Overweight Ireland

d-gal

Instead of posting this in a general area such as AH I said I would post it here and perhaps the gents club as well and get some opinions from people.

Ireland is getting worse and worse for obesity and over 50% of the population is overweight. We are doing zero about it as Ireland is now one of the top contenders in the world for obese kids to be seen. What is worse only 1 in 4 parents realise that their kids are overweight/obese. It is the same with ourselves as majority of females feel that a size 16 is acceptable (99% of the time it is not) and they feel life is too short to worry. Sounds a bit Gerry Ryan-esque as he simply has left his family without a father due to his lifestyle - **** food that he called good, an alcoholic and a double chin that screamed warnings. It's harsh but it is a reality.

Being overweight is severely related to so many different diseases and health issues that I will not even start to go into and everyone knows too well about already. It costs our health system millions every year due to people being to lazy to do anything about it. Sure you have your own rights to do what you want but when it effects so many others then its ridiculous and unacceptable.

Now the point I am getting at is what can you do as an individual to help? Can you look at yourself and say you are setting a good example to everyone around you? Setting a good example to your children/nephews/nieces?
A great example is g'em who has tried to help so many on boards to choose a better lifestyle, she is a great inspiration to all, even to so many males and of course females
I know this post might seem harsh and it might create a bit of drama but I am practically sick to bone of seeing our country turn into this fat slob of a nation. It's disgusting and it's nothing worse than seeing a five year old with a pot belly thinking it's alright coz every adult has one. It is harassment towards the kid.

What can we do about it?

PS On a sidenote I am a personal trainer who works tiredlessly with people of all ages trying to educate them on how important it is to be healthy and in shape. It's a huge passion of mine and all I want is improvement in this country towards the most important thing in life; health.

miss5

I think Ireland has a major obesity problem, Until recently people
were not educated about the risks, Being obese can take years off your
life and cause a huge amount of long term health problems. I think there
are many contributing factors, children adapt to the lifestyles of their parents
and bad eating habits continue. Look in any town in Ireland, The amount of take
aways compared to the number of health stores. Healthy food and gyms are
readily available and I guess it's a choice. I believe obesity is getting worse
every year in Ireland according to statistics from the last decade, It's a very worrying
trend.

Dudess

Was it definitely Gerry Ryan's excess weight that ended his life? I thought he'd actually lost weight prior to his death. His double chin definitely struck me as smaller than before.

On the one hand I am of the "It's none of my business what others eat" school of thought - I really don't get why it's such a cause for annoyance. On the other hand though, the above I suppose only applies when it's adults we're talking about - I have to say I do feel terribly for young kids who are really overweight.

Has anyone heard that atrocious ad featuring the two mothers chatting and one says she's started feeding her kids healthier food? She has a really strong (lame, put on) Dublin accent, indicating that she is not from a middle-class area, because middle-class parents of course only provide the best in quality food for their children...

d-gal

Dudess wrote: »

Was it definitely Gerry Ryan's excess weight that ended his life? I thought he'd actually lost weight prior to his death. His double chin definitely struck me as smaller than before.

He basically was a yo-yo for dieting, tried a week and failed the next. It was a def major factor towards his death. Proven science with a lifestyle like that you are destined for a shorter life. Was only a small example and hope it does not play too much of a part in this thread.

Have not seen the ad, knowing our health system there has to be something wrong with it, they do the most basic things wrong

ztoical

d-gal wrote: »

It costs our health system millions every year due to people being to lazy to do anything about it. Sure you have your own rights to do what you want but when it effects so many others then its ridiculous and unacceptable.

For someone who works as a trainer I would expect some better understanding of the reasons why people become overweight rather then just resorting to the lazy card. Not all reasons are connected to people just being lazy and not giving a toss or thinking it's acceptable. In alot cases primary schools are just to understaffed to be able to bring kids out for PE regular enough. Parents are so afraid of evil strangers they drive their kids everywhere and don't let them outside to play anymore. I visited my friends housing estate recently and saw kids out playing on the grass and it actually hit me I couldn't remember the last time I saw kids out playing like that which is frankly really sad and ties in not just with physical health issues but also mental health.

Should it be ok for people to be overweight? Frankly it's not black and white. Making a 16 year old girl feel like crap for being a size 18 isn't going to help her lose weight. There's rubbish attitude that thin = happy and it doesn't. Make someone feel positive about themselves and they'll be more out going and you'll find weight drops off without thinking about it. I went to school with a girl whose parents who told her all the time she was fat and sent her to weight watchers when she was 13, her reaction to this was to eat everything around her in school just to spite them. People become so focused on weight just look at the thread on this forum with people saying they won't go swimming cus they're worried what people will think of them in their swim suit. It's attitudes like the above were overweight people are described as disgusting that stops them going outside.

Yes some people are fat because they eat too much and don't move but you'll find they aren't the majority of overweight people. Alot of people who are overweight are because they're working two jobs trying to make ends meet don't have time to cook and are keeping weight on due to stress. Getting all in your face with these people isn't going to solve the issue and is more likely to lead to depression. I'm sorry for the rant but I really hate this bloody tough love fat people are all just lazy and just need a quick kick in the ass to sort the issue. It's so much bigger then that, families not eating together anymore, divorced parents over feeding kids out of guilt for not being there 24/7. The attitude of some fitness people doesn't help either, someone makes a bit of effort, might not be much but it's something and they are mocked for not doing enough, for being 'lazy' and 'disgusting'.

d-gal

ztoical wrote: »

For someone who works as a trainer I would expect some better understanding of the reasons why people become overweight rather then just resorting to the lazy card.

Yes some people are fat because they eat too much and don't move but you'll find they aren't the majority of overweight people. Alot of people who are overweight are because they're working two jobs trying to make ends meet don't have time to cook and are keeping weight on due to stress. Getting all in your face with these people isn't going to solve the issue and is more likely to lead to depression. I'm sorry for the rant but I really hate this bloody tough love fat people are all just lazy and just need a quick kick in the ass to sort the issue. It's so much bigger then that, families not eating together anymore, divorced parents over feeding kids out of guilt for not being there 24/7. The attitude of some fitness people doesn't help either, someone makes a bit of effort, might not be much but it's something and they are mocked for not doing enough, for being 'lazy' and 'disgusting'.

Exactly the type of response I was hoping to get to discuss.
Your point on people eating too much is not the majority reason for overweight people is quite frankly a joke. The main reason for being overweight is simply over-eating and eating the wrong foods, really simple science.
Majority of people do not work two jobs, most people in Ireland barely have a job at the moment.
A lot of people actually lose weight when stressed..its fairly 50/50
Depression?! If you get anyway fit you are less likely to be depressed, you have naturally more energy. I work with enough psychologists/psychiatrists, one of my strongest areas actually.
Time to cook? you must not be serious. I run my own studio, my average day is 6.30am until 7.30pm, where the hell do I get time to cook? I eat 7 times a day as well!
It's really simple, Ireland is a lazy nation, im sorry to be frank but it is. It's not difficult to walk more, be more active or refuse cappucinos and fast food everyday.
There is exceptions of people being overweight, medical reasons etc. but this is quite frankly the minority and def not the majority

ztoical

d-gal wrote: »

Exactly the type of response I was hoping to get to discuss.
Your point on people eating too much is not the majority reason for overweight people is quite frankly a joke. The main reason for being overweight is simply over-eating and eating the wrong foods, really simple science.
Majority of people do not work two jobs, most people in Ireland barely have a job at the moment.
A lot of people actually lose weight when stressed..its fairly 50/50
Depression?! If you get anyway fit you are less likely to be depressed, you have naturally more energy. I work with enough psychologists/psychiatrists, one of my strongest areas actually.
Time to cook? you must not be serious. I run my own studio, my average day is 6.30am until 7.30pm, where the hell do I get time to cook? I eat 7 times a day as well!
It's really simple, Ireland is a lazy nation, im sorry to be frank but it is. It's not difficult to walk more, be more active or refuse cappucinos and fast food everyday.
There is exceptions of people being overweight, medical reasons etc. but this is quite frankly the minority and def not the majority

Well you seem to have all the answers so I'm not bothering to continue with you this only to say that it's that type of attitude that puts alot of people off gyms and fitness centers. There's little no understanding offered it's all just "your full of excuses" and "just lazy" I don't eat fast food, I'm a strict veggie, don't drink, smoke or do drugs, I swim several times a week and do yoga but I also work 14+ hours a day 7 days a week and only sleep 3 hours a day if I'm lucky so I'm overweight... I'm most certainly am not lazy but am well aware that I've some lifestyle choices that aren't the best but I've made my choice to focus on my work and frankly I couldn't give a toss if you find me disgusting, I work hard and pay for private health insurance so won't be costing you a penny for any future health care I may need.

d-gal

ztoical wrote: »

Well you seem to have all the answers so I'm not bothering to continue with you this only to say that it's that type of attitude that puts alot of people off gyms and fitness centers. There's little no understanding offered it's all just "your full of excuses" and "just lazy" I don't eat fast food, I'm a strict veggie, don't drink, smoke or do drugs, I swim several times a week and do yoga but I also work 14+ hours a day 7 days a week and only sleep 3 hours a day if I'm lucky so I'm overweight... I'm most certainly am not lazy but am well aware that I've some lifestyle choices that aren't the best but I've made my choice to focus on my work and frankly I couldn't give a toss if you find me disgusting, I work hard and pay for private health insurance so won't be costing you a penny for any future health care I may need.

Really hit a bad chord with you but I don't find people disgusting. I find it disgusting that people have kids that are overweight coz kids have little choice in the matter.
You sound like the exception if your lifestyle is like that and again the minority so I don't want you to feel verbally attacked coz it is not aimed at people like you that make an attempt, it is more so aimed at people who do not care whatsoever

AARRRGH

I'm renting in CityWest (beside Tallaght) at the moment. It's ****ed. Yesterday in the local Dunnes Stores I was surrounded by "American sized" obese women. The food in their trolleys was 100% junk.

Whenever I go back to Blackrock (nice part of Dublin, where I grew up) I don't see any of these supersized people.

So it seems to be something which is affecting the improverished (= uneducated?) more than anyone else.

I personally am not going to do anything to help these people (they probably don't want to be helped anyway), but the Government should start targeting these poor areas to see if they can help educate people to start taking better care of themselves. It'll save Ireland a lot of money (healthcare) in the long run.

d'Oracle

It never ceases to amaze me, how many countries are the worst in the world for Childhood obesity.

And how many countries claim to have over 50% obesity.

AARRRGH

ztoical wrote: »

Yes some people are fat because they eat too much and don't move but you'll find they aren't the majority of overweight people. Alot of people who are overweight are because they're working two jobs trying to make ends meet don't have time to cook and are keeping weight on due to stress.

Are you talking about a little bit overweight or obese?

I can understand people being a little bit overweight, but there's no excuse for obesity.

d'Oracle

Also, I see kids out playing all the time.
I think its all basically sensationalism.

AARRRGH

ztoical wrote: »

I don't eat fast food, I'm a strict veggie, don't drink, smoke or do drugs, I swim several times a week and do yoga but I also work 14+ hours a day 7 days a week and only sleep 3 hours a day if I'm lucky so I'm overweight...

I think you're a bit of an exception... most overweight cases are due to bad diet and lack of exercise.

I don't really buy the "no time for healthy eating" excuse though. I eat super healthily. Most of meals take about 5 minutes to make. The longest one takes 25 minutes, and that one gives me food for a few days.

Honestly with a few small tweaks you could sort out your bad diet.

d-gal

AARRRGH wrote: »

I think you're a bit of an exception... most overweight cases are due to bad diet and lack of exercise.

I don't really buy the "no time for healthy eating" excuse though. I eat super healthily. Most of meals take about 5 minutes to make. The longest one takes 25 minutes, and that one gives me food for a few days.

Honestly with a few small tweaks you could sort out your bad diet.

I would guess being a veggie that she/he would consume a high number of carbs as there are limited protein foods available. And if you consume a high amount of carbs and don't burn them for energy then they will be stored in the body as fat.. But as you said a few small tweaks and it would be fine

d-gal

Just to let you know this thread was meant for the Ladies Lounge as I wanted to get an average viewpoint from people but it was moved as it was inappropriate and not put in a sensitive enough fashion and it would not be taken too well

xgtdec

AARRRGH wrote: »

I'm renting in CityWest (beside Tallaght) at the moment. It's ****ed. Yesterday in the local Dunnes Stores I was surrounded by "American sized" obese women. The food in their trolleys was 100% junk.

Whenever I go back to Blackrock (nice part of Dublin, where I grew up) I don't see any of these supersized people.

So it seems to be something which is affecting the improverished (= uneducated?) more than anyone else.

Go rent in Blackrock then:p

GSOIRL

Hi

I might go a little all over the place with this post but I'd like to add a few points.

1. Firstly I think the man/women who only gets 3 hours sleep should go to bed and stop reading and posting on boards. :D I'm only messing.

2. I think education is the key. I work in several schools and some of the things I've seen greatly worry me.

- There is very little or no education on healthy lifestyle and particularly very very little on healthy eating. I have looked through the books that they use for a class which I think is called CSPE. There are 3 books, one for each year from 1st year to 3rd year and the combined pages in these books that discuss nutrition is 5 or 6. It basically just shows them the food pyramid (I won’t go into my hatred of this here)
- All children should be taught how to read and understand food labels and the tricks that food companies use to disguise how bad their foods are.
- All children should be taught to cook.
- P.E. in Ireland is a complete joke in most schools. The average class in a school consists of the teacher throwing the pupils a ball and the ones who want to play football play while the others just stand around talking and playing on their phones.
- Most schools have one double class of P.E. per week for pupils. If you put in the time it takes to get changed before and after class most pupils get around 55mins a week.
- After school activities have been crucified by teacher pay cuts and school cover cutbacks.
- School canteens mainly serve crap fast food. Including chips with everything. Some newer schools (Milford in Donegal is very good) are getting better.
- School tuck shops sell mainly fizzy drinks and sweets.
- A child eating healthy improves more than just weight. It helps with behaviour, concentration and energy


3. I’ve recently been looking into getting health insurance. It annoys me that all I’m asked is sex and age. Surely I should be able to pay less than someone who smokes, drinks, is obese etc….

4. This one may sound stupid but it’s valid. Airline baggage should be more for people like me. I have a fairly low bodyfat % and so feel the cold more than most hence I need more clothes to keep warm. The reason airlines claim they charge is becuase it costs more because of the extra weight. Well I’m no maths expert but if I weigh 80kg and my bag weighs 25kg. My total weight on the plane is 105kg. Now lets say a fella is getting on the plane who weighs 130kg and his bag weighs 15kg why doesn’t he have to pay excess baggage when he weight on the plane is 145kg.

Sorry about the last one but it pissed me off when an airline tried to change me extra.:mad:

_JOE_

AARRRGH wrote: »

I'm renting in CityWest (beside Tallaght) at the moment. It's ****ed. Yesterday in the local Dunnes Stores I was surrounded by "American sized" obese women. The food in their trolleys was 100% junk.

Whenever I go back to Blackrock (nice part of Dublin, where I grew up) I don't see any of these supersized people.

So it seems to be something which is affecting the improverished (= uneducated?) more than anyone else.

I personally am not going to do anything to help these people (they probably don't want to be helped anyway), but the Government should start targeting these poor areas to see if they can help educate people to start taking better care of themselves. It'll save Ireland a lot of money (healthcare) in the long run.

Great stereotyping there mate.
Firstly, in coming to your conclusion, did you consider the population of Tallaght to be more than 110,000? Further, it has more gyms in one location than any other area in the country, hence my bewilderness at your comment re uneducated and impoverished.
Finally, i was under the impression that Citywest was a private suburb?

AARRRGH

_JOE_ wrote: »

Great stereotyping there mate.
Firstly, in coming to your conclusion, did you consider the population of Tallaght to be more than 110,000? Further, it has more gyms in one location than any other area in the country, hence my bewilderness at your comment re uneducated and impoverished.
Finally, i was under the impression that Citywest was a private suburb?

I'm not stereotyping, I'm saying exactly what I am seeing. If you spend any time in the CityWest/Tallaght area you will know it is a poor area with a lot of social problems.

Whenever I am shopping in Dunnes I have a look in everyone's trolleys to see what they are buying. Nearly every trolley is full of junk food and alcohol. If you don't believe me come out here and have a look for yourself. It is disturbing.

I don't really believe you have never heard of the link between poverty and a lack of education, and poverty and obesity.

helimachoptor

AARRRGH wrote: »

I'm renting in CityWest (beside Tallaght) at the moment. It's ****ed. Yesterday in the local Dunnes Stores I was surrounded by "American sized" obese women. The food in their trolleys was 100% junk.

Whenever I go back to Blackrock (nice part of Dublin, where I grew up) I don't see any of these supersized people.

So it seems to be something which is affecting the improverished (= uneducated?) more than anyone else.

I personally am not going to do anything to help these people (they probably don't want to be helped anyway), but the Government should start targeting these poor areas to see if they can help educate people to start taking better care of themselves. It'll save Ireland a lot of money (healthcare) in the long run.

Agreed, Tallaght/Citywest thare reams of fat people, just go into KFC anytime of the day and you'll see skangers in there buying their kids dinner

When i was growing up, I was allowed i treat a week, I went to Mcdonalds twice a year and I walked/cycled/played football all day long, kids these days sit on the xbox!

Handsome Bob

Dudess wrote: »

Has anyone heard that atrocious ad featuring the two mothers chatting and one says she's started feeding her kids healthier food? She has a really strong (lame, put on) Dublin accent, indicating that she is not from a middle-class area, because middle-class parents of course only provide the best in quality food for their children...

What's new? Like the guy in that mortgage ad who didn't know what a tracker mortgage is, he had a northside accent. Or how about the constant radio ads where the uninformed guy has the north side accent and the person that informs him has a middle-class/posh accent. It's nothing new to be honest. Anyway, same thread in TGC, here's my response:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=65937882&postcount=9

Sangre

_JOE_ wrote: »

Great stereotyping there mate.
Firstly, in coming to your conclusion, did you consider the population of Tallaght to be more than 110,000? Further, it has more gyms in one location than any other area in the country, hence my bewilderness at your comment re uneducated and impoverished.
Finally, i was under the impression that Citywest was a private suburb?

It quite well documented in America that obsesity is more likely to affect those with lower incomes. Whether Tallaght is "low income" is another matter altogether.

unreggd

Sangre wrote: »

It quite well documented in America that obsesity is more likely to affect those with lower incomes. Whether Tallaght is "low income" is another matter altogether.

Bullfeces!

Tallaght is home to Tesco, that opens til midnight every night, and always has plenty of cheap meat and veg

So no excuses!

IMO, its pure lack of education

Fitness and Nutrition should be a staple class in secondary schools all through to 6th year

d'Oracle

helimachoptor wrote: »

Agreed, Tallaght/Citywest thare reams of fat people, just go into KFC anytime of the day and you'll see skangers in there buying their kids dinner

When i was growing up, I was allowed i treat a week, I went to Mcdonalds twice a year and I walked/cycled/played football all day long, kids these days sit on the xbox!

Heaving generalisations abound there.
There are loads of kids who lead active lifestyles, play tonnes of sports etc.

And some kids have playstations.

Owen

I blame sweet counters. We have enormous sweet counters at the entrance to our shops, which are nearly 10 metres long in some shops. Full of all sorts of rubbish, crisps, jellies, chocolate, snacks. Then we have sweet counters at each individual till. We're indoctrinated from a young age that sweets are something you buy when in the shop, and it all goes pear shaped from there.

In most european cities, there are sweet areas of a shop, but they're usually confined, and with a relatively limited selection.

Jimmy Bottlehead

This touches on something I've had on my mind lately. After three years of gym work, and reading a decent bit on fitness, nutrition, I know the basics and I look in good shape. I've had so many of my friends come to me and ask for advice, or I offer to help them get in shape, which they happily agree to.

However, out of the roughly 15-18 people, only 2 have stuck with it. TWO!! The fact is, Irish people are lazy gits who would prefer to look like crap than do something about it. It shows - Irish guys tend to have beer bellies, and the girls are usually in horrid shape too. It's a given that as soon as I (and a lot of people I know, including the girlfriend) see a hot girl, it's assumed she's foreign, most likely Polish. Call that racist if you will, but as an Irish guy, it's coming from a fair place.

So to answer your original post D-Gal, you can't help those who don't want to be helped. Look at it like this; the more out-of-shape, fat people there are out there, the better we look. Harsh? Yes. True? Yes.

I've all the respect in the world for someone who was in crap shape and does something about it; I was that person once. But what pisses me off is when people EXPECT to look good and don't want to put in the effort, then whine endlessly about it, and being depressed about it.

/rant.

Chet Zar

In fairness, d-gal has a serious point. A lot of it is really just down to people getting lazier and lazier - let's call a spade a spade! Not ALL of it - but a large part. I gotta say I see more and more people on the heavier side every day of the week and I know I'm not imagining it! I walk up and down stairs as much as possible at work (only a few-storeys high) and when I mention about walking instead of taking the stairs people look at me like I've lost it!

Irish people are definitely getting fatter!

AARRRGH

I also think part of the problem is a lack of personal responsibility, and a culture which tolerates this sort of mentality. And fat people are very good at deluding themselves into think it's not their fault. Hardly ever will you hear a fat person say they eat too much or exercise too little...

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote:

Look at it like this; the more out-of-shape, fat people there are out there, the better we look. Harsh? Yes. True? Yes.

Haha, true... :pac:

amacachi

AARRRGH wrote: »

I also think part of the problem is a lack of personal responsibility, and a culture which tolerates this sort of mentality. And fat people are very good at deluding themselves into think it's not their fault. Hardly ever will you hear a fat person say they eat too much or exercise too little...

That's basically it. Kids are one thing, but there comes a point when it has to become personal responsibility. I'm a lardarse because of a bad sleeping pattern which is partly caused by and partly leads to bad diet. I know what I need to do to lose weight, I'm not an idiot. I am, however, sick of TV shows about it. When it comes down to it I just don't care enough to lose weight. I could make excuses but they're not valid IMO.

Chet Zar

amacachi wrote: »

That's basically it. Kids are one thing, but there comes a point when it has to become personal responsibility. I'm a lardarse because of a bad sleeping pattern which is partly caused by and partly leads to bad diet. I know what I need to do to lose weight, I'm not an idiot. I am, however, sick of TV shows about it. When it comes down to it I just don't care enough to lose weight. I could make excuses but they're not valid IMO.

And this, in the end - when the excuses fall away - is what it all comes down to for nearly every single last one of us!

xgtdec

Just as a matter of interest, has the OP or anyone else posting ever actually been fat or are you all just using your imaginations?

Dazd_N_Confusd

OP, if people weren't lazy and unhealthy then you wouldn't have a job. And why you care so much about others is beyond me.

amacachi

xgtdec wrote: »

Just as a matter of interest, has the OP or anyone else posting ever actually been fat or are you all just using your imaginations?

I'm about 23 stone.

taz70

d-gal wrote: »

Ireland is getting worse and worse for obesity and over 50% of the population is overweight.

So tell me, how do you define obesity?

Barry.Oglesby

I blame the parents, possibly the English too, and coloured people.

I work with a lot of kids, fat ones thin ones, fit ones, not so fit ones, lazy ones, energetic ones. So it was and so it shall be forevermore. You can blame schools, you can blame PE, you can blame Playstations but the best thing you can do is to stop moaning and go out and do something proactive about it- volunteer to coach a local football team or lead a group of young kids on a nature walk.... going to do that are we? Like **** you are.

A couple of notes on this thread before I go to bed:
1) saying the fitter you are the less likely you are to suffer from depression is like patting someone who suffers from depression on the back and saying "ah sure you'll feel better after an oul walk". You only have to look at the case of Robert Enke to know that's bull****.
2) Sweets/McDonalds etc. I'm not all that sure what my 5 year old does when he's at school, but I'm almost 100% sure when he goes there he doesn't climb out the window and go work on a site or something for a few bob. Parents control the money, and they should have the sense to say no to things like that. By and large, they do.
3) Obesity and lower incomes are linked. lower income means both parents working longer hours, meaning more prepacked or fast food. High calorie food is cheap (per calorie) easy to prepare and can be bought in bulk and frozen. Meat can be as cheap as you like but time is not. Comparitively speaking, calorie for calorie, healthy foods are much, much more expensive than their equivalent "unhealthy" food.
4) I don't see a lot of fat kids, honestly, but then again I have a certain kind of job. When I do see an overweight kid, they usually have pretty much every form of technology know to man at their disposal- xbox, ds, psp etc. etc. Active parents tend to breed active kids in my experience.

sesna

taz70 wrote: »

So tell me, how do you define obesity?

Not directed at me, but I would say body fat percentage over 15%.
BMI over 25-30 (depends on other factors).
Looking like a fatso is always a good measure.

Fat people, especially the morbidly obese people are a horrible burden on the health service. They should pay their own expenses for fat related conditions such as diabetes, high blood pressure, etc.

What sort of life is it when one cries themselves to sleep every night with face covered in chocolate?

AARRRGH

xgtdec wrote: »

Just as a matter of interest, has the OP or anyone else posting ever actually been fat or are you all just using your imaginations?

Yawn. We're all human. We all know what happens to us if we eat too much food. It's not exactly rocket science.

xgtdec

sesna wrote: »

Fat people, especially the morbidly obese people are a horrible burden on the health service. They should pay their own expenses for fat related conditions such as diabetes, high blood pressure, etc.

What sort of life is it when one cries themselves to sleep every night with face covered in chocolate?

Classy!!:D

AARRRGH

I agree with most of your post, but I don't fully agree with this bit:

Barry.Oglesby wrote: »

saying the fitter you are the less likely you are to suffer from depression is like patting someone who suffers from depression on the back and saying "ah sure you'll feel better after an oul walk". You only have to look at the case of Robert Enke to know that's bull****.

We know the inverse is true: the more out of shape you are the more likely you will suffer from depression; so it is fair to say exercising and eating properly are good for your mental health.

amacachi

sesna wrote: »

Fat people, especially the morbidly obese people are a horrible burden on the health service. They should pay their own expenses for fat related conditions such as diabetes, high blood pressure, etc.

What sort of life is it when one cries themselves to sleep every night with face covered in chocolate?

And there was me thinking there might be a serious discussion. The only burden I've placed on the health service in the last 5 years was for treatment for the results of a broken nose, ironically picked up while playing football and being "active".

And I don't like chocolate.

Barry.Oglesby

AARRRGH wrote: »

We know the inverse is true: the more out of shape you are the more likely you will suffer from depression; so it is fair to say exercising and eating properly are good for your mental health.

Like much of this topic, that oversimplifies. That's abstract reasoning, when you read the meat of the papers in which those links were published it's one of a variety of factors. Doesn't make it less true of course, but it's cherry picking to prove a point.

If you want to have a go at something in our culture our diet surely isn't first on the list. How about drink?

sesna

Barry.Oglesby wrote: »

Like much of this topic, that oversimplifies. That's abstract reasoning, when you read the meat of the papers in which those links were published it's one of a variety of factors. Doesn't make it less true of course, but it's cherry picking to prove a point.

If you want to have a go at something in our culture our diet surely isn't first on the list. How about drink?

Alcohol gets sufficient discussion. Its time to discuss the grossly excess layers of fat people are hauling around, and its destructive influence on our society.

Barry.Oglesby

sesna wrote: »

Not directed at me, but I would say body fat percentage over 15%.

Bwhahahahahahahah I have a bodyfat percentage over 15% and so do a good few guys I know who would, I could amost guarantee, in pretty much every fitness test you devise, chew up most of the posters on this thread.

Most people not living in Amazonia or Narnia are in and around 15-20% as they walk around. When they get fitter they get lower but in my experience not by much. I've been as low as 8% and as high as 19% depending on my lifestyle, goals of the time or just being plain lazy for a while. It's nice to hear I'm someone's opinion of obese though.

AARRRGH

Barry.Oglesby wrote: »

Like much of this topic, that oversimplifies. That's abstract reasoning, when you read the meat of the papers in which those links were published it's one of a variety of factors. Doesn't make it less true of course, but it's cherry picking to prove a point.

In fairness, and you know this, exercise has been proven to improve people's moods. I'm pretty sure every doctor would agree light exercise would benefit people suffering from depression.

Anyway, I don't want to get into a pissing contest with you. Let's just agree to disagree.

Barry.Oglesby wrote: »

If you want to have a go at something in our culture our diet surely isn't first on the list. How about drink?

Yep. I don't drink. Being sober on a Saturday night seeing what alcohol does to people was enough to make me give it up for good.

sesna

Barry.Oglesby wrote: »

Bwhahahahahahahah I have a bodyfat percentage over 15% and so do a good few guys I know who would, I could amost guarantee, in pretty much every fitness test you devise, chew up most of the posters on this thread.

Most people not living in Amazonia or Narnia are in and around 15-20% as they walk around. When they get fitter they get lower but in my experience not by much. I've been as low as 8% and as high as 19% depending on my lifestyle, goals of the time or just being plain lazy for a while. It's nice to hear I'm someone's opinion of obese though.

No problem. I'm not sure what you find funny about it though.

8 - 19% is a variance of 9kg of fat (in an average 80kg male).
Does your lifestyle go from binge eating Dominos every night to going on hunger strike, by any chance?

Barry.Oglesby

AARRRGH wrote: »

In fairness, and you know this, exercise has been proven to improve people's moods. I'm pretty sure every doctor would agree light exercise would benefit people suffering from depression.

Anyway, I don't want to get into a pissing contest with you. Let's just agree to disagree.

I'm not pissing, I'm just stating that studies like that are misappropriated on a regular basis. I agree, exercise is good and there is a link between good mental and good physical health, but that's not the way the argument was framed earlier.

AARRRGH

AARRRGH wrote: »

it is fair to say exercising and eating properly are good for your mental health.

Barry.Oglesby wrote: »

exercise is good and there is a link between good mental and good physical health, but that's not the way the argument was framed earlier.

I think it's pretty clear what I said... but whatever... let's just leave it, I really don't want to argue with you when in reality we both probably have the same opinion on this topic.

Barry.Oglesby

sesna wrote: »

No problem. I'm not sure what you find funny about it though.

8 - 19% is a variance of 9kg of fat (in an average 80kg male).
Does your lifestyle go from binge eating Dominos every night to going on hunger strike, by any chance?

I find it funny because I am, without patting myself on the back too much, a very fit man.

Your 9kg variance does not take into account increased or decreased LBM by the way. In my adult life I have been 75kgs (for about 20 minutes) but 77kgs a bit more regularly (for longer periods, usually about an hour), and I have been 88kgs. So the actual figure is about 13kgs in the difference. I'd say quite a lot of people go through variances like this for various reasons- injury, work, home life, children arriving. Currently I'm about 83kgs.

Barry.Oglesby

AARRRGH wrote: »

I think it's pretty clear what I said... but whatever... let's just leave it, I really don't want to argue with you when in reality we both probably have the same opinion on this topic.

Just FYI I meant much earlier in the thread, prior to your involvement.

sesna

Barry.Oglesby wrote: »

I find it funny because I am, without patting myself on the back too much, a very fit man.

Your 9kg variance does not take into account increased or decreased LBM by the way. In my adult life I have been 75kgs (for about 20 minutes) but 77kgs a bit more regularly (for longer periods, usually about an hour), and I have been 88kgs. So the actual figure is about 13kgs in the difference. I'd say quite a lot of people go through variances like this for various reasons- injury, work, home life, children arriving. Currently I'm about 83kgs.

My 9kg variance does not take LBM into account, as I stated it was a variance in weight of just body fat composition (not total weight).

Essential body fat in men is 3-5%. I know two males with body fat percentage of approx. 6-7%. Most moderately serious athletes I have met are around 12-13%. Maybe your % fat composition was not measured accurately? The worst way to measure it is by electrical impedence, as level of hydration effects result.

I'd accept injury as a valid reason, but would view work, children etc as excuses for lack of training.

Finally, it must be said there are of course varying levels of obesity and 19% body fat is a long way from someone who is morbidly obese.

Inspector Coptoor

Barry.Oglesby wrote: »

I'd say quite a lot of people go through variances like this for various reasons- injury, work, home life, children arriving. Currently I'm about 83kgs.

i agree completely with this.
I went from 119kg in Dec to 106kg in March and am back to 110kg now.

While i would probably be considered obese by sesna's definition of the word, i train 3-5 times per week and while it is mostly weight training I do, I have a blood pressure of 110/70, resting heart rate of 56 and have low cholesterol.

You can be fat and fit