HDip in education

Denerick

I'm evaluating my options after finishing my degree. I don't really want to go into teaching, but after sending something like 200 CVs in Britain and Ireland and getting only 2 interviews, I think it may be time to consider it. The obvious drawback is whether I will get a job at the end of it.

I'm considering secondary level teaching by the way.

Is it worth it for the likes of me? I recently completed my degree in TCD and throughout I was hoping to avoid teaching as a profession (Not that I consider it a dodgy job by any means, but personally I don't think I'd be a great teacher)

peanuthead

Denerick wrote: »

I don't really want to go into teaching

Denerick wrote: »

I was hoping to avoid teaching as a profession

Denerick wrote: »

personally I don't think I'd be a great teacher)

Denerick wrote: »

Is it worth it for the likes of me?

No

gagiteebo

Teaching isn't something you enter into lightly. It's not a profession that you can just 'have a go at' until the economy picks up or something better comes along.

It's challenging, frustrating, incredibly demanding - mentally, emotionally and physically and damn difficult at times. It's very hard to secure a job at the minute no matter what your subjects are and it can get very disheartening at times.....but you know what...I wouldn't do anything else. I love my job, I love going to work everyday, I love seeing those kids everyday (even though there are days I want to kill them). I can't imagine myself doing anything else. I am a teacher, it's part of who I am. To be honest I think teaching is a vocation.

You don't seem at all interested in it or passionate about it. IMHO you won't get anything from it and more importantly neither will the kids.

Denerick

You misunderstand me. (And I also think you're the exception rather than the rule when it comes to the 'vocation' business) I know plenty of teachers and the majority of them didn't feel passionate about it before they joined. (and many still don't :P) You are being unduly harsh here. The fact is you don't know what you'll make of a profession until you actually do it. My over-arching concern is that I would be no good. Who knows, perhaps I would be a good teacher.

Though judging by my first post, I suppose I deserved the reaction I got.

peanuthead

Denerick wrote: »

You misunderstand me. (And I also think you're the exception rather than the rule when it comes to the 'vocation' business) I know plenty of teachers and the majority of them didn't feel passionate about it before they joined. (and many still don't :P) You are being unduly harsh here. The fact is you don't know what you'll make of a profession until you actually do it. My over-arching concern is that I would be no good. Who knows, perhaps I would be a good teacher.

Though judging by my first post, I suppose I deserved the reaction I got.

Yeah but if you thought you would be no good but WANTED to do it, that would be okay. Thats how I was.

But you don't think you will be any good, nor do you want to do it by your own admission. By saying that many of the teachers you know were not and are still not passionate about the job suggests that you may not have any intention of even trying to like it.

I don't think we are being unduly harsh at all. To be honest its people like your friends that give us the bad reputation that we have as teachers.

peanuthead

Denerick wrote: »

P.S- There is a reason why the phrase 'If you can't do, teach' came about by the way! Methinks you have a rosy view of your profession...

P.P.S - Please don't take offence to that.

Well I do take offence to that. What exactly do you mean by that statement? Can you tell me exactly what the reason is for the coming about of that phrase?

Denerick

peanuthead wrote: »

Yeah but if you thought you would be no good but WANTED to do it, that would be okay. Thats how I was.

But you don't think you will be any good, nor do you want to do it by your own admission. By saying that many of the teachers you know were not and are still not passionate about the job suggests that you may not have any intention of even trying to like it.

I don't think we are being unduly harsh at all. To be honest its people like your friends that give us the bad reputation that we have as teachers.

Wow... Wasn't expecting there to be such a touchy feely reaction.

My friends are honest. An insurance manager has absolutely no idea as to whether they will 'love' the profession when they are in their early 20s. How could you possibly know? How could you even be passionate about it? The same goes with any other profession. You simply don't know what you'll make of it until you actually do. Judging otherwise is just that - a judgement.

Denerick

peanuthead wrote: »

Well I do take offence to that. What exactly do you mean by that statement? Can you tell me exactly what the reason is for the coming about of that phrase?

OK...

Have you never heard the statement before? Please lighten up, I only came here to ask a few questions, not be grilled in this fashion. I'll edit the post if it offends you.

Awesome-O

OP you obviously don't want to go into teaching, teaching is a job you need to feel passionate about, it's a job where you have to be in top form every day if you want to do right by your pupils. As a teacher myself the thing that stands out in my mind from my time in college was this "the day you stop loving your job is the day you quit teaching".
I wanted to be a teacher for as long as I can remember, in TY I did a weeks work experience and this confirmed it for me, I agree with the last poster, it is a voccation and if you are having doubts about your ability to be a good teacher your students (especially as you mention having an interest in second level) will pick up on this within your first 30 seconds in the classroom.
A good idea would be to as a local school can you sit in on a few classes to get a feel for it rather than going into something half-heartedly and then in a few years time changing your mind.

gagiteebo

No offence taken at all, that phrase is BS! I'm good at my job and I work damn hard at it!

I'm not saying there aren't people in the profession who don't feel passionate about it sure I knowplenty of them and they're the ones who come in every day complaining about the kids, the school, the education system in this country etc etc

I apologise if you feel I am being unduly harsh but I say it like it is, not everyone's cup of tea but that's cool. I'm so sick of hearing people who know nothing about teaching go on about the great holidays and what a handy number we have, sure the Dip is only a year so, do it and you too can live a life of luxury and get paid for it!

No we don't know how well we will do at something until we give it a go but you have to have the desire for it to begin with. I know I'd be crap at a lot of jobs because I have absolutely no interest in that field

When I think back to my school days I can easily remember which teachers were only there for the sake of it and which teachers actually loved or at least liked what they were doing. Whose class would you rather be in?

I don't know you at all sir but maybe try and get a little bit of subbing and test the waters. (Do you know anyone in local schools, a lot of it is about pull!)

Anyway I wish you the best of luck with whatever you decide to do! Hope you make the right choice

rainbowtrout

Denerick wrote: »

OK...

Have you never heard the statement before? Please lighten up, I only came here to ask a few questions, not be grilled in this fashion. I'll edit the post if it offends you.

But you've come onto the Teaching forum, you say you have no great interest in teaching, you reckon that the posters here are the exception to the rule, and have a slightly distorted view of our profession. What do you expect? Of course people are going to be offended.

I like my jobs, there are days where I am fit to kill the kids but overall I like what i do and I work hard at it and know many teachers who feel the same. Really if that's your view of teaching, you'd probably be doing the profession a favour by finding another career

gagiteebo

P.s if you think we're harsh, wait until you stand in front of 30 teenagers every day

Denerick

rainbowtrout wrote: »

But you've come onto the Teaching forum, you say you have no great interest in teaching, you reckon that the posters here are the exception to the rule, and have a slightly distorted view of our profession. What do you expect? Of course people are going to be offended.

Anything I know about the teaching profession I know from my experience as a student and from friends who went on to become teachers. What I've garnered from both is that:

A) There are good and bad teachers, enthusiastic and unenthusiastic. I know this from my time in school.

From my friends I know that many didn't feel passionate about becoming teachers when they did their HDip. I know four people who went to become teachers and all but one were in the same boat as me. I know one of them is extremely unhappy now and the other three are content enough in their profession.

So basically what I'm saying is that I COULD turn around in 5 years and find myself the most enthusiastic teacher or the planet or I COULD turnaround and resign. I know that from my personal experience from friends that clearly not everybody was passionate about teaching and certainly none considered it a lifelong dream - hence I don't think what I said was unreasonable and thus don't deserve the strong reactions I have gotten for simply stating my case in an honest fashion (IE, I'm not sure I want to be a teacher, I'm not sure I'd make a great teacher... Just being honest here) That doesn't mean I won't become a good teacher or that at some stage in the future I won't be glad I became a teacher.

That is clearly what I meant by saying that I considered her view to be the exception to the rule as opposed to the norm.

Thanks for the other responses by the way.

rainbowtrout

Denerick wrote: »

I know that from my personal experience from friends that clearly not everybody was passionate about teaching and certainly none considered it a lifelong dream

A lot of your 'personal experience of teaching' seems to be based on what your friends say. Why don't you go and find out for yourself? If I based my decisions on what my friends say I probably wouldn't have done half the things I've done in my life because their opinions would have put me off.

Denerick

rainbowtrout wrote: »

A lot of your 'personal experience of teaching' seems to be based on what your friends say. Why don't you go and find out for yourself? If I based my decisions on what my friends say I probably wouldn't have done half the things I've done in my life because their opinions would have put me off.

How exactly? How does one 'go find out for yourself'? I'm not basing my opinion entirely on my friends, but it is about all I have to go on right now. They took a lunge, and some of them are glad they did so. All I'm saying is that its unfair to expect everyone to approach teaching as if its their lifelong dream - clearly this is not the case, and I shouldn't be expected to conform appropriately to what I consider a minority case. Most people stumble into their career, they don't dive into it enthusiastically.

Miss Lockhart

What exactly do you want people here to tell you?

You ask "is it worth it for the likes of me?"

People have given you their opinions. You disagree.

What more can be said?

Denerick

Fair enough. I'll call it a day so.

rainbowtrout

Denerick wrote: »

How exactly? How does one 'go find out for yourself'? I'm not basing my opinion entirely on my friends, but it is about all I have to go on right now. They took a lunge, and some of them are glad they did so. All I'm saying is that its unfair to expect everyone to approach teaching as if its their lifelong dream - clearly this is not the case, and I shouldn't be expected to conform appropriately to what I consider a minority case. Most people stumble into their career, they don't dive into it enthusiastically.

errrmmmmm.... I might be stating the obvious here, but go into a school and ask if you can observe in classes for a few days, ask if they would let you teach one or two classes to see what it is like, try and get a bit of subbing work - although there's not much of that out there at the moment.


You've said a couple of times that people who want to teach are in a minority. I don't see how this can be so when there are many long established teacher training degrees both at primary and second level. The majority of students enter those courses straight after the Leaving Cert. I was one myself. So there are plenty of people out there who made the decision to teach at the age of 17/18 and possibly younger. I had looked into the course I did when I was at the end of third year - 15 years old. Not everyone just stumbles into the HDip and goes 'this will be grand for a job for a few years'. Just like you have friends who did the Dip without any great enthusiasm for teaching, I know plenty of people who did Arts/Science/Business degrees with a plan to teach afterwards only that the HDip was the only way forward for them. Some people do actually want to teach.

Awesome-O

Denerick wrote: »

How exactly? How does one 'go find out for yourself'?

As I and other posters have said, go into a school and ask the pricipal can you sit in on and possibly teach a few classes. Very few principals will have a problem with this, happens in my school regularly.

Denerick wrote: »

Fair enough. I'll call it a day so.

good!!!

Rosita

Denerick,

Just a few observations:

There is probably merit in much of your cynicism. True - not every teacher approaches it like it's their long-life dream - the reality is that the profession is over-subscribed and as my understanding of human nature goes there tends to be far more pragmatic people than dreamers. I actually think you are right in saying that that is a "minority" case. People pointing to the sheer volume of numbers training to be teachers does not enlighten us in any way regarding their motivations/thoughts. Of course this observation does not exactly move the discussion along, but I think it is indeed misleading for people to imply that if you haven't an overwhelming 'vocation' you're at nothing.

That said, if you have severe doubts about your ability to teach you would need to deal with that. Confidence is important in the classroom, but nothing breeds confidence quite like ability/preparation, so if you think you might not be good at it you might be onto something. Not saying it's irreversible, but this could be a difficult thing to get around.

But there can be a lot of nonsense talked about teaching where people extrapolate the general experience from their particular set of circumstances. For example I saw someone write on another thread "there's no such thing as a typical day" (in teaching). I don't understand this as I generally can predict quite well what I will be doing in school, and the nature of classes and students does not vary wildly from day to day - notwithstanding the fact that you are dealing with maybe 30 different personalities in the same room. And I don't see this 'routine' as some weakness of the job. Most jobs have 'typical days' most of the time I would say.

But - and I have far more work experience outside of teaching than in teaching so I can compare I think - the classroom is perhaps the most difficult place to be if you are not into it to quite an extent as there is such focus on you personally most of the time and you cannot work alone or go to ground by just getting your head down as you can do in other jobs.

I think teaching ability/ability to survive is very strongly influenced by personality. I would say if you find it enjoyable there probably isn't a job to match it, but the same applies in reverse unfortunately and that's where I would suggest many unhappy teachers come from.

But if you cannot decide whether you want to teach or not then get off the pot and look to observe classes as someone suggested, and be less concerned about what other people tell you. This is hardly rocket-science. There are too many variables in the opinions of others - different schools, different personalities, different attitudes, different choice of vocabulary when talking about it (for example 'passionate' is a qualitative word that can mean different things to different people), which can give unhelpful (for you personally) impressions.

Finally, the reason "those who can do, those who can't teach" came about is because a playwright decided to write the words down. Don't take it to heart in any sense or assume the 'reason' for the remark is any more complicated than the emissions of a remarkably fertile imagination. It's just a formula of words - nothing to live your life by or allow to influence decisions. You'll find similar stuff about every profession if you look for it. At the end of the day it's just BS. Books of quotations have a lot to answer for in giving these things such an afterlife outside of their original context.

pathway33

Denerick wrote: »

I don't really want to go into teaching ..... I was hoping to avoid teaching as a profession ..... personally I don't think I'd be a great teacher

I would say this is the best state of mind to go into teaching. You cannot then be disappointed. I can't speak for the teachers on this forum as I do not know any of them but you will find a lot of teachers will ramble on about it being a vocation and how such and such would make a terrible teacher while being unable to see their own weaknesses. I see teachers who think they are the bees knees and yet their disgraceful attitude to the task of correcting leaving cert exams is despicable given the fact that young people's careers are depending on their exam being corrected by people who are not agitated by the task.

When you go to do your classroom observation, follow this up by observing some nurses in a hospital and farmers in a mart and you will find a remarkable similarity amongst them with the attitude that 'I'm right and you're wrong'. It's called genetics and it's irish.

I know a teacher recently retired after 40 years of service. He was the best teacher in the school. Every class feared him and respected him at the same time. He got the most of his students in terms of exam results. And guess what. He absolutely hated it. Every year for 40 years he hated the 1st of September. I knew this man. I used to watch him correcting homework putting his head in his hands at the errors made. In one way teaching was never a career for him. He had high blood pressure but he survived. The moral: You don't have to love it to be the best.

Go be a teacher.

Qualitymark

What job would you really enjoy, and feel you were doing something worthwhile, and earn a decent living?

Rosita

pathway33 wrote: »

I know a teacher recently retired after 40 years of service. He was the best teacher in the school. Every class feared him and respected him at the same time. He got the most of his students in terms of exam results. And guess what. He absolutely hated it. Every year for 40 years he hated the 1st of September. I knew this man. I used to watch him correcting homework putting his head in his hands at the errors made. In one way teaching was never a career for him. He had high blood pressure but he survived. The moral: You don't have to love it to be the best.

This is interesting. A friend of mine showed me a card she got from her Leaving Cert class at the end of the year and one of the students said "you're the reason I want to be an Irish teacher". Now that's quite a compliment - you could argue it doesn't necessarily imply anything about the quality of the teaching/learning but it seems to say a lot of good things about the classroom atmosphere, which I think is fundamental to any effective class.

The funny thing is she doesn't like the job at all! But she seems to be fairly good at it if that's anything to go by. And yes, I too have seen one or two 'passionate' teachers with resources and enthusiasm coming out their ears but according to some of their students they were incredibly boring in class. There is indeed a danger in labels and being concerned with ticking all the boxes.

gagiteebo

pathway33 wrote: »

I would say this is the best state of mind to go into teaching. You cannot then be disappointed. I can't speak for the teachers on this forum as I do not know any of them but you will find a lot of teachers will ramble on about it being a vocation and how such and such would make a terrible teacher while being unable to see their own weaknesses. I see teachers who think they are the bees knees and yet their disgraceful attitude to the task of correcting leaving cert exams is despicable given the fact that young people's careers are depending on their exam being corrected by people who are not agitated by the task.

When you go to do your classroom observation, follow this up by observing some nurses in a hospital and farmers in a mart and you will find a remarkable similarity amongst them with the attitude that 'I'm right and you're wrong'. It's called genetics and it's irish.

I know a teacher recently retired after 40 years of service. He was the best teacher in the school. Every class feared him and respected him at the same time. He got the most of his students in terms of exam results. And guess what. He absolutely hated it. Every year for 40 years he hated the 1st of September. I knew this man. I used to watch him correcting homework putting his head in his hands at the errors made. In one way teaching was never a career for him. He had high blood pressure but he survived. The moral: You don't have to love it to be the best.

Go be a teacher.

Wow, your post just screams of some sort of bitterness or resentment!

Now in response to your comment about teachers not taking the corrections seriously, be very, very careful what accusations you start throwing around. The other thread was started as a bit of light-hearted relief, it is a long and arduous process and a bit of support and a laugh from your fellow correctors is needed but that does not mean for one second that any of us correcting JC and in particular LC papers do not take it seriously, quite the contrary. Where exactly does anyone say that they don't care about the marking or that they don't take it seriously?

As many posters said before, no it's not a vocation for all but that doesn't mean that it isn't for some so don't be so utterly insulting and to be quite honest arrogant. Your experience of one teacher is just that, an experience with one teacher. Fair play to him, he hated his job and still got results. I don't know many people who want to get up every day and go into a job they hate, what a waste. There are some of us who still manage to get results withoug striking the fear of God into teenagers and without living with high blood pressure.

mrboswell

Denerick wrote: »

How exactly? How does one 'go find out for yourself'? I'm not basing my opinion entirely on my friends, but it is about all I have to go on right now. They took a lunge, and some of them are glad they did so. All I'm saying is that its unfair to expect everyone to approach teaching as if its their lifelong dream - clearly this is not the case, and I shouldn't be expected to conform appropriately to what I consider a minority case. Most people stumble into their career, they don't dive into it enthusiastically.

Well you could start out by trying to get work as a substitute in a school. I did that for a year, with no guarantee of regular work for a year. I took a risk but it was worth it as I was then sure that I wanted to do the Hdip and become a teacher.
I did seek advice from friends but I still made sure I experienced it for myself. Try not to decide on you future on your friends advice alone - use it as an aid to your own experience when deciding.

True most people don't dive into to a career but then nor do they openly state that they might not enjoy it or be good at it.

I'm presuming that you won't bring up your previous comments when interviewing for a job or if applying for the Hdip...

rainbowtrout

pathway33 wrote: »

I would say this is the best state of mind to go into teaching. You cannot then be disappointed. I can't speak for the teachers on this forum as I do not know any of them but you will find a lot of teachers will ramble on about it being a vocation and how such and such would make a terrible teacher while being unable to see their own weaknesses. I see teachers who think they are the bees knees and yet their disgraceful attitude to the task of correcting leaving cert exams is despicable given the fact that young people's careers are depending on their exam being corrected by people who are not agitated by the task.

When you go to do your classroom observation, follow this up by observing some nurses in a hospital and farmers in a mart and you will find a remarkable similarity amongst them with the attitude that 'I'm right and you're wrong'. It's called genetics and it's irish.

I know a teacher recently retired after 40 years of service. He was the best teacher in the school. Every class feared him and respected him at the same time. He got the most of his students in terms of exam results. And guess what. He absolutely hated it. Every year for 40 years he hated the 1st of September. I knew this man. I used to watch him correcting homework putting his head in his hands at the errors made. In one way teaching was never a career for him. He had high blood pressure but he survived. The moral: You don't have to love it to be the best.

Go be a teacher.

Are you referring to teachers on this forum, or have you personally observed teachers while correcting the state exams? I certainly hope it wasn't a veiled attack on the posters in the thread about exam corrections. I've been correcting exams every summer for the past 9 years. Every paper gets the same attention and is corrected properly. However the nature of the work itself is monotonous. Try sitting down and correcting the same thing 400 times and see how you get on. Because teachers make jokes about corrections doesn't mean it doesn't get done properly. It's a way of letting off steam when you've corrected 50 papers and have another 50 to go to reach your next deadline, only for your advising examiner to ring and say 'Sorry we've changed the marking scheme again, can you go back and re-correct all those papers again. Sure, it won't take you that long so we're not extending the deadline' So you end up putting in ridiculously long days to get the work done on time but to the same standard because a student is depending on that grade after all.

It can also be disheartening as you'll know from the other thread, to go home with an agreed marking scheme from the conference, go and mark your papers and send them to your examiner and know that they'll be ringing 3 or 4 days later with a new marking scheme and all the work you've done has gone out the window, and you wonder why they just didn't implement the new scheme in the first place.

gagiteebo

rainbowtrout wrote: »

Are you referring to teachers on this forum, or have you personally observed teachers while correcting the state exams? I certainly hope it wasn't a veiled attack on the posters in the thread about exam corrections. I've been correcting exams every summer for the past 9 years. Every paper gets the same attention and is corrected properly. However the nature of the work itself is monotonous. Try sitting down and correcting the same thing 400 times and see how you get on. Because teachers make jokes about corrections doesn't mean it doesn't get done properly. It's a way of letting off steam when you've corrected 50 papers and have another 50 to go to reach your next deadline, only for your advising examiner to ring and say 'Sorry we've changed the marking scheme again, can you go back and re-correct all those papers again. Sure, it won't take you that long so we're not extending the deadline' So you end up putting in ridiculously long days to get the work done on time but to the same standard because a student is depending on that grade after all.

It can also be disheartening as you'll know from the other thread, to go home with an agreed marking scheme from the conference, go and mark your papers and send them to your examiner and know that they'll be ringing 3 or 4 days later with a new marking scheme and all the work you've done has gone out the window, and you wonder why they just didn't implement the new scheme in the first place.

Nail on the head rainbowtrout If ever there was a profession that requires a sense of humour it's teaching and the corrections are included in this! This is my 4th year doing it and yeah I moan about it but if it was really that bad I wouldn't do it again! And like yourself each paper gets the attention it requires. I always think of whoever is correcting the papers of my students and hope that they are giving them the attention they deserve so I do the same!

mrboswell

To be fair folks I think this is sliding off topic - shouldn't we keep it to teaching as opposed to correcting?

gagiteebo

mrboswell wrote: »

To be fair folks I think this is sliding off topic - shouldn't we keep it to teaching as opposed to correcting?

Yeah completely agree Just felt it necessary to address the comment by pathway33 but you're right!

EoghanRua

gagiteebo wrote: »

I don't know many people who want to get up every day and go into a job they hate, what a waste.

In fairness, nobody wants to get up every day and go into a job they hate. Unfortunately for, I imagine, a sizeable chunk of the population, it probably is a reality that they do. Putting bread on the table takes precedence over notions of self-actualisation when choice is removed. They probably do not see this vital function as a "waste". We need to keep this in mind when making statements such as the one above I think.

gagiteebo

EoghanRua wrote: »

In fairness, nobody wants to get up every day and go into a job they hate. Unfortunately for, I imagine, a sizeable chunk of the population, it probably is a reality that they do. Putting bread on the table takes precedence over notions of self-actualisation when choice is removed. They probably do not see this vital function as a "waste". We need to keep this in mind when making statements such as the one above I think.

I understand what you are saying but the OP wanted advice about becoming a teacher, he is in 2 minds so therefore he does have a choice. He feels he may not like it, he may not be good at it etc so if he were to enter into the profession feeling like this I do believe it would be a waste when he could be doing something he feels passionate about, whatever passionate means to him, as someone pointed out earlier it means different things to different people.

I think you have misunderstood me, I am not for one minute suggesting that people who are doing jobs to put food on the table etc, especially in this current climate are wasting anything. I know plenty of people like this, my own family included, I am talking about those who are lucky enough to have the choice. To refer to everyone like that would be pretty arrogant of me and that I am not.

Denerick

gagiteebo wrote: »

I understand what you are saying but the OP wanted advice about becoming a teacher, he is in 2 minds so therefore he does have a choice. He feels he may not like it, he may not be good at it etc so if he were to enter into the profession feeling like this I do believe it would be a waste when he could be doing something he feels passionate about, whatever passionate means to him, as someone pointed out earlier it means different things to different people.

What I am saying is that most people aren't passionate about what they do, and that you are the exception. I'm not really passionate about what jobs I do in the future. I believe I may come to love my job, but the fact remains that you do not know until you lunge into it.

gagiteebo

Denerick wrote: »

What I am saying is that most people aren't passionate about what they do, and that you are the exception. I'm not really passionate about what jobs I do in the future. I believe I may come to love my job, but the fact remains that you do not know until you lunge into it.

Like I've said Denerick I don't know you at all and that may well be true. All my opinions are based on the information you've presented thus far, particularly in your original post, you just have a very so-so attitude to a career which I love.

Go and try a bit of subbing as has been suggested before and take it from there

I don't feel I am the exception, rainbowtrout and a few others have agreed with me on here and feel the same, surely we all can't be exceptions. Someone said earlier, and I agree, passionate means different things to everyone.

I feel this thread is going around in circles to be honest and I almost feel like I have to defend teaching to you And you know what, if I am in the 'minority' of people who love their job then I realise how damn lucky I am but I don't want to get into that discussion again, I think it's pretty clear how we both feel about that

Best of luck in the future Denerick.

peanuthead

Denerick wrote: »

What I am saying is that most people aren't passionate about what they do, and that you are the exception. I'm not really passionate about what jobs I do in the future. I believe I may come to love my job, but the fact remains that you do not know until you lunge into it.

You know what, you really angered me yesterday. But I've been thinking about this. You are right in what you are saying. In general. Problem is, teaching is not like other jobs. In some other jobs (I've worked in a lot of other places, from clothes shops, to busy restaurants, to offices, call centres, bars...) you hate what you do but you get through it. I have to say, of all the jobs I have had, teaching is by far the least physically demanding job EVER. However mentally it is the most draining.

I think the point being made to you (certainly by me anyway) is that its the kind of job you really NEED to love doing if you are going to be able to stick it. You have to have a purpose for taking that level of crap on a daily basis with out going all Columbine!

I think the best advice you will get here is to go and do some observing. To just go and do the HDIP (Tell your friends its called the PGDE now ) will be an expensive waste of time (fees are 6.5K) if you opt out afterwards.

Oh and talking about the workload involved in the PGDE, I don't know how people get through it if they are not determined about teaching being their career of choice for definite.

gagiteebo

peanuthead wrote: »

I think the point being made to you (certainly by me anyway) is that its the kind of job you really NEED to love doing if you are going to be able to stick it.

Yes, I think that's what we've all been trying to say, well it was part of my point also.

Companero

OP, You , like me , do not have the teaching gene. Or at least you sound (in so far as one can tell from a post on the internet, like teaching secondary school is not in your blood.

I did the hDip , and like you, before doing it, was thinking, "Meh, well I've got an arts degree, might as well be a teacher" - and I did it, and I'm not ashamed to say, I hated every minute of it - I would quite honestly rather flip burgers than ever do something like that again.

I remember the guy I did the teaching practice with turning to me one day while we were supervising a class of rowdy teenagers, and smiling and saying "God, man this is a great job isnt it?" with a sigh of deep contentment. I knew then that there was an essential difference between those who have 'it' and those who don't.

Now admittedly this is not about teaching per se, I am still a teacher, but I work with adults, so there is no crowd-control or force-feeding involved. Teaching teenagers is rough work, and Irish teenagers are some of the most poorly parented in the world: I would liken it to being one of those selfless priests who minister to gang members in Brazilian Favellas or some such, you simply cant do it if you dont have that vocation, or like the teacher mentioned above, you may do it, but it may take more out of you than you have to give. If its not in you, and you choose to do it anyway, you may well be risking your mental and physical health.

And as for those holidays, as anyone whos ever taught knows, they are that long because you damn well need them!

EoghanRua

Companero wrote: »

OP, You , like me , do not have the teaching gene. Or at least you sound (in so far as one can tell from a post on the internet, like teaching secondary school is not in your blood.

I did the hDip , and like you, before doing it, was thinking, "Meh, well I've got an arts degree, might as well be a teacher" - and I did it, and I'm not ashamed to say, I hated every minute of it - I would quite honestly rather flip burgers than ever do something like that again.

I think the comparison is unfair to the OP. The key points he/she raised - in between the occasional silly unwittingly provocative remark - was "My over-arching concern is that I would be no good" but with the little rider "Who knows, perhaps I would be a good teacher".

I think that's not a bad way to be - to question oneself and as they say in teacher training be reflective.

The OP is not thinking "Meh, well I've got an arts degree, might as well be a teacher". The OP seems to be considering teaching on the basis that he/she is "after sending something like 200 CVs in Britain and Ireland and getting only 2 interviews". There is no suggestion that they couldn't be a*sed doing anything else, or that teaching is the path of least resistence representing the most passive decision possible at the time.

The OP does not make their decision to consider teaching seem as lightly taken as choosing salt/vinegar versus cheese/onion. It seems to me that if they go down that road by the time they get to the classroom they might be a bit more appraised of the realities of it than you were.

Denerick

The biggest drawback for me would be facing somebody like myself in the classroom. I used to pychologically torture teachers, I was a rather naughty boy. The rest of our class (All lads) were tyrants. I used to feel sorry for our teachers. One time I asked a maths teacher if they teach maths (A rather harsh barb considering the majority of the class failed the junior cert pree's). this was after the teacher spending 20 minutes calming the class down, and this started the chaos all over again. I was terrible for these little one liners that completely ruined the teachers authority...

What I really fear is trying to control a class! What if a little brat like myself asks such a question in front of me?

I think if I was teaching a class of well behaved older teenagers, I'd do well. I'd love to teach history and English to a class of curious teenagers. But anything from 15 years old downwards would terrify me!

Coogee

If you are good at it and njoy it then its a great job

gagiteebo

Denerick wrote: »

I think if I was teaching a class of well behaved older teenagers, I'd do well.

Yeah we all would but unfortunately there is no such thing, you could have the greatest honours LC class in Ireland and there will always be one or two little sh*tes in there, such is the nature of the job.

You learn as you go along what works and what doesn't, you learn from older, more experienced teachers and you learn from the students themselves. I teach all boys, have done for most of my teaching career and I love it because it suits me. Yeah they're a little cheekier and getting work from some of them is akin to getting blood from a stone but I like the energy of all boys and, well, it just works for me, I do love them Maybe all girls would work for you as they do tend to be better behaved in my experience. It's finding what works for you.

Did you look into subbing in local schools?

Denerick

gagiteebo wrote: »

Did you look into subbing in local schools?

I did ask, I didn't exactly get many positive replies though.

gagiteebo

Denerick wrote: »

I did ask, I didn't exactly get many positive replies though.

Really? How about just sitting in on classes then? Do you know anyone who is a teacher?