'Bar-extension' fines could put hotel out of business

sgarvan

A FOUR-star hotel could go out of business if it has to pay fines after it charged customers for non-existent bar extensions, its managing director said last night.

Couples who held wedding receptions at Roganstown Hotel & Country Club in Dublin discovered that despite being charged €550 for their receptions, the hotel did not apply to the District Court for special exemption orders under the Intoxicating Liquor Act.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/barextension-fines-could-put-hotel-out-of-business-2326083.html

We had our wedding reception here last July and received an email regarding this about two weeks. We are one of the couples whose bar extension was not applied for.

I would hope that the heavy fines are not given to the hotel as it would be a shame to see such a nice establishment close down

rpurfield

they should be made give back the money taken off each couple where they did not apply.simple and right punishment if ya ask me.dunno if its different county by county but my wedding reception in the newgrange in navan two years ago the fee for the extension was 250

Paulw

We had our wedding there in Feb and are in the same situation.

It is a brilliant venue and it would be a real shame if it had to close.

Eoineo

Interesting that it's being blamed on somebody who doesn't work there anymore. It's hard to believe that it wasn't picked up by accountants for 2 years!

mathepac

sgarvan wrote: »

... I would hope that the heavy fines are not given to the hotel as it would be a shame to see such a nice establishment close down

Paulw wrote: »

... It is a brilliant venue and it would be a real shame if it had to close.

I hope the owners are prosecuted and fined / jailed to the fullest extent possible under criminal law; if that means closure, then so be it.

According to yesterday's Sunday Times, thankfully a Garda investigation is now under way. (I can't post links as The Sunday Times website is now PPV)

If media reports are accurate, apart from taking money from their customers for a service they did not provide (a legal bar extension), my interpretation is that the owners / operators also did the following :

• operated bars and sold intoxicating liquor to members of the public outside of the licensing hours
• exposed their innocent, paying customers and their guests to possible prosecution under the intoxicating liquor acts as "found ons" (being on a licensed premises outside of the hours permitted)
• exposed their staff to prosecution for serving people outside of normal hours.

So if the media reports are to be believed, the owners / operators of the business concerned had no difficulty engaging in fraudulent and criminal activity in order to boost profits and cared nothing about the possible consequences for their customers and staff.

The bleating in the semi-literate press release / email blames a "breach of procedure" for the lack of licences at the weddings. IMHO, this is a bit like a medic saying the she forgot to register with the Medical Council in order to practice medicine in Ireland and that the fault lies with her former receptionist.

Eoineo wrote: »

Interesting that it's being blamed on somebody who doesn't work there anymore. It's hard to believe that it wasn't picked up by accountants for 2 years!

Interesting that according to the press release issued in mangled English by a spokesperson for the company pointing the finger at the former employee seems to attempt to exonerate be the hotel's license-holder in whose name the bar extension licences would have been issued.

The accountants would have looked at bar / function receipts and measured profitability; I'm not sure that checking for valid licences would be part of their remit.

Paulw

mathepac wrote: »

I hope the owners are prosecuted and fined / jailed to the fullest extent possible under criminal law; if that means closure, then so be it.

Yeah, sure just throw another 70 or so people on to the dole.

mathepac wrote: »

The bleating in the semi-literate press release / email blames a "breach of procedure" for the lack of licences at the weddings.

This is, in general, a simple procedure matter, especially for a hotel like this. It is not complex. The fee is taken, an application is made to the court and the fee paid. Unless there is an objection, it's simply a procedure that needs to be followed.

Obviously, someone messed up. And, of course, someone should be responsible.

From talking to a few about the place, it's clear that someone is being made a scapegoat. I doubt that a general manager would be the person who applies for bar extensions. Also, the place is poorly run by the owners, and could be a lot better, if staff and management were allowed to do their jobs properly, rather than being tied back by the owners.

I don't see how large fines and closure are good for anyone.

Sizzler

rpurfield wrote: »

they should be made give back the money taken off each couple where they did not apply.simple and right punishment if ya ask me.dunno if its different county by county but my wedding reception in the newgrange in navan two years ago the fee for the extension was 250

Id go one step further! If It was me and I was stung for this ridiculous charge I would already be down there demanding my money back first thing this morning!

Bar extensions should be a cost of doing business, anybody who pays them is worse imho, plenty of places around happy to take your business without asking you to pay for the bloody privilege of you & your guests spending money in their establishment!

Eoineo

mathepac wrote: »

The accountants would have looked at bar / function receipts and measured profitability; I'm not sure that checking for valid licences would be part of their remit.

While checking for valid licences might not have been part of their remit, charging for a bar extension would have been income to the hotel. Then on the other side paying a solicitor/court per bar extension would have been an expense. A hotel of that size would be audited on an annual basis I'd assume (maybe I'm wrong to assume this) and it would be picked up in an audit by a competent auditor as well.

Beasty

Let's not get into the workings of the audit profession.

From what I can see, the owners have owned up to their "omissions", and this thread is about the possible threat to the business and related jobs.

Please stay on-topic, otherwise posts will be deleted and/or infractions given

Thanks

Beasty

Corsendonk

Perhaps we should wait for any potential unfair dismissal or court proceedings before condemning any side.