Question about clipless safety.

wayne0308

Hi,

I got a pair of shimano 105 spd-sl pedals (I haven't cycled with them yet but practiced getting in and out of them). I live in Dublin city at the moment so I was wondering are these safe to use around the city? Are they harder to get out of than other clipless systems?

Do many of you use them and what are your experiences with them cycling in built up areas?

Cheers,

Wayne

Bluefoam

Shouldn't be a problem. There is adjustment in them, so you can get out easier if you want.

CheGuedara

If you're not used to cycling with clipless pedals I'd probably not recommend learning how to use them in the thick of Dublin city traffic.

Once you're a bit more comfortable and confident with them and able to clip in/out rapidly as almost second nature then they're totally safe - possibly just not when you're starting off and likely to spud fall at a junction or stopping in traffic.

+1 on reducing the tension on the pedals though - will make life a lot easier on you at the beginning

wayne0308

Thanks for your replies. I'll probably take some time to get used to them around the housing estate near here so before I venture any further.

Highway_To_Hell

I think you just need to say to yourself that at some stage you will fall. When I first got clipless pedals I spent a while practising cliping in and out in the front garden but as soon as I went for my first test run and needed to stop my first reaction was to lift my foot and ended up falling over (that was within 200 mtrs of the house).

In traffic I tend to semi unclip approaching red/amber lights and then I can easily get my foot to the ground without too much hassle. When/where possible I would also use poles/rails to rest against when at red lights and keep my feet clipped in as there is nothing more fustrating then pushing off when the lights go green and struggling to get clipped in.

Bluefoam

Best thing to do with clipless is just get out and cycle with them. They become second nature very quickly. The more procrastinating you do about them the more you will fear them. They aren't really that big a deal.

concussion

It's true, they're not. I only changed over last year after about 10 years on flat. Left foot in...left foot out. Right foot in....right foot out. Happy with that, I hit the road.

rflynnr

Just my tuppence worth but although I use SPDs, they're largely limited to touring and road bike use (i.e. outside the city). Assuming one is observing the ROTR, the amount of clipping and unclipping an urban environment demands, seems like a chore (unless you're an expert at track-standing). Wouldn't toe clips be adequate?

Mind you, I may very well be in a minority of one on this.

irishmotorist

rflynnr wrote: »

. Assuming one is observing the ROTR, the amount of clipping and unclipping an urban environment demands, seems like a chore (unless you're an expert at track-standing). Wouldn't toe clips be adequate?

I'd strongly disagree with this. It's no more a chore than just lifting your foot off the pedal. Having used toe clips, clipless and normal pedals, toe clips would be the bottom of my list. The amount of times that a lace got caught in the trappings of the clip and nearly gave me a heart attack are too numerous to mention. No problem like this with clipless.

blorg

rflynnr wrote: »

Just my tuppence worth but although I use SPDs, they're largely limited to touring and road bike use (i.e. outside the city). Assuming one is observing the ROTR, the amount of clipping and unclipping an urban environment demands, seems like a chore (unless you're an expert at track-standing). Wouldn't toe clips be adequate?

I find toeclips (with straps) SUBSTANTIALLY more difficult to get in/out of than (MTB) SPDs. I have fallen over stuck in toeclips; this has not happened with clipless pedals.

You can clip in and out of (MTB) SPDs as easily as sticking your foot on a pedal IMO. Road systems are about as easy to get out of but I find mine (Time RXS) much much harder to get INTO after a light.

rflynnr

blorg wrote: »

I find toeclips (with straps) SUBSTANTIALLY more difficult to get in/out of than (MTB) SPDs. I have fallen over stuck in toeclips; this has not happened with clipless pedals.

You can clip in and out of (MTB) SPDs as easily as sticking your foot on a pedal IMO. Road systems are about as easy to get out of but I find mine (Time RXS) much much harder to get INTO after a light.

As I suspected - a minority of one. (That said, 16 years of commuting etc., most of them in toe clips etc., never experienced problems getting out of them etc. etc. ... Proves nothing, I know.)

CramCycle

The first ones I ever got were the SPD-SLs and I found it second nature within 5 minutes. Very nervous till my first successful stop but after that I don't know how I lived without them.

blorg

rflynnr wrote: »

As I suspected - a minority of one. (That said, 16 years of commuting etc., most of them in toe clips etc., never experienced problems getting out of them etc. etc. ... Proves nothing, I know.)

Part of it is probably what you are used to. I never fell over stuck in toeclips until I was used to SPDs and only had toeclips on the one, town bike, so I could use normal shoes. I was then conditioned to twisting my foot in an emergency and unfortunately this didn't help me get out of the toeclips.

I find it difficult to imagine how you could find it difficult to get in and out of double-sided SPDs though if you are used to them. Getting in, in particular, should just be a matter of aiming your foot at the pedal and crunch. Certainly easier than flipping a pedal with a toeclip on it. I do find clipping into my road pedals a bit tricky as I said... but don't use them in situations requiring a lot of clipping in and out.

Paul Kiernan

I think it would be mad using road (SPD-SL) pedals in stop-start cycling. It's just too difficult to be certain you'll clip-in everytime you start off. If you don't, you have absolutely no pedal control as the hard sole just slips off the pedal.

MTB (SPD) pedals, on the other hand, like these with rubber soled shoes like these, will be just as hard to clip in, but at least you have full control and can pedal across that busy roundabout when you don't! Furthermore, because the cleats are recessed and the shoes look like human shoes, you can walk around in them.

I have both combinations and use road for long weekend cycles and MTB for stop-start commutes. It takes about a minute to swap the pedals.

blorg

Paul Kiernan wrote: »

MTB (SPD) pedals, ... will be just as hard to clip in,

I really don't find this. If you are having trouble clipping in to SPDs there is something wrong somewhere.

Paul Kiernan

blorg wrote: »

I really don't find this. If you are having trouble clipping in to SPDs there is something wrong somewhere.

It might be just a bad habit on my part. The ultra-cheap Crank Smartys tend to need a good push forward, not down, to get them in. I tend to just pedal a few turns without clipping and then when I'm up to a comfortable speed, I clip in. In fairness, they often just clip in on their own when I start to pedal.

The point I'm really making, though, is that it doesn't matter an awful lot if you don't clip in as you remain fully in control.

CramCycle

Paul Kiernan wrote: »

I think it would be mad using road (SPD-SL) pedals in stop-start cycling. It's just too difficult to be certain you'll clip-in everytime you start off.

Completely disagree, you have one clipped in, before you start off, so you can push off and then clip in the other with that bit of momentum.

There is rarely an occasion you need to clip out of both during a commute.

I find that toe clips are far harder as if you need to get out in an emergency your leg may not be in a great position to pull back or when your getting into them I find they take to much of your concentration off the road if they have spun slightly.

Only personal opinion though, everyone differs.

petethedrummer

Paul Kiernan wrote: »

I think it would be mad using road (SPD-SL) pedals in stop-start cycling. It's just too difficult to be certain you'll clip-in everytime you start off.

I cycled all last year in SPD-SLs through the city centre and was fine. I moved to SPDs just for the ease of walking up the stairs when I got into work. But I find the SPD-SLs easier to clip in and out of. There's a bigger target to hit or summat.

IM0

rflynnr wrote: »

As I suspected - a minority of one. (That said, 16 years of commuting etc., most of them in toe clips etc., never experienced problems getting out of them etc. etc.

me too, for urban use I use toe clips, and for training (in a half rural area) I use clipless look keo. Ive never had a problem getting out of toe clips, simply pull foot back, and most importantly HAVE THEM ON LOOSE!! I will happily track stand/SBR in toe clips in urban areas, but I will clip out a bit sooner in my keo's, not that my brain will fart when I stop, just that its one thing putting a normal set of shoes down last minute and another doing it in shiney plastic raised footbed cleats and shiney carbon soled bike shoes with a raised heel. Try doing the later on an off camber road - ouch!

Paul Kiernan

I find 95% of the time I clip in no problem but now and again I kick the pedal or something and it starts spinning and I'm looking down, trying to get it sorted. Maybe just lack of practice.

But I will say this, from experience, it's not much fun on an M50 roundabout when you're trying to get to the 3rd exit and the juggernaut behind you is going off at the 2nd:o.

irishmotorist

me@ucd wrote: »

Ive never had a problem getting out of toe clips, simply pull foot back, and most importantly HAVE THEM ON LOOSE!!

This is one thing that I never really get. If they're loose, then you're losing a lot (or most?) of the benefit of having them on in the first place. Pulling back and up (against tension) is where having a pedal system (other than just push down) benefits. If the strap is loose you can't pull back and your pull-up is quite nullified.

IM0

irishmotorist wrote: »

This is one thing that I never really get.

if you dont know how to pedal efficiently then that is probably the case :rolleyes:

goldencleric

Can anyone recommend a set of road shoes and pedals for around 100 for both. Was looking at these and these. Actually are shimano shoes and look pedals even compatible? Any other suggestions? Going to be using them to commute on my fixie and hopefully for track racing or sportives (singlespeed until I get my road bike ) so would you recommend a road system or mtb system?

smallframe

Hi all, new poster and newbie cyclist (CheGuedara's been slowly converting me), just want to give my 2c to the OP and last post. Got a present of SPD-SLs and Shimano shoes in Feb and although I had several spud falls learning to use them, I find them great. As someone who's only been cycling in the last few months, if I can learn to use them, literally anyone can

irishmotorist

me@ucd wrote: »

if you dont know how to pedal efficiently then that is probably the case :rolleyes:

For my benefit then, could you explain how to pedal efficiently with loose toe straps?

blorg

There is research that shows that pulling back and up is not efficient and that simply unweighting the foot going up while mashing with the other is the most efficient pedalling style. I imagine this is what he is referencing.

Loose toeclips are a bit pointless compared to clipless pedals though; I'm with you there. I do use them on my hack bike so I can use normal shoes but to be honest I'm tempted to take them off and just have flats on that bike. Clipless on the 9 other bikes BTW.

Chris Peak

Paul Kiernan wrote: »

But I will say this, from experience, it's not much fun on an M50 roundabout when you're trying to get to the 3rd exit and the juggernaut behind you is going off at the 2nd:o.

Which one is this? There's one near me which is 'quite interesting'...
There is a cycly track along side it. Only problem is trying to find the bloody thing!

CramCycle

Paul Kiernan wrote: »

But I will say this, from experience, it's not much fun on an M50 roundabout when you're trying to get to the 3rd exit and the juggernaut behind you is going off at the 2nd:o.

Not trying to be smart but what roundabout are you getting off on the 3rd exit on a bike?
I don't know as I only use one crossing at the M50

Chris Peak wrote: »

Which one is this? There's one near me which is 'quite interesting'...
There is a cycly track along side it. Only problem is trying to find the bloody thing!

The one at Tallaght is the same with a non signposted cycle track that starts on a side road. I find risking my life on the roundabout easier and in some cases safer (and always quicker )

Chris Peak

CramCycle wrote: »

The one at Tallaght is the same with a non signposted cycle track that starts on a side road. I find risking my life on the roundabout easier and in some cases safer (and always quicker )

This is the one near me. You have no clue to the existence of the cycle track until you've passed through the roundabout and negotiated the slip road off the slip road off the M50, and are beside the Spa Well pub.

I made inquires as to where it starts and got this reply from Philip Murphy in the Road Dept of SDCC

" I wash to confirm that I have spoken to the relevant engineer who has stated that there may be some confusion caused by the presence of steps as cyclists approach the entrance to the dedicated cycling / pedestrian facility. The steps are for able bodied pedestrians while an adjacnet ramp approach has been provided for all other users including cyclists."
That clears that up then....

CramCycle: When the lights just turn red it's quicker using the path. All other times it's best to stay on the road I find.

OP: SPD's are fine to use even in stop - start traffic. Just remember to only turn your heel sidewards and never try to release by pulling up. :eek: When pulling up to a red light, just half un-clip your shoe so can click back in if the light goes green.

CramCycle

Chris Peak wrote: »

This is the one near me. You have no clue to the existence of the cycle track until you've passed through the roundabout and negotiated the slip road off the slip road off the M50, and are beside the Spa Well pub.

I made inquires as to where it starts and got this reply from Philip Murphy in the Road Dept of SDCC

" I wash to confirm that I have spoken to the relevant engineer who has stated that there may be some confusion caused by the presence of steps as cyclists approach the entrance to the dedicated cycling / pedestrian facility. The steps are for able bodied pedestrians while an adjacnet ramp approach has been provided for all other users including cyclists."
That clears that up then....

The cycle track going towards Tallaght (ie if your on the right of the road at the petrol station) is a left turn then right onto the track, IMO its a bit longer even with the red lights but its not even signposted and its in a really bad state of disrepair. If you mean the track on the left then if your on that side it is a bit quicker. I turn left onto this road at the Spawell so to wait to get across would add a good bit on and I know there is a track (by pure luck) further up.

That said the bit that he mentions with the steps, I presume this is the new part on the Tallaght side. I looked at the sign posts on this, I'm not even sure your technically allowed cycle down it as it seems to be painted as a one way system. Technically its a F*** up. There is no dedicated Wheelchair ramp here either. I think the ramp they have is incredibly badly designed if it is indeed for Wheelchair users as well. Surely a wider path to accommodate 2 wheelchairs starting further back would have made more sense

Anyway, I realise you were pry being sarcastic, but just in case that statement from the council is shocking. When I'm on the road from Tallaght heading over the bridge, AFAIK, there is no point at which I could see the track (as you pointed out), and they spent several months laying that out. personally I could have thrown a few grand at a few builders from back home and they would of done it better and quicker in 1/10th of the time. (No offence to the council lads, I realise they are just following orders)

Chris Peak

CramCycle wrote: »

The cycle track going towards Tallaght (ie if your on the right of the road at the petrol station) is a left turn then right onto the track, IMO its a bit longer even with the red lights but its not even signposted and its in a really bad state of disrepair. If you mean the track on the left then if your on that side it is a bit quicker. I turn left onto this road at the Spawell so to wait to get across would add a good bit on and I know there is a track (by pure luck) further up.

That said the bit that he mentions with the steps, I presume this is the new part on the Tallaght side. I looked at the sign posts on this, I'm not even sure your technically allowed cycle down it as it seems to be painted as a one way system. Technically its a F*** up. There is no dedicated Wheelchair ramp here either. I think the ramp they have is incredibly badly designed if it is indeed for Wheelchair users as well. Surely a wider path to accommodate 2 wheelchairs starting further back would have made more sense

Anyway, I realise you were pry being sarcastic, but just in case that statement from the council is shocking. When I'm on the road from Tallaght heading over the bridge, AFAIK, there is no point at which I could see the track (as you pointed out), and they spent several months laying that out. personally I could have thrown a few grand at a few builders from back home and they would of done it better and quicker in 1/10th of the time. (No offence to the council lads, I realise they are just following orders)

Jeez.. I forgot all about the cycle track heading towards Tallaght!
I found the start of the Spa Well side track by back tracking from the Spa Well roundabout. I sent some pictures in to clarify the point, so I should have a response within the next week or so.

I was pretty shocked and disappointed by the Council's response all right.

Photo's here.

CramCycle

Chris Peak wrote: »

Jeez.. I forgot all about the cycle track heading towards Tallaght!
I found the start of the Spa Well side track by back tracking from the Spa Well roundabout. I sent some pictures in to clarify the point, so I should have a response within the next week or so.

I was pretty shocked and disappointed by the Council's response all right.

Photo's here.

I won't be out that way for another week or so but I'll try to get pictures of the other side when i do. Can you PM me the details for mailing the council or a phone number because the other side I got on is also dreadful. There is heaps of soil, rocks, potholes scattered around the place, the odd chunk of builder waste as well to slice your tyres real good.

Nice pictures by the way, it took them over 8 months to get that done, 5 days a week, rain or shine. I especially like the fact that you have to be in the North M50 lane well before hand and either bunny hop onto the pavement or stop in traffic and walk. Met another cyclist the last time I was there who I used to see most mornings. She now has to get off her bike and walk the ramp as its too tight/steep/awkward.

The lads who were building it told me it was to stop car drivers in the area going down there?!?

Apparently the giant rocks they had were not enough to stop them, to be honest, I'd be impressed if someone could get a car down there before this.

Chris Peak

PM sent CramCycle

Bunnyhopper

I haven't been using clipless for long but I recently started with SPDs and haven't had any trouble with them. Shortly after I started using them I was doing a tight slow turn and felt the balance start to go. Before I even had time to think "Oh ****" my foot was off the pedal and on the ground. I'm still not sure quite how I managed it but it was just automatic, even at that stage.

That said, I'll probably fall over in front of an appreciative crowd the next time I head out...

blorg

Bunnyhopper wrote: »

That said, I'll probably fall over in front of an appreciative crowd the next time I head out...

I was using them five years before I had my first fail to unclip moment. In fairness the cleats were worn.

petethedrummer

The only thing I 'd say is to make sure your cleats are screwed good and tight onto your shoe. I fell off a few month ago stopped at lights when my SPDs wouldn't come out till I was lying on the ground.

blorg

petethedrummer wrote: »

The only thing I 'd say is to make sure your cleats are screwed good and tight onto your shoe. I fell off a few month ago stopped at lights when my SPDs wouldn't come out till I was lying on the ground.

Actually when I say worn, that is what happened with mine, they came loose of the shoe.

Paul Kiernan

CramCycle wrote: »

Not trying to be smart but what roundabout are you getting off on the 3rd exit on a bike?
I don't know as I only use one crossing at the M50

The one at Carrickmines. I come down Glenamuck road from Kilternan and cross the motorway there. The second exit is the entrance to the M50 and I have to make it to the 3rd. Not easy when pedalling with one leg!

There is a bike lane but it's such a pain in the arse to use it through the junction that I go on the road and then join it on the other side.

cdaly_

A colleague of mine changed his pedals for SPDs today. Sat up on the bike and tried a few clip / unclips before heading out of the car park for a test ride. Rode up to a semi-track stand at the top of the car park ramp and (in his own words, thinking "Isn't there something I'm supposed to be doing now?") keeled over...

Stifled the giggles and followed him up the ramp to slag see was he ok...