Munster vs Ospreys @Thomond Park, Saturday 19 Sep 8:00pm; RTE2/S4C

thomond2006

http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/7906.php

Munster have named an unchanged squad for the Magners League clash with title holders Ospreys at Thomond Park Stadium on Saturday (8pm).
The squad trained today at the match venue and they will announce the starting XV and replacements at lunchtime on Friday.

Munster:
D Hurley, F Jones, S Deasy, I Dowling, D Howlett, D Barnes, J Murphy, S Tuitupou, R O'Gara, P Warwick, D Williams, P Stringer, T O'Leary.

W du Preez, M Horan, D Varley, D Fogarty, J Hayes, T Buckley, D O'Callaghan, B Holland, D Ryan, M O'Driscoll, I Nagle, A Quinlan, N Ronan, D Leamy, T O'Donnell, P O'Mahony.

thomond's first game of the year!

What a huge game this is. The Ospreys beat us here last year and were by far the better side. They carried the momentum onto the Grand Final where they disposed of Leinster.

I think the strongest possible side will be selected (needs to be to win IMO) and it should give us a big impression as to who is first choice for the HEC, with the areas in question being tighthead prop, fly-half, fullback and DOC's second row partner.

By all accounts the Ospreys will send their strongest side possible too, with Alun Wyn Jones and Adam Jones set to make their first appearance of the season. Crucially, the game looks like it comes to early for Mike Phillips and James Hook is still recovering from shoulder surgery.

We have our own injury concerns though. Along with long-term absentees in O'Connell and Earls, we'll still missing the likes of Flannery, Wallace, Mafi, Gleeson and Barry Murphy and Coughlan clearly hasn't reached full fitness yet.

For anyone thinking taking the young 'uns to the game, it looks like Munster are running family offers to boost ML attendances: http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/7910.php

I would like to see:

Du Preez
Varley
Buckley
DOC
Ryan
Quinlan
POM - He did make a decent impact last week, don't think Ronan is the man for this game.
Leamy
Stringer
ROG - Better explain this one. I think his bitter spat with an Edinburgh player at the final whistle was very instructive. He is feeling extra bitter than usual that Sexton has his jersey so I think he will be interested (rarity for the ML) and will give 110%. If he fecks up on Saturday, then at least (in theory) he won't start in the Heineken.
Murphy
Tuitupou
Barnes - We need a centre at 13, not a winger.
Howlett
Jones

Fogarty
Horan
Hayes
MOD
Ronan
TOL
Warwick
Hurley/Deasy

I'm hopeful of a big crowd as I think it will be a seriously competitive match. Ospreys beat us last year and tbh they could well do it again. Phillips' absence is huge though, I think his back-up Nutbrown is no better than average. Something tells me that ROG's attitude (I'm certain he'll start) will have a big bearing on the result.

C'mon Munster!!!

PhatPiggins

I wouldn't pigeon hole Murphy as a winger, he played from 12 out for the Tigers. I'd stick with him at 13 for a few more games. He has all the tools for the position and we have no out and out 13's in the squad, worth sticking with imo.

Don't think O Mahony's a 7 but I see where you're coming from with regard to the O's backrow

Glad to see the branch showing some sense with the pricing

Amazotheamazing

Consider we also face the Ospreys in the HEC, I expect we'll see a bit of shadow boxing from both teams, could be a strange match.

thomond2006

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Consider we also face the Ospreys in the HEC, I expect we'll see a bit of shadow boxing from both teams, could be a strange match.

If you mean shadow boxing as keeping certain moves/tactics in reserve, I wouldn't be so sure about that. These sides know each other inside out and video analysis has become incredibly detailed/accurate. I don't think Munster will leave anything behind. Last year's nonperformance against the Ospreys will definitely motivate them plus they are playing at home anyway.

This match is terribly important for another reason. We go to Glasgow the following week and will be likely be forced (through IRFU Player Management) to rest players. That means it will be a tough game that we could lose. After that, we'll have the derby at the Aviva. That's another toss up. So lose this Saturday and we could be going to London Irish in the Heineken with 3 straight defeats. It's a defeatist/negative outlook but it could very well happen.

PhatPiggins

Munster have tactics :eek::eek:

Haven't seen any yet this season

thomond2006

PhatPiggins wrote: »

Munster have tactics :eek::eek:

Haven't seen any yet this season

Tactics include winning right??

profitius

I'd like to see some bit of invention from the backline for this game. The midfield have looked clueless so far. Tuitupou has been ok but Johne Murphy has done nothing.

With the new rules it could suit Ospreys more because they have skillful players and an excellent backs coach too.

I'd expect Munster to win in Glasgow if Glasgow still have alot of injuries.

Against Leinster it should be more even this season. Leinsters dominance at the breakdown won't be there but Schmidt could have them playing well in the backs.

rebelarmy08

With Felix doing so well at FB , would Warwick be worth a run in the centre ?

murphym7

rebelarmy08 wrote: »

With Felix doing so well at FB , would Warwick be worth a run in the centre ?

Back to "after hours" wth you young man >>>>>>>>>:D

thomond2006

Munster vs Ospreys
Referee: Neil Paterson (Scotland)
Assistant referees: Alan Rogan (Ireland), Brian Macneice (Ireland)
Television match official: Dermot Maloney (Ireland)
Assessor: John Sheehan (Ireland)



On Warwick at centre, I don't think you have could have ROG and him at 10 and 12. Too fragile defensively I'd say. Maybe Tuitupou at 12 and Warwick at 13.

redroar1942

thomond2006 wrote: »

Tactics include winning right??

True enough but we would have been expected to beat those teams anyway. The gameplan has been far too simplistic so far, we need to expand on it a bit if we want to beat the top teams. The Ospreys will be a good litmus test, if we play like we have in the last 4 games we'll lose.

Wawrick would be wasted at 13. Easy to rag on Murphy and Tuitupou but they've got a lot of scrappy slow ball so far.

I'd really like to see a quick game as Howlett and Jones look really sharp, I won't be holding my breath though.

budhabob

Munster: F Jones; D Howlett, J Murphy, S Tuitupou, I Dowling; P Warwick, T O'Leary; M Horan, D Fogarty, J Hayes; D O'Callaghan, D Ryan; A Quinlan, N Ronan, D Leamy capt. Replacements: D Varley,W du Preez, T Buckley, B Holland,P O'Mahony, P Stringer, R O'Gara, D Barnes.

http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/7927.php

Pretty concerned about the front row. Glad to see warwick and jones retained retained however. still looking forward to getting back down to Thomond though.

Otacon

budhabob wrote: »

Munster: ...M Horan, D Fogarty, J Hayes...

Pretty concerned about the front row.

Its the first properly competitive game of the year, and we put out Horan and The Bull? McGahan, have you learned nothing?

I respect both players immensely, but we have our best frontrow on the bench, simple as.

As for Fogarty...

budhabob

Otacon wrote: »

Its the first properly competitive game of the year, and we put out Horan and The Bull? McGahan, have you learned nothing?

I respect both players immensely, but we have our best frontrow on the bench, simple as.

As for Fogarty...

My sentiments exactly.

theKramer

I hope thats not an indicator for the Heineken Cup. I think hes just rotating, as Hayes/Fogs/Horan have benched the last two games. Hope its nothing more than that.

Its nice to see that ROG is not walking straight back into 10. Maybe he'll actually start to care about the ML now that he is made fight for his place. Im interested to see how Warwick and O'Leary will do, as Warwick should have a little bit more time to make a decision as the defence will be kept more honest by the threat of O'Learys break, but then that will probably be tempered by O'Learys God-awful pass. Hopefully he worked on it over the summer

buck65

Otacon wrote: »

Its the first properly competitive game of the year, and we put out Horan and The Bull? McGahan, have you learned nothing?

I respect both players immensely, but we have our best frontrow on the bench, simple as.

As for Fogarty...

Sorry have I missed something? Is it not Rd 3 of the Magners League? Didn't we also have 2 pre season friendlies? Mc Gahan has given alot more game time to du Preez, Varley, Buckley. It is no harm to rotate the front row now that we have options. Also Fogarty is our only option as Flannery is injured so he needs game time to keep match sharp but if you believe that Saturdays front row will start against London Irish I reckon you're mistaken.
Ps Aironi and Edingurgh games were both competitiive and 4 points there are the same thing as 4 poins in Thomond on Saturday.
PPS Both Varley and Buckley are Irish internationals and because of the World Cup and all that nonsense they can only start and play so many games.

thomond2006

VS

Date: Saturday, September 18
Kick-off: 20:00 BST
Venue: Thomond Park
Referee: Neil Paterson (SRU)
Assistant Referees: Alan Rogan, Brian Macneice (both IRFU)
TMO: Dermot Moloney (IFRU)

Munster:
15 Felix Jones, 14 Doug Howlett, 13 Johne Murphy, 12 Sam Tuitupou, 11 Ian Dowling, 10 Paul Warwick, 9 Tomas O'Leary,
8 Denis Leamy (capt), 7 Niall Ronan, 6 Alan Quinlan, 5 Donncha Ryan, 4 Donncha O'Callaghan, 3 John Hayes, 2 Denis Fogarty, 1 Marcus Horan.

Replacements: 16 Damien Varley,17 Wian du Preez, 18 Tony Buckley, 19 Billy Holland, 20 Peter O'Mahony, 21 Peter Stringer, 22 Ronan O'Gara, 23 Danny Barnes.

Ospreys:
15 Lee Byrne, 14 Nikki Walker, 13 Tommy Bowe, 12 Andrew Bishop, 11 Shane Williams, 10 Dan Biggar, 9 Jamie Nutbrown,
8 Jonathan Thomas, 7 Marty Holah, 6 Jerry Collins, 5 Ian Evans, 4 Alun Wyn Jones (capt), 3 Craig Mitchell, 2 Mefin Davies, 1 Paul James.

Replacements: 16 Richard Hibbard, 17 Duncan Jones, 18 Adam Jones, 19 Ian Gough, 20 Ben Lewis, 21 Rhys Webb, 22 Gareth Owen, 23 Richard Fussell.

What a game in prospect. Gone are the days when the Ospreys were the perennial bridesmaids and Munster were the undisputed "Kings of Europe".

Now Munster are said to be in transition lest they go into permanent decline and the Ospreys have a star laden squad that looks to be finally producing the goods under pressure, a situation where they failed dismally again and again in the past (ironically most notably in the 2009 Heineken Cup Quarter Final where they were "bate out the gate" by Munster).

Last year's fixture was a case in point. Ospreys came off the back of a very unlucky defeat in the Heineken Cup to Biarritz and got 6 points from 2 games against Leinster and Ulster. They arrived in Thomond Park and were expected to put up a decent fight before succumbing to the inevitable: defeat in Fortress Thomond.

They tore up the script. Not with dazzling rugby that would have you on the edge of your seat (which was what they were reputed for), but a calm, precise gameplan. The 9-10-12 axis of Phillips, Biggar and Hook ran the show; Biggar showing old school Ronan O'Gara-esque game management and control. Munster did wake up in the second half but the damage was done. The Ospreys had 'stolen' Munster's home semi-final. They then went to the RDS and dispatched Leinster in the Magners League Grand Final with frightening ease. The rugby world stood up and took note. The Ospreys now mean serious business, both in the Magners and in Europe.

So they won't hold any fears coming to Thomond. There is certainly more pressure on them this year, as their supporters can be (and should be) confident of a victory in Limerick.

This will be a big litmus test for Munster and it could be instructive as to how successful their European exploits will be this season. The Edinburgh performance was an upward graft from the win against Aironi but they will need to up a few gears to overcome this Ospreys side.

The Teams:

Mick O'Driscoll misses out for Munster so Donnacha Ryan starts alongside Donnacha O'Callaghan. Tomás O'Leary is ahead of Peter Stringer and intriguingly, Paul Warwick retains his place at 10 ahead of Ronan O'Gara again. The entire front row is changed from the side that defeated Edinburgh: Horan, Fogarty and Hayes are in instead of the benched Varley, Du Preez and Ireland hopeful Tony Buckley.

The Ospreys have a near full strength panel. Ryan Jones, Mike Phillips and James Hook are absent through injury. Tommy Bowe makes his first appearance of the season at 13 with Nikki Walker and Shane Williams on the wing. The two hairy Jones are on the bench.

Key Head to Head:

Felix Jones and Lee Byrne: Definitely the match up of the game for me. The young Munsterman (;)) is a seriously talented fullback and he is a player that could break into the Irish set up if he gets a run of games at Heineken level. He is got serious pace and his kicking game has vastly improved since his injury. He comes up against one of the best fullbacks in Europe since 2008. He can have the occasional faux pas but on form Byrne is a brilliant player with lots of experience.

Prediction: Ooh, tough one to call. I worry about our scrum and lineout. Denis Fogarty needs a big game to justify his selection. If he shows up like he did last season, Munster will be in big big trouble. Niall Ronan needs to show his physical side against Collins and Holah. If Biggar runs the show similarly to last year, I honestly can't see Munster winning. However I have to show a little faith and say Munster by 3-7.

Just a word on Alan Quinlan. It's his 200th match for Munster. Over the years he hasn't been everybody's cup of tea but he has been a brilliant servant to Munster, in the same bracket of legendary status as Stringer, O'Gara, Hayes and Galwey. Good luck to him tommorrow.





Team lists and Time/Date/Refs etc taken from: http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3825_6382596,00.html

Otacon

buck65 wrote: »

Sorry have I missed something? Is it not Rd 3 of the Magners League? Didn't we also have 2 pre season friendlies? Mc Gahan has given alot more game time to du Preez, Varley, Buckley. It is no harm to rotate the front row now that we have options. Also Fogarty is our only option as Flannery is injured so he needs game time to keep match sharp but if you believe that Saturdays front row will start against London Irish I reckon you're mistaken.
Ps Aironi and Edingurgh games were both competitiive and 4 points there are the same thing as 4 poins in Thomond on Saturday.
PPS Both Varley and Buckley are Irish internationals and because of the World Cup and all that nonsense they can only start and play so many games.

If, as you suggest, this is purely down to rotating players as a part of that resting program, then fair enough.

However, I am getting the distinct impression, linked also to the fact that Buckley was taken off very early in the Edinburgh game, that The Bull and Horan are going to be our 'HEC props'.

buck65

I think that Buckley was hovering in yellow card territory for not being square in the scrum against Edinburgh and McGahan made the call. Hayes really did nothing in that game and Buckley has looked comfortable enough apart from a few minutes in Edinburgh.
Horan is behind du Preez I think at the moment. Great options from the bench if the scrum needs steadying but Buckley will be a big player for us this season.

Thomond 2006, well done on the match preview btw. Very professional.

profitius

They're resting Buckley and Du Preez for next weekend I reckon.

thomond2006

profitius wrote: »

They're resting Buckley and Du Preez for next weekend I reckon.

I dunno, wouldn't be so sure about that tbh.

We'll know who is first choice by the Heineken Cup I suppose.

thehighground

It is working out well actually if you think that Buckley's scrummaging needs to be tested. This is the starting front row for the Os (1 Paul James, 2 Mefin Davies, 3 Craig Mitchell).

The Os bench is Hibbard and the two Joness. Buckley's scrummaging will be tested big time by the Joneses! We wouldn't learn anything from the Os starting front row.

Judgement Day

I'm happy that the best team available has been put out but with Keith Earls, Jerry Flannery and Paul O'Connell still out it has a decidedly makeshift look about it. It's going to be a hard fought battle and let's hope Quinnie celebrates his 200th cap with yet another man of the match award.

Two wins for Irish provinces tonight with Connacht beating Glasgow 19-17 and Ulster are now top of the Magners League after seeing off Edinburgh 29-21. Lets hope Munster and Leinster can make it a full house tomorrow.


C'MON MUNSTER!

thomond2006

I hope Quinlan gets to lead the team out (a la John Hayes for Ireland).

Corcioch

Great to see Warwick ahead of ROG at 10.


Would rather see the "other" front row starting myself . . . . .Mushy should have more and more game time invested in him imo . . . .the team and country will benefit.

Cant wait for it . . . .hope the atmosphere will be a bit better than the last 2 games at Musgrave Park . . .twas flat.

Amazotheamazing

thomond2006 wrote: »

I hope Quinlan gets to lead the team out (a la John Hayes for Ireland).

It was mentioned in one of the press releases that he will.

Judgement Day

While looking for an Alan Quinlan tribute video on You Tube (there doesn't appear to be one!) I came across this one - Richie McCaw would have got away with it.

C'MON MUNSTER!

wixfjord

Think that sums him up a bit tbh Judgement Day! Hilarious that Lenihen thinks its so funny when Quinnie does it! Good 6 but not a fan at all tbh.

Very interesting game this, cant wait to see how Ronan does, after a few good performances, against a heavyweight back row.

Howlett is probably the only Munster outside back that you would take over their Spreys counterpart so forwards battle will be key imo. Whichever wins from two poor enough front rows could win the game.

pappyodaniel

wixfjord wrote: »

Think that sums him up a bit tbh Judgement Day! Hilarious that Lenihen thinks its so funny when Quinnie does it! Good 6 but not a fan at all tbh.

I bet you would if he was in your side and I bet I wouldn't. Everyone loves the cute hoor' on their team, the fella playing on the edge of the rules and there's no better man than Quinnie.

wixfjord

pappyodaniel wrote: »

I bet you would if he was in your side and I bet I wouldn't. Everyone loves the cute hoor' on their team, the fella playing on the edge of the rules and there's no better man than Quinnie.

Maybe so, but hes not playing in my team is he?! And blind faith and support is not something I personally like to do, incidents with Sexton, Heaslip, Brennan and Jennings have shown that. I would tend to take situations on their merit unlike some on here, and theres no doubt that Quinnie has gone a bit further than the edge of the rules aswell, but that's neither here nor there. A lot of difference between a cute hoor and a dirty bastard, not saying Quinnie is either btw.

thehighground

wixfjord wrote: »

Maybe so, but hes not playing in my team is he?! And blind faith and support is not something I personally like to do, incidents with Sexton, Heaslip, Brennan and Jennings have shown that. I would tend to take situations on their merit unlike some on here, and theres no doubt that Quinnie has gone a bit further than the edge of the rules aswell, but that's neither here nor there. A lot of difference between a cute hoor and a dirty bastard, not saying Quinnie is either btw.

He could have been according to this:

There have been times when Quinlan and the rest of the core group over the last decade or more could have gone abroad, in the pre-Charlie McCreevy tax rebate years. He, apparently, could have gone to Leinster last season. But their loyalty and success are interwoven, He made his debut in November ’96 against Samoa at Musgrave Park and the following season became a regular in their Heineken Cup team.

Obviously, his playing on the edge characteristics are sought after in Ireland as Connacht apparently offered him a player/coach role as well.

From Gerry Thornley article in Irish Times today.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2010/0918/1224279169147.html

RuggieBear

no need to go over this old chestnut again. don't post again on this thread, thetmo

TheTMO

thehighground wrote: »

He could have been according to this:



Obviously, his playing on the edge characteristics are sought after in Ireland as Connacht apparently offered him a player/coach role as well.

From Gerry Thornley article in Irish Times today.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2010/0918/1224279169147.html

I'd take note of the 'apparently' aspect. Why would Leinster sign him when O'Brien and McLaughlin are far better than him currently and Rhys Ruddock looks like hes going to be three times the player Quinlan was? Doesn't make sense.

EDIT : Just saw warning, fine.

danthefan

I really cannot see why Leinster would have been interested in Quinlan.

Amazotheamazing

danthefan wrote: »

I really cannot see why Leinster would have been interested in Quinlan.

You never know, in theory Leinster could lose Heaslip, Jennings, SOB, McLaughlin and Ruddock to Irish camps or have them rested by the IRFU. Would make sense to want an experienced player to call on should those players be lost.

In general though, I think coaches respect Quinlan a lot more than fans do. He's still a player most coaches would want in their squad.

phog

As a Shannon, Munster and Irish fan I've huge repsect for Quinny, haven't always agreed with his deeds but he done his time for those.

After the WC in which he injured his shoulder scoring a try Ireland missed him badly in the following 6Ns, watch how many times the opposition walked through our lineouts in those games, if Quinny was around that just wouldnt have happened.

budhabob

Is leamy injured?

Taco Corp

Looking forward to this match and to seeing Bowe in at 13.

danthefan

ROG on for Dowling, interesting.

fonecrusher1

That was poor from rog.

handsomecake

did the northern hemisphere not get the message that the rules are changed and we don kick any more...........ball in hand etc this criticism is levelled at both teams by the way

danthefan

Is Leamy broken again?

wicklowdub

Byrne a lucky boy there.

danthefan

Again Niall Ronan is avoiding rucks like the plague.

outwest

donal lenihan is annoying me, nugent well all il say is i miss the irish

dreamer_ire

wicklowdub wrote: »

Byrne a lucky boy there.

He should be enjoying the view from the bin... poor call by the ref.

outwest

munster got out of jail there,

wicklowdub

Tuitupou looks good in broken play, runs at every opportunity.

Peter B

C'mon lads, every time the ball is passed out wide it always gets passed straight to the player or behind him. We need to get the player running on to the ball!

RuggieBear

munster look like they have been well coached on how to play the new tackle and release/ruck law. some amount of turnovers

RuggieBear

a cracking nill all game