Roundabouts - some dodgy information out there?

snappieT

A friend of mine is learning to drive, and I went for a spin with him yesterday to see how he's getting on. I started off teaching him, but he's had some proper lessons since. When we were driving, he came off a roundabout in (what I see as) an unsafe way, but he was adamant that his instructor told him to do it this way. I'm not convinced.

When turning right at a roundabout, he entered via the right lane, and went onto the inside lane of the (two lane) roundabout. When exiting, he cut across the outside lane of the roundabout so that he would be in the left lane of the (two lane) exit. This is the red line in the pic below. This seems insane, as a car going straight through the roundabout (the blue line) could be in the outside lane at that point.



A bit of research leads to a lot of ambiguity, and then to this site, which explicitly says

Our animation shows the vehicle exit the roundabout into the right lane (Lane 2). You should only do this if there is traffic in the nearside lane or you wish to turn right straight after leaving the roundabout.
In an ideal situation you should leave the roundabout in the left lane (Lane 1)

Would anyone care to clarify for me what way you should exit a roundabout if you're turning right, and if possible provide text from the rules of the road or otherwise to show this?

GTE

The way I was taught


First Exit: Left lane
Second Exit: Left lane or right lane (and join into the left lane after first exit) depending on road markings
Third Exit and After: Right lane and then join the left lane after the last exit before yours.

http://www.rotr.ie/pdf-downloads/english/rules-of-the-road%20eng.pdf

Your friend seems very correct. Providing he is indicating properly and the road user taking the blue line is following the rules of the road then there is no problem though since there are two lanes on the exit maybe he could have taken the right lane at the exit instead. However, I have a feeling that if there was a car in the way he would notice.

Do remember that if the Blue driver took the right hand lane (say if the road markings dictated that) then he would join the red line and follow that.

sentient_6

Hmmm......if i'm going right at a roundabout & the exit has two lanes & tend to stay in lane two while taking the exit & then return to lane one once its safe to do so. But, i guess if there's no traffic in lane one it probably isn't a big deal to go straight into it to exit. But got to check those mirrors & have a look over the shoulder to be safe.

harr

snappieT wrote: »

A friend of mine is learning to drive, and I went for a spin with him yesterday to see how he's getting on. I started off teaching him, but he's had some proper lessons since. When we were driving, he came off a roundabout in (what I see as) an unsafe way, but he was adamant that his instructor told him to do it this way. I'm not convinced.

When turning right at a roundabout, he entered via the right lane, and went onto the inside lane of the (two lane) roundabout. When exiting, he cut across the outside lane of the roundabout so that he would be in the left lane of the (two lane) exit. This seems insane, as a car going straight through the roundabout could be in the outside lane at that point.

A bit of research leads to a lot of ambiguity, and then to this site, which explicitly says


Would anyone care to clarify for me what way you should exit a roundabout if you're turning right, and if possible provide text from the rules of the road or otherwise to show this?

your friend is right i think?you only use the left lane when you exit at first exit or second exit(straight) you should use the right hand lane for all other exits on the roundabout so when you move from right to left lane to exit there should be no cars in the left lane.

The Big Red Button

snappieT wrote: »

When turning right at a roundabout, he entered via the right lane, and went onto the inside lane of the (two lane) roundabout. When exiting, he cut across the outside lane of the roundabout so that he would be in the left lane of the (two lane) exit. This is the red line in the pic below. This seems insane, as a car going straight through the roundabout (the blue line) could be in the outside lane at that point.

Well, you're going to have to cut across the outside lane at some point anyways in order to exit!

snappieT wrote: »

Would anyone care to clarify for me what way you should exit a roundabout if you're turning right, and if possible provide text from the rules of the road or otherwise to show this?

I think you're right, I would take the inner lane going round and then exit onto the right hand lane. And that's how it's done in the diagram on this page, same in the moving diagram here (watch the yellow or red car.)

But then if you look at the diagram on the RSA page here, it looks like the car is exiting onto the left hand lane. So I'm not 100% sure.

sentient_6

harr wrote: »

...so when you move from right to left lane to exit there should be no cars in the left lane.

Cars could've entered the roundabout from other exits though & be just behind you as a result. So mirrors all the way i think.

GTE

The problem that the OP has is easily sorted out by using the mirrors and taking note of what people are doing on the roundabout are doing, especially considering its only a matter of taking a different lane on the exit.

The only way I can see a problem is if you have a rally speed start by the Blue line driver just as the Red line driver is beginning to exit but that doesn't really happen.

In normal circumstances if the red driver is taking proper care and attention you shouldnt have a problem thats his or her fault. If he or she does not do this you have a much bigger problem on your hands across all driving instead of something small like this.

This thread could jump to making something huge out of a small technicality IMO but if your friend used that lane on the exit as he was side by side by blue line driver then he should be told he is wrong. It should be simple for him when he works it out.

snappieT

I suppose that more than anything, the right lane seems the safer one to exit off of, as there is no chance of a collision. I just can't see why it wouldn't always be used for that reason. For that matter, is there any circumstance under which you would exit in the right lane?

GTE

snappieT wrote: »

I suppose that more than anything, the right lane seems the safer one to exit off of, as there is no chance of a collision. I just can't see why it wouldn't always be used for that reason. For that matter, is there any circumstance under which you would exit in the right lane?

Well, generally there isnt a chance of a collision when you do it properly.

By the book probably every situation for when you are exiting from the inside lane of a roundabout, but in most situations outside of very busy roundabouts there is little point.

Its a similar thing when you go straight you start on the left lane, cut into the right lane and then cut back into the left lane on a roundabout thats very empty. Slight laziness but not the worst offence to do as long as an idiot isn't at the wheel thinking he can do it when he likes.

Matt Simis

snappieT wrote: »

I suppose that more than anything, the right lane seems the safer one to exit off of, as there is no chance of a collision. I just can't see why it wouldn't always be used for that reason. For that matter, is there any circumstance under which you would exit in the right lane?

There is no difference (though I prefer to stay right "in lane" too) as he has to cross the path of the blue line driver whether he exits on the left or right lane of his exit.

jaffa20

Your friend is right. It's how instructors are teaching it and how i was taught. You should be checking your mirrors etc and idicating anyway before taking the exit. If someone was taking the same exit in the left lane, you would obviously exit onto the right lane but if you coming around the roundabout, they shouldn't be to your left at the time you are taking the exit unless they moved out without giving you right of way. Either way, i'd say doing both are ok.

opinion guy

.

cyclopath2001

Matt Simis wrote: »

There is no difference (though I prefer to stay right "in lane" too) as he has to cross the path of the blue line driver whether he exits on the left or right lane of his exit.

The matter of the 'correct' lane is important, but not as important as observing the regulations on overtaking, failing to overtake correctly is what causes conflict on roundabouts. The lane discipline and indicating are helpful, but, there seems to be a lack of awareness in all these discussions of roundabout etiquette, of the problems caused by ignorance of the overtaking regulations.

The fundamentals of overtaking are:

1: Not endangering anyone..
2: Not to cause inconvenience to anyone.

Once these are understood, lane use on roundabouts is nearly a matter of courtesy, like deciding which fork to use at dinner.

Forest Master

Your friend is 100% right - you always exit in the left lane when taking the 3rd exit. How would there be a collission? There shouldn't be another car there (i.e. your blue line) unless they joined the roundabout too early! And when exiting you always check your left mirror anyway.

corktina

thats how I was taught but then again why is there a second lane ?

Matt Simis

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

The matter of the 'correct' lane is important, but not as important as observing the regulations on overtaking, failing to overtake correctly is what causes conflict on roundabouts. The lane discipline and indicating are helpful, but, there seems to be a lack of awareness in all these discussions of roundabout etiquette, of the problems caused by ignorance of the overtaking regulations.

The fundamentals of overtaking are:

1: Not endangering anyone..
2: Not to cause inconvenience to anyone.

Once these are understood, lane use on roundabouts is nearly a matter of courtesy, like deciding which fork to use at dinner.

Thats great and fine, but nothing to do with my post expect to back up what Im saying in a very wordy manner..

kazul

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

Once these are understood, lane use on roundabouts is nearly a matter of courtesy, like deciding which fork to use at dinner.

As a motorist-hating rule-lover you should understand that you don't arbitrarily decide which fork to use at a properly set table. There are specific rules which one should follow.
I'm off to the cycling forum now to lecture some users on the rules of the road, quid pro quo etc.

cyclopath2001

kazul wrote: »

As a motorist-hating rule-lover

sigh.

kazul wrote: »

There are specific rules which one should follow.

There are statutory regulations governing overtaking and changing lanes. There are no statutory regulations governing lane use on a roundabout. Therefore, when discussing best practice on a roundabout, it is logical to begin by dealing with what is required by law. After that, following recommended procedure is certainly a good idea.

From what I see every day safety problems on roundabouts are primarily caused by illegal overtaking.

ajaynejr

You (red line) should have changed to the left lane a little sooner. That is, change to the left lane just after passing the exit before yours. Then you will be lined up to use the left lane in the exit.

The complaint has been raised on other forums about cars comin' 'round in the left lane making it harder to enter the roundabout (blue line). The answer to this complaint is that you are not supposed to enter alongside a car proceeding in the circle. Just in case it may be headed for the next exit. Let that car move on and then enter.

If you ask me, a roundablut is an accident waiting to happen. You are not supposed to have cars in the left lane having the choice of taking the exit or continuing around and also cars in the right lane having the choice of taking the exit or continuing around. There ought to be lane lines painted on the roadway in the circle that force cars in the left lane to exit or force cars in the right lane to continue around.