Laminate vs Engineered

tails_naf

Hi All,
We're at the stage where we have to decide on flooring for the ground floor.
We're going with tile and woodfloor (isn't everyone?) - but in shopping around we have been constantly told by flooring sellers that the high quality laminates are the way to go.

They say the good laminates look like the real thing, don't mark, easier to install (click lock), much cheaper, etc.

I'd like to hear opinions on this. Until this week I hadn't given laminates a second thought, thinking they were something you put in an attic or other room you rarely use.

Are they really that good that you can't tell the difference?
Do they feel the same when walked on, or do the spring (as I'd imagine they would due to their considerably less weight/strength)?

It's hard to break mentally from the thought of having real wood, but if I truly can't tell the difference, why pay it?

gman2k

Eh, that's a no for me. Give me a good eng board over a lam any day.
It's much more substantial, and will take wear and tear better.
A good eng board will have at least 6mm top layer, which can be resanded a couple of times over it's lifespans. Scratch a laminate floor and that piece is for the bin.
Eng board is much heavier, and less prone to warping and thermal expansion.
You say 'they say .. good laminates...don't mark..." Is this a salesperson taking the proverbial? Any product in the home can be marked, especially a product that is literally going to be walked all over!

mr_edge_to_you

Tails, in the exact same boat as yourself. Unfortunately cost is a massive issue as you get nearer the end. Laminate is the best value flooring product on the market to get a house finished. Our lovely walnut semi solid sitting room floor cost the same as laminate for our 5 bedrooms. No debate for us at this stage. I'd rather laminate than concrete.

Calibos

Ditto. Having to think about flooring now. Tiles in the bathrooms and the Kitchen/Lounge, carpet on the stairs and everywhere upstairs and due to budget and pets, laminate in the hall, dining room and sitting/livingroom. Builder introduced us to a flooring guy who brought out samples from various manufacturers.

tbh when I saw them I said to myself, I thought laminates were supposed to have come on in leaps and bounds in the last few years. My arse!!

Then I came to the Balterio samples. Ah now we're talkin. They had much more realistic wood effect and colours and the surface texture was very realistic. Whereas the other manufacturers boards if they had any surface texture at all had an even raised striped surface texture, the balterio had raised surface texture that mirrored/followed the wood effect grain underneath including the knots. Hope I have explained what I mean well enough.

Have a look at the balterio website.

clancon d

i totally agree.. engineered floors are fantastic but as the last chap says.. balterio/parador are absolutely savage laminate floors.. i bought a parador walnut laminate.have it down 2 years now.. like brand new. kids/dogs/tools/stileto's etc all passed through..heavy footfall and its in great condition.. <SNIP>

EDIT: Do not name your company on thread again

Overheal

Well I'll play Devil's Advocate then. I work for a Mom'n'Pop flooring store in the US.

Engineered Hardwood - well, you know you cant go solid, on the slab. Engineered is great for Resale and Aesthetics. It will weather and age - when exposed to UV, hardwoods darken (cork-floors lighten) and regular foot traffic is gonna beat down on the floor a little bit. youll see the knicks and gouges.
If you're going to go for real wood, theres 2 ways to go - posh and shiney (cheaper) or go for the Rustic, Distressed, Wire-Brushed (personal favorite) and Handscrapes. The advantages of those is that you wont go Grey when someone gouges it. Your dog's claws suddenly add Character - not Damage, to the floor. As a result, much easier on resale and the eyes. "Its not a Bug; its a Feature."

Now if you would Rather have that Smooth Finish, I'd steer you towards the High-End Laminates. Wilsonart, Formica (another favorite, the Quintessa Lineup) and Shaw all have very incredible looking laminates. The thing is, you're paying as much, if not more, for those as you would a basic hardwood floor. But you get the advantages of the Scratch Resistance. And you can get the Hand-Scraped look in a laminate, so if/when scuffs do occur, they aren't nearly as noticeable.

As I was saying too: Hardwoods Age and Darken; Laminates are very colorfast. If you NEED to make a repair, and have a few cartons in the attic of either: it will be very easy to swap out laminate planks, and very difficult to replace hardwood. Not just because you put the Hardwood in with Glue - but because after even a year, let alone 5, that spare carton in the attic will never match the color of whats already down.

Formica has some Fantastic looks (if these brands are even available overseas!); Wilsonart has the best warranty in the business though. Highly resistant to drop-impacts, very high durability. I could just give 2 ****s about the look. Formica likes to be different, and really gets the advantage of laminate: you dont need to have a Boring Species in a laminate. Your Walnuts, Your Pecans, Your Plum and Apple woods, and usually-very-soft-Pine are all on offer, with all of the looks and none of the problems of using the real thing. Pine in particular, unless youre aiming for the Distressed look (which is fantastic looking. I would marry Pine if I could) is really unsuitable as a resilient floor. Way too soft of a grain.

So if your main buying-point is Resilience: Go for Laminate. Laminates have come a long way in 10 years to being mistaken for the real thing - and I love pranking my customers about it.

"Hi How can I help you today"

"Oh Im fine, Im just browsing your selection of Wood Floors. Im sick of Pergo (laminate)"

*customer is clearly in the laminates section*

If you want it for Aesthetics and bragging rights, Hardwood is the way to go. And if you have real water issues (poorly trained dogs, spills, etc) Then truthfully neither is suitable - and dont be fooled by the ceramic-look-laminates. They are as vulnerable to spills as wood. In which case, Ceramic/Porcelain is still a good option in a Foyer.

ThePiedPiper

We put down laminates all upstairs and in two rooms downstairs and they look really good. The nasty looking laminates that were about 5 or 10 years ago look terrible but the newer stuff looks the business, is hard wearing and affordable enough. If however, you've got wads of cash at this stage of your bill and don't mind paying 4 times the price for a similar, but superior product, then go for it...

Baylee

I think laminate flooring is the best kind of flooring that is out there in the market presently. It is very easy to install and maintain. The cost is also very less. The only problem with laminate flooring is that it cannot be refinished. But they last for a very long time. They are well worth the money you spend.

________________
Laminate Wood Flooring

mr_edge_to_you

Well the first room of laminate is in and the results are great. Our carpenters are fitting it so its being kept nice and tight. It's a nice cheap way of finishing off the house.

imitation

I`m kinda torn on this one too, I know laminate is the way to for bedrooms and seldom used rooms, but I would love a nice solid/engineered floor in the living room. The thing about it is that I would like a walnut colored floor, and they seem to mark very badly from stuff like furniture legs, no matter how careful you are its going to happen.

What would you go for in a large ( 6m x4m) open plan room with alot of light ? Can you lay solid wood floors straight onto concrete or is engineered the way to go ? The room is heated by rads instead of UFH.

justflow1983

Another point to keep in mind is the question of offgassing, if you're of the mind to worry about these things. Many of the engineered timber floors let off significantly less VOCs than many of the laminate floors. Pergo comes to mind (I can't remember where this info came from) as letting off a high level of VOCs.

BarneyMc

I was in a store today comparing laminates and engineered floors - the laminates were about a third of the cost of the engineered, looked great and apparently are very hard wearing. Has anyone any used laminate flooring in their "good downstairs rooms" and recommend/regret going down that route?

imitation

BarneyMc wrote: »

I was in a store today comparing laminates and engineered floors - the laminates were about a third of the cost of the engineered, looked great and apparently are very hard wearing. Has anyone any used laminate flooring in their "good downstairs rooms" and recommend/regret going down that route?

I went for laminate in the "good" rooms for the last 4 years, I don't have any regrets, it still looks good and it is hard wearing. It doesnt have character like a solid/end floor would, but it looks good. I would say though that lighter colours look better and more natural, dark laminate tends to mark more obviously.

I would also suggest getting decent 10/12mm laminate board rather than the thin 5mm stuff, it doesnt last as well and you can feel it flexing most of the time.

BarneyMc

imitation wrote: »

I went for laminate in the "good" rooms for the last 4 years, I don't have any regrets, it still looks good and it is hard wearing. It doesnt have character like a solid/end floor would, but it looks good. I would say though that lighter colours look better and more natural, dark laminate tends to mark more obviously.

I would also suggest getting decent 10/12mm laminate board rather than the thin 5mm stuff, it doesnt last as well and you can feel it flexing most of the time.

Good, this matches up exactly with what I've been told. It's the 12mm laminate and 3mm underlay I'm looking at.

murphy31ie

Would the thin laminate not be good for the UFH, there was an 8mm laminate in B&Q that was very reasonable, I was only going to get it for baby's room

BarneyMc

murphy31ie wrote: »

Would the thin laminate not be good for the UFH, there was an 8mm laminate in B&Q that was very reasonable, I was only going to get it for baby's room

I asked about this and it's fine for UFH. Personally I'd go for the 12mm just for added strength.

sydthebeat

the thinner laminates tend to curve at the edges over time.
engineered doesnt have this problem

BarneyMc

sydthebeat wrote: »

the thinner laminates tend to curve at the edges over time.
engineered doesnt have this problem

Would the 12mm laminates have this problem?

sydthebeat

BarneyMc wrote: »

Would the 12mm laminates have this problem?

will it be a floating floor? it has a habit of happening when the install isnt very tight, so board ends rub against each with movement

BarneyMc

sydthebeat wrote: »

will it be a floating floor? it has a habit of happening when the install isnt very tight, so board ends rub against each with movement

I'm not sure? It will go down on 3mm underlay which will be placed on top of the finished floor (probably liquid screed).

tbukela

If going with either laminate or an engineered board with UFH, be wary of the underlay. There is a specialist perforated underlay for use with UFH that is quite costly, c. €7 sq yard. However you can get cheaper types with low tog values around the €3.5 sq yard.

We are going with AC4 rated laminate in a lot of the rooms as we have it in current house and its very durable.

BarneyMc

tbukela wrote: »

If going with either laminate or an engineered board with UFH, be wary of the underlay. There is a specialist perforated underlay for use with UFH that is quite costly, c. €7 sq yard. However you can get cheaper types with low tog values around the €3.5 sq yard.

We are going with AC4 rated laminate in a lot of the rooms as we have it in current house and its very durable.

Thanks for this info. So does the perforated underlay let the heat up through the floor better?

tbukela

So does the perforated underlay let the heat up through the floor better?

So I was told in a couple of different shops when I asked about the underlay. They also said that the extra price for the perforated over the low tog underlay wasn't worth the extra money. I was advised to stay away from any of the foam underlays.
If you are putting down any carpets you will have the same problem with the underlay also.

BarneyMc

tbukela wrote: »

So I was told in a couple of different shops when I asked about the underlay. They also said that the extra price for the perforated over the low tog underlay wasn't worth the extra money. I was advised to stay away from any of the foam underlays.
If you are putting down any carpets you will have the same problem with the underlay also.

Sorry, are you saying the more expensive perforated underlay is not worth the extra money although it does perform a bit better?

tbukela

BarneyMc wrote: »

Sorry, are you saying the more expensive perforated underlay is not worth the extra money although it does perform a bit better?

Yes, that is what I was told. Unless the perforated underlay is twice as good as the next best its not worth twice the price.

imitation

BarneyMc wrote: »

Would the 12mm laminates have this problem?

I have had 12 mm installed the past 4 years with the basic foam overlay on a concrete floor, no sign of any issues yet, it feels like very rigid and isn't excessively noisy. I guess a good installer and base floor are important.

little_monty

I've just put down a floating floor 12mm krontotex laminate (in kitchen, hall, bedrooms) with 4mm underlay

I'm happy with it so far. It does look good and any wear over time should be well camafloged.

It can feel a little spongy. this is partly due to my imperfect floor & the 4mm underlay. (my last house had an engineered floating floor which also felt spongy).