Fianna Fail are Unelectable under Brian Cowan

dixiefly

There is a view at the upper levels of Fiann Fail that they are unelectable under Brian Cowan. However, it is not a convenient time to get rid of him as the optimum time for a heave is in about 6 months. He can continue to take hits in the meantime and leave the new leader from becoming exposed to the fallout from the next budget.

Remember, FF over the last 10 years under Bertie developed their strategies based on optimising votes at the next General Elections. That thinking doesnt go away easily.

The only way the Cowan will be leader going into an election is if there is a snap / unexpected election. I cannot see him still being leader in 18 months when an election would be approx due. In fact if I was offered 100/1 on him being FF leader in 2 years I wouldnt take it.

Permabear

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Manic Preacher

donegalfella wrote: »

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I disagree with your sentiment. If Brian Lenihan was Taoiseach he'd lead FF back into Govt.

LarrytheLantern

i think mr. Cowan is doing a fine job.
every time i see him on TV it makes me proud to be Irish.

dixiefly

donegalfella wrote: »

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It isnt just about winning the overall election. The heave on Cowan when it comes will be more about damage limitation. Many FF politicians will be looking at their own seats and they will see themselves as having a better chance under an alternative leader. Also. it will be important for them to avoid complete wipeout in the next election which will reduce their power base this making a quick return less likely/

It is not beyond a possibility that they have counted in a loss of the next election and are thinking of the following election in the hope that they are in government come 2016.

Todays events, if they take legs, may precipitate the heave.

Essexboy

delete "under Brian Cowan" and the thread title would be correct. :cool:

SoupyNorman

Fianna Gael are equally unelectable under Kenny.

Callan57

That anybody would think of voting for FF after what they have done (twice in my lifetime) really scares me. :mad::eek:

Koloman

Callan57 wrote: »

That anybody would think of voting for FF after what they have done (twice in my lifetime) really scares me. :mad::eek:

And the sad thing is that there are people out there willing to give then the chance to bankrupt the nation for a third time!

Liam Byrne

SoupyNorman wrote: »

Fianna Gael are equally unelectable under Kenny.

Who are this "Fianna Gael" ?

SoupyNorman

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Who are this "Fianna Gael" ?

FG then.

Koloman

donegalfella wrote: »

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But Jesus could turn water into wine! Brian Cowen would have him in his cabinet!

FF will have a chance to get back in, simply because the other political parties don't do anything to inspire confidence. Its not as if there are a lot of choices out there. Hell, I'd love to get Tony Blair over here and vote him in, rather than any of the politicians we currently have at the front.

galwayrush

Manic Preacher wrote: »

I disagree with your sentiment. If Brian Lenihan was Taoiseach he'd lead FF back into Govt.

That's almost as scary as Cowan remaining.

Liam Byrne

Deleted User wrote: »

FF will have a chance to get back in, simply because the other political parties don't do anything to inspire confidence.

If FF get back in, then no-one's voting based on "inspiring confidence".

johnnyskeleton

Koloman wrote: »

But Jesus could turn water into wine! Brian Cowen would have him in his cabinet!

In his water cabinet?

gandalf

It's fairly obvious at this stage that FF will not get into power at the next election barring a miracle. None of the senior members with leadership aspirations will heave against Cowen before the next General Election as they will then be tainted with that loss.

Unless it looks like they are heading for an absolute collapse of support and remember the hard core FF support always runs in the mid twenties I don't see a change in leadership at all*.

(*this of course depends on the number of early morning interviews that BC gives in future as well )

I'm pretty sure I read many similar threads here on boards about FF prior to the last election, and what happened?

freewheeler

LarrytheLantern wrote: »

i think mr. Cowan is doing a fine job.
every time i see him on TV it makes me proud to be Irish.

Ah stop now would ya....serious comments only please!:rolleyes:

Koloman

LarrytheLantern wrote: »

i think mr. Cowan is doing a fine job.
every time i see him on TV it makes me proud to be Irish.

Just let me check my calendar... no, it's not April 1st!

evenmicheal

A certain percentage of people will always vote Fianna Fail regardless what they do. Civil war politics is not dead yet.

steelcityblues

Koloman wrote: »

But Jesus could turn water into wine! Brian Cowen would have him in his cabinet!

But FFers are the best at turning the wine into water!

PeterIanStaker

gandalf wrote: »

It's fairly obvious at this stage that FF will not get into power at the next election barring a miracle catastrophe

FYP

Laminations

LarrytheLantern wrote: »

i think mr. Cowan is doing a fine job.
every time i see him on TV it makes me proud to be Irish.

You might think uber sarcasm is hilarious, but after so many trolls on here it just gets annoying. Moderate and witty sarcasm is hilarious, aim for that

jmayo

donegalfella wrote: »

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Well at least d ahern and m woods would be happy with that.

Manic Preacher wrote: »

I disagree with your sentiment. If Brian Lenihan was Taoiseach he'd lead FF back into Govt.

Yeah the great white hope of ff. :rolleyes:
Isn't he the guy that told us Anglo would only cost 8 billion ?
Isn't he the guy that told us he would shake up the banks execs ?
Isn't he the guy that supported willie o'dea in speech in the Dáil ?
Isn't he the guy that told us NAMA would make a profit ?
Isn't he the guy that forgot to read important part of report on Anglo ?
Need I go on ?

SoupyNorman wrote: »

Fianna Gael are equally unelectable under Kenny.

Are they a new party

Koloman wrote: »

But Jesus could turn water into wine! Brian Cowen would have him in his cabinet!

Jesus couldn't work that fast, he would run out.
Besides cowen drinks Guinness AFAIK.

Laminations

jmayo wrote: »

Besides cowen drinks Guinness AFAIK.

What? Haven't you heard the latest from the FF spin machine, Brian Cowen doesn't drink. It wasn't a hangover he was sporting, it was nasal congestion, it wasn't guinness in that pint glass, it was coke and cream.

Craven99

So if it is not FF who would you like to see getting in?

FF have wrecked the country and very few people think that FG are a viable alternative. So I am genuinely curious on who people would vote for?

Laminations

Craven99 wrote: »

So if it is not FF who would you like to see getting in?

FF have wrecked the country and very few people think that FG are a viable alternative. So I am genuinely curious on who people would vote for?

Very few people? I think they show a majority in the polls? Some polls ahve put them at or near 40%

Revolution9

A lot of people thought FF were unelectable under Bertie. We still voted them in though!

Tim Robbins

Manic Preacher wrote: »

I disagree with your sentiment. If Brian Lenihan was Taoiseach he'd lead FF back into Govt.

Or Martin.

FG don't offer credible opposition and Labour only represent over paid public and semi state sectors. I heard Pat Rabbite recently defend the average wage in the ESB of 79K.

The best we can hope for is for a FG / FF alliance.

Laminations

Revolution9 wrote: »

A lot of people thought FF were unelectable under Bertie. We still voted them in though!

The amount of sh1t that has come out since 2007 though, it'd be a real shame if we voted them in again. I dont think you can compare now with then. People had their reasons back then, they still wanted to believe in the FF dream of a soft landing, now people have more facts

mark17

Fianna Fail know themselves they are unelectable, they won't allow any of the
three by-elections take place, to me that says it all. Now. they must hang on
as long as they can in order to make a few euro, because Kenny has made it clear
he is getting rid of Seanad Eireann, so ex- FF TD's won't even get jobs there when they
are fired out.

On another note it's funny how silent the Green Party are about Biffos hangover.

Het-Field

Revolution9 wrote: »

A lot of people thought FF were unelectable under Bertie. We still voted them in though!

Different times, and different circumstances.

maynooth_rules

mark17 wrote: »

On another note it's funny how silent the Green Party are about Biffos hangover.

Ah yes the great yellow bellies that are the Green party. Shame to see a party that had morals like them just piss away all their hard work over the years

Biggins

gandalf wrote: »

It's fairly obvious at this stage that FF will not get into power at the next election barring a miracle. None of the senior members with leadership aspirations will heave against Cowen before the next General Election as they will then be tainted with that loss...

More than likely Cowens heave out will come after they get booted out I think.
He will see it as a good time to step down as party leader (before he is invulnerably shoved) and FF will spin it then as "Time for refreshing the Org" - "Inserting new life" etc... you know, the usual PR bull.

Koloman

Laminations wrote: »

What? Haven't you heard the latest from the FF spin machine, Brian Cowen doesn't drink. It wasn't a hangover he was sporting, it was nasal congestion, it wasn't guinness in that pint glass, it was coke and cream.

I wonder does he need to go to nasal congestion anonymous meetings?

Raiser

Revolution9 wrote: »

A lot of people thought FF were unelectable under Bertie. We still voted them in though!

Never underestimate the stupidity of an Irish Person in a Polling Booth :mad:

dan_d

Why is it Brian Cowen that's making FF unelectable? They're unelectable full stop - they don't need him to do it for them. Why is it that people think that Lenihan is some sort of acceptable substitute? FF are, as a party, rotten to the core - and I personally don't want to know about them until most, if not all, of the "old guard" are ousted out of there.

Course that'll never happen.

molard

dan_d wrote: »

Why is it Brian Cowen that's making FF unelectable? They're unelectable full stop - they don't need him to do it for them. Why is it that people think that Lenihan is some sort of acceptable substitute? FF are, as a party, rotten to the core - and I personally don't want to know about them until most, if not all, of the "old guard" are ousted out of there.

Course that'll never happen.

i agree .all the ministers should not be elected.they have ruined this country and don't even know it.that's the scary this.think tank was a piss up paid with our taxes.remember that everytime your told no funds available for services.

Mighty_Mouse

If B Lenihan's health allows him to take over the leadership then it’s a possibility FF/Labour will form the next government. In fact I'd guess if the figures made sense Cowen would step down at an opportune time giving Lenihan his 100% support (no heave) then FF would start to gain ground quickly.

This election is anger v fear!!

People are so angry with FF that they want to see them punished but are scared senseless at the possibility of Enda Kenny in charge of the economic recovery brief.

Imagine FG/Lab with Enda Kenny leader & Joan Burton as minister of Finance!!
If FF change leadership & pick the right message then they could be back in the game:

- New FF – the mistakes were made by our predecessors Bertie, McCreevey, Look at the new FF performance to date. Refer to independent international validation of managing the worst crisis since the foundation of the state.

o Haughey/Bertie/Lawlor/McSharry

---

the corrupt side of FF has been defeated, the Albert Reynolds side of the part is now in charge again.

o Bertie will disappear off the face of the earth & won’t get presidency for this reason?

People just do not like Enda Kenny. He embarrasses them. The thought of him leading Ireland on a world stage embarrasses them. The idea that he could handle the economic crises brief scares them.

I admire Michael Noonan greatly but he doesn’t play well on a national level.
Kenny (Dumb) / Noonan (boring) V Rabitte/Burton (screech & screech), V B Lenihan/ Hanafin(or whoever)..............then the playing field levels.

The fact that FG could not provide a political alternative during the last 10 years, through corruption (tribunals, Beverly Cooper Flynn re-admittance), the fact that FG could not complete wipe-out FF in the last 3 years says a lot. The fact that FG never learn political lessons is amazing. Not since Fitzgerald have they had a leader with real national appeal. The fact that Richard Bruton (their best performer) is no longer in the game is just idiotic.
If labour aligns with FG then the sheer force of public anger will see them into office but it's not because they have done anything to inspire public loyalty.
FF should be dead on the floor. The fact they are not says it all.

The lack of a political alternative in this country depresses me tbh

Liam Byrne

Mighty_Mouse wrote: »

In fact I'd guess if the figures made sense Cowen would step down at an opportune time giving Lenihan his 100% support (no heave) then FF would start to gain ground quickly.

People are so angry with FF that they want to see them punished but are scared senseless at the possibility of Enda Kenny in charge of the economic recovery brief.

Imagine FG/Lab with Enda Kenny leader & Joan Burton as minister of Finance!!

I'm scared senseless at the thoughts that our current Minister for Finance who set up NAMA and signed us up to an uncaveated, unwarranted blanket guarantee without even reading the reports that he himself commissioned might be viewed by some as a reasonable leader! :eek: