1st bike wash - absolute disaster!

austinbyrne21

Hi all,

I need advice... After a morning spin today I thought I'd give the bike it's 1st wash.

Used this link http://worldwidecyclesblog.com/2007/06/11/tip-of-the-week-bike-washing/, as it was posted in another thread and seemed one of the better websites.

The only thing different I did to this was to use this degreaser, http://www.fatspanneruk.com/product_details.aspx?Product=Concentrated-Degreaser, instead of the Jizer one that the website uses.

I even used the exact same Park tools brushes.

So, I started brushing on the degreaser on chain, cassette, chain rings etc. and left it for about 10mins. Then came back with my warm soapy water to wash it off (again using the same brush from the website). Here's were it went downhill.

It was like I just provoked the grime and **** into sticking on for dear life. The best way I can describe it is like gloss paint, I could blast this stuff with a fire engine hose and it's not coming off.

It didn't turn into a nice white chalky substance and wash off.

Now, my bike looks awful. All this grime crap all over my chainset, chain stay, chain, cassette, deraillers...

Was it just a case of using rubbish degreaser (from Wheelworx) or was my chain just too far gone for cleaning. Didn't look it.

Any quick fix solution? And by quick fix I mean VERY quick fix. I've a dualathlon in Phoenix Park on Wednesday evening that obviously I could be doing with a bike for.

Sorry for this being rediculously long but I thought I might get more help if I described my dilemma in detail.

Thanks in advance!

kona

I never leave degreaser on for more than 5 mins.....

You probably need to take it apart and clean each bit individually with plenty of degreaser.

What brand is the degreaser?

Hungrycol

Have you tried a tooth brush and white spirits?

bcmf

if you have the tools remove the parts that are removeable ie cassette chain,chainrings. get yourself a bucket or basin and some diesel/kerosene.leave the parts to soak for an hour or so. when you take them out (deffo were heavy duty gloves of some description) and with and old toothbrush give them a gentle scrub. Another quick dip and then make sure all the diesel/kero is washed off.Dry thouroughly as any left that gets into bearings etc will remove essential grease.
I wouldnt use it on your rear mech unless you can disassemble and re-assemble it with a hint of grease.It will also remove any paint/stickers so dont use on it on your frame etc.
Dont forget to lube your chain fully after it has been FULLY dried out

austinbyrne21

@Kona - The degreaser brand is "fatspanner", it's 1 I bought in Wheelworx the other evening.

@Hungrycol - Didn't know I could get away with white spirits, might give that a go.

@bcmf - I'd have neither the tools nor, more importantly, the know-how to chance the disassembling it.

blorg

Get a chain cleaner; they really do work very well indeed. You just fill with degreaser, clamp it on the chain and rotate the pedals backwards. Chain comes out as shiny as they day you bought it.

austinbyrne21

blorg wrote: »

Get a chain cleaner; they really do work very well indeed. You just fill with degreaser, clamp it on the chain and rotate the pedals backwards. Chain comes out as shiny as they day you bought it.

Yea, I think I should've just got 1 of these in the 1st place alright. Learned the hard way I guess. As I won't be able to get my hands on 1 of these before Wednesday evening would it do my bike much damage to complete a 13km route in Phoenix Park. My chain at the minute is quite grubby but my cassette and deraillers seem fine. Don't know if there'd be any use in lubing it up in that state, would there? Any advice?

blorg

It will probably be fine; 13km is not very long. You could probably get a chain cleaner in a local bike shop. Wipe/scrub off what you can, lube it and wipe off any excess.

austinbyrne21

Cheers Blorg, I'll give that a go. And then get a chain catcher Thursday and give it a good once over.

Peetrik

Actually I recently tackled this for the first time myself. Used fairy liquid instead of an expensive degreaser and same thing happened, it just smeared all the oil and grit and grime all over the place.

I ripped up an old t-shirt and wiped and scraped everything off and then washed again, wiped up and washed again and it came out perfect.

Then just lubed up, left it over night and wiped off the excess lube and it ran like a dream

Captain Havoc

Clean the bike often and don't lash oodles of oil on it either.

xz

blorg wrote: »

Get a chain cleaner; they really do work very well indeed. You just fill with degreaser, clamp it on the chain and rotate the pedals backwards. Chain comes out as shiny as they day you bought it.

alternetively you could use Diesel instead of degreaser, its cheaper for the same amount, cleans well and leaves a nice oily residue, which is a good state for the chain to be left in overnight, in morning wipe as dry as possible and lube as normal.

biomed32

cleaned my bike properly for the first time in ages, the whole lot chain and all and all i used was halfords car wash which had degreaser in it. i put it on the chain and sprokets neat and diulted down to clean the frame, i swear the bike looks as new even though its about 6 years old:D

austinbyrne21

biomed32 wrote: »

cleaned my bike properly for the first time in ages, the whole lot chain and all and all i used was halfords car wash which had degreaser in it. i put it on the chain and sprokets neat and diulted down to clean the frame, i swear the bike looks as new even though its about 6 years old:D

What was the brand of this and roughly how much did it cost if you don't mind me asking?

biomed32

http://www.halfords.ie/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_11101_catalogId_15551_productId_714871_langId_-1_categoryId_212371

there you go mate, it worked for me, just be sure to wash it off real well and dry up with a clean cloth

austinbyrne21

Cheers Biomed32, that's great. Might try getting up to Halfords tomorrow on my lunch break to get some of that stuff. Thanks again!

kona

Peetrik wrote: »

Actually I recently tackled this for the first time myself. Used fairy liquid instead of an expensive degreaser and same thing happened, it just smeared all the oil and grit and grime all over the place.

Fairy liquid = BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD


It has salt in it to agitate baked on crud, very bad stuff from a corrosive point of view.

Peetrik

Really? oh smeg... was told it cuts grease and is mild enough to ingest so is grand for components.

Looks like Ill be hitting halfords myself so

Cheers
P

Lumen

Peetrik wrote: »

Looks like Ill be hitting halfords myself so

Get a big container of car shampoo. Lasts ages and doesn't have salt in it. Not much use for the drivetrain (that's what you need degreaser for) but is good for the rest.

tomasrojo

The salts in washing-up liquid were mentioned in an older thread.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=64567864

As I said there, I've been using washing-up liquid for many years, and with no problems. I can't see the salt causing any problems if you wash it off promptly and thoroughly. I certainly haven't seen any problems at all, and my chain-life seems to be absolutely normal.

Murph100

+1 Except make sure its 'Wax Free' otherwise braking gets very interesting

Simoniz do a wax free one, found it in Woodies, local Halfords doesn't seem to stock it.

Lumen wrote: »

Get a big container of car shampoo. Lasts ages and doesn't have salt in it. Not much use for the drivetrain (that's what you need degreaser for) but is good for the rest.

Lumen

tomasrojo wrote: »

As I said there, I've been using washing-up liquid for many years, and with no problems. I can't see the salt causing any problems if you wash it off promptly and thoroughly. I certainly haven't seen any problems at all, and my chain-life seems to be absolutely normal.

The problem is more that you have to be confident you've washed it all off, and that some hasn't worked its way into places it shouldn't (like bearings).

Since there are lots of cheap alternatives available I personally don't think it's worth the hassle of using washing up liquid for proper bike washing, although it's fine for general wiping down.

gerardduff

I bought this and it works a treat. It comes with biodegradable (is that a word? looks weird) degreaser, which works well, but remember the junk that comes off is not bio so best not to go chucking it down the shore. It's remarkable that the degreaser works so well and is made of orange rinds or something. Cleaning the chain with white spirit is horrible as it leaves the chain it a right state and can make it difficult to lube properly until it is well and truly dried out...which can take an age. I have heard of a half parafin half white spirit bath but have never tried it and sounds a bit too 1950's for my liking.

RoubX

for a few spots or particularly grimey bits on the frame, you could use WD-40 on a clean old rag. Quite expensive to wash your whole bike in it though!
Also, by mentioning WD-40 I know I risk bringing the wrath of the entire board down on me. I'm only talking about degreasing! It also doubles a nice aftershave for those special nights out...

Paul Kiernan

OP - it sounds like you just didn't use enough degreaser to break down all the greasy gunge. It likes trying to wash up a load of greasy dishes without enough washing up liquid. Normally after degreasing everything just washes off with water leaving it all spotless.

BTW, this chain cleaner (with free postage) from PBK looks like a steal!

austinbyrne21

Paul Kiernan wrote: »

OP - it sounds like you just didn't use enough degreaser to break down all the greasy gunge. It likes trying to wash up a load of greasy dishes without enough washing up liquid. Normally after degreasing everything just washes off with water leaving it all spotless.

BTW, this chain cleaner (with free postage) from PBK looks like a steal!

Yea, reckon you're right. I got that car wash, Halford's own brand stuff this evening and it worked a treat. I could eat my dinner of my chain now. That chain cleaner looks bang-on for me alright, even if it turns out rubbish it's only €8.

On another note, I'm leaving the chain the way it is over night - clean. When I lube it up tomorrow, do I rub it down afterwards or just let it drip-dry if you know what I mean.

Lumen

austinbyrne21 wrote: »

On another note, I'm leaving the chain the way it is over night - clean. When I lube it up tomorrow, do I rub it down afterwards or just let it drip-dry if you know what I mean.

Don't leave the chain overnight, it'll probably go rusty. Best to wipe dry and lubricate immediately, or after an hour or so. Doesn't matter if it's still a bit wet.

Apply lube to the top of the bottom of the chain, so that gravity drives the lube into the pins - that's where you want it, nowhere else. There should be no dripping, but you can wipe off excess with a cloth/kitchen towel. If you leave lube on the plates it'll just attract crud.

austinbyrne21

@Lumen - Cheers for the heads up, just went out there now and lube it up. Seems to be running much smoother, I'll know for sure tomorrow when I'm on it.

Reckon that's my 1st cleaning finished - about 34 hours after starting. Christ, that was epic! I think I learned everything the hard way.

Tayto2000

I think reading your post, and assuming that the stuff you bought isn't rubbish, the only place you went wrong was leaving it for ten minutes... It sounds like you dissolved the grease but left it on long enough for your solvent to evaporate, leaving the gunge behind...

Like Paul Kiernan said, use more and work it with the brush while it's fresh. Chain scrubbers are very useful too if you don't want to take the chain off.

blorg

Honestly when you get a chain cleaning machine you will wonder how you ever lived without it. That PBK one (or the Barberi one) will do the job grand and much better than nothing but having bought the more expensive Park one I would say it is better and worth it. I started with the Barberi one from PBK and it just wasn't quite as solid or well sealed and the brushes wore out quicker. But for the price it is hard to complain; it does do the job.

austinbyrne21

Yea, I definitely reckon the chain cleaner is the way to go. And I think the Park Tools one is the one for me. I'm a bit of a brand whore, I'm not ashamed to admit. And it'd go nicely with my Park Tools set of brushes. What degreaser do you use with it? I see you get a little bottle with the chain cleaner but surely this would only last a couple of washes. Do you just buy your own degreaser?

tomasrojo

If you want to clean the bike before you have a chain-cleaner, I find this works well:

Soak a j-cloth in soapy water (as I said, I use a squirt of washing-up liquid, but if you fear the salt then use something else). Squeeze the cloth around the chain and turn the pedals backwards until the whole chain has passed between your fingers and over the cloth a few times; squeeze the sides and then the top of the chain. Then get an old dish-washing brush and press it against the sprockets, turning the pedals backwards. Repeat for the chain rings. Rinse off the suds thoroughly with hot water, not soapy.

Works for me anyway.

Paul Kiernan

I got this degreaser from CRC when my Park tools bottle ran out. I believe Halfords do a similiar one for €15.

blorg

austinbyrne21 wrote: »

Yea, I definitely reckon the chain cleaner is the way to go. And I think the Park Tools one is the one for me. I'm a bit of a brand whore, I'm not ashamed to admit. And it'd go nicely with my Park Tools set of brushes. What degreaser do you use with it? I see you get a little bottle with the chain cleaner but surely this would only last a couple of washes. Do you just buy your own degreaser?

I use Fenwicks FS-1- neat it is a good degreaser and diluted 10-1 a good general bike cleaner like Muc-Off. That Weltite Citrus one linked by Paul looks like very good value though, I will order that next and give it a try. The Park Chainbrite is just too expensive IMO @twice the price of FS-1/that Weldtite.

WithCheesePlease

Paul Kiernan wrote: »

BTW, this chain cleaner (with free postage) from PBK looks like a steal!

How does that work? Do you need to take your chain off to use it?

And does it come with brushes?

blorg

WithCheesePlease wrote: »

How does that work? Do you need to take your chain off to use it?

And does it come with brushes?

It is just a bottle of degreaser. The generally accepted ways to use it would be to:

- pour it into your chain cleaner and rotate pedals backwards
- take off chain and shake it in a bottle containing degreaser
- drip it onto the chain and try to scrub off the dirt with brushes/cloths

Of those three options I prefer the first. I use the last one on my fixed gears as it is difficult to rotate the pedals backwards where I clean the bike. I use a Grunge Brush and it does work but not as well as a chain cleaner machine.

Lumen

blorg wrote: »

it is difficult to rotate the pedals backwards where I clean the bike

In the bath?

blorg

Lumen wrote: »

In the bath?

I didn't want to say it in case it was seen as a bit eccentric.

WithCheesePlease

Thanks (not for the picture of some guy showering!) but I was wondering how the chain cleaner machine works... Can you just feed the chain through that while it's still on the derailer or do you need to take the chain off first?

gerardduff

Check this or this for a tutorial on how to use a chain cleaner

Paul Kiernan

WithCheesePlease wrote: »

How does that work? Do you need to take your chain off to use it?

And does it come with brushes?

I don't think that one comes with brushes (but it is cheap:)).

The chain will carry the degreaser from the chain cleaner all around the chainset and cassette and through the rear mech. This will dissolve all the gunge (which I imagine is just lubricant, road dirt and metal filings). It might need a bit of brushing to loosen eveything. Some people use a roll of toilet paper and let the chain pull it over the chainset and cassette. I usually run through the gears as well to spread it around. It should all then easily hose off leaving just shiny, clean bare metal. This then needs to be dried and the chain re-lubed fairly quickly.