European Club

WHIP IT!

Playing the European Club for first time on Monday... I take it I'm in for a treat??

Will be playing off Society tees unfortunately (or maybe, just as well??) so anybody got any advice on course management or particular holes to wwatch out for?? I find myself getting in trouble off the tee from Society pegs alot more often than I do from the middle pegs...

Dr.Silly

Man you're in for a treat, beautiful course, can't remember specific holes,
avoid the bunkers cause you're not going to make par if you get in one of the fairway bunkers....you need a ladder to physically get out of some of them, let alone the ball...
Greens wicked fast, like Baltray greens..
Enjoy, let us know how you get on.

WHIP IT!

Dr.Silly wrote: »

avoid the bunkers cause you're not going to make par if you get in one of the fairway bunkers....you need a ladder to physically get out of some of them, let alone the ball...
Greens wicked fast, like Baltray greens..

Oh b*ll*x

Dr.Silly

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3xUjnSdMRU
http://www.irelandgolf.com/images/Ed_IrelandGolf_IMG_0736.jpg

that's you in that second link that is :-)

kenco

Enjoy it WhipIT!

Played a couple of years back and while my golf was very bad on the day its a great course and is beautifully laid out. If you are on a good day it will test and reward. If the wind is blowing and you are not on your day, then just enjoy it and understand why Tiger played it a few years back and also Harrington insisted on the Irish PGA being played there a week or two before the British Open!!

Renno

Great course, although pretty intimidating for a hacker like myself. Played once a few years ago just after Tiger and O'Meara had played one of their pre British Open rounds. Tiger had set the record (not sure if it was official), and we were made quite welcome to play off the back tees if we wished to see how he did it.

The view from the 1st tee (namely no fairway to be seen and miles of long grass between us and a very distant flag) prompted a long walk to the front tee.

As long as you hit it long and straight you should be fine.

Kace

Bring plenty of eggs and tell Ruddy that you don't want the 3 cans of Ass Whoop included in your green fee ;-)

mike12

Hi,
Have played it 5 times now but never in summer so i imagine the rough is very hard this time of year so stay out of it, the course is set up that you can only drive the ball 280 on a lot of holes before u run into trouble so get a stroke saver and look out for that think the 3rd 4th 8th are like that, the impression from the tees is that its very tight small fairways but they is plenty of room when u get out there the 7th looks like there is no where to drive the ball but there is plenly of room. Great course one of the best in the country enjoy.
Mike

Dr.Silly

mike12 wrote: »

Hi,
Have played it 5 times now but never in summer so i imagine the rough is very hard this time of year so stay out of it, the course is set up that you can only drive the ball 280 on a lot of holes before u run into trouble so get a stroke saver and look out for that think the 3rd 4th 8th are like that, the impression from the tees is that its very tight small fairways but they is plenty of room when u get out there the 7th looks like there is no where to drive the ball but there is plenly of room. Great course one of the best in the country enjoy.
Mike

Isn't it the 7th hole actually that was voted in the top 50 holes in the world ?

conno16

when are they building the clubhouse and health spa?

PhilipMarlowe

There's a lovely "spa" just a few yards east of the 15th green...

conno16

realistically the lack of facilities at the euro club is costing the owners dearly
they just dont have a golf "experience" to offer

when i'm golfing out foreign i'm not gonna take a risk heading off to some place that operates out of a portacabin
days are precious when ur on holidays, agreeing your golf itinerary etc
i believe they have significantly failed to tap into the US and japanese golf markets in particular
thats suicidal in this economic environment
hopefully the course will survive
i could see a US company coming in and turning the place round with something like a 25-35m investment

Obni

Fantastic course. The approach shot to the 10th green is one of the most difficult shots in the country.

The_Architect

conno16 wrote: »

realistically the lack of facilities at the euro club is costing the owners dearly
they just dont have a golf "experience" to offer

when i'm golfing out foreign i'm not gonna take a risk heading off to some place that operates out of a portacabin
days are precious when ur on holidays, agreeing your golf itinerary etc
i believe they have significantly failed to tap into the US and japanese golf markets in particular
thats suicidal in this economic environment
hopefully the course will survive
i could see a US company coming in and turning the place round with something like a 25-35m investment

Conno,

I would have to take the polar opposite view.

The course closures you are going to see will be those that were developed through the Celtic Tiger years with high maintenance models and hotels that suck in any money the golf course needs - The "Luxury" resort model.

Pat Ruddy is the one developer in Ireland who saw past that and put the golf first. The European will continue where many more won't.

conno16

cant agree with that at all
totally flawed concept to design a course and then not finish it off properly
its the same as building a top notch hotel and not putting any beds in the rooms
ruddy will regret not investing properly
wait til its taken over and transformed into the jewel of the east

Unglika Norse

didn't see a porta cabin when I was last in it, nice tidy clubhouse with good food and a beer, a shop more than adequate locker rooms, and as he turned down 55 million for it cant see him selling it at all. You have to understand the mans passion about the place.

Anyways as the architect says it's not the likes of the European that will go, far from it, it's on a very sound footing

heavyballs

conno16 wrote: »

cant agree with that at all
totally flawed concept to design a course and then not finish it off properly
its the same as building a top notch hotel and not putting any beds in the rooms
ruddy will regret not investing properly
wait til its taken over and transformed into the jewel of the east

your right Conno,that's why there's a big waiting list for membership,(btw they have a strict limit on membership),no sign of a receiver is there?you talk some sheite
was there a few weeks ago,after great golf we came in and got a grand bit of grub,shower and a pint,that'll do me

karlyk1

WHIP IT! wrote: »

Playing the European Club for first time on Monday... I take it I'm in for a treat??

Will be playing off Society tees unfortunately (or maybe, just as well??) so anybody got any advice on course management or particular holes to wwatch out for?? I find myself getting in trouble off the tee from Society pegs alot more often than I do from the middle pegs...

Oh boy, you're in for a real treat! Have played it many times with my own society and it's stunning. The 17th is a fantastic hole, but then again they nearly all are. Buy a strokesaver off Mr Ruddy. Just forget about your score as soon as you step on the 1st tee and try to enjoy it... if you try to take it on and beat the brute it will kill ya!

heavyballs

don't be frightened of it,that's my advice,i play off 5 and tbh i wouldn't do the hcp justice too often,i started off really tight and made a balls of the first few holes,then on the back nine i shot 2 over,it's wider than people say,pick a line and stick with it,

The_Architect

karlyk1 wrote: »

Just forget about your score as soon as you step on the 1st tee and try to enjoy it...

Good advice this.

acejeff

The_Architect wrote: »

Conno,

I would have to take the polar opposite view.

The course closures you are going to see will be those that were developed through the Celtic Tiger years with high maintenance models and hotels that suck in any money the golf course needs - The "Luxury" resort model.

Pat Ruddy is the one developer in Ireland who saw past that and put the golf first. The European will continue where many more won't.

I have to agree with the architect here and also add that for the designer/owner Pat Ruddy this course is like his baby! In my opinion his
masterpiece. The reason he hasn’t marketed the hell out of it and milked for everything it’s worth is because he is not consumed by greed like the developers of the Celtic Tiger era and instead sees this as a purely “golfing” experience. That is the experience on offer here. The course speaks for itself and people who are interested in golf for golf’s sake, rather than having to be pampered and have a Michelin star meal at the end of the round, will travel far and wide to play this golf course. For a golfer this is a pure and heavenly experience.

conno16

thanks for that input Pat

would be great if we could set up a live Q&A segment with you on boards at some point? you know, deal with a range of golf discussion items etc

acejeff

conno16 wrote: »

thanks for that input Pat

would be great if we could set up a live Q&A segment with you on boards at some point? you know, deal with a range of golf discussion items etc

Am I not allowed to express an opinion on this board without being presented with a cynical response such as the above?

I'm from the Wicklow area and have had the great pleasure of playing this on many occasions. For one I am glad that he hasn't exploited it's marketability. As I said above it's a pure golfing experience, one that I, as a golfer, thoroughly enjoy and indeed prefer Celtic Tiger pampered nonsense (some fool taking your bag out of the car for you, tv and leather sofas in the changing room, and the golf course was only okay!)

conno16

fair enough, i retract the above

the ideal scenario for me would be if someone like donald trump came in, purchased the club and brought it onto a new platform
every club / resort needs to start with the basics - get the golf course fit for purpose
Ruddy has done this
however he clearly lacks the know-how, ambition and vision here to develop the course further
this is a golden opportunity for ireland
we dont have the luxury of promoting our links golf every 2 years on an international stage (like the scots with the Open) so we need to define and differentiate ourselves in other ways
hence maximising available resources like the Euro Club
its on the right side of the country to cash in
people like ruddy have a responsibility to promote ireland as a top golfing destination
we're not optimising this here at the Euro Club, a club that has serious potential
in fact, if this venture is not attractive to someone like Trump (which i'm sure it is, but am just making a point here) well then the govt should come in with a compulsory purchase order
tourism is hanging its hat on the golf industry as far as i can see
lets kick this on and develop the jewel of the east

newport2

acejeff wrote: »

Am I not allowed to express an opinion on this board without being presented with a cynical response such as the above?

I'm from the Wicklow area and have had the great pleasure of playing this on many occasions. For one I am glad that he hasn't exploited it's marketability. As I said above it's a pure golfing experience, one that I, as a golfer, thoroughly enjoy and indeed prefer Celtic Tiger pampered nonsense (some fool taking your bag out of the car for you, tv and leather sofas in the changing room, and the golf course was only okay!)

Agreed.

It's a great course, probably the most difficult I've ever played. I wouldn't change anything about it - apart from the wind!

acejeff

conno that is some of the most ridiculous nonsense I have ever heard/read. "WE" are not optimising the European (are you a member / have an ownership stake!?) "compulsory purchase order". Let me remind you that this is a privately owned and built golf course and thankfully our government can't take it over with a view to exploitng the hell out of it (Am i really having to type a response to such an utterly stupid comment!!??)

And Donald Trump- come on! Someone like him would ruin this place, turning it into a gimmicky, (3 leprachauns, a harp, some tartan, a pint of guinness and a wild links, oh yeah how "Irish" the americans will love that), "fake" authenticity pile of tosh.

Conno- some things don't have to be about making money. The European Club is one of them, a great golf course, a pure golfing experience.

newport2

conno16 wrote: »

fair enough, i retract the above

the ideal scenario for me would be if someone like donald trump came in, purchased the club and brought it onto a new platform
every club / resort needs to start with the basics - get the golf course fit for purpose
Ruddy has done this
however he clearly lacks the know-how, ambition and vision here to develop the course further
this is a golden opportunity for ireland
we dont have the luxury of promoting our links golf every 2 years on an international stage (like the scots with the Open) so we need to define and differentiate ourselves in other ways
hence maximising available resources like the Euro Club
its on the right side of the country to cash in
people like ruddy have a responsibility to promote ireland as a top golfing destination
we're not optimising this here at the Euro Club, a club that has serious potential
in fact, if this venture is not attractive to someone like Trump (which i'm sure it is, but am just making a point here) well then the govt should come in with a compulsory purchase order
tourism is hanging its hat on the golf industry as far as i can see
lets kick this on and develop the jewel of the east

Most courses that followed that route are now owned by NAMA

conno16

grand so
it'll be leprechauns that'll be running around those barren dunes in a few yrs time when the country is effectively abandoned
sure pat can have the course all to himself at that point and enjoy his "pure and heavenly experience"

conno16

newport2 wrote: »

Most courses that followed that route are now owned by NAMA

most courses? would love to know what ur referring to here
how many courses does Trump have going through a nama process btw?

FixdePitchmark

I'm just looking at the comments and nobody mentioning the 100 or 180 euro to play.

Perhaps I'm not in the right circles but are people paying that or getting reduced rates.

I played it about ten years ago , but was too young to appreciate it, will go back with wisdom and enjoy.

But agian , how do I get in not paying the big money.

Even if life is not about money , 180 euro makes me think about my life.

Dr_Colossus

acejeff wrote: »

The reason he hasn’t marketed the hell out of it and milked for everything it’s worth is because he is not consumed by greed like the developers of the Celtic Tiger era and instead sees this as a purely “golfing” experience. That is the experience on offer here.

acejeff wrote: »

I'm from the Wicklow area and have had the great pleasure of playing this on many occasions. For one I am glad that he hasn't exploited it's marketability. As I said above it's a pure golfing experience, one that I, as a golfer, thoroughly enjoy and indeed prefer Celtic Tiger pampered nonsense

acejeff wrote: »

Conno- some things don't have to be about making money. The European Club is one of them, a great golf course, a pure golfing experience.

Haven't played the European Club yet so can't vouch for the experience but a few contradictions above. If the club isn't all about making money and offering a true golfing experience for all why then are green fees still at €180? That must be near one of the most expensive green fees in the country at present so rules it out for the majority of the golfing public. Granted there are open days over the winter but they're still €60 so a hefty enough wedge to pay out for a day's golf.

newport2

conno16 wrote: »

most courses? would love to know what ur referring to here

how many courses does Trump have going through a nama process btw?

I'm referring to clubs who overinvested through "someone like Donald Trump".

conno16

at least Trump would be up front in terms of his objectives / motivation

conno16

newport2 wrote: »

I'm referring to clubs who overinvested through "someone like Donald Trump".

ur trying to crawl backwards there newport
thats ok though

newport2

conno16 wrote: »

ur trying to crawl backwards there newport
thats ok though

I made the point that most clubs who overinvested are now owned by NAMA, not really sure where you're getting confused with that conno

FixdePitchmark

I'd love to give Trump a good Thump.

The most vile capitalist is not welcome in an already destroyed country, him and his ilk have done enough damage.

Perhaps we could put a Mcdonalds on the 9th tee.

This is gone a bit strange.

conno16

newport2 wrote: »

I made the point that most clubs who overinvested are now owned by NAMA, not really sure where you're getting confused with that conno

overinvestment
i love that

newport2

conno16 wrote: »

overinvestment
i love that

Great, I hope you're happy together.

conno16

newport - not to labour the point or indeed get stuck into a junior cert economics / accountancy discussion, but ur "overinvestment" point is completely irrelevant to my earlier thread
i understand what ur trying to articulate though
and i agree with you
as i said, its not relevant to this discussion though in my opinion
all the best

k.p.h

Dr_Colossus wrote: »

Haven't played the European Club yet so can't vouch for the experience but a few contradictions above. If the club isn't all about making money and offering a true golfing experience for all why then are green fees still at €180? That must be near one of the most expensive green fees in the country at present so rules it out for the majority of the golfing public. Granted there are open days over the winter but they're still €60 so a hefty enough wedge to pay out for a day's golf.

The European Club is something different to be fair, Pat Ruddy is one of Ireland's great course designers. The European Club was not conceived as an investment but rather a designer's desire to build a world class links course. That's is reflected in the fact that Ruddy and his family run the facility.

In turn think this reflects the reason the fee's a relatively expensive, The European Club is Ruddys baby, his master piece so to speak. He wrote a book about the place and everything.

I think the expensive fee's can be forgiven considering what it is, a great designers magnum opus and one of the best links courses in the world.

acejeff

k.p.h wrote: »

The European Club is something different to be fair, Pat Ruddy is one of Ireland's great course designers. The European Club was not conceived as an investment but rather a designer's desire to build a world class links course. That's is reflected in the fact that Ruddy and his family run the facility.

In turn think this reflects the reason the fee's a relatively expensive, The European Club is Ruddys baby, his master piece so to speak. He wrote a book about the place and everything.

I think the expensive fee's can be forgiven considering what it is, a great designers magnum opus and one of the best links courses in the world.

I second that. Only allows a limited membership also. It is seen, as it should be, as a privelege, to play it.

Deco1983

If Trump should invest anywhere it should be Elmgreen - The jewel of the M50 .An amazing piece of land with amazing potential right in the heart of the city..and charging 180 a round would certainly cause the right kind of attrition at the club

conno16

missing the point deco

remember rule 1 - get the course fit for purpose
thanks mr ruddy, now enjoy ur retirement in barbados or whereever takes ur fancy

Kevinmarkham

k.p.h wrote: »

In turn think this reflects the reason the fee's a relatively expensive, The European Club is Ruddys baby, his master piece so to speak. He wrote a book about the place and everything.

I think the expensive fee's can be forgiven considering what it is, a great designers magnum opus and one of the best links courses in the world.

One of the reasons for the high green fee is so that the club is taken seriously by Americans, and to keep it on a par with other courses.

You can take that with a pinch of salt, because green fees could drop substantially if Pat wanted to do so in the off-peak months, but as has been pointed out, it's his baby and he can do what he likes with it. And that's just one of the reasons it's among the best courses on the island.

I played there on New Year's Day a few years back (before Hooked, so he had no idea who I was), and the fourball I was in got blown off the course, utterly soaked. We stumbled in after 9 and there was Pat, handing out free green fees because of the conditions. Name me another worldclass course where that would happen!

acejeff

conno16 wrote: »

missing the point deco

remember rule 1 - get the course fit for purpose
thanks mr ruddy, now enjoy ur retirement in barbados or whereever takes ur fancy

I've actually had the pleasure of speaking with Mr. Ruddy on a number of occasions and I believe he will happily enjoy his retirement at the European Club.

Whyner

I've played it a few times and never paid more than 60

I brought a group there and he provided more prizes than needed and all were very decent

I also rang them up when I was organising a charity gig and asked for a free 4-ball. Got it in the post the next day

I love everything about the place, the lack of distance markers, the scorecard, playing shots from the beach spa...

What are we discussing here anyway?

ThunderCat

Kevinmarkham wrote: »

One of the reasons for the high green fee is so that the club is taken seriously by Americans, and to keep it on a par with other courses.

You can take that with a pinch of salt, because green fees could drop substantially if Pat wanted to do so in the off-peak months, but as has been pointed out, it's his baby and he can do what he likes with it. And that's just one of the reasons it's among the best courses on the island.

I played there on New Year's Day a few years back (before Hooked, so he had no idea who I was), and the fourball I was in got blown off the course, utterly soaked. We stumbled in after 9 and there was Pat, handing out free green fees because of the conditions. Name me another worldclass course where that would happen!

Great touch there by Pat and as well as being a nice gesture to your immediate group it serves as positive publicity for the place through word of mouth such as what you have just posted.
With regards the green fee's it would be good if some of the heavyweight Irish courses operated a similar pricing system as certain other big clubs in the United States. Bethpage Black and the Bandon Dunes Resort for example offer discounted fee's for New York State residents and Oregon state residents respectively which gives the locals the chance to sample wonderfull courses at reduced rates while still getting plenty of revenue from visiting golf tourists being charged full whack. So maybe in terms of the European Club, you could have the lowest rate for Wicklow residents, second lowest rate for Leinster residents (non Wicklow), third lowest rate for Irish residents (non Leinster) and full whack for everyone else. Of course I think this is a wonderful idea seeing as im a Leinster resident that would benefit from reduced fees but I suppose in reality it would have to be only a certain amount of reduced fees available each day to avoid excess traffic and damage to the course and these would be off-peak aswell no doubt. Good idea from an Irish golfers point of view, but I doubt the top courses would be keen to implement such a system if they continue to rake it in under their current system of charging everyone full price.

k.p.h

Old article here worth a read.

Whyner

k.p.h wrote: »

Old article here worth a read.

What is the course in Sligo he refers to?

acejeff

Whyner wrote: »

What is the course in Sligo he refers to?

Ballyliffen Golf Club- described as "the Ballybunion of the North". By all accounts a well hidden secret that is worth a visit. High praise indeed in a part of the country which boasts some top courses namely Rosses Point and Enniscrone. Hoping to take a vistit up that way in March and get this course in.

stringy

Kevinmarkham wrote: »

. Name me another worldclass course where that would happen!

without taking away from the great gesture, that happened to me in Victoria in Vilamoura!