Do not Watch RTE One Now!!

Big Mouth

We wouldn't want any here to see the scumbags that shot 3 showband members and have Republican sympathies or Nationalist anger (Or even understand the sentiment).

Best not watch the type of activity the UVF, UDR, RUC and BA get up to when their not shooting the bad IRA men who eat babies

So lets get back to the usual IRA / Republican bashing......

baldbear

Madness what happened to them. Brave men attacking a few musicians.
Depressing viewing allright

KeithAFC

That was the troubles for you. Not nice. RIP to all.

Big Mouth

KeithAFC wrote: »

That was the troubles for you. Not nice. RIP to all.

LOL.....you don't get that kind of response when its the IRA inolved..then its all scumbags blah blah blah.

KeithAFC

Everyone knows the IRA were scum. Whats your point? Its the same with the UDR etc.

eamo12

Big Mouth wrote: »

We wouldn't want any here to see the scumbags that shot 3 showband members and have Republican sympathies or Nationalist anger (Or even understand the sentiment).

Best not watch the type of activity the UVF, UDR, RUC and BA get up to when their not shooting the bad IRA men who eat babies

So lets get back to the usual IRA / Republican bashing......

OK - IRA scumbags *deliberately* murdered hundreds of INNOCENT men, women and children. But I cannot verify that they actually ate the babies they murdered.

How's that?

Big Mouth

I don't think the IRA as a whole were scum, plenty of people don't so you're wrong there .

Yes they commited some attrocities and weren't always right in what they did but they were created for a reason don't be so naive to think they weren't.

Wouldn't blame the IRA for bombing a military target at all in response to these kind of acts were commited by oppressive anti-cathlolic scum.

And if you think the IRA are bad I'd love to know your thoughts on the BA who are currently killing women and children as we speak!

baldbear

The British army fella Robert Nairc got what was coming to him after that.

Big Mouth

eamo12 wrote: »

OK - IRA scumbags *deliberately* murdered hundreds of INNOCENT men, women and children. But I cannot verify that they actually ate the babies they murdered.

How's that?

How do you feel about the BA, as I mentioned above?

KeithAFC

Big Mouth wrote: »

I don't think the IRA as a whole were scum, plenty of people don't so you're wrong there .

Yes they commited some attrocities and weren't always right in what they did but they were created for a reason don't be so naive to think they weren't.

Wouldn't blame the IRA for bombing a military target at all in response to these kind of acts were commited by oppressive anti-cathlolic scum.

And if you think the IRA are bad I'd love to know your thoughts on the BA who are currently killing women and children as we speak!

I think the family of the pregnant woman at Omagh who lost her life and her two twins yet to be born will disagree.

Big Mouth

KeithAFC wrote: »

I think the family of the pregnant woman at Omagh who lost her life and her two twins yet to be born will disagree.

That was the RIRA and they are scum I agree there.....now answer my question please!

Wolfe Tone

KeithAFC wrote: »

I think the family of the pregnant woman at Omagh who lost her life and her two twins yet to be born will disagree.

You cannot condense all the actions of the IRA's down into one atrocity.

KeithAFC

Big Mouth wrote: »

That was the RIRA and they are scum I agree there.....now answer my question please!

Answer what question? You love the IRA, i don't.

Wolfe Tone

KeithAFC wrote: »

Answer what question? You love the IRA, i don't.

The one about the BA, friend.

junder

Don't normally watch rte but seen a programme a couple of weeks ago dramatised what would have happened if the RoI had invaded northern ireland. Would have lasted less then a day

Big Mouth

junder wrote: »

Don't normally watch rte but seen a programme a couple of weeks ago dramatised what would have happened if the RoI had invaded northern ireland. Would have lasted less then a day

Yet the Brits couldnt defeat the IRA for forty years!! Back on topic your thoughts on the shooting dead of 3 catholic musicians?

c-note

i'm 27 years old.

i have vague memories of crossing the border with my parents. in the late 80's early 90's.

The border crossing between louth and armagh was manned by soldiers armed with machine guns and there were heavy armoured vehicles.
cars were pulled over and searched. It meant nothing to me as i didnt understand what was going on.

Last weekend i was in Donegal. The only sign i had crossed the border was the change in road signs.

In the past there were many attrocities like the miami show band, perpetuated by dominant minorities on both sides of the divide.

I am optimistic about the future of NI because i believe that today society in the north is dominated by the majority of peaceful people who have humanity and respect for people and thier views.

I believe the scenes of rioting on 12 july last, were fueled mostly by an opportunistic antisocial and disfunctional element. Theese same people live everywhere in the world and will sieze any excuse and opportunity to "rage agains the machine". They are thugs. And the instigators have outdated and obsolete mindsets, they are people with small minds who feel big playing soldier.

Things are better now and will continue to improve but only if the reasonable majority can watch programmes like "bombings" realising that the context is history, and can be strong enough not to foster resentment towards people with different political aspirations.
.02

junder

Big Mouth wrote: »

Yet the Brits couldnt defeat the IRA for forty years!! Back on topic your thoughts on the shooting dead of 3 catholic musicians?

I think the murder of any innocent person is a disgrace regardless of their religion. What are your thoughts on the death of 8 innocent Protestants by the ira?

Wolfe Tone

How would you define innocent?

fontanalis

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

How would you define innocent?

Being catlick and believing in the transubstantiation unlike those prods.

Wolfe Tone

fontanalis wrote: »

Being catlick and believing in the transubstantiation unlike those prods.

What?

fontanalis

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

What?

Wondering how you define the victims guilty?

Einhard

Big Mouth wrote: »

LOL.....you don't get that kind of response when its the IRA inolved..then its all scumbags blah blah blah.

Murdering IRA scumbags/Murdering UDA scumbags. No difference. All scumbags.

Wolfe Tone

Wondering how you define the victims guilty?

Ehhh, I don't the poster said "I condemn the murder of innocents" I asked for his definition of innocent.

fontanalis

Should be obvious.

Einhard

Big Mouth wrote: »

How do you feel about the BA, as I mentioned above?

Anyone who deliberately targets innocent civilians is scum. It's simple really. Do you have evidence that the British Army is, as a matter of policy, deliberatley and purposefully murdering civilians today?

Einhard

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

You cannot condense all the actions of the IRA's down into one atrocity.

That's like saying you can't condense the life of Ted Bundy or Charles Manson into one murder spree. The IRA purposefully targetted innocent men, women, and children. Hence they are vile and scum. How the OP can condemn the RIRA, and not the group from which they borrowed their methods is beyond me.

Wolfe Tone

fontanalis wrote: »

Should be obvious.

Not really. For instance some republicans would not regard the killing of RUC or BA members as killing innocents. I was enquiring after his definition.

Wolfe Tone

Einhard wrote: »

That's like saying you can't condense the life of Ted Bundy or Charles Manson into one murder spree. The IRA purposefully targetted innocent men, women, and children. Hence they are vile and scum. How the OP can condemn the RIRA, and not the group from which they borrowed their methods is beyond me.

That is simply not true. From what you say you make it sound like the IRA went out to deliberately kill women and children-they didn't. In many cases they attacked barracks or things such as warrenpoint, or bishopsgate in England. The IRA were not a bunch of mindless insane serial killers.

Of course they committed many terrible acts.

Einhard

Big Mouth wrote: »

LOL.....you don't get that kind of response when its the IRA inolved..then its all scumbags blah blah blah.

I think the reason the IRA get so much negative attention from posters, is because the likes of the UDA and the British Army don't have their sycophants here defending their actions in the North. Also, neither of them usurped and tainted the terms Nationalist and Republican, and neither claimed to be acting in my name. Also, lest we forget, it was the traitors in the IRA who refused to recognise the legitimacy of the democratically mandated Republic. That's why they get such short shrift on these boards.

TOMASJ

Einhard wrote: »

Anyone who deliberately targets innocent civilians is scum. It's simple really. Do you have evidence that the British Army is, as a matter of policy, deliberatley and purposefully murdering civilians today?

They at it in Afghanistan every day of the week,

Einhard

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

That is simply not true. From what you say you make it sound like the IRA went out to deliberately kill women and children-they didn't. In many cases they attacked barracks or things such as warrenpoint, or bishopsgate in England.

Are you for real? They bombed Manchester city centre. They bombed Canary Wharf. They bombed a Rememberance Service in Enniskillen. They bombed Warrington town centre. They murdered ten Protestant workmen in cold blood at Kingsmill. They murdered Det Gda Gerry McCabe. They bombed pubs full of civilians in Birmingham and Guilford.

These were all actions which deliberately targetted civilians. They were perpetrated by callous, vicious killers with not an ounce of regard for human life. Anyone who argues differently is an apologist for murderers.

Einhard

TOMASJ wrote: »

They at it in Afghanistan every day of the week,

Evidence please. Provide me with some evidence of the British Army as an institution deliberately targetting innocent civilians.

Einhard

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

Not really. For instance some republicans would not regard the killing of RUC or BA members as killing innocents. I was enquiring after his definition.

I can understand that some might be of that opinion, and were the security forces the sole target of IRA attacks, I'd view their campaign in the North and in Britain with more nuance. But let's not delude ourselves that RA only killed soldiers.

CrackisWhack

I wouldnt consider myself an IRA sympathiser by any means, I like to think I have a balanced view of things, but the war they fought was for a reason, civil rights for catholics in Northen Ireland, not a bad cause?


If you want real atrocities in the last two or three years look no further than the British or U.S. governments, killing tens of thousands of civilians in a resource driven war.

CrackisWhack

Einhard wrote: »

Evidence please. Provide me with some evidence of the British Army as an institution deliberately targetting innocent civilians.

Do you honestly think they have an unbiased inquiry into casulaties from bombs being dropped on Iraqi targets?

Wolfe Tone

They have done terrible things alright, as you know the troubles fell into a series of tit for tat killings.
Personally I don't think that targeting pubs etc was a tactic that would ever work, or should have been tried.
I can see the logic however in targeting infrastructure and the BA and the RUC.


It is really terrible that the armed campaign was necessary at all. Thankfully that for the most part seems to be behind us.

BlaasForRafa

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

Not really. For instance some republicans would not regard the killing of RUC or BA members as killing innocents.

And that would show the sick and twisted nature of those "republicans"

Wolfe Tone

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

And that would show the sick and twisted nature of those "republicans"

How is that sick or twisted? Take the BA for instance, they are sodiers.

Anyway lets not descend into a IRA discussion thread, there are enough of them already.

BlaasForRafa

CrackisWhack wrote: »

the war they fought was for a reason, civil rights for catholics in Northen Ireland, not a bad cause?

Rubbish, they fought because they were thugs and scum. The real heroes were people like Gerry Fitt, John Hume and Seamus Mallon who pursued a peaceful path unlike Sinn Fein/Ira.

BlaasForRafa

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

How is that sick or twisted?

If you really have to ask how is that sick or twisted then theres no point in talking to you.

Wolfe Tone

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

If you really have to ask how is that sick or twisted then theres no point in talking to you.

It was a war.

Einhard

CrackisWhack wrote: »

Do you honestly think they have an unbiased inquiry into casulaties from bombs being dropped on Iraqi targets?

No, but Amnesty would. Human Rights Watch would. Or do you expect people to take your word for massive, intentional civilian murders on the part of the British Army, and expect no evidence?

Einhard

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

They have done terrible things alright, as you know the troubles fell into a series of tit for tat killings.
Personally I don't think that targeting pubs etc was a tactic that would ever work, or should have been tried.

So you agree that blowing apart civilians in town centres and pubs is murder then? And that the orchestrators of such attacks are murderers? Glad we could clear that up then...

Einhard

CrackisWhack wrote: »

I wouldnt consider myself an IRA sympathiser by any means, I like to think I have a balanced view of things, but the war they fought was for a reason, civil rights for catholics in Northen Ireland, not a bad cause?

I'd agree with you to a point there. Many who joined the IRA did so out of genuine anger and grievances over the lack of political rights, and outrage over massacres such as Bloody Sunday. But nobody has the right to murder civilians going about their daily routine. That's a concept which some "Republicans" have a problem hetting their heads around unfortunarely.

Incidentally, no one here is defending the actions of the British Army during the Troubles, so the ins and outs of their actions in Iraq or Afghanistan have nothing to do with IRA atrocities.

Wolfe Tone

o you agree that blowing apart civilians in town centres and pubs is murder then? And that the orchestrators of such attacks are murderers? Glad we could clear that up then...

Not necessarily. If the bomb in town centers for instance was to damage infrastructure then no, but early comprehensive warnings should have been given, like at Bishopsgate, so everyone could be evacuated. However if the intent was simply to kill innocent people, then yeah.

Don't forget there were two sides to this. Very easy to focus just on what the IRA did.


Anyway, back to the showband...

CrackisWhack

Einhard wrote: »

No, but Amnesty would. Human Rights Watch would. Or do you expect people to take your word for massive, intentional civilian murders on the part of the British Army, and expect no evidence?

I think you're giving these organisations too much credit! I didn't say they we're intentional civilian murders either, so you think the war in Iraq is just and fair??

I suppose they did find all those WMD's? and a little bit of oil for good measure, but who is going Tony blair and George W to a war crimes court?

Anyway it wouldn't be the first time either country has committed an atrocity in this region.

FlutterinBantam

Now I didn't see the prog, but I understand the that Wes and Harris were blown apart when the bomb exploded prematurely.

Would have to question the Op's attitude, why bring all this up now.?

Of course it was wrong, just like the IRA murders of the era were wrong.

Seems to me like a propaganda exercise,on who's behalf I don't know, but the usual suspects are staying well away I note:cool:

And why wouldn't they, not a leg to stand on.

Who is the OP trying to stoke up??

Wolfe Tone

You will be able to see it on the RTE player early tomorrow I would say.

CrackisWhack

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

Not necessarily. If the bomb in town centers for instance was to damage infrastructure then no, but early comprehensive warnings should have been given, like at Bishopsgate, so everyone could be evacuated. However if the intent was simply to kill innocent people, then yeah.

Don't forget there were two sides to this. Very easy to focus just on what the IRA did.


Anyway, back to the showband...

Also there has been elemnts of collusion been spoke about in recent times which I could well believe, truth of the matter is we'll probably never find out, but as you say theres two sides to every story.

Wolfe Tone

CrackisWhack wrote: »

Also there has been elemnts of collusion been spoke about in recent times which I could well believe, truth of the matter is we'll probably never find out, but as you say theres two sides to every story.

Such as with Monaghan etc... There is always more to every story than meets the eye, even Omagh too I would say.