Oil Analysis

Anan1

Check this out - I think it looks well worthwhile:

http://www.blackstone-labs.com/

kyote00

Similar idea here

http://www.frost.co.uk/item_Detail.asp?productID=9653&frostProductName=Oil%20Spy%20&catID=37&frostCat=New%20Products&frostSubCat=&subCatID=

I dunno, if there's lot's of metal bits in the oil it may well be due to how old oil was drained out previously. I'd be taking the results with a grain of salt really.

mecanoman

Interesting stuff lads.

ianobrien

From a chemistry perspective, these tests strips work on a chemical reaction with a constituent producing a colour, eg water. The tests are not quantitative, just qualitative.

They are not definative oil analysis. They can't measure if the oil is breaking down (after all, it's still a hydrocarbon) They won't be able to tell if the oil is contaminated with fuel, etc. Personally, I would want to know what produces the colour change, what the limit of detections are etc. After all that, they strike me as a waste of money. An old school mechanic would do a better job by looking at the dipstick and smelling it.

ianobrien

ianobrien wrote: »

They won't be able to tell if the oil is contaminated with fuel, etc

They claim they can.

ianobrien

RoverJames wrote: »

They claim they can.

Oh, I'd love to see the chemistry behind that. Oil is a hydrocarbon, fuel is a hydrocarbon, The difference is due to the fractions of the crude oil that is taken.

Unless the sump is full of diesel/petrol I'm not too sure how they'll do it.

I can understand how they can do it for diesel (go after the dye) but for petrol.......

Matt Simis

RoverJames wrote: »

I dunno, if there's lot's of metal bits in the oil it may well be due to how old oil was drained out previously. I'd be taking the results with a grain of salt really.

But... isnt that something you would want to know?
I know the guys on the Audi S4 forums religiously send an Oil sample off after each change (which they do often) and then keep a log. They always know whats going on in their engines. Great for resale too.

kyote00

jaysus, who let the nerd in here...ruining these great products with cold science....

is that u knobby, my old chemistry teacher....
;

ianobrien wrote: »

From a chemistry perspective, these tests strips work on a chemical reaction with a constituent producing a colour, eg water. The tests are not quantitative, just qualitative.

They are not definative oil analysis. They can't measure if the oil is breaking down (after all, it's still a hydrocarbon) They won't be able to tell if the oil is contaminated with fuel, etc. Personally, I would want to know what produces the colour change, what the limit of detections are etc. After all that, they strike me as a waste of money. An old school mechanic would do a better job by looking at the dipstick and smelling it.

Matt Simis

Matt Simis wrote: »

But... isnt that something you would want to know? .

Not really, I think this oil testing lark on cars that are in use is total and utter bullsh1t. Fair enough to be doing it on engines running on test beds for development and what not.

ianobrien

ianobrien wrote: »

From a chemistry perspective, these tests strips work on a chemical reaction with a constituent producing a colour, eg water. The tests are not quantitative, just qualitative.

Would they not do titrations instead of test strips, so then you'd have quantitative results, albeit fairly rough ones.

unkel

Let's all get the free test kit and post our results here!

af_thefragile

I might get one of those...
My engine does use up a fair amount of oil...

Wibbs

Good quality oil filter, good quality oil at the correct grade and type for your engine(the "name" means less than the eu standards it passes), magnetic drain plug and change the oil and filter every 3000 or 5000 miles, depending how anal one is. Sorted. Properly gapped spark plugs, a functioning thermostat and once a year replacement of your fuel filter and your engine should run and run and run, if its good to start with.

af_thefragile

af_thefragile wrote: »

I might get one of those...
My engine does use up a fair amount of oil...

I can diagnose your probs remotely, the Puma is fecked :pac:

unkel wrote: »

Let's all get the free test kit and post our results here!

costs $25 for the results

ianobrien

RoverJames wrote: »

Would they not do titrations instead of test strips, so then you'd have quantitative results, albeit fairly rough ones.

No.

Well, it depends on what you are looking for. It's probably better suited fir the chemistry forum.

Damien360

I had a look at the blackstones one. I visit labs that do oil analysis so I will give my 2 cents here.

Tests:

Spectral analysis. Based on the cost, this is done by X-Ray diffraction. They are testing for the metals that are present. Irish Rail test their engines and the bus oil for metals using a similar technique (AA). Ulsterbus do the same for buses only. Depending on the metal detected, it is an indicaiton of wear and tear of a particular part of the engine. They can then aim directly for that part and replace before failure.

Viscosity. Very simple test and measures the thickness/fluidity of the oil. Just like your car, the thicker the oil the worse it is. Unlike your car, a bus/train does not take just 5 Litres of oil, so the costs of just changing the oil every few thousand miles are enourmous. They wait until the oil falls below a given target and then change.

Insolubles. This is a simple filtration test. Based on the weight of particles left behind in a given 100mls you can determine the oil quality. Test done for same reasons as viscosity.

Flashpoint. Depending on the oil grade it will ignite at a given temperature consistently. If you have fuel leakage in to the oil then it will change this and can be detected. If you get this in your car, then it is likely the engine is shagged already. The test will just prove the word of a good mechanic.

For 25 dollars, the most they will do is spectral analysis as it is easily automated with very low costs. The others require lab work and therefore analysts wages.

The tests listed under "other tests" are for waste oil analysis and are required for permits before disposal. Anyone that gets Enva to collect their waste oil will know some of the tests as they charge depending on the PCB content.

Finally, they state, quite correctly that there are no guarantees with oil analysis. Keep your money in your pocket folks.

Tests strips do not work for metal analysis. If you discover a way to make it work, stick a patent on it quick, you will be a wealthy man. For any test, test strips tell you "yes you have XXXX there but not how much of it is present." The oil spy one is a load of balls and very hit and miss based on the technique.

unkel

RoverJames wrote: »

costs $25 for the results

Missed that bit

Anan1

Damien360 wrote: »

For 25 dollars, the most they will do is spectral analysis as it is easily automated with very low costs. The others require lab work and therefore analysts wages.

They do claim on their website to test viscosity, insolubles and flashpoint too in the standard $25 analysis?