Irish public sector has give more than other EU public sector

galway2007

Irish public sector has give more than any other public sector
The Irish public sector have given way more than any other public sector and it is time to stand up and be ready to bring this country to its knees if need be
The Greeks have given the following
Public sector pay frozen until 2014
Public sector salary bonuses - equivalent to two months' extra pay - scrapped or capped
Public sector allowances cut by 20%
The Spanish will give
5% pay cut
Now is the time to reject the croke park deal and also reject the crap that is written here by private sector worker as most of them in one way or another cause this country to be F*****D by their greed.
Stand up for our condition and pay vote no now but remember that your union is in bed with this government
If they touch us again be prepared to take all services out but for now vote no and take no more crap

Welease

Great..vote No.. and stop whining..

syklops

I suggest you visit another european country and experience their health systems, their transport systems, their planning systems, and then ask yourself, money aside, which public sector has given the most.

Spudmonkey

This is more of it.. Just fanning the flames. You could really have posted this at the end of one multiple "anti-PS" threads. Did it really deserve a new one?

Anyway to your point. Given more away than any other EU Public sector? Possibly because they were overpaid to begin with!

Go on. Vote No. See how far and how much it gets you.

Drumpot

Idbatterim

Is this a troll?!

Scarab80

galway2007 wrote: »

Irish public sector has give more than any other public sector
The Irish public sector have given way more than any other public sector and it is time to stand up and be ready to bring this country to its knees if need be
The Greeks have given the following
Public sector pay frozen until 2014
Public sector salary bonuses - equivalent to two months' extra pay - scrapped or capped
Public sector allowances cut by 20%
The Spanish will give5% pay cut
Now is the time to reject the croke park deal and also reject the crap that is written here by private sector worker as most of them in one way or another cause this country to be F*****D by their greed. Stand up for our condition and pay vote no now but remember that your union is in bed with this government
If they touch us again be prepared to take all services out but for now vote no and take no more crap

Is that right? The removal of the 2 month bonus is a 14% reduction straight up along with the following....

Freeze on state pensions (450 million)
Reducing bonuses and pay by 7 percent for public sector employees (360 million)
Cuts to pension subsidies (150 million)
Other measures include: reducing government overtime hours by 30 percent, cutting public-sector benefits 10 percent


Paycuts for the irish public / civil servant

dromdrom

Just after watching 'life after dell' on t.v there real people struggling to get by, it sickens me to the core to come on here and see well paid public servants with a sense of entitlement that would put an African dictator to shame harp on about the pain they are feeling. Dear god let them vote no and lets give our leaders a mandate to take them down.

oldyouth

Delighted to hear that the CPSU has rejected the Croke Park agreement. I for one will toot my horn as I drive by yout picket line. In fact, I look forward to doing that for years to come. Keep up the good work, the nation is proud of you. Great to hear that the island of public service has aligned itself to a small country like Ireland

stepbar

dromdrom wrote: »

Just after watching 'life after dell' on t.v there real people struggling to get by, it sickens me to the core to come on here and see well paid public servants with a sense of entitlement that would put an African dictator to shame harp on about the pain they are feeling. Dear god let them vote no and lets give our leaders a mandate to take them down.

O please god they do vote no.

Then the government might actually take the hatchet to the bloated public service that exists in this country.

But don't be fooled.... it won't happen overnight.

dromdrom

dromdrom wrote: »

well paid public servants with a sense of entitlement that would put an African dictator to shame

Haha!

Well said.

I'd also like to add that the Irish public sector has give a fair bit more pay than similar public sectors. Someone on the dole in Ireland earns almost as much as a teacher in Greece. Which you might want to take into account when you get into the "has give" side of the argument.

johnhargrove

I worked in the department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment (As it was then known) for 2yrs.

People in the public sector don't work as hard as those in the private,
there's more perks, its an easier life, and the unions are having a laugh right now.
Again I speak from personal experience, I was even in the union!

We cannot afford our bloated public sector anymore,
get over it.

stepbar

johnhargrove wrote: »

I worked in the department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment (As it was then known) for 2yrs.

People in the public sector don't work as hard as those in the private,
there's more perks, its an easier life, and the unions are having a laugh right now.
Again I speak from personal experience, I was even in the union!

We cannot afford our bloated public sector anymore,
get over it.

I worked 3 months in a Dole Office and seen enough in that 3 months to have an opinion.

The breaks were absolutely amazing (probably on average 1hr 45min). Flexi Time another joke. One person in addition to the 20 days holidays she had, worked up another 20 days in flexi time even though there was no work to be done.

The computer system was (and still is) a joke and actually was the main reason for probably keeping about half the office in a job.

If anyone tells me that there's not scope for improvement in the public service I'll throw them a box.

dunsandin

To OP- and yet not enough.

johnhargrove

stepbar wrote: »

I worked 3 months in a Dole Office and seen enough in that 3 months to have an opinion.

The breaks were absolutely amazing (probably on average 1hr 45min). Flexi Time another joke. One person in addition to the 20 days holidays she had, worked up another 20 days in flexi time even though there was no work to be done.

The computer system was (and still is) a joke and actually was the main reason for probably keeping about half the office in a job.

If anyone tells me that there's not scope for improvement in the public service I'll throw them a box.

Why the heck can't people get together and put a stop to this carry on??

We're borrowing to pay 50% of the public sector wage bill.
This is not sustainable.

You could argue that public servants deserve the pay. Fine.
But we simply haven't got the money to pay them!!!!!!!!
You can't spend more than you earn!

thebaldsoprano

galway2007 wrote: »

Irish public sector has give more than any other public sector

Maybe it's because they were getting more than any other public sector. Looking at teacher's pay from 2007:



Taken from here.

thebaldsoprano

Interesting article here about the EU wishing to set guidelines for public sector pay.

syklops

I dont think using teachers is a good example. For instance it is a skilled job, in that you have to learn the subjects your teaching, and you have to deal with kids - yuck.

But there are hundreds of other jobs in the PS to compare to. How much does a woman with basic typing skills earn in the dole office, compared to other european countries.

I'm in the Czech Republic and am on a fantastic wage of 1200 euro a month. An office clerk would be on a third of that. Now I know a PS worker will come on and say "Ah yes but cost of living..." For a start clothes here are more expensive than in Ireland. I honestly wonder how people clothe themselves. Alcohol and cigarettes are alot cheaper but you cant live on them, and my GF and I are paying 100 euro less than our house in Dublin did.

Btw the reason I am here is because neither my GF or I had a job for life. I pray to the almighty the unions vote no on the croke park deal and Brian lenihan can take a scalpel to the PS. Abolish the RSA they do nothing anyway. Getting rid of the QUANGOs, would do half the job and bypass the unions.

Minister:"We're cutting your pay"
Union:"Well if you do that then we'll go on strike and no work will be done"

Minister:"We're closing your department, your all unemployed"
Union:"Well if you do that then we'll go on strike and no work will be done... Oh."

Minister:"Yeah."

Andrew33

Rojomcdojo wrote: »

I'd also like to add that the Irish public sector has give a fair bit more pay than similar public sectors. Someone on the dole in Ireland earns almost as much as a teacher in Greece. Which you might want to take into account when you get into the "has give" side of the argument.

EARNS? hahahahahaha!

syklops

Andrew33 wrote: »

EARNS? hahahahahaha!

I actually LOL'ed. As in for real. That does not happen really happen very often.

paddyland

galway2007 wrote: »

The Irish public sector have given way more than any other public sector

The Irish public sector has taken way more than any other public sector too. The more they have taken, the more they have to give.

#15

thebaldsoprano wrote: »

Maybe it's because they were getting more than any other public sector. Looking at teacher's pay from 2007:



Taken from here.

Maybe primary teachers were getting more than most countries because they worked more than primary teachers in most other countries.

OECD 2009



This thread is ridiculous btw.

johnhargrove

Look you can debate whether public sector workers deserve the money until the cows come home.
We just haven't got the money to pay them in this country, spending is out of control.
If we're not seen to be making more cuts our cost of borrowing will increase further putting us in a tougher situation.

I think the first cuts to make would be to politicians pay + pensions (cut further), cut CEO of semi-state bodies pay, cut hospital consultants pay (€250,000 in Ireland, £110,000 in the UK), cut the public sector expenses entitlements - when I worked in the public sector, if you were in a city such as Amsterdam for a day you got €222 per day to cover expenses. There was also some crazy rule that if you had a 10hr+ flight you could fly business class, some of my colleagues at a junior level took advantage of this.

johnhargrove

If working in the public sector is 'so bad', why are thousands upon thousands of private sector workers desperate to work in the public sector??

dean21

stepbar wrote: »

O please god they do vote no.

Then the government might actually take the hatchet to the bloated public service that exists in this country.

But don't be fooled.... it won't happen overnight.

Take the hatchet if they want
You kids will be taught in a class room of 50 kids
You will more than likely die on a trolley in pain
And if you house is broken in you will be best to say in bed
The people that will suffer from a reduced public sector are the poor and not the private sector worker that are moaning here
But then I don’t expect any more from private sector worker as all thought the boom it was me me me.

galway2007

Scarab80 wrote: »

Is that right? The removal of the 2 month bonus is a 14% reduction straight up along with the following....

Freeze on state pensions (450 million)
Reducing bonuses and pay by 7 percent for public sector employees (360 million)
Cuts to pension subsidies (150 million)
Other measures include: reducing government overtime hours by 30 percent, cutting public-sector benefits 10 percent


Paycuts for the irish public / civil servant

They cut all there bonus not they real pay
There is no bonus here for public sector except the higher paid PS who got to include that in they pay cut
We have an overtime ban

dean21

dean21 wrote: »

Take the hatchet if they want
You kids will be taught in a class room of 50 kids
You will more than likely die on a trolley in pain
And if you house is broken in you will be best to say in bed
The people that will suffer from a reduced public sector are the poor and not the private sector worker that are moaning here
But then I don’t expect any more from private sector worker as all thought the boom it was me me me.

Anyone else noticing a certain lack of...well...intellect from certain people in this thread? Feck it sure, let's give them 25k a year for opening envelopes.

galway2007

johnhargrove wrote: »

Why the heck can't people get together and put a stop to this carry on??

We're borrowing to pay 50% of the public sector wage bill.
This is not sustainable.

You could argue that public servants deserve the pay. Fine.
But we simply haven't got the money to pay them!!!!!!!!
You can't spend more than you earn!

Or the money to pay the 450 k on the dole
look like we will have to ask them to leave the county

galway2007

Rojomcdojo wrote: »

Anyone else noticing a certain lack of...well...intellect from certain people in this thread? Feck it sure, let's give them 25k a year for opening envelopes.

and you do????

galway2007

thebaldsoprano wrote: »

Maybe it's because they were getting more than any other public sector. Looking at teacher's pay from 2007:



Taken from here.

cost of living????

tian shi

dromdrom wrote: »

Just after watching 'life after dell' on t.v there real people struggling to get by, it sickens me to the core to come on here and see well paid public servants with a sense of entitlement that would put an African dictator to shame harp on about the pain they are feeling. Dear god let them vote no and lets give our leaders a mandate to take them down.

Well said.

galway2007

johnhargrove wrote: »

If working in the public sector is 'so bad', why are thousands upon thousands of private sector workers desperate to work in the public sector??

But if it is so great why did private sector not take the jobs during the boom???
O i rem now, they or there employer were to busy screwing the irish people

galway2007

galway2007 wrote: »

But if it is so great why did private sector not take the jobs during the boom???
O i rem now, they or there employer were to busy screwing the irish people

This is a fallacy, which nobody takes seriously so don't bother spouting it. There were loads of applicants for PS jobs during the boom.


To answer your question: I am a mature student - who, by the way, has spent 9 months working in various PS departments during the boom



It's 'their', not 'there'.

Welease

galway2007 wrote: »

But if it is so great why did private sector not take the jobs during the boom???
O i rem now, they or there employer were to busy screwing the irish people

How many PS appointments were undersubscribed during the boom?

cson

galway2007 wrote: »

But if it is so great why did private sector not take the jobs during the boom???
O i rem now, they or there employer were to busy screwing the irish people

Yay nothing like another Public-Private Shitefest to rumble the loins in anticipation.

Your plan;

Vote No
Bring Country To Knees
????????
PROFIT!

cson

cson wrote: »

Yay nothing like another Public-Private Shitefest to rumble the loins in anticipation.

Your plan;

Vote No
Bring Country To Knees
????????
PROFIT!

I don't think these lads will be happy until they're getting paid with wheelbarrows of punts a la Zimbabwe..

johnhargrove

Rojomcdojo wrote: »

Anyone else noticing a certain lack of...well...intellect from certain people in this thread? Feck it sure, let's give them 25k a year for opening envelopes.

EXACTLY!:)

johnhargrove

Welease wrote: »

How many PS appointments were undersubscribed during the boom?

In 2004 (height of the boom), the Mid-Western Health Board had over 2000 applications for 150 Grade 3 Clerical Officer positions.
I know this as I was doing the recruiting!

Scarab80

galway2007 wrote: »

They cut all there bonus not they real pay
There is no bonus here for public sector except the higher paid PS who got to include that in they pay cut
We have an overtime ban

Ok by that logic the pension levy is not a cut to your real pay, so taking in increments many PS workers have had an overall pay rise! And seeing as you have no problem with non salary related cuts i'm sure you'd have no problem if your flexi time was taken away, your holidays were reduced to statutory 20 days a year, no uncertified sick leave, unpaid sick leave, reduction in pension entitlements, reduction in overtime rates, reduction in flat rate and unvouched allowances, increased working hours per week etc etc etc.....

oflahero

galway2007 wrote: »

by private sector worker as most of them in one way or another cause this country to be F*****D by their greed

Seriously, even this gem alone makes this thread unworthy of any attention whatsoever.

Ahhh, d'oh!, I replied.

McCruiskeen

cson wrote: »

Yay nothing like another Public-Private Shitefest to rumble the loins in anticipation.

Your plan;

Vote No
Bring Country To Knees
????????
PROFIT!

Tee hee hee. Reminds me of

Welease

johnhargrove wrote: »

In 2004 (height of the boom), the Mid-Western Health Board had over 2000 applications for 150 Grade 3 Clerical Officer positions.
I know this as I was doing the recruiting!

Precisely.. and the PS sector grew substantially which could not nor would not happen if the conditions were so poor in relation.. But people like Galway2007 don't let facts get in the way of their ill-informed rants.

johnhargrove

Welease, are u in the public sector? Are you in the union?

Welease

johnhargrove wrote: »

Welease, are u in the public sector? Are you in the union?

Nope (i moved abroad during the last recession).. but both parent were Revenue & P&T (well one was became semi state/private)..

I have sympathy for those hard working PS members, but the level of bollox on this site and from the unions is staggering..

smcgiff

#15 wrote: »

This thread is ridiculous btw.

LOL - you just posted the amount of hours a primary school teacher works as a defence for their pay!

Riskymove

Scarab80 wrote: »

so taking in increments many PS workers have had an overall pay rise!

thats incorrect

if your flexi time was taken away

most of the PS are not on flexi-time

your holidays were reduced to statutory 20 days a year

most of CPSU are on 20 days I think

reduction in pension entitlements

on the way

, reduction in overtime rates

already done

reduction in flat rate

already done

and unvouched allowances

please, we are not all politicians in PS

increased working hours per week etc etc etc.....

already happening for many PS

thebaldsoprano

#15 wrote: »

Maybe primary teachers were getting more than most countries because they worked more than primary teachers in most other countries.

OECD 2009

Right, so for working an extra ~80 hours, or two weeks, an Irish teacher gets almost double the salary of a French one.

#15 wrote: »

This thread is ridiculous btw.

Well it's no surprise with arguments like that

gandalf

What has the reductions in wages that other countries have implemented got to do with what we as a country can afford?

The money is not there and we cannot continue to borrow to pay peoples wages at the levels that we are doing. Cuts have to be made and the fact that permanent jobs have not been cut should be commended.

OMD

#15 wrote: »

Maybe primary teachers were getting more than most countries because they worked more than primary teachers in most other countries.

OECD 2009



This thread is ridiculous btw.

Same crap from teachers again. Are Irish children better educated than others in Europe? No. The fact that Irish teachers take longer to do a poor job should not mean they get paid more. By the way your graph shows Irish teachers work about average hours.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.