M3 motorway tolls?

Demonon

Well the famous motorway opens today, I notice on this map

http://www.eurolink-m3.ie/images/header/web-m3-mapa-2.jpg

there are 2 toll plaza locations north, and south, does this mean if travelling to Kells and back from Dublin it will cost (in a normal car) €1.30 x 4 = €5.20 ? Is that right ?

amacachi

Yup, 2 tolls each way.

Tragedy

Why is there two tolls on it?

Victor

Tragedy wrote: »

Why is there two tolls on it?

To make it less worthwhile / practical to skip them.

It also means you pay for what you use.

me_right_one

Stupid road never should have been built. Do you have to pay for donkeys? Cos thats what the country will be commuting on soon

Tragedy

Two tolls make it more worthwhile to skip them surely.

I don't mind tolls, but having two on one stretch seems a bit ott.

Gophur

me_right_one wrote: »

Stupid road never should have been built. ............

Go on, enlighten us all. Why?

Lando Griffin

Great, all the infrastructure is nearly in place, now all we need is to build an economy.
Time to throw away the shovel and the s**t thats doing the shovelling.

Gophur

betafrog wrote: »

Queue argument about historic this that and the other.... :eek:

It may well be, but the poster did not elaborate!

The M3 is about 20 years too late. It will replace one of the most infuriating roads in the country. Any road that bypasses Kells, Navan and Dunshaughlin can only be good. It's design, however, bringing all the traffic into the South side of Virginia is ridiculous. The very least it could have done was to end up North of Virginia, with 15 clear miles ahead of it, to Cavan town.

There was an opportunity to build a rail-link the length of the Motorway, too, but this didn't happen. Imagine the prosperity that would bring along it's route?

Note, there were zero new road projects started in 2009 and none planned for 2010. Our infrastructure seems to be at a standstill.

celticbest

Two tolls in the space of 60km is a bit much IMO, fair enough it only €1.30 a toll at the moment but how long will it stay at this level?

I travelled to Carlow the other day from Dublin city centre and did not have one toll for the whole length of the journey................(PS), it was more then 60km to Carlow. (approx. 85km)

Gophur

betafrog wrote: »

Hmmm this is interesting,

It seems pyrite, a chemical that expands when exposed to moisture and oxygen was used in some of the construction of the M3...

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0604/1224271819714.html

Clever people them construction folk...

“as far as we are aware,” the pyrite was used as filling for embankments.

What's the issue? If it's in embankments it's not a problem.

Absurdum

“as far as we are aware,” and builders don't sit comfortably together imo

Shane732

What exactly shouldn't this motorway have been built? I live close to the motorway and I'm thrilled about it.

Anyone remember the horrible queues at the end of the N3 dual carriageway? Since the new stretch of road has open there gone. There will no longer be a queue at the fairyhouse cross, Dunshaughlin, Navan.... Is this not all good news or do you prefer sitting in traffic?

Getting into town in the mornings will be so much easier specially once they have the junction at Blanchardstown completed.

This is a massive boast.

me_right_one

Gophur wrote: »

The M3 is about 20 years too late.
Note, there were zero new road projects started in 2009 and none planned for 2010. Our infrastructure seems to be at a standstill.

There was no need for it. 20 years too late? Why? Just why? Note, there's a good reason there are no new roads planned, WE DONT NEED THEM!

squod

Shane732 wrote: »

What exactly shouldn't this motorway have been built? I live close to the motorway and I'm thrilled about it.

Anyone remember the horrible queues at the end of the N3 dual carriageway? Since the new stretch of road has open there gone. There will no longer be a queue at the fairyhouse cross, Dunshaughlin, Navan.... Is this not all good news or do you prefer sitting in traffic?

Getting into town in the mornings will be so much easier specially once they have the junction at Blanchardstown completed.

This is a massive boast.

The sensible thing to do was to put rail infastructure in along side the M3. Another sensible thing was to not put roundabouts on top of the off ramps on the N3. Dunshaughlin shoulda been by-passed an age ago and if the original (planned) route of the M3 was used the whole yoke woulda been built alot sooner.


Why it is that Navan doesn't have the same infastucture as Dundalk (for example) is beyond reason.

vetstu

squod wrote: »

Why it is that Navan doesn't have the same infastucture as Dundalk (for example) is beyond reason.

Because the road through Dundalk is the main route in the country (to Belfast)
The road through Navan ends up in Ballyshannon.

shedweller

I've been wondering. Why are these motorways tolled in the first place? The reason i ask is that speeds are higher on motorways and therefore more fuel is used. My car (diesel) will use 5L/100k at 100kph but it rises to nearly 7L/100k at 120kph. So i spend an extra E2.40 (approx) every 100km i travel on a motorway. Being a diesel, if i remember correctly, the govt take 60% or thereabouts as diesel tax.
This amounts to E1.44 extra tax every 100km of motorway. It's just an example and everyones numbers are different. But the point is that motorways generate a lot of money for the government just in fuel taxes.

Gophur

me_right_one wrote: »

There was no need for it. 20 years too late? Why? Just why?...............

There was no need? If you had spent any time trying to commute through the hell-hole that was Kells, the hell-hole that was Navan (7 sets of traffic lights on its "relief" road, and the hell hole that was Dunshaughlin, you'd see the need.

New roads bring prosperity. There has been practically zero new Industrial investment along the N3 for 20 years. A proper road, connecting the region with the Airport, for example, or the ports, would have provided necessary infrastructure to support Industrial investment.

As for the Tara "thing"? 99% of the so-called protesters never visited Tara and never will. It was a convenient excuse to open their mouths to shout about something. (Amazing how little protests took place on dole day, the protesters were too busy!)

me_right_one wrote: »

...................... Note, there's a good reason there are no new roads planned, WE DONT NEED THEM!

Only somebody with either a narrow mind or an empty head would say such a thing. Proper roads are necessary for an economy to function.


And, finally, from a safety angle, the N3 claimed so many lives over the past decades, people who would be alive today if there was a proper road. This is one reason why the N3, in Cavan, needs to be upgraded as soon as possible, to Motorway status. In the past five years, alone, approximately 10 people have died on the N3 between Cavan town and the new road.

shedweller

I wholeheartedly agree with the building of the roads themselves. But the tolling of them i think, is unneccesary, due to the point i raised in my previous post. Anyone got any thoughts on this?

Gophur

shedweller wrote: »

I wholeheartedly agree with the building of the roads themselves. But the tolling of them i think, is unneccesary, due to the point i raised in my previous post. Anyone got any thoughts on this?

Unless you can think of some other way to fund them, other than the PPP method, one will have to pay tolls to give the private investors their necessary return on their investment.

The Greens, and their ilk love road tolls, they are another way to penalise the bad people driving dirty cars.

R.O.R

shedweller wrote: »

I've been wondering. Why are these motorways tolled in the first place? The reason i ask is that speeds are higher on motorways and therefore more fuel is used. My car (diesel) will use 5L/100k at 100kph but it rises to nearly 7L/100k at 120kph. So i spend an extra E2.40 (approx) every 100km i travel on a motorway. Being a diesel, if i remember correctly, the govt take 60% or thereabouts as diesel tax.
This amounts to E1.44 extra tax every 100km of motorway. It's just an example and everyones numbers are different. But the point is that motorways generate a lot of money for the government just in fuel taxes.

What would your fuel economy be doing the stop/start, through town route?

You'll find it's better to be going a steady 120km/h rather than 0-30-0 every couple of seconds.

You can also drop your speed a little and the economy will go up. 110 should see much better figures than 120, won't make a huge difference to travelling time, won't get in most people's way, and will probably get me a huge slagging for saying this

Cionád

shedweller wrote: »

I wholeheartedly agree with the building of the roads themselves. But the tolling of them i think, is unneccesary, due to the point i raised in my previous post. Anyone got any thoughts on this?

Time is also saved, so if you value your time using the tolls can be worth it. Say your in employment and you're earning 20 euro an hour, skipping an old road to save half an hour at a cost of 2.60 + a few cent in extra diesel seems like a good deal. Also, there is nothing to stop you travelling at 100km/h on the motorway.

The alternative is more tax on fuel, which will be resisted by country folk who live miles from civilization, and can only dream of a nearby motorway to serve them directly.

samsemtex

Gophur wrote: »

There was no need? If you had spent any time trying to commute through the hell-hole that was Kells, the hell-hole that was Navan (7 sets of traffic lights on its "relief" road, and the hell hole that was Dunshaughlin, you'd see the need.

New roads bring prosperity. There has been practically zero new Industrial investment along the N3 for 20 years. A proper road, connecting the region with the Airport, for example, or the ports, would have provided necessary infrastructure to support Industrial investment.

As for the Tara "thing"? 99% of the so-called protesters never visited Tara and never will. It was a convenient excuse to open their mouths to shout about something. (Amazing how little protests took place on dole day, the protesters were too busy!)



Only somebody with either a narrow mind or an empty head would say such a thing. Proper roads are necessary for an economy to function.


And, finally, from a safety angle, the N3 claimed so many lives over the past decades, people who would be alive today if there was a proper road. This is one reason why the N3, in Cavan, needs to be upgraded as soon as possible, to Motorway status. In the past five years, alone, approximately 10 people have died on the N3 between Cavan town and the new road.

Well said, ridiculous comments from the other guy. New roads are never a bad thing.

Saab Ed

My wifes journey time to work in each direction everyday has been cut by 20-25 minutes because of this new road. Working on 20 minutes , times twice a day by five days a week, that's just over three hours a week she's got back because of this new road and she doesn't even have to go through the toll.

How many other people out there have just been handed back so much time because of this road. Kells to Dublin on a wet Monday morning could take in and around 2 hours on a bad day. Same journey today in heavy traffic is 45 minutes. No traffic is Kells, Navan and Dunshaughlin is a welcome boost to the locals who've been hammered for years with a national route going straight through what is in Dunshaughlins case just a small country village.

How the road was built, who built it and the route it took might have been a bad idea but thats a separate argument to the road itself being a bad idea, its a bloody great idea and one that, and Im not over valuing the worth of this here, has changed my life for the better.

shedweller

Gophur wrote: »

Unless you can think of some other way to fund them..............

I think the tax take on fuel is quite large. What are they doing with it? Ok, nama etc. but why wasn't this done during the boom times when there was money to burn?
I pity anyone that has to use the m3 tolls (or any toll) every day. Their yearly toll bill must be big.
Re: the value of my time, well, i clock in/clock out and don't get overtime. I leave a little earlier (10mins) but save enough to tax and insure my car. Worth it imo.

Also, there is nothing to stop you travelling at 100km/h on the motorway.

Very true Cionad. Although there are people that have a problem with that too, unfortunately. As for your point about extra tax, well, there's enough on it already. I doubt tolling would stop if there was extra tax placed on fuel.

traco

Was on this yeaterday and surprised by the two tolls, thought it was only one toll so was surprised by the second.

Correct me if I am wrong but I think the first toll heading North is approx 14km after M50 and its then 36km to the next one which is about 15km from the end.

IMO I think they are too close together.

L1011

me_right_one wrote: »

Note, there's a good reason there are no new roads planned, WE DONT NEED THEM!

Note that there are about 140 road schemes planned by the NRA at the moment :rolleyes:

me_right_one

MYOB wrote: »

Note that there are about 140 road schemes planned by the NRA at the moment :rolleyes:

I know. More unbelievably crazy FF policies. It always reminds me of Iran's nuclear policy. Most Iranian people dont even have toilets, and their govt needs nuclear material? Ha

Fishtits

I can't understand anyone who accepts that we have to pay to drive on a road?

If the Gov spent the income they make from road tax on our roads we've have the best roads in Europe...

Motorists have been rode for years, no sign of change.