across the eye can do serious damage.

what he did was stupid,dangerous and a cheap shot on what was in effect a defenceless player, ball was gone minor handbags going on and he drags his hand over his face and eyes ---- why would you want to pull a players scrum cap off ???

hes a very lucky man, very lucky. i hope he learns from it.

irishbucsfan

Shelflife wrote: »

i never said it was worth a three month ban, what i said was to be consistant it would warrant it.

danthefan you dont have to shove your fingers into the socket to damage the eye a nail across the eye can do serious damage.

what he did was stupid,dangerous and a cheap shot on what was in effect a defenceless player, ball was gone minor handbags going on and he drags his hand over his face and eyes ---- why would you want to pull a players scrum cap off ???

hes a very lucky man, very lucky. i hope he learns from it.

Your version of events differ wildly from what actually happened.

The Treviso player was involved in a scuffle with Strauss(? Have to look again to see that) and O'Brien reached down to help his team mate by grabbing the Italian's scrum cap. While he wasn't looking, he missed with his hand and placed it on the Italian's chin. Then he looks down (for the first time) and moves his hand up and grabs the scrum cap.

There is no indication that there is ANY downwards pressure onto the players face while SOB moves his hand. Therefore to say he "dragged" his hand across the Italian's face is wrong.


SOB did absolutely nothing wrong, and the Treviso management obviously agree.

Digifriendly

Shelflife wrote: »

hes a very lucky man, very lucky. i hope he learns from it.

Surely the only thing he will learn is how much you can get away without being punished.

danthefan

Digifriendly wrote: »

Surely the only thing he will learn is how much you can get away without being punished.

What has he gotten away with exactly?

siochain

hand raked across the face, looks like intent was there and could have potiental caused damage. Rugby is a tough physical game and there is no place for this in the game. 12 weeks would be fair call.

All sorts of suff goes on in rucks, for me everthing but gauging, stamping\ruck to the head area is far game.

Leinster supporter.

Shelflife

"SOB did absolutely nothing wrong"

of course not .

no point argueing with you dan, you carry on there.

irishbucsfan

Shelflife wrote: »

"SOB did absolutely nothing wrong"

of course not .

no point argueing with you dan, you carry on there.

I said that.

That's great. You can go ahead and chase down gouging incidents that don't exist and make a mockery of any attempts to stamp it out of the game.

I'm happy knowing that fellow fans, the IRFU and the team/player this particular "gouging" allegedly took place against disagree with you.

Chucky the tree

It wasn't a gouge but he made contact with the eye area. If this was HEC he'd out for a good while

Shelflife

apologies to dan, please insert irishbucsfan in his place.

Goodluck2me

Shelflife wrote: »

that was a nasty bit of work there by o brien, no need to have his hand anywhere near his face.

it appears to me that contact was made with the eyes and that it was deliberate in the sense that there was no other reason for his fingers to be in that area.

It should be a 12 week ban if they want to be consistant.

Ridiculous, it was harmless what he did, people need to get a grip if they think players should be banned for this...

outwest wrote: »

as expected, if it was erc it would be a much differnet outcome,

he wont do it again tho, good news for ireland, but i dont like the look after your own attditude in terms of banning players,

Again, the ERC wouldnt ban him either, it was an absolutely nothing incident.

Shelflife wrote: »

i never said it was worth a three month ban, what i said was to be consistant it would warrant it.

Consistent with what? Neil Best and the stade francais players incidents were infinitely worse.

Lads, this is no worse than a vigourous clear-out of a ruck, if he contacted the eye it would be pure fluke and unlucky.

siochain

Goodluck2me wrote: »

Lads, this is no worse than a vigourous clear-out of a ruck, if he contacted the eye it would be pure fluke and unlucky.

way off the mark, vigorous clear-out of a ruck is within in the rules and great part of the game.

Any contact to the eye area is out of order and could result in a very unlucky permanently damaging injury to the receiving player.

Having played as an open side for many years I love the contact in the tackle and break down area. But this thing of contact to the eye area has no place in the game.

pappyodaniel

It was a really dumb thing to do, much like Alan Quinlan on Leo Cullen but luckily for SO'B the outcome was different.

I'm really glad for him as I do believe there was no intent to gouge, just an act of frustration and stupidity.

murphym7

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Your version of events differ wildly from what actually happened.

The Treviso player was involved in a scuffle with Strauss(? Have to look again to see that) and O'Brien reached down to help his team mate by grabbing the Italian's scrum cap. While he wasn't looking, he missed with his hand and placed it on the Italian's chin. Then he looks down (for the first time) and moves his hand up and grabs the scrum cap.

There is no indication that there is ANY downwards pressure onto the players face while SOB moves his hand. Therefore to say he "dragged" his hand across the Italian's face is wrong.


SOB did absolutely nothing wrong, and the Treviso management obviously agree.

Stauss not big enough to take care of himself? He was coming off the better of the scuffle anyway.

It was not a gouge, no argument. But does anyone else not think that dragging a fella by the scrum cap isnt dangerous?? Its tied around the neck for f**k sake. A short ban to focus the mind on discipline and safety would be appropriate. Two on one, with the one being on his back on the ground, very brave.

Diom

CatFromHue wrote: »

its not a gouge, he isnt even looking at the guys faces as he drags his hand along it.

he is looking to pull him away by his scrum cap

its silly as its nothing to do with him and his leinster teammate is on top in the scuffle!

there is nothing in it

but who can guess what the ban of there is one will be!

He has his fingers in the eye area of the face. That's a gouge. His finger is hooked as it hits the eye.
Plus what the hell was he doing in the first place dragging a player by the scrum cap.

IMO he deserved 6 weeks at least.

weareallmarks

it was a gouge!

he is lucky to have gotten away with it.. very lucky. good news for leinster ....

JustinDee

murphym7 wrote: »

It was not a gouge, no argument. But does anyone else not think that dragging a fella by the scrum cap isnt dangerous?? Its tied around the neck for f**k sake. A short ban to focus the mind on discipline and safety would be appropriate. Two on one, with the one being on his back on the ground, very brave.

Thats not what he was cited for though.

danthefan

So just to be clear, the Treviso management say it wasn't a gouge and the Treviso player says it wasn't a gouge, but some guys on the internet know better. Got it.

weareallmarks

dan you can see the right ring finger lifting up the treviso players eyelid on his right eye.... looking at it it is a gauge...but the intent is the question...


and at the end of the day he walked out without a ban so its onward and upward....it was a wwe eye rake...

danthefan

weareallmarks wrote: »

dan you can see the right ring finger lifting up the treviso players eyelid on his right eye.... looking at it it is a gauge...but the intent is the question...


and at the end of the day he walked out without a ban so its onward and upward....it was a wwe eye rake...

So you are actually saying you know better than the Treviso management and supposed victim. Good lord.

siochain

danthefan wrote: »

So you are actually saying you know better than the Treviso management and supposed victim. Good lord.

New HC club like Treviso may have a motive not push the issue.

Peter B

murphym7 wrote: »

But does anyone else not think that dragging a fella by the scrum cap isnt dangerous?? Its tied around the neck for f**k sake.

Scrum cap is secured around the chin. Dragging someone by their scrum cap will only keep their mouth shut. Not dangerous at all.

Peter B

siochain wrote: »

New HC club like Treviso may have a motive not push the issue.

I reckon when it was highlighted Treviso originally had no knowledge of it. When they saw the video they saw it was just an accident and rightly so in my opinion thought it was no issue.

I remember back in my playing days in a maul struggling for balance ended up putting my hand on what I thought was the ground, ended up being an opponents face. Also have felt the soft wet insides of someone face during while handing off another player. Also while tackling someone, they ducked as I was tacking and my hand ended up going straight into their face.

These things happen in rugby. Its when it is done on purpose that it really grinds my gears.

duckysauce

Peter B wrote: »

Scrum cap is secured around the chin. Dragging someone by their scrum cap will only keep their mouth shut. Not dangerous at all.

it is it their tongue is sticking out at the time or sobs finger is in the mouth, someone could lose a finger or tongue and it will all end in tears

Peter B

duckysauce wrote: »

it is it their tongue is sticking out at the time or sobs finger is in the mouth, someone could lose a finger or tongue and it will all end in tears

I think what you are trying to say is that if a player is having their scrum cap pulled they could lose a tongue if they have it sticking out. Really? You actually believe that? Somehow the player pulling on the scrum cap is going to pull with so much force the other player is going to bite off their own tongue? Between their gum shield and bottom teeth?

Really?

Also Sean O'Brien would have done well to be pulling the players jersey with one hand the scrum cap with the other hand, all the while with fingers in the guys mouth?

Lets not let this snowball. It was not a very dangerous thing Sean O'Brien was doing by pulling on the scrum cap.

duckysauce

Peter B wrote: »

I think what you are trying to say is that if a player is having their scrum cap pulled they could lose a tongue if they have it sticking out. Really? You actually believe that? Somehow the player pulling on the scrum cap is going to pull with so much force the other player is going to bite off their own tongue? Between their gum shield and bottom teeth?

Really?

Also Sean O'Brien would have done well to be pulling the players jersey with one hand the scrum cap with the other hand, all the while with fingers in the guys mouth?

Lets not let this snowball. It was not a very dangerous thing Sean O'Brien was doing by pulling on the scrum cap.

ever hear of tongue in cheek humour ?

Jigga

danthefan wrote: »

So just to be clear, the Treviso management say it wasn't a gouge and the Treviso player says it wasn't a gouge, but some guys on the internet know better. Got it.

Leo Cullen said Alan Quinlan didn't gouge him, Nick Kennedy said Shane Jennings didn't gouge him. Both got lengthy bans, O'Brien can count himself very lucky.

phog

Jigga wrote: »

Leo Cullen said Alan Quinlan didn't gouge him, Nick Kennedy said Shane Jennings didn't gouge him. Both got lengthy bans, O'Brien can count himself very lucky.

But they were H/Cup games.

danthefan

Leo Cullen quite clearly reacted on field to having fingers in his eyes.

duckysauce

bit of an over reaction at the time no ? was basically the same thing face getting mauled by a hand , not eye balls getting pulled out by either quinlan or sob

danthefan

Comparing the SOB incident to what Quinlan did is an absolute joke.




Why can people not get over the fact the guy who was supposedly "gouged" had absolutely no idea about it until after the game?

duckysauce

? what the head in the chin? or hand on face