Roundabout Accident

MacAva · 03-06-2010 10:35am #1

Hi, would appreciate if anyone could give me some advice,

I was involved in a collision on a Two-lane roundabout a few days ago.
I was approaching the roundabout in the right-hand lane to proceed through the roundabout and into the right-hand lane after the roundabout, after which was another roundabout straight ahead.

While I was exiting the first roundabout, a car came up on my outside, from the left-hand lane intending on turning right and caught my back left door and dented it, without a mark on his.

Now I know there is confusion and many differing opinions about roundabout rules but correct me if im wrong:

On a roundabout where the exit consists of one single lane, left lane is for turning left and straight on and right lane is for turning right only. (We were both wrong)

On a Two-lane roundabout however, where there are 2 lanes on the exit, both lanes can be used to proceed through the roundabout. The driver in the left lanes last choice is straight on, therefore if he was using roundabout correctly, the accident would not have occurred.

Any feedback would be appreciated.
Thank you.

corktina · 03-06-2010 10:47am

looks about right there except the other car must have been on the Inside not the outside.... i know there is confusion about which is the inside and which the outside lane on a roundabout.... the lane nearest the median on a dual carriageway is the OUTSIDE lane and thus the lane nearest the centre of the roundabout should be called the OUTSIDE lane or better still the right hand lane.... wahts more...if he hit your rear laft hand door, he was behind you and thus to blame on that count too

no1beemerfan · 03-06-2010 10:51am

corktina wrote: »

...if he hit your rear laft hand door, he was behind you and thus to blame on that count too

I'd only consider this....he was behind you so he is at fault.

MacAva · 03-06-2010 10:53am

Apologies, yes, he was on the 'left-hand lane' ON the roundabout to turn right! I know this is wrong, I just wanted to confirm or get some advice as to whether you can travel through a roundabout to go straight through in the right hand lane if the exit has 2 lanes (not the usual single lane roundabout where the exit merges into one lane)

MacAva · 03-06-2010 10:55am

Yes he was behind me but must have assumed that because I was in the right lane that i was going right. Pity he didn't abide by this logic

gooch2k9 · 03-06-2010 10:57am

Almost happened me the last day too. Two lane roundabout onto a dual carriageway. I drove in the right hand lane to go straight on as i couldn't get into left hand lane. Some amadan of a lass in the left hand lane decides she can go take the third exit turning right! Nearly went into her, but for the fact I had an idea she'd do it, i would have.

Instinct is a big thing in driving.

And yeah I'd say you weren't at fault for that collision.

Henry Ford III · 03-06-2010 10:58am

You were blameless imho O.P.

MacAva · 03-06-2010 11:02am

Oh ye, you're right gooch2k9!

I had checked my mirrors of course, im very cautious on roundabouts, and next thing he was up behind me and in the side of my car!!

I think turning right on a roundabout from the left lane is asking for an accident! They are so dangerous and so many people dont know how to use them or abuse the rules and cause an accident!

MacAva · 03-06-2010 11:03am

Thanks for replies.

dirtydiesel · 03-06-2010 11:04am

MacAva wrote: »

Apologies, yes, he was on the 'left-hand lane' ON the roundabout to turn right! I know this is wrong, I just wanted to confirm or get some advice as to whether you can travel through a roundabout to go straight through in the right hand lane if the exit has 2 lanes (not the usual single lane roundabout where the exit merges into one lane)

To do that you are going to cut up any vehicle using the left lane.
Not sure either of you were using the roundabout right but its a tough call to make.
Did either of you admit to been wrong?
Is the question just for your piece of mind or insurance reasons.
I always stay in the left lane if im going straight on.

vincenzolorenzo · 03-06-2010 11:06am

MacAva wrote: »

Hi, would appreciate if anyone could give me some advice,

I was involved in a collision on a Two-lane roundabout a few days ago.
I was approaching the roundabout in the right-hand lane to proceed through the roundabout and into the right-hand lane after the roundabout, after which was another roundabout straight ahead.

While I was exiting the first roundabout, a car came up on my outside, from the left-hand lane intending on turning right and caught my back left door and dented it, without a mark on his.

Now I know there is confusion and many differing opinions about roundabout rules but correct me if im wrong:

On a roundabout where the exit consists of one single lane, left lane is for turning left and straight on and right lane is for turning right only. (We were both wrong)

On a Two-lane roundabout however, where there are 2 lanes on the exit, both lanes can be used to proceed through the roundabout. The driver in the left lanes last choice is straight on, therefore if he was using roundabout correctly, the accident would not have occurred.

Any feedback would be appreciated.
Thank you.

Yep thats always been my understanding of the rule anyway. A lot of people do seem to have difficulty learning the rules of roundabouts though :rolleyes:

One thing that is very common here though is a single lane roundabout with two lanes approaching it! There's a good few roundabouts I go to everyday that only have room for one car to go around and yet have two lanes approaching it!

gooch2k9 · 03-06-2010 11:07am

dirtydiesel wrote: »

To do that you are going to cut up any vehicle using the left lane.
Not sure either of you were using the roundabout right but its a tough call to make.
Did either of you admit to been wrong?
Is the question just for your piece of mind or insurance reasons.
I always stay in the left lane if im going straight on.

MacAva was using the roundabout correctly. If the exit has two lanes the left lane is for left and straight on(coming out on the left lane on the exit), the right lane is for straight on(right lane of exit) or turning right.

SueWho · 03-06-2010 11:07am

The other car was wrong, you had the right to do what you did.

A good driver plays by the rules of the road and in the event of an accident they can always blame the other person.

A very good driver is always trying to anticipate the errors that bad drivers make and takes appropriate action to avoid getting in accidents with these idiots.

One example is when you are going straight through a 2 lane roundabout you should stay in the left hand lane- you are entitled to be there and you cannot get whacked into by those idiots who use the left lane even though they are taking the third exit- however they will hit you if you are in the right hand lane.

MacAva · 03-06-2010 11:11am

Yes dirtydiesel, you are right, however, there were 2 lanes and the driver in the left lane's last option was to take my exit. And if he did, there wouldn't have been an accident. I wouldn't have caused an accident using that lane to go straight through unless someone was using the left lane incorrevtly to turn right.

This is why there is so much confusion around roundabouts and their rules, because the rules for a single lane exit roundabout and a double lane one is different in terms of what lane you can use to go straight through.

onemorechance · 03-06-2010 11:13am

Left lane for left turns and straight on. You can use the right lane for going straight on when

Also, overtaking on a roundabout is illegal, so you can say he was trying to overtake you.

MacAva · 03-06-2010 11:15am

I agree 100% SueWho and I always take the left lane to go straight on but on this occasion, there was a roundabout (very close) after the one I had the accident on and I was anticipating that also as well as abiding by the rules of the road. He literally came out of nowhere. I was driving slowly and he didnt expect me to take that exit and must have jammed on.

He has admitted liability. It is for both insurance and peace of mind.

Viper_JB · 03-06-2010 11:15am

OP were you changing into the left lane at the time?

Speak Now · 03-06-2010 11:16am

MacAva wrote: »

Hi, would appreciate if anyone could give me some advice,

I was involved in a collision on a Two-lane roundabout a few days ago.
I was approaching the roundabout in the right-hand lane to proceed through the roundabout and into the right-hand lane after the roundabout, after which was another roundabout straight ahead.

While I was exiting the first roundabout, a car came up on my outside, from the left-hand lane intending on turning right and caught my back left door and dented it, without a mark on his.

Now I know there is confusion and many differing opinions about roundabout rules but correct me if im wrong:

On a roundabout where the exit consists of one single lane, left lane is for turning left and straight on and right lane is for turning right only. (We were both wrong)

On a Two-lane roundabout however, where there are 2 lanes on the exit, both lanes can be used to proceed through the roundabout. The driver in the left lanes last choice is straight on, therefore if he was using roundabout correctly, the accident would not have occurred.

Any feedback would be appreciated.
Thank you.

The other car was definitely in the wrong lane.

Always be aware though as some 2 lane roundabouts have the outside lane marked for those turning right only.
It's like this on the ORR in waterford not that anyone pays attention to it :rolleyes:

Tea 1000 · 03-06-2010 11:19am

http://www.rulesoftheroad.ie/rules-for-driving/junctions-roundabouts/roundabouts.html
Point of note here is the sentence :
Going straight ahead
Stay in the left-hand lane, but do not indicate "left" until you have passed the first exit. Where conditions dictate otherwise, you may follow the course shown by the broken red line.
For those who didn't follow the link above, the course shown by the broken red line is the one the OP took.
The source of confusion lies in that what is a condition that allows you to take that course? Is it the condition that the lanes are there? Is it the condition that the left laners are mainly turning left and there's a bit of a tail back in that lane?
Either way, the main point here is that it's never OK to turn right from the left hand lane, so whether the OP is correct or only kind of correct for their position, the other car was definitely wrong, therefore you're in the clear OP.

MacAva · 03-06-2010 11:21am

I took the route the red car took in this diagram to proceed to the next right lane to then take a right turn at a roundabout that followed very close after. If I was in the left lane going straight on I would have had very little time to change lanes before I reached the next roundabout.

Speak Now · 03-06-2010 11:22am

Viper_JB wrote: »

OP were you changing into the left lane at the time?

I'm trying to picture this as well. If he hit his left back door the driver in the wrong must have being switching lane when he hit him. Either that or OP would have been just about off the roundabout when he was clipped from the driver coming round in the left lane. Doesn't paint a pretty picture whichever. Either way he wasn't looking at was going on in front of him :eek:

MacAva · 03-06-2010 11:23am

I hope so Tea 1000!!! Thanks. I am very aware of those rules and never ever use the right hand lane to go straight through unless there was 2 lanes on exit.

MacAva · 03-06-2010 11:27am

Yes, I was just exiting the roundabout, still following the marked lanes, as the red car in the diagram shows, and he clipped my back door!

I had also had my indicator on so I'm confident he hadn't his eyes on the road!!

I am just worried it will go 50:50 like a lot of roundabout accidents seem to go!

Bogger77 · 03-06-2010 11:35am

I was recently involved in Similar, where guy moved from left hand lane into the right hand lane, and we collided. Very close to being a 50 50, but since he moved lanes, he was at fault according to his own insurance company.

In this case, if what you say is correct, then you could be 50 50, as you we in the process of changing lanes/crossing lane, even if other driver didn't notice.

Speak Now · 03-06-2010 11:35am

MacAva wrote: »

Yes, I was just exiting the roundabout, still following the marked lanes, as the red car in the diagram shows, and he clipped my back door!

I had also had my indicator on so I'm confident he hadn't his eyes on the road!!

I am just worried it will go 50:50 like a lot of roundabout accidents seem to go!

He must have been asleep. If they're had been any car follwing the same line as you they would have got some fright seeing the line he was taking.

Brings up another question, when were roundabouts introduced in Ireland.
Do we have a generation of older people on full licenses who never learned how to use them properly?

cc · 03-06-2010 11:37am

Came across this type of roundabout in Holland last year, seems the business, quielty forces everyone into using the correct lane, some even had raised bumps instead of white lines to further discourage lane changing while on the roundabout. Might put an end to the daily fun and games we have on ours.

6034073

Attachment not found.

CoDy1 · 03-06-2010 12:23pm

^Looks like that larger truck is after cutting up the white van!

Viper_JB · 03-06-2010 12:24pm

If you were in the process of changing lanes at the time it'd probably be classed as 50:50 tis a bit mad really but it who ever is in the lane at the time has priority over anyone changing into that lane as far as the insurance is concerned.

Voodoomelon · 03-06-2010 12:57pm

OP was in the right.

A lot of people who don't know how to use a roundabout stay in the leftmost lane regardless of the exit they are taking so they dont end up in a position whereby they cut people off when changing from right hand lanes.

Little do they know they are causing just as much hassle.

MacAva · 03-06-2010 1:23pm

If the driver was taking the route he should have been for the lane he was in, the accident wouldn't have ocurred. I could have gone right too and still it wouldn't have happened. But he should't have attempted to take any exit after the one I was taking and that's why I believe he his wrong, along with the fact that he was behind me and should have been paying attention to my signals.

corktina · 03-06-2010 1:28pm

MacAva wrote: »

Apologies, yes, he was on the 'left-hand lane' ON the roundabout to turn right! I know this is wrong, I just wanted to confirm or get some advice as to whether you can travel through a roundabout to go straight through in the right hand lane if the exit has 2 lanes (not the usual single lane roundabout where the exit merges into one lane)

id say you are right.....

corktina · 03-06-2010 1:36pm

Its quite straight forward...you were in the right lane, he was in the wrong lane...he hit you.

Where i learnt to drive it was always the rule that the left lane was for left or straight on and the right for straight on and turn right. I never can understand this weird idea that you can use the right lane to go straight on ONLY if the 2nd exit has two lanes...what do you have to be to know that if you arent local? Psychic?

Speak Now · 03-06-2010 1:49pm

corktina wrote: »

Its quite straight forward...you were in the right lane, he was in the wrong lane...he hit you.

Where i learnt to drive it was always the rule that the left lane was for left or straight on and the right for straight on and turn right. I never can understand this weird idea that you can use the right lane to go straight on ONLY if the 2nd exit has two lanes...what do you have to be to know that if you arent local? Psychic?

Road signs :pac:

MacAva · 03-06-2010 1:51pm

Yes that's true Corktina and I see your point but if it was a single lane roundabout where the exit merges into one lane the cars from both lanes would be exiting into one lane and would cause big problems therefore this is why the right lane is only used to turn right. However this is why there is confusion.

But I thought the reason you cant turn right from the left lane was to avoid what happened to me, colliding with a car in the right lane going straight on.

corktina · 03-06-2010 2:11pm

MacAva wrote: »

Yes that's true Corktina and I see your point but if it was a single lane roundabout where the exit merges into one lane the cars from both lanes would be exiting into one lane and would cause big problems therefore this is why the right lane is only used to turn right. However this is why there is confusion.

But I thought the reason you cant turn right from the left lane was to avoid what happened to me, colliding with a car in the right lane going straight on.

It doesnt cause problems in the UK where people watch their mirrors and know what they are doing. By their method, people going straight on are able to bypass left -turners. In the UK you would pass the first junction in the right hand lane and then signal left and move to the left , finally turning left.
I think the Irish drivers dont realise that an indication isnt a "please may I" , its an indication of what you intend to do and if you are behind, you make room for that driver to do it....

corktina · 03-06-2010 2:11pm

Jerry Seinfeld wrote: »

Road signs :pac:

do they ALWAYS show whether there are one or two lanes exiting? i dont think so....

MacAva · 03-06-2010 2:24pm

No I dont think so. Ive used this roundabout on a number of occasions.

I always use my mirrors and was on this occasion. I know its easy to say that now but he literally crept up from nowhere assuming I was going to head right for the last exit and didn't prepare to stop until it was too late.

djimi · 03-06-2010 2:25pm

Seems pretty clear cut to me; he was in the left hand lane and the only way he could have hit you was if he was trying to move into the right hand lane. You change lanes and hit a car in the lane youre moving into them youre in the wrong, 100% of the time. I cant see anyway that this is the OPs fault.

Either he was trying to change lanes, or was intending to proceed past the second exit while in the left hand lane; either way the other driver was in the wrong.

Speak Now · 03-06-2010 2:25pm

corktina wrote: »

do they ALWAYS show whether there are one or two lanes exiting? i dont think so....

Was only messing but in fairness if there is only one exit from two lanes entering then the ouside lane will be marked for turning right only.
Like you said...most out us aren't Physics.

MacAva · 03-06-2010 2:33pm

Im nearly 100% sure the road markings for both lanes were two yield signs.

He was travelling around the roundabout in the left lane to make an exit at the last exit on the right, i was in the right lane, and while Still in the right lane that was continuing on into the exit (not merging) I was just at the exit and he clipped my back side. He was behind me and perhaps going too fast to break in time to avoid hitting me.

Bogger77 · 03-06-2010 2:34pm

MacAva wrote: »

If the driver was taking the route he should have been for the lane he was in, the accident wouldn't have ocurred. I could have gone right too and still it wouldn't have happened. But he should't have attempted to take any exit after the one I was taking and that's why I believe he his wrong, along with the fact that he was behind me and should have been paying attention to my signals.

Signalling intention does not give right of way.

the more you write, the less 50 50 it becomes, and the more benefit of doubt goes to the other driver.

You signaled and then cut across his lane, is what I read from this.
They could have been exiting on the 2nd exit after they entered, so there's a chance that they were in the right lane. We don't know, we just have your version.

gooch2k9 · 03-06-2010 2:39pm

If you aren't local you'd stay in the left lane to go straight ahead, if you know the roundabout there is no problem using the right hand lane to go straight on.

MacAva · 03-06-2010 2:42pm

Yes but my point is if he was in the left lane, he shouldn't have been going any further than the exit I took!!! He should have been carrying on in the lane he was in and going straight on (where i was going) at the latest. No further, ie. the 3rd and last exit. He should have been in my lane. You cant be in the left lane to take the last exit.

corktina · 03-06-2010 2:50pm

Bogger77 wrote: »

Signalling intention does not give right of way.

the more you write, the less 50 50 it becomes, and the more benefit of doubt goes to the other driver.

You signaled and then cut across his lane, is what I read from this.
They could have been exiting on the 2nd exit after they entered, so there's a chance that they were in the right lane. We don't know, we just have your version.

no you have it wrong sir...he was in the rh lane and signalled and was leaving the roundabout still in the Rh lane...T'other guy was in the LH going 3/4 of the way round the r'about when he shouldnt have been. Op wasnt changiong lanes and nor was t'other guy (who shouldnt have been where he was.

Hammer Archer · 03-06-2010 2:51pm

Bogger77 wrote: »

Signalling intention does not give right of way.

the more you write, the less 50 50 it becomes, and the more benefit of doubt goes to the other driver.

You signaled and then cut across his lane, is what I read from this.
They could have been exiting on the 2nd exit after they entered, so there's a chance that they were in the right lane. We don't know, we just have your version.

I don't see how it's the OPs fault to be honest. As far as I can gather from it, the other car entered the roundabout in the left hand lane at around the same point that the OP did and then proceeded to try and turn right in the left hand lane. Had he been following the rules of the road he should have been in the right hand lane or else he would have exited at the first or second exit.

MacAva · 03-06-2010 2:57pm

Corktina has it exactly right!!!

There was no lane change. The right-hand lane continued on past the roundabout. He too should have taken my exit if he was in the left lane but he intended on carrying on the whole way around the roundabout.

Then if someone entered from the first exit and was intending to leave at the 3rd exit, you would think that I could potentially cross their path but they should be yielding to traffic on their right/traffic already on the roundabout and wouldn't have entered until i had cleared the roundabout.

TJJP · 03-06-2010 3:05pm

gooch2k9 wrote: »

Almost happened me the last day too. Two lane roundabout onto a dual carriageway. I drove in the right hand lane to go straight on as i couldn't get into left hand lane. Some amadan of a lass in the left hand lane decides she can go take the third exit turning right! Nearly went into her, but for the fact I had an idea she'd do it, i would have.

No, it almost happened to the 'amadan of a lass' who's lane you were about to cross.

If you'd crossed her lane and she hit you, you'd be the one paying out.

MacAva · 03-06-2010 3:06pm

TJJP you cannot turn right on a roundabout from the left lane. There's no question about that!!

db · 03-06-2010 3:07pm

I tend to agree with Bogger here. If you looked properly you should have seen the other vehicle and because you were in the right-hand lane you had to change lane to exit the roundabout. Is it possible that the other driver entered the roundabout from your exit one and was leaving at his second exit ? The only other way he could have been where he was without you being aware of it is if he was going very fast and hoping to overtake you on the roundabout.
The key thing for me (I could very well be wrong) is that he was on the piece of road where you collided first and that gives him right of way.

corktina · 03-06-2010 3:09pm

TJJP wrote: »

No, it almost happened to the 'amadan of a lass' who's lane you were about to cross.

If you'd crossed her lane and she hit you, you'd be the one paying out.

you dont understand roundabouts at all my friend....he didnt cross her lane, her lane turned off at the first or possibly second exit and she should have been on it!...

Bogger77 · 03-06-2010 3:09pm

corktina wrote: »

no you have it wrong sir...he was in the rh lane and signalled and was leaving the roundabout still in the Rh lane...T'other guy was in the LH going 3/4 of the way round the r'about when he shouldnt have been. Op wasnt changiong lanes and nor was t'other guy (who shouldnt have been where he was.

I disagree, to be in the right hand land, and exiting roundabout, you have to cut across the left hand lane. I've yet see a roundabout in Ireland, where two lanes are marked, with the inner lane having marked exit across the outer lane. In this case, the OP cut from one lane to the exit, across the left hand lane and doing so caused a collision with a car in that lane. Indicating does not give right of way, OP seems to suggest that either they weren't really looking, or didn't fully check blindspots.

Remember, car in left lane, had the right to continue to the second exit after it entered in the left hand lane. That's according the RSA ad's.
On roundabouts such as Dunkettle in Cork city, this can lead to issues, as it has 3 exits, not the usual 4, and so 2nd exit is the position where 3rd would be normally, when approaching from Dunkettle interchange.

Roundabout Accident

Comments