Scammed on ebay

mossy464

Think iv been scammed on ebay for oxegen tickets.

Paid a guy through paypal for tickets and he said he would swiftpost them today. That was grand, I mailed him this evening and he said he had posted them. Then I mailed him back and asked him for a tracking number and he hasnt got back to me since.

That got me a bit suspicious and then I was on ebay and I saw another similiar auction to the one I used to buy the tickets.

It was practically identical except the ebay member id was swal1128 as opposed to the member i bought off swal1127.

As soon as I saw that I knew there was something wrong. I have opened a dispute with paypal, my question is will paypal refund my money if there are no funds in the sellers account? Or am i protected?

Benny Lava

Yes, you more than likely have been scammed.

The same thing happened to my brother when he tried to buy an iPhone on eBay. He then sent some e-mails threatening legal action and after a while his money was returned.

mossy464

Do you know if I can get my money back from paypal if it is not in the sellers account?

mossy464

Iv checked it out and even if paypal does not issue a refund I think I can contact my credit card company about the issue and they should be able to charge back the credit card.

jor el

mossy464 wrote: »

Do you know if I can get my money back from paypal if it is not in the sellers account?

Not from Paypal.

mossy464 wrote: »

Iv checked it out and even if paypal does not issue a refund I think I can contact my credit card company about the issue and they should be able to charge back the credit card.

That's a possibility, though not a guarantee.

Benny Lava

mossy464 wrote: »

Do you know if I can get my money back from paypal if it is not in the sellers account?

I would imagine so, but I'm not sure.

The incident involving my brother was with a 3V card so that's the angle I researched this from.

Max Power1

mossy464 wrote: »

Do you know if I can get my money back from paypal if it is not in the sellers account?

jor el wrote: »

Not from Paypal.



.

yes you will. Jor El's reply there is incorrect. If the item was bought on ebay you are guaranteed a refund unless the seller proves delivery.

mossy464

Hopefully I will anyway as I also used a 3v card.

Im actually sick at the thought of this scum who scammed me.

I have also sent an email to 3v about my problem.

jor el

Max Power1 wrote: »

yes you will. Jor El's reply there is incorrect. If the item was bought on ebay you are guaranteed a refund unless the seller proves delivery.

No you're not. Paypal have a ton of get out of paying you back clauses. They will only refund when money is available. If it's not, they'll give you a PFO response.

kumate_champ07

what price was the ticket?

mossy464

250 for two tickets. He said they were an unwanted prize. Its my own fault really. It was too good to be true.

Im really worried about getting the money back though and some of it isn't mine.

mossy464

I looked at the sellers profile and he has 2 positive feedback from when he bought some stuff in the last month or so or is this kind of thing common in scams. Probably wishful thinking by me.

Ebay seems like a stupid place to put scams really.

jor el

mossy464 wrote: »

I looked at the sellers profile and he has 2 positive feedback from when he bought some stuff in the last month or so or is this kind of thing common in scams. Probably wishful thinking by me.

Very common. And with e-tickets, it's even easier to sell it multiple times and run a whole load of scams off the one ticket.

mossy464 wrote: »

Ebay seems like a stupid place to put scams really.

Why? It's a scammers paradise. There is so little investigation done by eBay, and it's very difficult for a scammer to lose out. Have a look at this thread, and you'll see that same scam being run for years now. I'd reckon the scammer in that thread has netted 10s of thousands of euro by now.

mossy464

jor el wrote: »

Very common. And with e-tickets, it's even easier to sell it multiple times and run a whole load of scams off the one ticket.



Why? It's a scammers paradise. There is so little investigation done by eBay, and it's very difficult for a scammer to lose out. Have a look at this thread, and you'll see that same scam being run for years now. I'd reckon the scammer in that thread has netted 10s of thousands of euro by now.

I suppose when you put it that way it makes sense.

Im so pi**** off. So you reckon I dont have much chance of getting my money back?

jor el

mossy464 wrote: »

Im so pi**** off. So you reckon I dont have much chance of getting my money back?

Start a dispute in Paypal as soon as you can (you may have to wait some time before you can even open it) and then escalate to a claim. Leave negative feedback for the seller right now, saying you haven't received the ticket and the seller is not responding to you.

Report the sale to eBay, and link them to the other auction that you believe is the same seller. They'll probably do nothing at all, or maybe they'll answer a question you didn't ask, but you should do it anyway.

If all that fails, then a credit card charge back is your only course of action. This often does work, but in some cases the bank either can't or won't intervene. The certainly won't do anything unless you exhaust your options with Paypal. Paypal claims can take anything from 10 days to 3 months.

SOLVITENS

I am pretty much sure Paypal should place a hold on the payment for 21 day or until buyer left positive feedback.:)

https://www.paypal-marketing.co.uk/safetyadvice/PaymentHoldsForEbayItems.htm

It is from ebay.co.uk , but ithink the same applies to irish sellers.

mossy464

Can you even do a chargeback with a 3v card?

I have opened a dispute with paypal and have also contacted 3v. Fingers crossed.

I will contact ebay also. Thanks

allthedoyles

I would ring paypal first 1890 943 220 or (01)4369023

mossy464

SOLVITENS wrote: »

I am pretty much sure Paypal should place a hold on the payment for 21 day or until buyer left positive feedback.:)

https://www.paypal-marketing.co.uk/safetyadvice/PaymentHoldsForEbayItems.htm

It is from ebay.co.uk , but ithink the same applies to irish sellers.

Thats the problem. Im so stupid. The seller said he would not post the tickets until he could access the funds so I stupidly left positive feedback.

Funnily enough he offered me a refund when I initially said no.

Oh im kicking myself.

SOLVITENS

I sold laptop in ebay in august 2008 and paypal put payment received on hold. I had a little selling history , but only with low value items. Laptop payment was £ 370.00. Buyer from Donegal received laptop , left positive feedback , but paypal did not release money for around 10 days anyway. So if all this happened within last day or two , there is hope that money is still with paypal.

If You did not escalate to claim yet , do it now.

mossy464

SOLVITENS wrote: »

I sold laptop in ebay in august 2008 and paypal put payment received on hold. I had a little selling history , but only with low value items. Laptop payment was £ 370.00. Buyer from Donegal received laptop , left positive feedback , but paypal did not release money for around 10 days anyway. So if all this happened within last day or two , there is hope that money is still with paypal.

If You did not escalate to claim yet , do it now.

I cant escalate it to a claim for a few days. Its only a dispute atm.

I just got an email back from the seller saying you have ur refund as I sent him a few mails complaining but there is no refund in my paypal account.

He is saying that the refund should be there but no sign of it. Should it take a while to appear or is he just talking spoof?

SOLVITENS

There will be no money in Your paypal account , as You paid with 3V, it goes straight in your 3v card. Check latest activities tab to see if there is something refund related. Also have a look at Your case , if seller refunded it should be closed.

mossy464

No nothing there. Dispute is still open and I also checked on my 3v account. Nothing.

What is this gimp playing at. Thanks for all this help. Cant believe i have been so stupid.

If nothing happens tonight, I will ring paypal first thing in the morning.

mossy464

This guy got back to me again telling me to f off because paypal had taken the money out of his account and I was refunded.

Do you think he is lying? The dispute is still open and still no sign of anything.

Grumpypants

He has told you he posted them right?
And then he said he issued a full refund?

Why would he issue a refund if the tickets where on the way. Sounds dodgy wonder does it take a few days to go back onto the 3V voucher?

SOLVITENS

It looks like paypal has frozen Your payment in his account. To refund You he has to complete refund form in his account. Paypal does not refund automatically, You should go through dispute - claim process. I am not sure if he can access funds even to refund You now. Just stick to Your claim and do not close it.

mossy464

Grumpypants wrote: »

He has told you he posted them right?
And then he said he issued a full refund?

Why would he issue a refund if the tickets where on the way. Sounds dodgy wonder does it take a few days to go back onto the 3V voucher?

Thats what i said, looks very dodgy.

Now he has escalated the dispute to a claim to get paypal to investigate and that he has sent the tickets.

Doesnt make sense. One minute he says he is giving me a refund and then he is escalating a claim saying he sent the tickets.

mossy464

Is it possible that when I first started the dispute on paypal that they froze the funds in his account?

Then he says i got the refund as paypal took the funds although he has sent the tickets.

Hence he escalated to a claim to get money back for the tickets.

SOLVITENS

He has to provide paypal with tracking number. If You do not trust the seller , don't sign for anything what arrives at Your address. He can send page of old newspaper with registered mail and he will have a proof of delivery.

mossy464

Now he says he will give me tracking number tomorrow. All sounds very dodgy.

I have told him I want it now as the envelope could arrive tomorrow. Awaiting response.

Lets say I did sign for something and it was a piece of newspaper, couldnt i then open a claim as the item was not what was for sale?

SOLVITENS

You can open Not as Described claim , but ,as You started dispute already, You cannot to change it from paypal page . Paypal will close in his favour , then You should appeal and to ring paypal to tell all the story , so paypal can reopen other claim against seller .

But , again , if You did not escalate to claim maybe You can change nature of claim from Your paypal page . Not sure about this.

mossy464

Cheers. I'll see what i can do on the dispute page.

Heres the sequence of comments in the dispute, just in case you want a read of them.

* 7/6/2010 16:48 PDT - PayPal: Seller escalated this dispute to a Claim.
* 7/6/2010 16:48 PDT - Seller: i sent items provided i would be paid and items have bein sent now i wont receive the funds
* 7/6/2010 14:09 PDT - Buyer: You have not responded to my email giving me a tracking number for the tickets you apparently sent. Also the fact that you have set up another ebay account trying to sell tickets leads me to believe that you are definitely trying to scam people. Saying you have tickets when you actually do not have any. I want my money back or else proof that you have sent the tickets which at this stage I believe is very unlikely.

I can change the dispute alrite. It says the following on the case page:

If you received the item but it's different than you expected, you can change your reason for this claim.

jor el

If he had refunded the money, there would be a record of that in your Paypal account, even though the money itself would not be there. It could take up to a week to see this appear on your 3V account, so no point checking that. You cannot charge back with 3V, they simply won't entertain the idea.

If a refund had been given on the payment, Paypal would also have closed the dispute automatically, as there would be no need to let it continue, so obviously he hasn't refunded the money. I would say he's chancing his arm, to see if you'll close the dispute.

Everything he said and did should have screamed scam at you before you even paid. Saying he won't post tickets until the money clears is firstly against eBay's rules, and secondly an obvious scam attempt. Leaving feedback for him before receiving what you bought, why did you do that?

If the funds are on hold by Paypal, you have a chance of getting your money back. If he has a tracking number, any tracking number, that shows a delivery took place, then Paypal could close in his favour, give him the money, and close the case. Paypal will never re-open a closed dispute, though you can probably appeal to them over the phone/email. At that point though, you'll be wasting your time as the money will already be gone and Paypal will give you nothing.

Cross your fingers and hope for the best.

Grumpypants

Not much use to you now i know but for the future check feed back and dont leave feedback until the item arrives.

mossy464

jor el wrote: »

If he had refunded the money, there would be a record of that in your Paypal account, even though the money itself would not be there. It could take up to a week to see this appear on your 3V account, so no point checking that. You cannot charge back with 3V, they simply won't entertain the idea.

If a refund had been given on the payment, Paypal would also have closed the dispute automatically, as there would be no need to let it continue, so obviously he hasn't refunded the money. I would say he's chancing his arm, to see if you'll close the dispute.

Everything he said and did should have screamed scam at you before you even paid. Saying he won't post tickets until the money clears is firstly against eBay's rules, and secondly an obvious scam attempt. Leaving feedback for him before receiving what you bought, why did you do that?

If the funds are on hold by Paypal, you have a chance of getting your money back. If he has a tracking number, any tracking number, that shows a delivery took place, then Paypal could close in his favour, give him the money, and close the case. Paypal will never re-open a closed dispute, though you can probably appeal to them over the phone/email. At that point though, you'll be wasting your time as the money will already be gone and Paypal will give you nothing.

Cross your fingers and hope for the best.

I have just been onto paypal and the money is on hold in his account. The woman on the phone basically told me what you said. They are awaiting a response from the seller and basically I should either receive the item or a refund. He has to provide them a tracking number with proof of delivery.

What im worried about now is if he sends some piece of paper in an envelope with a tracking number and I receive it next week or something after the festival.

As long as I dont sign for it, will i be ok?

jor el

mossy464 wrote: »

I have just been onto paypal and the money is on hold in his account. The woman on the phone basically told me what you said. They are awaiting a response from the seller and basically I should either receive the item or a refund. He has to provide them a tracking number with proof of delivery.

That's good that the money is on hold. You haven't lost it yet then.

mossy464 wrote: »

As long as I dont sign for it, will i be ok?

I've read cases of people losing when a tracking number that doesn't work, or was signed for somewhere else, was supplied to Paypal. If something does turn up, you'd probably be best refusing it, and asking for it to be returned to sender. This way, the tracking will show it was not delivered. It will show that delivery was refused though, and I've no idea if Paypal will penalise you for this.

It's a tricky one. If you do sign, open it in the presence of the post person, and if there's nothing in the envelope then see if they can record that on the slip.

Max Power1

do not accept delivery of anything now. If delivery is not confirmed, the case will go in your favour. Onus is on the seller 100% in these cases.

ttm

Interesting comment that...

mossy464 wrote: »

I just got an email back from the seller saying you have ur refund as I sent him a few mails complaining but there is no refund in my paypal account.

He is saying that the refund should be there but no sign of it. Should it take a while to appear or is he just talking spoof?

...there is a well reported eBay scammer that has been know to say exactly the same

Irreverent

Hi Mossy464

How is your paypal dispute going? I am going through a similar situation right now.

mossy464

Irreverent wrote: »

Hi Mossy464

How is your paypal dispute going? I am going through a similar situation right now.

Paypal sent me an email the other day saying they are waiting to here back from the seller.

So far he has not got back to them and if at the end of a ten day period he has still not contacted them the case will automatically go in my favour.

The end of this ten day period is friday. I never even received the tickets from him and the festival is over since yesterday so it was definately a scam. Im pretty confident of getting my money back. If he attempts to send me anything at this stage I will not accept delivery of it.

Grumpypants

I have just been through a claim back (i bought a 120GB HD and it turned up as a 20GB one and no contact from seller) and while i got my money back in one of their emails they sent i got the impression a claim back still depends on him having a paypal account still open as if they cant get the money they will only place restrictions on his account. If they have your money on hold you should be ok but that email did worry me.

Seller did contact me today looking for the item to be shipped back because i didnt want it !! Ill post it back but only once he covers shipping.