*Fantasy Fight* Steve Collins -vs- Joe Calzaghe

strobe

We haven't had a fantasy fight thread in a while and just reading through the other Collins thread I thought I'd throw this one out there. How do you all see a fight between Collins and Calzaghe, both in their prime playing out?

cowzerp

i'd see collins wearing Joe down with a late stoppage, joe has nothing that steve cant handle, even speed!!

Collins style would have been a nightmare for joe.

whaaames

I'm probably a bit biased on this one, but i think Collins would've been a lot to handle for Joe, he would've been raw strength and determination and kept coming forward for 12 rounds, but then again it wasn't in Joe's nature to do anything other than work for 12 rounds either so this would've been close, if it came down to it i reckon Steves' willingness to come foreward and fight wouldve been his undoing and Joe's workrate and pure volume would've carried him through. For me it's Joe on a split Decision

magma69

I think Calzaghe would have been too much for Collins. His work rate would help him steal rounds and I think he would nick it. Calzaghe was a match for anyone at 168 bar a prime Roy Jones Junior, who was simply phenomenal.

eagle eye

Calzaghe beats Collins over the distance. Steve will win some rounds but Joe wins it clearly.

digme

Collins would eat him for breakfast,he's too much.

maxxie

Calzaghe wins - too clever for collins

digme

Hard to be clever when you have a fist rammed down your throat.

walshb

digme wrote: »

Collins would eat him for breakfast,he's too much.

I have no issue with anyone saying Collins can win, but to be making out that
it's a cert?

Who did Steve ever eat for breakfast that was world class? Please, Pyatt excluded.

I also don't see how Collins wears down Calzaghe, Paul? Joe is big, strong, rugged and ULTRA conditioned. How Collins wears him down is a puzzle to me.

Collins wasn't a big hitter and was terribly inaccurate as well, sloppy
and not all that fast.

This fight would be horrible with Joe's sharpness, movement, speed and better accuracy winning a decision.

digme

Going to the shop to get a few Carling,I'll be back in a minute to tell you.

digme

All right Walsh,

Simply put steve wouldn't allow him to do anything,doesn't matter if he is accurate or not,he's in your face,he's a workhorse.I truly believe that no mater who was in front of him, he was going to die in the ring before he'd lose and it was that attitude which would beat Calzaghe.He's just an animal.

seadnamac

Joe wins this clearly. Too fast, too clever, too well conditioned. Will get in, fire off a combination and get out. Unaminous decision.

cowzerp

digme wrote: »

All right Walsh,

Simply put steve wouldn't allow him to do anything,doesn't matter if he is accurate or not,he's in your face,he's a workhorse.I truly believe that no matter who was in front of him, he was going to die in the ring before he'd lose and it was that attitude which would beat Calzaghe.He's just an animal.

Thats most my answer too, Calzaghe never fought anyone who put him under pressure, his speed is over rated or exaggerated and his power would not even register with Collins-Collins would have brought him into the trenches and in my opinion no 1 beats Collins in that type of fight-the way to beat collins would be with silky skills and Calzaghe did not have them.

nacho libre

Collins would take three punches to land one but in saying that he didn't have great power so would he really be capable of slowing Calzaghe down as he would need to do? I 'm not sure he would so i see Calzaghe winning handily enough on points.

megadodge

I have to agree with the Calzaghe supporters (and I've always championed Steve as being better than a lot credited him).

Collins' strengths were his workrate, chin, physical strength and belief. Unfortunately for him, Calzaghe has an even better workrate and conditioning, a very good chin and great belief so Steve's normal outworking of his opponent ain't gonna happen here. Plus Calzaghe is a lot, lot faster (hands and feet) and is a more skilful boxer.

Collins doesn't have the punch to hurt Calzage either, so I see a clear but hard fought UD for Joe.

walshb

Some here seem to think that Steve is stronger, more rugged and more physical.
I question this. Meeting Joe he will be facing a very strong man, a BIGGER man too and he could be well surprised. Collins will NOT wear down Joe Calzaghe.

He will not really hurt Joe. Calzaghe is every bit as strong and conditioned. He has enough of a chin to withstand anything Collins does land. Speed and movement win out here, and Calzaghe possesses these traits in greater amounts than Steve.

cppromotions

Collins would out work Calzache He would punch through Calzache with everything he could throw that is what wears you down on the otherhand when Calzache throws punches they are more speed than power Collins not only had a great chin but he had a great defence as well Calzache correct me if im wrong was down in his last 3 fights and to top it all off didnt he say in a recent undercover interview that he used cocaine which is a performance enhancing drug which makes him a CHEAT!.

seadnamac

cppromotions wrote: »

Collins would out work Calzache He would punch through Calzache with everything he could throw that is what wears you down on the otherhand when Calzache throws punches they are more speed than power Collins not only had a great chin but he had a great defence as well Calzache correct me if im wrong was down in his last 3 fights and to top it all off didnt he say in a recent undercover interview that he used cocaine which is a performance enhancing drug which makes him a CHEAT!.

You are wrong. And, are you serious?

cppromotions

I didnt believe it myself when i was told cause i liked to watch Calzache
but then I googled the story and found it to be true

cppromotions

I do stand corrected he was down in his last 2 fights

walshb

I am not convinced that Joe was using drugs during his career, he may well have been, as many ohers may well have been, but would Charlie be the choice drug in the sport? I am no medical expert, but I would have thought that cocaine was not a drug choice for improving performance.

cppromotions

Spent 17 years in America in some top gyms and take it from me Cocaine was the origional performance drug

walshb

cppromotions wrote: »

Spent 17 years in America in some top gyms and take it from me Cocaine was the origional performance drug

I could well believe that. A lot of folks seem to think it's all about
steroids, HGH and EPO; but that is not the only drugs that can
help an athlete. Wasn't Ray Leonard another one fond of the coke, Aaron
Pryor too? See, once these guys are found to be users, their careers come
under scruting then, and rightly so.

And the excuse: "He only started using after his career was over," doesn't cut it

cppromotions

Dont agree with performance drugs no matter what kind they use
Aside from all that whether Calzache used coke during his career or not he was a very talented fighter, Steve Collins to me was the most exciting fighter to watch no matter who he fought you knew it was going to be a war if him and Calzache fought it would have been a cracker!
I saw Steve Collins defend his USBA Title against Tony Thornton in the USA that was a different fighter he was so elousive what a different fighter he was then to the fighter he became he also recieved 46 stitches after that fight Thornton was like Hagler shaven head which in that fight became an extra weapon Collins recieved 10 stitches over his left eye 12 over his right eye and 24 on his ear he was a real mess but he still won dont know if anybody knows where that fight can be found would be great to find a link?

mrgardener

cppromotions wrote: »

Dont agree with performance drugs no matter what kind they use
Aside from all that whether Calzache used coke during his career or not he was a very talented fighter, Steve Collins to me was the most exciting fighter to watch no matter who he fought you knew it was going to be a war if him and Calzache fought it would have been a cracker!
I saw Steve Collins defend his USBA Title against Tony Thornton in the USA that was a different fighter he was so elousive what a different fighter he was then to the fighter he became he also recieved 46 stitches after that fight Thornton was like Hagler shaven head which in that fight became an extra weapon Collins recieved 10 stitches over his left eye 12 over his right eye and 24 on his ear he was a real mess but he still won dont know if anybody knows where that fight can be found would be great to find a link?

I have been looking for a link for the Thornton fight for ages but to no avail.
Regarding the fight with Calzaghe, my head would say Joe would win but saying that, Steve had a ferocious SOMETHING - heart, grit, determination, whatever, that made him nearly unstoppable.
I'd imagine that a lot of fighters were near terrified at the thought of stepping into the ring with him.

walshb

But, Joe had all that heart, grit, determination and winners mentality too. And, he was the better boxer.

mrgardener

walshb wrote: »

But, Joe had all that heart, grit, determination and winners mentality too. And, he was te better boxer.

You're right of course. I'll never be able to make a foolproof arguement for Collins. Still, even if the head says Calzaghe would win, when it comes to the crunch, I'd probably put my money on Collins. Just can't make an arguement as to why.................:o

cppromotions

at the end of tyhe day he had the balls

cowzerp

walshb wrote: »

But, Joe had all that heart, grit, determination and winners mentality too. And, he was the better boxer.

Rare would i say this but Bren thats rubbish, Steve was technically very good-his style in the eubanks fights etc was all wear and tear but he was a great counter puncher to and had great technique..

If you said Calzaghe was faster, fitter etc then maybe you have an argument he did have grit and determination in fairness but even you are a critic of his actual boxing so i dont get that. Collins in my opinion would be made for beating Calzaghe.

walshb

cowzerp wrote: »

Rare would i say this but Bren thats rubbish, Steve was technically very good-his style in the eubanks fights etc was all wear and tear but he was a great counter puncher to and had great technique..

If you said Calzaghe was faster, fitter etc then maybe you have an argument he did have grit and determination in fairness but even you are a critic of his actual boxing so i dont get that. Collins in my opinion would be made for beating Calzaghe.

Paul, I am a critic of his punching technique. Also, he can be sloppy at times, but overall, he had the better feet and balance and rhythm. I think he was a better boxer, stylist so to speak. Either way, Collins was never really a great boxer, he was slugger/fighter and THEN a boxer. Saying this, when he did it, he did it well, but as a pure boxer I would rate Collins a 6 or 7, and I'd rate Joe a 7 or 8.

paraguay99

Calzaghe takes this with something to spare.

Calzaghe style is an awful one for Collins.

bryaner

whaaames wrote: »

I'm probably a bit biased on this one, but i think Collins would've been a lot to handle for Joe, he would've been raw strength and determination and kept coming forward for 12 rounds, but then again it wasn't in Joe's nature to do anything other than work for 12 rounds either so this would've been close, if it came down to it i reckon Steves' willingness to come foreward and fight wouldve been his undoing and Joe's workrate and pure volume would've carried him through. For me it's Joe on a split Decision

+1

bryaner

cppromotions wrote: »

Collins would out work Calzache He would punch through Calzache with everything he could throw that is what wears you down on the otherhand when Calzache throws punches they are more speed than power Collins not only had a great chin but he had a great defence as well Calzache correct me if im wrong was down in his last 3 fights and to top it all off didnt he say in a recent undercover interview that he used cocaine which is a performance enhancing drug which makes him a CHEAT!.

Quiet the opposite of a performance drug , more like a gutter drug.

strobe

I'm going to have to go against the grain on this one.....

I think Collins takes it. People seem to forget that Steve could move a bit when he wanted to. If you watch some of his old fights, pre Eubank, there were times when he was slick as you like with his head and feet movement. I heard him more than once in the old days being described as an ellusive counter puncher. Now that's a big overstatement but he could do it when he had to, when he wanted to. He was also as accurate as most out there with his shots when he kept his composure and din't just throw caution to the wind and swing for the rafters.

I see it starting off cagey enough for the first three or four rounds. Joe popping off some good shots at medium range and catching Steve but Collins just about shading it in the ecxhanges of flurries. Probably two rounds each at the end of the fourth.

Then I think Joe would land with a little more consistancy and avoid as much as possible standing and trading off with Steve. I think he'd get a lot of succsess like that and probably open up a lead on the cards over the next three or four rounds, throwing lots and lots of shots and outboxing him.

Coming into the ninth I think Collins would be a couple of rounds down and I think he would be aware of that. Then when the bell went for the start of the round I think he would come out like something possesed. Landing big swinging hooks to the body, zapping Joe's energy and restricting his movement and firing hard right bolos and straights onto Joes head whenever his guard came down. Joe gets caught up in trading with him as he gets cornered or backed against the ropes and comes off the worse for it. I'd say the bell saves him from taking a count.

The tenth and Joe tries to go back to letting lose with a lot of shots and staying away from the ropes but Collins is having none of it. His tail is up and he is cutting Joe's latteral movement off with big hooks to the body and constant pressure. Most of Joe's shots are coming of Steves shoulders and gloves as he swings his upper body about lets everything go. The shots that do catch Collins flush, and there are a few of them aren't even registering. I'd say Joe puts a knee down under a flurry of punches with a minute to go in the round. Gets up after 5 or 6 but comes under continuos pressure for the rest of the round.

Into the 11th and Collins is straight out of the traps like a madman. But this time Joe is ready for it and he lands a few hard shots as Steve comes charging in and rocks Collins. Wanting to take advantage and get this crazy Irishman out of there he comes on and tries to finish it. But Collins recovers in typical fashion and comes out on top in the 2 or 3 exchanges of flurries that follow. Joe on the back foot again gets caught with a massive left hook to the body, vicious right straight to the head combo, while his balance isn't set and goes down hard.

He is up after only a few seconds, but he is still shaky and Collins knows it. He goes down on a knee again under a dozen big shots thrown by Steve, only 5 or 6 landing, but landing heavy. Joe get's up on the count of 8 with a minute to go in the round but Steve can smell blood and is right on top of him chest to chest, muscling him onto the ropes and throwing the kitchen sink at him. Joe is barely throwing shots back at this stage and is closed in a shell trying to work his way off the ropes. He tries to open up with a hard uppercut but Collins hand fiils the gap where his hand was and makes his head rattle.

Calzaghe is trying to keep his feet under him and Collins is pummeling him around the body and into his glove protected head. The ref steps in and calls it. It's all over. The crowd goes wild.....

cppromotions

If you want to look at where Steve Collins was at in his early stage of his career take Fermin Cherino he was destroyed in 6 rds by collins in 91 yet in the year that followed he took Mccallum Thornton and Roy Jones jnr the distance

mrgardener

strobe wrote: »

I'm going to have to go against the grain on this one.....

I think Collins takes it. People seem to forget that Steve could move a bit when he wanted to. If you watch some of his old fights, pre Eubank, there were times when he was slick as you like with his head and feet movement. I heard him more than once in the old days being described as an ellusive counter puncher. Now that's a big overstatement but he could do it when he had to, when he wanted to. He was also as accurate as most out there with his shots when he kept his composure and din't just throw caution to the wind and swing for the rafters.

I see it starting off cagey enough for the first three or four rounds. Joe popping off some good shots at medium range and catching Steve but Collins just about shading it in the ecxhanges of flurries. Probably two rounds each at the end of the fourth.

Then I think Joe would land with a little more consistancy and avoid as much as possible standing and trading off with Steve. I think he'd get a lot of succsess like that and probably open up a lead on the cards over the next three or four rounds, throwing lots and lots of shots and outboxing him.

Coming into the ninth I think Collins would be a couple of rounds down and I think he would be aware of that. Then when the bell went for the start of the round I think he would come out like something possesed. Landing big swinging hooks to the body, zapping Joe's energy and restricting his movement and firing hard right bolos and straights onto Joes head whenever his guard came down. Joe gets caught up in trading with him as he gets cornered or backed against the ropes and comes off the worse for it. I'd say the bell saves him from taking a count.

The tenth and Joe tries to go back to letting lose with a lot of shots and staying away from the ropes but Collins is having none of it. His tail is up and he is cutting Joe's latteral movement off with big hooks to the body and constant pressure. Most of Joe's shots are coming of Steves shoulders and gloves as he swings his upper body about lets everything go. The shots that do catch Collins flush, and there are a few of them aren't even registering. I'd say Joe puts a knee down under a flurry of punches with a minute to go in the round. Gets up after 5 or 6 but comes under continuos pressure for the rest of the round.

Into the 11th and Collins is straight out of the traps like a madman. But this time Joe is ready for it and he lands a few hard shots as Steve comes charging in and rocks Collins. Wanting to take advantage and get this crazy Irishman out of there he comes on and tries to finish it. But Collins recovers in typical fashion and comes out on top in the 2 or 3 exchanges of flurries that follow. Joe on the back foot again gets caught with a massive left hook to the body, vicious right straight to the head combo, while his balance isn't set and goes down hard.

He is up after only a few seconds, but he is still shaky and Collins knows it. He goes down on a knee again under a dozen big shots thrown by Steve, only 5 or 6 landing, but landing heavy. Joe get's up on the count of 8 with a minute to go in the round but Steve can smell blood and is right on top of him chest to chest, muscling him onto the ropes and throwing the kitchen sink at him. Joe is barely throwing shots back at this stage and is closed in a shell trying to work his way off the ropes. He tries to open up with a hard uppercut but Collins hand fiils the gap where his hand was and makes his head rattle.

Calzaghe is trying to keep his feet under him and Collins is pummeling him around the body and into his glove protected head. The ref steps in and calls it. It's all over. The crowd goes wild.....

Jaysus strobe, I'll never watch another fight again, I'll just wait for your review!:D
Now, if you can get the fight on to youtube, I'll be seriously impressed!!