Standard and Poor ?!?

lisbon_lions

Can someone explain to me what these shower are about? Am I right in saying they are a private outfit who run around laying ratings on countries (and their people) with such ratings having a serious bearing on the taxpayer of each nation?

I understand that they asked for "new faces" in Irish Govt in 2009 - erm, FF chumps aside, you should kindly keep the fcuk out of our politics, its not your department. In fact, i'm at a loss as to what your function [agenda] is S&P? In other words, should a financial services company have such an overbearing influence on a sovereign state or nation (and its people)? I think not, but i'm open to reasoned debate, as ever.

EI111

They don't have a direct affect, they just act as a guide for the [people who really decide interest rates at auction

Slydice

Short:
Investment funds buy Irish Government debt but not for free. They charge interest.

When the rating agencies lower our rating, the investment funds charge more interest to buy our debt.

Long:
Our greed got the better of us in the last few year and the property bubble happened.

The government and independent regulators did nothing to stop it.

Now, no one has jobs and we can't pay for our houses so these guys are telling the "Market" (investment funds) that it is risky to buy Irish.

Longer:
So, the **** hit the fan and we've panic and made things worse.

First we guaranteed the banks instead of letting some fail.

Then the Gov took on all the property loans that ain't gonna get paid back into NAMA.

The Gov tried to hide that with a trick called an SPV so the E.U. would say NAMA is OK.

That actually worked. We tricked the E.U. but we were only fooling ourselves.

So now the Market has figured out that we are broke and that we also have to pay for NAMA.

Way to long, queue the trolls:
So now that the tide has gone out, the market has seen us with our pants down (Gov debt + NAMA)

It doesn't like what it sees and thinks we might default. I've read were riskier than Iceland now.

NAMAs controllers the NTMA kicked up a fuss about it this morning. Something like "How dare you not believe our trick".

Well, fact of the matter is... These guys Standard & Poor's are a company. Not a Gov or the E.U.

They advise investment funds. Right now they look at Ireland and they see 400,000 unemployed trying to pay off the 2006 average house price of 300,000 euro by using their Social Welfare of 150 - 200 euro a week.

We're bust. End of.

kippy

These are the same rating agencies that got it hopelessly wrong in the bubble times, especially when giving ratings to US banks who at the time were completely upto their oxters in toxic debt. Banks who shouldnt have had a rating at all. Questions were asked about the "independence" of these agencies.
They do have power, make no mistake and what they are saying about our ability to pay is bang on, if only they were as good in the "celtic tiger" days.........

kfallon

Nice username OP

john hanrahan

these ratings agencies also gave AAA ratings to the subprime mortgage bundles coming out of the U.S, which if we cast our mind back were a major cause of the collapse of U.S banks which lead to a global downturn.

i do think there is something not quite right about these agencies, and i suspect a political and or a national bias in their judgments

FISMA

These were also the people that were giving AAA to Bear Sterns, Lehman Brothers, Fannie, Freddie, and AIG right up until about the time that...

Also, giving a AAA rating is a matter of perspective. All they have to do is follow the letter of the law but not the spirit.

Slydice

FISMA wrote: »

These were also the people that were giving AAA to Bear Sterns, Lehman Brothers, Fannie, Freddie, and AIG right up until about the time that...

Also, giving a AAA rating is a matter of perspective. All they have to do is follow the letter of the law but not the spirit.

They sure are.

Now if they tend to make a picture look better than it is and they are only notching us down 1 level...

Have a think about where we really are.

Cats and Dogs on the street know we're screwed.

foxyboxer

I always find it ironic when the rating agency Moody's gives a good rating

Who should do the rating Op?
Seriously, who?