Worried about the future

peanuthead

Hi all

Writing this now in quite a worried state. No real point in going unregged for this one. My mother and father separated 5 years ago. My mother was, and is a member of a religious organisation. This organisation was quite severe and had a huge amount of silly and unnecessary rules.

In 2005, with the introduction of a new rule, my mother was told to leave her family and to never have any contact with us again.

Although we see her around and have tried to speak to and contact her, she has never spoken to us since leaving in the middle of the night on 23rd December 2005.

Attempts to get through to her for anything house or family related had been unsuccessful.

Now she has been in touch via a solicitor and is taking us to court - looking for the family home to be sold and for her to receive all the profit.

****************Some Background Information*************************

Dad doesn't have any qualifications. He has always worked and worked very hard to get cash to help with the bills etc. The problem was that it was always cash work.

Mam on the other hand was a teacher, full time worker and had an income coming into the bank, which obviously was paying off the mortgage.

Dad stayed at home to mind four children while mam went to work.

Dad eventually left the religious organisation as he no longer agreed with its ideas. We remained part of it and continued to go to church. My dad continued to respect the rules of said church despite not agreeing with it.

Dad has a slight problem with the drink. He doesn't drink, but when he does he tends to drink for at least a week solid. He only does this during holidays.

He now works and has done so in a PAYE job for the last 10 years or so.

My mother has had no contact whatsoever with us since she left.

*************************************************************************************

Her solicitor this morning sent a registered letter to the house, outlining her 'claim' in which she states that:

• Dad failed as a father and husband
• His alcohol abuse prevented him from finding work
• She was the SOLE provider in the home
• Dad undermined her parenting
• Dad disrespected her religious beliefs

This is all crap. There is more to it obviously, but these points are blatant LIES. I am fuming. I am so angry I feel like punching a wall or something.

But I'm afraid that the fact that his cash work can't be proved and the fact that the mortgage came from her wage means that even though its BS it is going to look true to the courts.

She is looking for sale of the property and full profit. Its so unreasonable as my father's money went on bills, food, shopping that sort of thing, while hers paid the mortgage. It wasn't like he was sitting on his ass knocking back the cans getting a free ride like she's making it sound.

My mother was (and is) a horrible person. My dad had an awful time of it with her sarkiness, smart comments and constant undermining of his attempts to find work.

He has put his heart and soul into both the house and the family.

When she left my mother asked my dad to kick us out and she would come back (at the time we were her problem, not my dad. Now that its going legal he's the bad one!!!) but he said no. So off she went, abandoned her 'children' (ages 16, 18, 19, 22) and husband and has the NERVE to say he failed as a father/husband.

I don't really know why I'm writing this - I know I can't ask for legal advice and thats okay because we have a solicitor.

I suppose I just want to vent but also want to get words of encouragement/reality from others as I'm at my wits end.

thanks
p

Stheno

Your father really needs legal advice from his solicitor, and perhaps contacting the likes of AMEN will also help him advice wise.

At the end of the day your mother abandoned your family for her religious beliefs, which is at least a strength in your fathers case, and he has supported the family since.

Best of luck.

seamus

While this is a horrible thing to have to deal with and for your Dad who is no doubt approaching his advanced years, remember that he's gotten the better flip of the coin here. He's got the love and support of four adult children who will no doubt do everything they can to help him and look after him. She has nothing except a grudge and a mental illness.
At the end of the day a house is just bricks and mortar and all the money in the world is worth nothing next to his family. Don't let him forget that. Losing the house would not be the end of the world because he will still have his family.

If there are any dependents living in the house - children under 18 or students under 23, she basically hasn't a hope of forcing him to sell the house. Can't give legal advice here; he should be getting his own solicitor and building up the counter-case based on the testimony of the four children she has alienated.

Recent court judgements have prevented the sole mortgage payer from claiming the full value of the home. The role of primary carer is considered to be equal to that of primary provider in maintaining a home, so the fact that your Dad has been and is the primary carer for the family will be his strongest argument. How much each of them did and did not earn is less relevant.

peanuthead

Stheno wrote: »

Your father really needs legal advice from his solicitor, and perhaps contacting the likes of AMEN will also help him advice wise.

At the end of the day your mother abandoned your family for her religious beliefs, which is at least a strength in your fathers case, and he has supported the family since.

Best of luck.

Yes I know he needs legal advice. He has been burying his head in the sand but got a rude awakening this morning I can tell you. I attend the solicitor meetings with him so the appointment has been made for Friday to give my job enough notice.

seamus wrote: »

While this is a horrible thing to have to deal with and for your Dad who is no doubt approaching his advanced years, remember that he's gotten the better flip of the coin here. He's got the love and support of four adult children who will no doubt do everything they can to help him and look after him. She has nothing except a grudge and a mental illness.
At the end of the day a house is just bricks and mortar and all the money in the world is worth nothing next to his family. Don't let him forget that. Losing the house would not be the end of the world because he will still have his family.

If there are any dependents living in the house - children under 18 or students under 23, she basically hasn't a hope of forcing him to sell the house. Can't give legal advice here; he should be getting his own solicitor and building up the counter-case based on the testimony of the four children she has alienated.

Recent court judgements have prevented the sole mortgage payer from claiming the full value of the home. The role of primary carer is considered to be equal to that of primary provider in maintaining a home, so the fact that your Dad has been and is the primary carer for the family will be his strongest argument. How much each of them did and did not earn is less relevant.

What you say about family is so true seamus and I often wonder how she gets on without hers. She doesn't even have contact with her own brothers and sisters, we do but she doesn't.

Again I know he needs legal advice and believe me he has a solicitor. He will be visiting him on Friday.

Its good to know about the recent court judgements. I cannot get over her blatant lies in the 'claim'. I know that for a lot of families this is not that hard to understand, but coming from the strict religious background that we did, separation and the like was never EVER considered in our family, despite coming from an area where its very very common.

Thats another thing, to her it is bricks and mortar, but to my dad (he's 57 by the way) its the only thing he truly has to call his own (or at least he thought he could). We had an extension built to our home about 8 years ago and my dad helped to lay the foundations for it. He has put so much into this house and a mixture of pride and attachment means he doesn't want to let go.

Whereas her? Well she's been renting since she left. She wants as much cash as she can get her hands on because she wants to buy herself a home in Spain (HQ of the mad church).

Problem being if he has to sell up and even give her half - I don't think he'll get a mortgage for something on his own. Even with me I don't think it would be possible (although I must look into this). I couldn't bear to think of him spending his days renting somewhere. He just wouldn't be able to deal with that.

Sometimes I think it would be good to get out of this house - no more memories, fresh start - location is also a kip!! But the problem is where to go from there.

Sleepy

Even if your father contributed nothing financially towards the running of the home his role as main carer for yourself and your siblings would be considered to be his contribution (or that's certainly the way it worked when my parents divorced though the genders were reversed - possibly an issue given the inherant sexism in Irish law).

Given price drops in the current market, however, now may be a good time for this to happen. Lowe house prices should make it easier for your father to buy her out of her share than it would have been a few years ago (and given the levels of denial out there, I'd lay 10 to 1 that your mother thinks the house is worth far more than it's real value).

I've no idea what the legalities of the situation but is it possible to have your mother declared as not being of sound mind / diminished capacity and legally incapable of handling her own financial dealings since from the sounds of things she's involved with a cult?

peanuthead

Sleepy wrote: »

Even if your father contributed nothing financially towards the running of the home his role as main carer for yourself and your siblings would be considered to be his contribution (or that's certainly the way it worked when my parents divorced though the genders were reversed - possibly an issue given the inherant sexism in Irish law).

Given price drops in the current market, however, now may be a good time for this to happen. Lowe house prices should make it easier for your father to buy her out of her share than it would have been a few years ago (and given the levels of denial out there, I'd lay 10 to 1 that your mother thinks the house is worth far more than it's real value).

I've no idea what the legalities of the situation but is it possible to have your mother declared as not being of sound mind / diminished capacity and legally incapable of handling her own financial dealings since from the sounds of things she's involved with a cult?

I wanted to do this - I wonder if there is a way of getting her tested or something?

She is involved in a cult. They destroy families and I had regular email contact with a guy who had been abandoned by his whole family in favour of this church too - I'm hoping I can get back in touch with him too as I imagine he will be useful to have around.

I would be afraid that she is in fact of sound mind in a weird way - that she genuinely believes all of this and can stand over everything they preach. I remember this from asking her questions about the church and their reasons for certain things when I was younger - she always had an answer for everything.

I will ask solicitor on Friday if there is any way that we can request that her mental capacity be tested. thanks.

LegacyUser

Hey Op,

First of all *big hug*, that is just the most depressing story. Just wanted to say that while the legal system is very sexist here, i.e. automatic custody of children goes to women, I will point out that it's a double edged sword. The courts are out and out disgusted at women who leave their children. Please don't worry too much about this, while it is heinously unfair you just have to remember that it will work out. Make sure your dad has a good solicitor, hide his booze and overall just be there for him. You're doing great though and he's very lucky to have you and your siblings. If you feel upset at the injustice just remember that your father has you guys, your mother just has an invisable man in the sky.

Big big hugs.

peanuthead

so sorry for you wrote: »

Hey Op,

First of all *big hug*, that is just the most depressing story. Just wanted to say that while the legal system is very sexist here, i.e. automatic custody of children goes to women, I will point out that it's a double edged sword. The courts are out and out disgusted at women who leave their children. Please don't worry too much about this, while it is heinously unfair you just have to remember that it will work out. Make sure your dad has a good solicitor, hide his booze and overall just be there for him. You're doing great though and he's very lucky to have you and your siblings. If you feel upset at the injustice just remember that your father has you guys, your mother just has an invisable man in the sky.

Big big hugs.

Even if custody was given to her - she wouldn't want it!! I know that wasn't your point though, I know what you mean. I was kind of hoping this situation:

Female judge: Unable to fathom why another woman would abandon their children for a religious organisation.

Male judge: (Sexistly) sides with my dad for doing what a lot of men don't normally do and stick around and try his best.

As I said above, it may be a blessing in disguise if the house goes - its in a rough enough estate, wouldn't mind getting out and the sister hates the place too!

But its my dad. This is all he ever wanted - his own place and he's very down at the thought of losing it.

username123

Hi OP - what a horrible situation.

Well as far as the family home goes your mother hasnt a legal leg to stand on. Herself and your father were married under Irish law, and it doesnt matter who physically paid the mortgage, the both have an equal share in the family home, and if there are any children under 18 or under 22 and still in full time education then the family home cannot be sold anyway without the express agreement of both parents.

You dont mention what the legal situation is re your parents, are they legally seperated, going for divorce or what? It may be that they need to hammer that out.

As far as court and judges go - its unlikely it will go to court at all - this is the kind of thing that gets sorted between solicitors and mediation (in this case maybe not mediation). However if it DOES go to court a judge is not going to look favourably on a mother who abandoned her family to join a cult.

Darlughda

Horrible situation.

Peanuthead, there are quite a number of organisations out there that provide support and advice for people who's family members have gotten caught up in a cult.

Some of them are specific to a particular cult, some deal with extricating a person out of them, and others deal with the fallout for example situations like the one your father is in. I don't know which are the best but there is a fair bit of info on google, and then maybe you will be able to find an Irish branch.

This could be useful for your father's solicitor, particularly if you can find info on any people who faced this particular nasty situation, and could this could support a legal argument.

dory

I'm very sorry to hear of your situation. As the others have said, it's highly unlikely she would get all the profit. Maybe if he got 50% he could buy something small in the country and get away from the old memories? It might be a blessing in the end, he gets away from the family home and still keeps the support of his four children.

peanuthead

username123 wrote: »

Hi OP - what a horrible situation.

Well as far as the family home goes your mother hasnt a legal leg to stand on. Herself and your father were married under Irish law, and it doesnt matter who physically paid the mortgage, the both have an equal share in the family home, and if there are any children under 18 or under 22 and still in full time education then the family home cannot be sold anyway without the express agreement of both parents.

You dont mention what the legal situation is re your parents, are they legally seperated, going for divorce or what? It may be that they need to hammer that out.

As far as court and judges go - its unlikely it will go to court at all - this is the kind of thing that gets sorted between solicitors and mediation (in this case maybe not mediation). However if it DOES go to court a judge is not going to look favourably on a mother who abandoned her family to join a cult.

Thanks for your advice.

the legal situation is this:

She walked out 5 years ago and we never heard from her again until now. I told my dad to regularise matters legally, ie: look for a separation but I believe this was not possible until now as 5 years had to have been passed. I was just about to bring the situation up again with my dad this december but he got ill and was in hospital. It was while he was in hospital that the first letter came, saying she wanted a judicial separation.

My dad knew that she wanted to do this as she was retiring. We know that as some of her post still comes to this address, therefore we got her pension info (no figures!! just a letter confirming that she was retiring) She always said that after retirement she would go off to Spain to live closer to the church.

So he was dragging his heels about it but went to solicitor. Dad made an offer that he would keep the house and she could keep her pension. She rejected and said she wasn't interested in mediation.

That was the last we heard until now when her 'claim' which does talk about court proceedings came through the letterbox this morning.

Darlughda wrote: »

Horrible situation.

Peanuthead, there are quite a number of organisations out there that provide support and advice for people who's family members have gotten caught up in a cult.

Some of them are specific to a particular cult, some deal with extricating a person out of them, and others deal with the fallout for example situations like the one your father is in. I don't know which are the best but there is a fair bit of info on google, and then maybe you will be able to find an Irish branch.

This could be useful for your father's solicitor, particularly if you can find info on any people who faced this particular nasty situation, and could this could support a legal argument.

thanks for that info. I didn't know about it and will check it out. Hopefully solicitor will have some info for us friday. My dad is passing the letters on to him tomorrow so that he can have them read for friday.

dory wrote: »

I'm very sorry to hear of your situation. As the others have said, it's highly unlikely she would get all the profit. Maybe if he got 50% he could buy something small in the country and get away from the old memories? It might be a blessing in the end, he gets away from the family home and still keeps the support of his four children.

Yeah I suppose after all is said and done and in a years time that won't seem like such a bad thing and may even be, as you say, a blessing in disguise, it doesn't feel like that at moment, but I am a believer that all things happen for a reason so hopefully this time I'm not let down.



Thanks for all the supportive posts by the way. I don't have too many people close to me so its good to vent this way!! Telling your friends about it means they are constantly hounding you about it with only the best intentions of course - this way I can face the conversation when I'm able to but don't have to open the thread if I can't face it - hope that makes sense.

username123

OP - I know you are on your fathers side in this, and I totally think your mother was crazy to run off and leave her family to join a cult, but just bear in mind that no one except the two people in the situation really know what went on, and your fathers drinking may have had effects on her that you dont know about.

I suppose Im just saying, no one knows what goes on between two peope behind closed doors and its important for YOU that you try to remain as objective as possible too. Just so you dont hate your mother on your fathers behalf as it were - because you really dont know her side of the story as regards the relationship with your father. It may have been difficult for her to be the sole 'official' earner, his drinking may have affected her in ways you dont know about, etc.... Its easy to jump in to the defence of the parent you ended up being closest to - but really its their situation to sort out and what may seem fair to you may be skewed by your view of the situation which is coloured by being left behind with your father.

So while its commendable that you are supporting your father, try to look after yourself and allow them to sort this out for themselves if you can.

Its just that its clear you are quite tied up in and very worried about all of this - which is understandable, but so you dont get consumed with hatred or rage or so full of worry that youre a big bag of stress - try to back away from it a bit emotionally if you can.

Big hugs by the way - it is stressful.

CDfm

Hi OP

First of all I hear your pain and imagine lots of people men & women on boards are rooting for you.

It does seem that your Dad was used to being bullied by your Mum and put dealing with it on the long finger. Maybe your Mum has found her niche and as a teacher she will get both a cash lump sum and pension and of course your Dad would be entitled to a portion of that too. That is her achilles heel.

The best route if there has been an unequal relationship is to contact Amen on www.amen.ie who are a support group and based in Navan and tel 046 9023718 and they have support staff to deal with situations such as your Dads. Probably best to make an appointment and go with him and bring the paperwork with you.

I know quite a few guys who have gone their and even my girlfriend who is a manager at a company where she manages 10-12 men has refered guys there.

Best of luck.:)

coolcat63

She's made her accusations but no court will take them at face value. Before seeing the solicitor write down as much as you can, between you, your siblings and your father to refute them. Get all the information on her cult; especially any previous cases where they have asset-stripped devotees.

Try to be as calm and rational as possible for your fathers sake. You WILL win this.

peanuthead

username123 wrote: »

OP - I know you are on your fathers side in this, and I totally think your mother was crazy to run off and leave her family to join a cult, but just bear in mind that no one except the two people in the situation really know what went on, and your fathers drinking may have had effects on her that you dont know about.

I suppose Im just saying, no one knows what goes on between two peope behind closed doors and its important for YOU that you try to remain as objective as possible too. Just so you dont hate your mother on your fathers behalf as it were - because you really dont know her side of the story as regards the relationship with your father. It may have been difficult for her to be the sole 'official' earner, his drinking may have affected her in ways you dont know about, etc.... Its easy to jump in to the defence of the parent you ended up being closest to - but really its their situation to sort out and what may seem fair to you may be skewed by your view of the situation which is coloured by being left behind with your father.

So while its commendable that you are supporting your father, try to look after yourself and allow them to sort this out for themselves if you can.

Its just that its clear you are quite tied up in and very worried about all of this - which is understandable, but so you dont get consumed with hatred or rage or so full of worry that youre a big bag of stress - try to back away from it a bit emotionally if you can.

Big hugs by the way - it is stressful.

Hi

thanks for your advice.

I was only thinking about this today. I know that there are many things that may have gone on that I didn't know about. I'm sure my dad's drinking did piss her off at times, hell it gets on my nerves when it happens.

Had she left for a reason like that, although it would be hard I would, on some level, accept and understand that.

Contrary to how its sounding on here - I actually have quite a poor relationship with my father. I too am a teacher, look like her, teach the same subjects as her and can have that sarky way about me that she had (as much as I hate it) I think the fact that I am so like her has meant that our relationship has deteriorated over the years. I know he is as sorry as me about that fact, but it is nevertheless a fact.

I don't resent my mother because she's taking my dad to court. The resentment was there long before this happened. She was awful to live with and left me with an inferiority complex, low self-esteem and confidence issues that it took 2 years of counselling to deal with.

It wasn't the tough time it sounds like it was at the time for me and my siblings - we were delighted she was gone. She was never a mother to us and I suppose thats why we dealt with her leaving better than most of our friends would have. They could not get over how well we handled it - but I suppose you don't mourn the loss of something you never had to begin with. I remember my sister put it beautifully one day when she said:
"Even though she's gone and we have no idea where she is - the distance between her and us is still the same"

Before this I had been thinking of moving out once the school year gets going again and the wages are in. But you are right and I need to detach myself emotionally from this a little. I think I may still move out as I think I'll be more help to him from a distance. As I said our relationship is shaky at the best of times, with all this tension added we could be killing each other before court!!

CDfm wrote: »

Hi OP

First of all I hear your pain and imagine lots of people men & women on boards are rooting for you.

It does seem that your Dad was used to being bullied by your Mum and put dealing with it on the long finger. Maybe your Mum has found her niche and as a teacher she will get both a cash lump sum and pension and of course your Dad would be entitled to a portion of that too. That is her achilles heel.

The best route if there has been an unequal relationship is to contact Amen on www.amen.ie who are a support group and based in Navan and tel 046 9023718 and they have support staff to deal with situations such as your Dads. Probably best to make an appointment and go with him and bring the paperwork with you.

I know quite a few guys who have gone their and even my girlfriend who is a manager at a company where she manages 10-12 men has refered guys there.

Best of luck.:)

Thank you. I will absolutely be getting in touch with them. Hopefully he will agree to go - he is a wee bit stubborn at the best of times.

Thank you also for your kind wishes. As I said before I'm sure that whatever the outcome it will be ok!

coolcat63 wrote: »

She's made her accusations but no court will take them at face value. Before seeing the solicitor write down as much as you can, between you, your siblings and your father to refute them. Get all the information on her cult; especially any previous cases where they have asset-stripped devotees.

Try to be as calm and rational as possible for your fathers sake. You WILL win this.

I'm glad to hear that the court won't take her accusations at face value. I'm thinking this could be where we win as everything she has said about my dad not working is lies. She probably thinks that because it was cash work that it can't be proven, but I was just thinking that some of his time was spent working in a sandwich van. He will have certs to say he passed health and safety checks to be selling food. That may be enough to prove that although he shouldn't have been working for cash, he was still working.

I know some people will not be pleased to hear that he was working for cash - nor would I be but thats in the past and I suppose this is his punishment for not being above board!!

Finding others who this has happened to shouldn't be a problem. I had one very well informed contact and I'm sure he will be able to root out some other poor unfortunates as I know for a fact there are many!





I'm reading the letter now in front of me and it mentions that this is taking place in the Circuit Family Court. It has a Record Number and all so I guess that means it will in fact be going to court??

CDfm

OP - Family Courts are different. The court number means yes a court date has been set according to her application and there will be a hearing or an adjournment. Court cases are expensive but your father needs to be represented. He may also be eligible for legal aid if on a low income. Amen could assist him work this out.

Its the judge who decides the split of assets and your Dad has the right to seek maintenance too from the higher earning spouse.

Here is a thread on marriage etc

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055694680

What you have to remember is that the system is adversorial as it is based on contract law and with lawyers you get a lot of emotional noise and mudslinging. Marriage law is based on property law and the disollution of a marriage divides that.Your mother retired early so her financial need is of her own making.

Just because your mother has started the process this way means she has come out all guns blazing.Leopard and spots. I have a teacher mother so I know what they can be like.There is a bias in courts towards the "homemaker " these days.

I am divorced and it took ages but there is a change inthe way men are treated.

The reason I posted the link is that your father needs to sit down with people and plan his case. He might even look at contacting the County Council to look at his housing needs for when the case comes up as a judge will take this into account if it is presented to them.

That she has a court number means that she is going in and making an application for the house to be sold and "her asset". Your Dad has to participate or the decisions are made without him. So he needs to present his needs to the judge too.The judge makes the decision on who gets what.

(I think I know the organisation you mean by the way and they will be property rich too and have property that is occupied by members -so its worth doing your homework in to the organisation and your mothers housing needs too as she may not have any if she is living in a group property and working as a volunteer in their centre).

If your fathers health is now poor and his earning capacity low he needs to be looking at this to see whether or not there is reason for an adjournment etc.

So what I am saying here is that your father needs to participate and plan his case and find a good solicitor who can maximize his situation for the court.

I am naturally a bit biased here -cos my own situation was on the nasty side. I have 2 kids who live with their Mum and I have a great relationship with them. You havent turned out bad at all. All parents are human and bitterness is kind of non productive and a luxury.

I genuinely hope your mother has found happiness or will be happy in her new life and your Dad gets a good result too.

helimachoptor

OP/Mods am i allowed ask what church this is?

peanuthead

And am I allowed to answer? I assume so, as I have actually mentioned them on this site before so it is no secret who they are.

The only thing I would be worried about is possibly becoming known via the thread. But to be honest I have nothing to hide in that respect - and have probably given enough information on a unique enough situation as it is, so rather than name them here I'll post a link to a post I wrote way back in April 2008. (Which ironically names them!)

I have re-read the post and notice that at the time I had the date of her leaving as 22nd Dec 2004. I actually honestly don't know which date is the real one.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=318698

seamus

You may be lucky that it's a relatively small cult - they will have less access to high-level solicitors and less savvy legally. I was worried you were going to mention Opus Dei, who would be a whole other kettle of fish.

CDfm gives great advice. Good luck.

helimachoptor

peanuthead wrote: »

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=318698

Thanks OP, quite some eye opening posts in there.

CDfm

peanuthead wrote: »

And am I allowed to answer? I assume so, as I have actually mentioned them on this site before so it is no secret who they are.

The only thing I would be worried about is possibly becoming known via the thread. But to be honest I have nothing to hide in that respect - and have probably given enough information on a unique enough situation as it is, so rather than name them here I'll post a link to a post I wrote way back in April 2008. (Which ironically names them!)

I have re-read the post and notice that at the time I had the date of her leaving as 22nd Dec 2004. I actually honestly don't know which date is the real one.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=318698

when it comes to family law stuff you are ok to post as long as you dont give detail to actually identify the people involved -thats the general rule with any media.

cases are in camera for that reason

dont forget it is the judge who is in charge and its your Dad who instructs the solicitor

Judges are human too and were practicing lawyers and have seen it all before. they are likely not to be happy if someone was going to take the proceeds of a sale and give it to a church

A real tip is to get all the factual information together as a person not used to it will be upset by the doublespeak and lies. So dont be your job is to get your result but also by keeping your integrity.

My judge in the Circuit Court was a woman and she was great to me and reviewed the agreement and did not just rubber stamp it but made court orders I had recieved previously part of her order. So it can be fairer than you think

peanuthead

seamus wrote: »

You may be lucky that it's a relatively small cult - they will have less access to high-level solicitors and less savvy legally. I was worried you were going to mention Opus Dei, who would be a whole other kettle of fish.

CDfm gives great advice. Good luck.

Yes a small cult which is now headed by a former lawyer however. I'm sure he's a dab hand and doing just enough to make sure he doesn't cross the line. An ex-lawyer from Spain that is.

helimachoptor wrote: »

Thanks OP, quite some eye opening posts in there.

yeah, you think that's bad, you should google them and find a list of their rules.

CDfm wrote: »

when it comes to family law stuff you are ok to post as long as you dont give detail to actually identify the people involved -thats the general rule with any media.

cases are in camera for that reason

dont forget it is the judge who is in charge and its your Dad who instructs the solicitor

Judges are human too and were practicing lawyers and have seen it all before. they are likely not to be happy if someone was going to take the proceeds of a sale and give it to a church

A real tip is to get all the factual information together as a person not used to it will be upset by the doublespeak and lies. So dont be your job is to get your result but also by keeping your integrity.

My judge in the Circuit Court was a woman and she was great to me and reviewed the agreement and did not just rubber stamp it but made court orders I had recieved previously part of her order. So it can be fairer than you think

Yeah getting all that factual info organised. A bit of a pain as I am trying my best to help dad but he is just so down about it all and is always "too busy" to do it.




Anyway- went to the solicitor today and I'm in a much better situation understanding-wise about it all, ie: what has to be done next.

The solicitor doesn't seem to be able to tell which way this is going to go. I believe that is normal in these cases but it doesn't help.

So glad I was there as my dad was useless on his own. Couldn't remember dates, doesn't know whats left on mortgage, was getting information mixed up... I know he is stressed and overwhelmed but its very hard to explain to him how important it is to remember things like:

When you were looking after the kids and doing the shopping, where was the money coming from?
His answer is: Maybe it came from my account, but it could have came from the joint account (eg: her wages)

Anyhow, I don't want to get into the specifics as I'm aware this is not a legal issues thread, but it was so hard today trying to get his head round it all.

I know a previous poster suggested that I need to take a step back but I can't. If I don't hold his hand through this it won't be done. At least not well done.

I have to write our counter claim over the weekend and write up a list of the expenditures my dad has so that he can fill it out with figures. All he can say to that is "Why do I have to do this?"

All this amidst the fact that I have just encountered some serious work-related problems.

I'm trying to stay calm and restrained and I'm doing a relatively good job at it now, but the work-related problem centres around not enough hours and I'm going to have to make those hours up and when I do I can see myself becoming so stressed.

CDfm

Peanuthead - you need to get yourself down to Navan with or without your dad. They have meetings on Tuesday nights for guys to sit around and get used to the idea that they are not the only one and think positively.The documentation etc is standard legal stuff and you need to know whats what. So you need to call them.

It is very hard to deal with these things unemotionally and thats why you get people to help you. These things are normally awful to have to write up yourself as it is painful.

Whenever I was dealing with them I used to pop in and see a friend of mine who managed an office in the city and who would put the stuff in order for me. It wasn't her crap so she felt easier putting it together.

The answer to your Dad is to say that she is taking a court case and you appreciate it brings back bad memories but the stakes are high and its for the house. Its not nice to be the object of someones hate.

peanuthead

CDfm wrote: »

Peanuthead - you need to get yourself down to Navan with or without your dad. They have meetings on Tuesday nights for guys to sit around and get used to the idea that they are not the only one and think positively.The documentation etc is standard legal stuff and you need to know whats what. So you need to call them.

That was one thing I left out of my post, I told him about amen and he was all "yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, we'll go" and then I said it was in Navan and he let a roar on the top of his voice "Navan??? Do you think I have the time to go to Navan??"

The man is not THAT busy - he could well fit this in. I'm the one who couldn't , but I still would.

The tricky bit is that I work days and he works nights. I get in about 8pm most nights and he's off to work at 10pm until 6am.

It involves me taking time off work each time something needs to be done, like today for example. It won't be long before my employer gets annoyed about that, although given my hours at the moment it wouldn't be a problem, but that's a whole other story.

So my question was going to be can I as a woman go to amen?


I have decided to go to the country for the weekend, just to get some much needed head space.

CDfm

peanuthead wrote: »

That was one thing I left out of my post, I told him about amen and he was all "yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, we'll go" and then I said it was in Navan and he let a roar on the top of his voice "Navan??? Do you think I have the time to go to Navan??"

Haha - tell him he will wish he made the effort before he goes to court.
He is afraid .

So my question was going to be can I as a woman go to amen?

I cant see why not as it was set up by a Woman and most of the staff are women. You will fit right in

It is an egalitarian organisation.

I have decided to go to the country for the weekend, just to get some much needed head space.

Thats the spirit.

username123

peanuthead wrote: »

I have decided to go to the country for the weekend, just to get some much needed head space.

Good on you!! A good start on looking after YOU and detaching a little

I know you need to support your father and help him out to get things done, I just meant for you to try to keep emotionally seperate about the situation between your mother and father, as you'll only do your own head in. Help out, yes, but try to keep it in businesslike mode in your mind if you can (easier said than done eh?).

Good luck.

peanuthead

Hi all

Had a chat with my dad this evening.

He's being a bit more realistic about things now. Which, totally unexpectedly has me now very afraid and upset.

After talking to the solicitor and others who have been in similar situations he has accepted that he will more than likely have to sell.

I'm furious that he's giving up so easily as I want him to fight her for all that he can get. I can notice myself getting very much emotionally involved and I even broke down in front of my dad today. I haven't done that in about 10 years and that was a big thing to me.

I hate the thought of my dad living out his days in rented accommodation. NO disrespect whatsoever to anyone who does this but I just don't want it for my dad. He may not have been the one paying the mortgage for all those years but he was the one who made that house a home.

I'm working on our counter claim and defence at the moment as per the solicitors instructions.

I should add that I don't like the solicitor and am not comfortable with him representing us. I have said this to my dad and he has said that although he doesn't trust him, he doesn't trust solicitors full stop so he doesn't see the point in switching.

The worst part is that we have been given NO indication of how this is likely to turn out. Mainly because I suppose they don't know as every case is unique. Thing is, no matter what the value of the house, my dad has access to about 20K (Don't know if that's savings or a loan - must ask). Nowhere near enough to buy her out I would imagine.

PS: This is a judicial separation. She can't divorce due to her religion but I have encouraged my dad to pursue one anyway, for his benefit and to annoy her also. He is going to.

That last bit in bold seems so tit-for-tat. I can feel the bitterness starting to form and I don't think I can control it to be honest.