exchanging barrells

andyone

ok guys... a friend has a remy 700 in .223 with the standard barrell that was shortened.... he's looking to get a medium barrell if there is such a thing instead of the varmint as weight is an issue..... the question i have is this..
If a barrell was sourced.... is it as simple as unscrewing one and then screwing in the other one.... presuming both are from remy 700 actions... and also does any one know where on can be sourced...... with all the custom work going on surly there is a multitude of unused secondhand barrells lying around....
thanks in advance
andy:cool:

johngalway

A visit to a good gunsmith would be my suggestion.

andyone

johngalway wrote: »

A visit to a good gunsmith would be my suggestion.

it would be and thank you.....but it doesn't answer my question...... do you not think that remington thread all their barrels for the 700 series the same... from a production perspective it is my believe that it would be cost effective for remington to do this.... as i can't imagine some poor guy down the back of the remy factory hand screwing barrells to actions.... and then if they don't seat right.... unthreading it and sticking it on a lathe to take of the excess and then rethreading it.....
and if every one asked their local gunsmith, there would be no need for a forum like boards...... and also.. thats one mans opinion....(and it could by biost) (spelt wrong)
and for the record i did ask one.... and wasn't happy with his answer...

Dvs

Hello Andyone,
the answer to your question is,
no it is not that simple,
It is not pipe fitting,
the rifle needs to be checked for correct headspace.

Or it either will not chamber rounds,
because the bolt won't close,
the bullet will be to far into the lands of the rifling,
or worse case senario it could result in a catastrophic detonation.


You decide if you need a competent person to do it or not.

Dvs.

andyone

Dvs wrote: »

Hello Andyone,
the answer to your question is,
no it is not that simple,
It is not pipe fitting,
the rifle needs to be checked for correct headspace.

Or it either will not chamber rounds,
because the bolt won't close,
the bullet will be to far into the lands of the rifling,
or worse case senario it could result in a catastrophic detonation.


You decide if you need a competent person to do it or not.

Dvs.

so in your opinoin remy fit all their barrells on an idvidual basis... checking for head space and how well the bullets sit on the lands????

patsat

Not sure about the different thread sizes but I wouldn't chance it!

It may screw together nice and tight but no way would I chance firing it!
Ask a different gunsmith if the first one didn't answer your question, changing a barrel should be left to them and they will be the ones who have barrels lying around.

CJhaughey

andyone wrote: »

it would be and thank you.....but it doesn't answer my question...... do you not think that remington thread all their barrels for the 700 series the same... from a production perspective it is my believe that it would be cost effective for remington to do this.... as i can't imagine some poor guy down the back of the remy factory hand screwing barrells to actions.... and then if they don't seat right.... unthreading it and sticking it on a lathe to take of the excess and then rethreading it.....
and if every one asked their local gunsmith, there would be no need for a forum like boards...... and also.. thats one mans opinion....(and it could by biost) (spelt wrong)
and for the record i did ask one.... and wasn't happy with his answer...

If you read Johns reply he said a *good gunsmith* not just a local gunsmith.

Dvs

andyone wrote: »

so in your opinoin remy fit all their barrells on an idvidual basis... checking for head space and how well the bullets sit on the lands????

They do not check specifically to see,
how far into the lands of the rifling a bullet will be.

They check using a headspace gauge that the headspacing in within safe parameters as part of a production line, but they are individually checked.

Barrels that don't pass are sent back to be reamed or rechambered,
if possible or scraped if not.

You find this hard to believe why?

As I said incorrect headspacing can result in
either the rifle will not chamber rounds,
because the bolt won't close,
the bullet will be to far into the lands of the rifling,
or worse case senario it could result in a catastrophic detonation.




As I said, you decide if you need a competent person to do the work or not,
It's your friends head that will be beside the rifle when the trigger is pressed.


If your still not happy with the above answer,
here is an alternative:
:rolleyes:

There is no need to get a look at it gunsmith they are robbing gits,
checking headspacing that's for wimps,
screw the new barrel on and go shoot that sucker!

Whats the worst that can happen?

Why would a firearms manufacturer think it necessary to check it's firearms as part of it manufacturing process,
quality control is for wimps!

:rolleyes:



Dvs.

ejg

Must be done by a good gunsmith. Tolerances change within the remmy production. Too risky to just screw out and screw in new barrel without head space check.

Other than that look at using a lighter scope / mounts, lighter stock (carbon can save up to 800 grams compared to laminate), lighter moderator..?

edi

andyone

ok guys..... as a lay man how can i check the head space...

patsat

andyone wrote: »

ok guys..... as a lay man how can i check the head space...

ur only asking for trouble get someone qualified to do it!

Dvs

andyone wrote: »

ok guys..... as a lay man how can i check the head space...

With a headspace gauge,
you can buy a headspace gauge in .223.

But the problem is will you be able to judge if it is correct or not,
Having a socket set didn't make me a car mechanic!

if you find that the headspace is incorrect.

If it's to tight,
do you have the machinery, reamers and know how to,
ream the chamber or re cut the chamber if needed?

If it's too much,
will you be able to judge if the headspacing is too much,
which will cause case head separation and blown primers.


Dvs.

andyone

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KICBv-0U87Y&feature=related


http://gunsmith.websgreatestfinds.com/556mm-223-headspace-gauge-colt-556mm-h-space-gauge-field-223


first vid has a guy getting technical.....

and the second is a site were one could buy go, nogo guages......

even good gunsmiths have to start somewhere.....:cool::cool:

CJhaughey

andyone wrote: »

first vid has a guy getting technical.....

and the second is a site were one could buy go, nogo guages......

even good gunsmiths have to start somewhere.....:cool::cool:

You are correct, everyone has to start somewhere, but realistically DIY headspace is not the place to start a long and illustrious career as a smith.
The potential for serious injury or fatality is just too high, hard to shoot with your eye blown out.
If you want to start gunsmithing start with something that isn't quite as critical as headspace measurement.
Or you or your friend may end up collecting a Darwin award.

andyone

ok gentlemen, you have helped me to make up my mind.... i won't be buying go/nogo gauges........ but do feel free to continue talking about the subject.. my only regret is that after handing the rifle over to some one more qualifeid,who has the tools.... i won't be able to sit in on the operation....:(:( as i would really like to be educated..... and i think we'll all agree youtube is not the place for and education....

cbrjohnthou

Whats the story, has that Tackleberry fella died or what? This is definitely his thing:D:D:D:D LOL.

andyone

shank1 wrote: »

Whats the story, has that Tackleberry fella died or what? This is definitely his thing:D:D:D:D LOL.

ha ha i thought so too....;)

Tackleberrywho

andyone wrote: »

ha ha i thought so too....;)

Good to hear people were interested where I was,n Just after a 200mile round trip!

long day;)

Tackleberrywho

andyone wrote: »

ok guys... a friend has a remy 700 in .223 with the standard barrell that was shortened.... he's looking to get a medium barrell if there is such a thing instead of the varmint as weight is an issue..... the question i have is this..
If a barrell was sourced.... is it as simple as unscrewing one and then screwing in the other one.... presuming both are from remy 700 actions... and also does any one know where on can be sourced...... with all the custom work going on surly there is a multitude of unused secondhand barrells lying around....
thanks in advance
andy:cool:

A small bit of retro fitting, nothing major Between 60-100 depending on difficulty. A lot of factory actions have low tolerances in the fitting to aid in automated assembly.

Nothing a good man and a good mill/lathe can't cure:D

Tackleberrywho

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

A small bit of retro fitting, nothing major Between 60-100 depending on difficulty. A lot of factory actions have low tolerances in the fitting to aid in automated assembly.

Nothing a good man and a good mill/lathe can't cure:D

If you need anymore info just PM me.
it's the same Technology required to rebarrel a rifle with a custom barrel.

I'll have a few pics of the process shortly.

Anyone god a good camera with a decent lens. I prefer Nkon DSLR but canon or Sony will do:D

Johnny_Coyle

In general, I think it is a terrible idea to go changing barrels.

"Can" it be done, of course. "Should" it be done, no.

We're not talking about a particularly expensive rifle. How much money will you save by doing this and not buying another rifle? Keep in mind that Remington will now avoid your rifle like the plague - forget warranties et al.

You are correct that another barrel could be put on, however, this is not a trivial thing.

Although barrels are not as extreme as stretch bolts, there is a certain amount of stretching and seating that goes on between the barrel and the receiver. I prefer to keep it this way.

It is indeed a job that a competent gunsmith could do. However, think of the pressures that are involved and realize that it will be your face pressed up against the stock for the next few decades.

I would contact Remington to see what they would charge to do the job. However, I suspect they would not do it at all.

Spannerman7

Are they not a complete barsteward to remove, I read somewhere the twisting action from many firings binds them together extreemly tight.
I threaded my swift and remember trying to remove the barrel to mount it in the lathe but stopped as I thought if I went any harder I'd damage something, so I made a jig and mounted the rifle with the stock removed. Turned out perfectly (excuse the pun), I have a machine shop but would not risk it on anyone elses as I'm not a gunsmith. All I remember is the barrel is not comming off easily. Did you do this yourself Tack ? I'd love to read your progress. I often thought about upgrading the barrel on my ruger.

andyone

although my original post sounded like "metalwork in the local asylum" to most of ya's.... it still has ye talking on the subject.....Im all ears....

Tackleberrywho

andyone wrote: »

although my original post sounded like "metalwork in the local asylum" to most of ya's.... it still has ye talking on the subject.....Im all ears....

If you go to Fergal White he stands over his work. The Remington warranty is not the issue, you will now have an Ireland Custom Rifle warranty

Fergal white is a gunsmith/Custom Rifle builder that changes barrels for a living. His last Rifle broke the Irish 1000yard F=Class record withe a 7/270 WSM on a RPA Quadlock action

He is not a gunsmith with a hammer and half an idea, he is a highly qualified and trained Engineer.
Fergal will leave your mates rifle Better than when it came from the factory and can do a multitude of after-market conversions

Now I will get flack for advertising him but I can assure you I have nothing to gain from this.
I just hate to see a person be told something can not be made in Ireland as the consensus is we are not good enough...........

tomcat220t

Any idea what calibre was the record set with ,tack?

tomcat220t

andyone wrote: »

although my original post sounded like "metalwork in the local asylum" to most of ya's.... it still has ye talking on the subject.....Im all ears....

Give John Greene a call 086-3554425.;)Although theres only so much an accurate rifle will do for Elmer J Fudd:D.More gun shy rabbits for the winter season:eek:

SD308

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

His last Rifle broke the Irish 1000yard F=Class record which was on a remington 700 action.;)

For the sake of accurate info, I have to correct you on this.
If the shoot you are referring to was held as part of the NRAI 2010 Nationals on 02/05/10 then it was in fact not a 1000yrd Fclass shoot. It was a 1000yrd five shot group Benchrest shoot. The group measured 6.37" and won the competition that day, as to whether it is an Irish record, I’m not sure. It very well may be as I'm not aware of any other 1000yrd five shot group Benchrest shoots having taken place in Ireland.

Regardless it was a great achievement by the man who shot it.

Stephen.

Tackleberrywho

tomcat220t wrote: »

Any idea what calibre was the record set with ,tack?

The Irish record was broken with a 7/270 WSM.

It's a newish calibre to the Irish shooting scene, but I have seen 3 of them made over the past few months.

It was not the remington that was a 6mm BR which is owned by the same individual. The Remington 700 6mm is a tack driver also but not the record holder.

Tackleberrywho

SD308 wrote: »

For the sake of accurate info, I have to correct you on this.
If the shoot you are referring to was held as part of the NRAI 2010 Nationals on 02/05/10 then it was in fact not a 1000yrd Fclass shoot. It was a 1000yrd five shot group Benchrest shoot. The group measured 6.37" and won the competition that day, as to whether it is an Irish record, I’m not sure. It very well may be as I'm not aware of any other 1000yrd five shot group Benchrest shoots having taken place in Ireland.

Regardless it was a great achievement by the man who shot it.

Stephen.

I apologise as i am not a target competitor so classes I had given the incorrect one.
Point that is beyond reproach the man was using an Irelandcustomrifle Build in 7mm/270 WSM

tomcat220t

Is that a wsm .270 case necked up to 7 mm?.What make of barrel was it built with?

Tackleberrywho

tomcat220t wrote: »

Is that a wsm .270 case necked up to 7 mm?.What make of barrel was it built with?

You would have to ask Figgy that, I think it was Kreiger but not sure.

I'm off to zero post my glass rebed today myself, I'm still awaiting this 20+ Degrees!

Here is his contact details,
Fergal White
090 64 73803
086 326 0735

www.irelandcustomrifle.com
http://www.shooting-hunting.com/results.html?Keywords=Custom+Rifles

I have noticed that John Greens details are posted so i think it is only fair that Figgy's are too as then folks can make up their own mind on where they want to go.

Just that any myth can be dispelled that there is not Custom Rifle builders in Ireland.
There is No Need to go to England Guys!
Green is in Kilkenny AFAIK.
Fergal is in Athlone.

andyone

tomcat220t wrote: »

Give John Greene a call 086-3554425.;)Although theres only so much an accurate rifle will do for Elmer J Fudd:D.More gun shy rabbits for the winter season:eek:

elmer is sitting beside me and not impressed....:mad::mad::mad:
or is it just more rabbits for your one field gun.......

tomcat220t

andyone wrote: »

elmer is sitting beside me and not impressed....:mad::mad::mad:

:D:D:D:D:DWhere else would he be,today :PGive his little baldy head a rub for me;).Hes the one stuck with a .223 carbine not me:o.

andyone

TOMCAT220tWHO???;)

pat58

FIREARMS ACT 1925:

Restrictions on the manufacture and sale of firearms

10. (1) On and after the commencement of this Act it shall not be lawful
for any person to manufacture, sell, repair, test, or prove, or expose for
sale, or have in his possession for sale, repair, test, or proof, by way of
trade or business, any firearm or ammunition unless such person is
registered in the register of firearms dealers.

Either the OP is a registered firearms dealer or the suggestion of a barrel being changed or tampered with in any way is illegal under the firearms act

tomcat220t

andyone wrote: »

TOMCAT220tWHO???;)

He looking too much into this ,guy!:DCrimes against an A4 sheet at the sand box ,shall be pardoned.:p

CJhaughey

pat58 wrote: »

Either the OP is a registered firearms dealer or the suggestion of a barrel being changed or tampered with in any way is illegal under the firearms act

I think you are picking that up wrong Pat.
The key words would seem to be *by way of
trade or business* OP isn't asking about it as a commercial venture, but for a friend.

pat58

FIREARMS ACT 1925:

Restrictions on the manufacture and sale of firearms

10. (1) On and after the commencement of this Act it shall not be lawful
for any person to manufacture, sell, repair, test, or prove, or expose for
sale, or have in his possession for sale, repair, test, or proof, by way of
trade or business, any firearm or ammunition unless such person is
registered in the register of firearms dealers.

Firearms act is a grey area at best but would soon become very black and white legally if the OP were to tamper in any way with his friends rifle that could potentially cause serious injury or death.

It wasn't me!

pat58 wrote: »

Firearms act is a grey area at best but would soon become very black and white legally if the OP were to tamper in any way with his friends rifle that could potentially cause serious injury or death.

You're still missing the point that it's "any person ... by way of trade or business".

Tackleberrywho

It wasn't me! wrote: »

You're still missing the point that it's "any person ... by way of trade or business".

Irelandcustomrifle.com is owned by a RFD as his trade or Business. Fully approved by DOJ.

I should have made that clear from my original post!
Every rifle comes with a guarantee as does every service under the sale of goods and supply of services act 1980.

So if OP needs work done bring it to the relevant Custom rifle builder. End of story.

pat58

andyone wrote: »

ok guys... a friend has a remy 700 in .223 with the standard barrell that was shortened.... he's looking to get a medium barrell if there is such a thing instead of the varmint as weight is an issue..... the question i have is this..
If a barrell was sourced.... is it as simple as unscrewing one and then screwing in the other one.... presuming both are from remy 700 actions... and also does any one know where on can be sourced...... with all the custom work going on surly there is a multitude of unused secondhand barrells lying around....
thanks in advance
andy:cool:

If you dont mind me asking whats wrong with the remington barrell on it at the moment, is it shot out??

pat58

andyone wrote: »

ok guys... a friend has a remy 700 in .223 with the standard barrell that was shortened.... he's looking to get a medium barrell if there is such a thing instead of the varmint as weight is an issue..... the question i have is this..
If a barrell was sourced.... is it as simple as unscrewing one and then screwing in the other one.... presuming both are from remy 700 actions... and also does any one know where on can be sourced...... with all the custom work going on surly there is a multitude of unused secondhand barrells lying around....
thanks in advance
andy:cool:

If you dont mind me asking whats wrong with the remington barrell on it at the moment, is it shot out??

deerhunter1

andyone wrote: »

so in your opinoin remy fit all their barrells on an idvidual basis... checking for head space and how well the bullets sit on the lands????

contact remington through their website they will let you know for sure

Tackleberrywho

pat58 wrote: »

Firearms act is a grey area at best but would soon become very black and white legally if the OP were to tamper in any way with his friends rifle that could potentially cause serious injury or death.

That is why he does not tamper with anothers firearm, But his friend goes to a RFD/Custom rifle builder and gets the work done.

In fact replacement actions can also be purchased in the same calibre if one wanted to use one for a complete new build. Every part of a remington can be replaced. That is why people like them, interchangeability

andyone

pat58 wrote: »

If you dont mind me asking whats wrong with the remington barrell on it at the moment, is it shot out??

... we used to fox alot.... and he got his barrell shortened for the task.... its shoots well out to 200yds...but after that the bullets take a notion of there own....he got it taken back to 18".. twas very handy for getting over gates and through ditches.... these days though he wants to drive the bullets out further..(for paper) and feels the old barrell isn't up to the task...
one thing for sure is it is not shot out......

pat58

andyone wrote: »

... we used to fox alot.... and he got his barrell shortened for the task.... its shoots well out to 200yds...but after that the bullets take a notion of there own....he got it taken back to 18".. twas very handy for getting over gates and through ditches.... these days though he wants to drive the bullets out further..(for paper) and feels the old barrell isn't up to the task...
one thing for sure is it is not shot out......

Has he tried re-crowning or bedding it? Its unusual to hear of a rifle shooting well out to 200yards but no further.

What size groups is he getting at 200 yards and when you say out further im guessing your talking aout 300+yards, how do you mean that the bullet takes a notion of its own?

Tackleberrywho

andyone wrote: »

... we used to fox alot.... and he got his barrell shortened for the task.... its shoots well out to 200yds...but after that the bullets take a notion of there own....he got it taken back to 18".. twas very handy for getting over gates and through ditches.... these days though he wants to drive the bullets out further..(for paper) and feels the old barrell isn't up to the task...
one thing for sure is it is not shot out......

I he gets a new barrel he can get up to a 28 inch barrel in a variety of twists to suit what ever round is his favorite, i'm getting a 1/10 to shoot 55-68 grain rounds.

If he decided to go with a match barrel he would make a tack driver!

andyone

pat they are all valid points... he has a choate stock that he uses from time to time... and the action is rock solid on it...... there is no need to bed that stock... its a solid shooting platform...
as far as i know he's putting it down to powder burn, i could be wrong....because the barrell is shorter... he reckons that he's not getting the full whack out of the powder..... and i've also heard that with a short barrell the barrel hasn't enough rifiling to properly stablise the bullet.... these are all his opinions.....
i also belive that he likes the look of a heavier barrell, as opposed to the light version that is on it at the mo..(and i know i already mentioned weight(who am i ))......
IMO its a good set up as is....... but two things... 1. its not mine... and 2. each to his own...

Tackleberrywho

andyone wrote: »

pat they are all valid points... he has a choate stock that he uses from time to time... and the action is rock solid on it...... there is no need to bed that stock... its a solid shooting platform...
as far as i know he's putting it down to powder burn, i could be wrong....because the barrell is shorter... he reckons that he's not getting the full whack out of the powder..... and i've also heard that with a short barrell the barrel hasn't enough rifiling to properly stablise the bullet.... these are all his opinions.....
i also belive that he likes the look of a heavier barrell, as opposed to the light version that is on it at the mo..(and i know i already mentioned weight(who am i ))......
IMO its a good set up as is....... but two things... 1. its not mine... and 2. each to his own...

http://www.truefliteriflebarrels.co.nz/13544/5112.html
up to 30" available!;)

tomcat220t

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

http://www.truefliteriflebarrels.co.nz/13544/5112.html
up to 30" available!;)

Id say ,he looking for around 22" in barrel length .30" barrel in .223 :eek:.Hard to get a field big enough to turn the thing in:p

Tackleberrywho

tomcat220t wrote: »

Id say ,he looking for around 22" in barrel length .30" barrel in .223 :eek:.Hard to get a field big enough to turn the thing in:p

I am referring that the OP said his mate wanted to go on paper.

But yes 30" is very long!