What foxes can and will do to young lambs *Graphic photo warning*

johngalway

Sunday April 18th

What with my course, travelling, farming and shooting I've not been getting much shut eye. A couple of nights ago a ewe had twins on part of my Dads farm. All was well, good ewe with plenty of milk for them, as they'd been fed for the past while after our disaster of a winter. Lambs were up and about and sucking.

Then this happened.



And this...



I rang my shooting buddy John, we agreed it must be a dog fox. Thinking a vixen would bring the entire lamb/s off with her for either her own cubs or a relations cubs. I figure the ewe left the lambs asleep to graze and our villain knocked them off at the one time, instead of killing one and returning for the other.

We had been out here already (same night as that ewe had the twins), as a ewe had turned up at the trough for feed with blood about her tail, but, no lamb in tow and none to be found in that part of the farm. Stayed out until the juice went in the batteries, and saw zilch.

Tonight the plan is to be on station for 11.30pm, and stretch out into the night as long as we can. We didn't think our fox was coming early. Conditions are brutal for shotgun, which is what John uses. It's too calm, too bright, and the ground doesn't make it possible to move silently. So, John is the night beater really, not bothered about making noise, walking about to rise a fox in my direction or keep an eye on places I can't see then signal me.

I'd picked out my spot for tonight during the daytime. It gave me a pretty much 300° view around the hillock I was on. In front of me there's a path running left right with fox scat on it, to my left there's a path running towards me with scat on it. To my right I can see a long small ridge and a marsh. Behind me, I can't see much, but John is the other side of that hillock so it's covered too.

After the usual goings on, getting cold, bored, fed up, watching John's lamp move about, turning ewes eyes into foxes eyes for the third time I spot what I'm looking for. It's 1.18am, so we've been there just under fifty minutes. There's a set of eyes cresting the ridge off to my right, walking on towards me through the neighbours land which is in the middle of all our land. The fox comes on along the fence, crosses through it and then another and turns to the left as I'm looking at it.

While watching this I've moved 20-30 yards towards the fox and can go no farther due to the marsh. It's not at all bothered by the lamp thank God. As I settle for the shot it stops beside a large rock and the Mr. Hornadys deadly, accurate & dependable Vmax removes this lamb killer from the farm. I never did range it, probably between 150 - 200 yards somewhere, dog fox with a lower K9 missing, broken off some how.



That's one down. Two more foxes to be accounted for on Dad's farm yet, both suspects in missing lambs, as well as two neighbours with fox predation problems, God knows when we'll have the time to get to them! Nothing coming easy this year !!

who the fug

A dead fox always makes me smile.

bunny shooter

Bet the antis won't post them pictures of what the lovely fox does on their site

Tackleberrywho

bunny shooter wrote: »

Bet the antis won't post them pictures of what the lovely fox does on their site

Exactly, Foxes are cute cuddly red dogs that eat grass and herbs, not likkle cutie wootie lambs!

Foxes have been eating lambs amongst other things since their introduction to the country several Hundred years ago.

The Anti's probably do not even know what native Animals are!:D:D

thebiglad

Its just nature - happens with all carniverous animals - can see it any night on National Geographic.

A pet dog could as easily do the same - you gonna shoot them too?

Supports contolling/shooting them for control to allow domestic farming but not for a hobby.

Why not post up some pictures of the aftermath of an attack on lambs etc by Pheasants - they get shot too...

johngalway

thebiglad wrote: »

A pet dog could as easily do the same - you gonna shoot them too?

Yes. As it's entirely legal to shoot a domestic dog about to worry, in the process of worrying, or after worrying sheep, never mind killing. That's LAW.

Supports contolling/shooting them for control to allow domestic farming but not for a hobby.

I am a sheep farmer, my shooting buddy comes from a sheep farming family and lives on a farm, my Dad is a farmer, as are the neighbours I mentioned. What's your point?

...............

bunny shooter

thebiglad wrote: »

...A pet dog could as easily do the same - you gonna shoot them too?............

I'm not from a farm but I was reared in the countryside.

Yes if "pet" dogs are killing lambs attacking sheep or other farm animals they will be shot/put to sleep.

It's the country way !

All true country people know and abide by this.

thebiglad

My point is that most normal folk (those not in the anti-hunting groups) are opposed to hobby shooting and not the necessary control shooting.

Therefore posting up a picture of slaughtered lambs to support the need to control is irrelevant.

Going off on a saturday afternoon for the craic of shooting things is a different point.

bunny shooter

thebiglad wrote: »

My point is that most normal folk (those not in the anti-hunting groups) are opposed to hobby shooting and not the necessary control shooting......

The various hunting/fishing bodies in this country have a verifiable membership figure.

Where is you proof to back up your statement ?

And your statement makes the assumption that some folk are not "normal". How are you qualified to say what is normal ?

thebiglad

A pet dog could as easily do the same - you gonna shoot them too?

Yes. As it's entirely legal to shoot a domestic dog about to worry, in the process of worrying, or after worrying sheep, never mind killing. That's LAW.

John, guess should you see this thread - perhaps you can provide advice on what ammunition to use

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?threadid=2055887218

bunny shooter

Federal 52 grain BTHP from my .220 Swift is all that's required for any size dog or fox

Biglad where do you live/were you reared................urban or rural ?

Rovi

thebiglad wrote: »

A pet dog could as easily do the same - you gonna shoot them too?

Yes. As it's entirely legal to shoot a domestic dog about to worry, in the process of worrying, or after worrying sheep, never mind killing. That's LAW.

John, guess should you see this thread - perhaps you can provide advice on what ammunition to use

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?threadid=2055887218

[MOD NOTICE]
Just a gentle reminder of the Shooting/Hunting Charter to any of the regulars here thinking of posting on that thread:

Posting in Hunting to troll users in Animal Welfare or Animal&Pet Issues is not acceptable; nor are regular posters from Hunting who troll in those forums. In both cases, infractions and/or bans may be given by mods in both forums even if the user only posted in one forum.

The OP in that thread appears to be genuinely aghast at what apparently happened, and is looking for advice on how to proceed.
They've been given good advice to approach the owner of the sheep and to keep their dog securely fenced in future.
It's not certain whether their dog actually killed the sheep or merely came across the carcass; either way, that's for them and the sheep's owner and possibly the Dog Warden to sort out.

The OP is having something of a crash course in the Country Code (and the Law) regarding dogs worrying livestock and the potential consequences for both themselves and the dog, and they appear to be genuinely contrite and determined to make things 'right', as best they can.

Please bear this in mind when replying, and please also remember that you're something of an ambassador for the hunting/shooting community over in that neck of the woods.
[/MOD NOTICE]

thebiglad

bunny shooter wrote: »

Federal 52 grain BTHP from my .220 Swift is all that's required for any size dog or fox

Biglad where do you live/were you reared................urban or rural ?

I am was raised urban but father from a farming family (who still farm) so many summer holidays spent in that environment.

monarch

thebiglad wrote: »

My point is that most normal folk (those not in the anti-hunting groups) are opposed to hobby shooting and not the necessary control shooting.

Therefore posting up a picture of slaughtered lambs to support the need to control is irrelevant.

Going off on a saturday afternoon for the craic of shooting things is a different point.

ever heard of each to there own, look after your own corner and all the rest.
if all the anti's manage to get blood sports banned is this country are ye going to go around the country giving money to all the farmers that will be out of pocket,no grass or crops because of deer damage no lambs because of foxs, and of course all the lost revenue to the government which i am sure ye will pay and ye will provide jobs for all of those who will be out of work. Dont think ye will be doing that so dont ye wake up to some real issues in this country and realise that country sports were here long before ye and please god long after ye are gone.

wolfpawnat

OP may I ask how you are sure it was the work of a fox. As other users have said, there are a number of animals capible of killing a lamb, mink are always a prime suspect, as are pet dogs.

greenpeter

Has to be the most heart breaking thing any sheep farmer could come across.:mad:
Some pile of foxes down your way john, you have as much work with them as lambing by the looks of things.


As for dogs seen a few Grey hounds go on a rampage on Sunday in a field of new Born's, they killed about 20 odd lambs before we got them and would attack a person if they got in there way. Once they get the taste of blood all hell will break loose and only a bullet will stop them.

johngalway

wolfpawnat wrote: »

OP may I ask how you are sure it was the work of a fox. As other users have said, there are a number of animals capible of killing a lamb, mink are always a prime suspect, as are pet dogs.

Mink will bite the neck and bleed them.

Birds, be they greycrows, ravens, black backed gulls, the eyes would have been the first to go, also there wouldn't have been any chewing.

Dogs, the ewes would have been extremely disturbed and gathered up together, either in a corner or on a height, basically an area they feel they can defend.

Foxy is Mr Culprit in this instance.

johngalway

thebiglad wrote: »

My point is that most normal folk (those not in the anti-hunting groups) are opposed to hobby shooting and not the necessary control shooting.

Therefore posting up a picture of slaughtered lambs to support the need to control is irrelevant.

Going off on a saturday afternoon for the craic of shooting things is a different point.

Where are your statistics to prove most people are opposed to hobby shooting please?

The photos are there for the benefit of people getting into this line of work. Seeing the damage caused will help others decide what's done damage and how to take appropriate action to stop it. There is an obvious note on the topic title saying graphic photos are included, if you do not like those photos, perhaps you should not view the thread.

The relevance of Saturday afternoon shooting to this thread is lost on me.

thebiglad wrote: »

A pet dog could as easily do the same - you gonna shoot them too?

Yes. As it's entirely legal to shoot a domestic dog about to worry, in the process of worrying, or after worrying sheep, never mind killing. That's LAW.

John, guess should you see this thread - perhaps you can provide advice on what ammunition to use

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?threadid=2055887218

I read that thread earlier in the day. You're trolling at this point so I've no further interest in talking to you.

bunny shooter

thebiglad wrote: »

I am was raised urban but father from a farming family (who still farm) so many summer holidays spent in that environment.

I note you ignored my other questions and JG has asked more or less the same questions so we await your answers

You hoilday in the country and you know all about it :rolleyes:

Ask your father he will know what's going on

I live in the country. Have most of my life. Have been around farms and farmers most of my life. JG is a sheep farmer.

And you think you know more than us about the countryside and it's ways

kowloon

I've had ducks and chickens taken by foxes, but on one occassion the fox killed most of my chickens and left half of them. I suspect it was a vixen and her extended family. Since then I've built a pen at great expense. A few times I've gone up at feeding time to see a fox looking in trying to figure out how to get at the chickens.

Fox proof pens, the kind a fox can't dug under or jump over, are not cheap.

endasmail

last thursday during the day ,the lad i work with was was having a cup of tea looking out the window
a fox was making off down the field with one of his ducks in its mouth
the duck was that heavy ,the fox had to stop every few yards ,take a breather and continue on again

friday night/sat morn
same lad goes out to hen/duck shed
only to find one hen missing
the rest were all killed ,including all his ducks
fox and got in through building site fences ,either climbed in or dug under

unlike john i haven got any pics
but working with the lad for week was evidence enough for me

kay 9

Good stuff John. Pity how someone always comes along though to try and ruin a good thing:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Surfing_Xboxer

Wow...A fox kills to eat?!?!?!? ..... Such a shock......!!!!

Dear god..

gavlaw

Surfing_Xboxer wrote: »

Wow...A fox kills to eat?!?!?!? ..... Such a shock......!!!!

Dear god..

how long did it take you to figure that out:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

kippy

Jaysus, a concerted PR exercise by the hunters, strange one that.
"Look at the bad bad fox kill the lovely ickle lambs" (forgetting that we ourselves eat the ickle lambs with it suits us, at least we cut them up neatly I suppose - hope no one decides to go hunting us, oh wait)


I am neither pro or anti hunting, but these cheap PR exercises from both sides infuriates me.

Surfing_Xboxer

kippy wrote: »

Jaysus, a concerted PR exercise by the hunters, strange one that.
"Look at the bad bad fox kill the lovely ickle lambs" (forgetting that we ourselves eat the ickle lambs with it suits us, at least we cut them up neatly I suppose - hope no one decides to go hunting us, oh wait)


I am neither pro or anti hunting, but these cheap PR exercises from both sides infuriates me.

DITTO

IRLConor

Be polite and respectful to all other posters regardless of their point of view, please.

This is aimed at all of you.

gavlaw

well your point of view is different so i would think it was

Surfing_Xboxer

I just think posting a picture of something a fox MIGHT of done ( and HAS to do to survive ) is a lame reason to justify killing it ....

EPIC FAIL..My opinion and no insult intended

Amalgam

Not going to get entagled in a pro\against argument..

Just curious about the pictures, whatever killed the animals seems quite wasteful, is that normal for lamb kills, or just particular to these photos?

johngalway

Surfing_Xboxer wrote: »

I just think posting a picture of something a fox MIGHT of done ( and HAS to do to survive ) is a lame reason to justify killing it ....

If you know it all, what killed those two lambs?

A lot of people who think they know it all deny foxes will take lambs. That information is totally incorrect and is fed to many people day in day out.

This is not a PR exercise and I resent the accusation. The justification in shooting the fox is in protecting my fathers livestock from predation, which I am well within my rights to do.

There is a warning in plain English in the title of this thread that it contains graphic images of what foxes do to lambs. It's your own issues that yourself and Kippy chose to open the thread and start talking nonsense.

And please, answer my opening question.

gavlaw

Surfing_Xboxer wrote: »

I just think posting a picture of something a fox MIGHT of done ( and HAS to do to survive ) is a lame reason to justify killing it ....

EPIC FAIL..My opinion and no insult intended

its clear you just dont understand what would you do if your house was over run with rats would you just let them get into your cupboards and eat your food which cost you money to put there dont think so

johngalway

Amalgam wrote: »

Not going to get entagled in a pro\against argument..

Just curious about the pictures, whatever killed the animals seems quite wasteful, is that normal for lamb kills, or just particular to these photos?

I would say most of the fox calls I've been too there would mostly be legs/skins and tails left around and the rest taken. However, almost all of those calls have been sorted out by a vixen being removed from the area.

My mates Dad used to trap foxes years ago for the skins and has quite an in depth knowledge of their habits. John relayed to him over the phone how the lambs were and his first reaction was "dog fox", hey presto there's a dog fox prowling about that night.

By the by, the area is an island joined to the mainland by bridge, there is severely limited access to other foxes so it's unlikely one just happened to be in the area, if you get what I mean.

You will get instances of foxes raiding hen houses or pheasant pens and they will kill far far more birds than they could possibly eat.

Tackleberrywho

johngalway wrote: »

If you know it all, what killed those two lambs?

A lot of people who think they know it all deny foxes will take lambs. That information is totally incorrect and is fed to many people day in day out.

This is not a PR exercise and I resent the accusation. The justification in shooting the fox is in protecting my fathers livestock from predation, which I am well within my rights to do.

There is a warning in plain English in the title of this thread that it contains graphic images of what foxes do to lambs. It's your own issues that yourself and Kippy chose to open the thread and start talking nonsense.

And please, answer my opening question.

You are correct John, Every Rat I saw my cats take head was missing, same to with rabbits, looks like a big Cat

Although my .223 can have the same effect if it hits skull on Rabbits and fox with Hornady 55grn Molycoated Varmint express.

But i often wonder why guys HIJACK threads!
Not a lot of sheep around me or volunteers to hold my lightforce!

But given the opportunity!
I always find the Silage fields are great hunting grounds in may-August for foxes.
My Mate has a lot of his chickens and other fowl taken by foxes so i get the call every now and then

Surfing_Xboxer

just to clarify...Im not poking fun at anyone...I can understand that your livestock is being killed and you need to protect it

I just dont agree with it

Boards = peoples opinions

sorry if I offended

gavlaw

Surfing_Xboxer wrote: »

just to clarify...Im not poking fun at anyone...I can understand that your livestock is being killed and you need to protect it

I just dont agree with it

Boards = peoples opinions

sorry if I offended

but do you agree with killing rats that get into your house and eat your food

DERICKOO

There is a difference between "fox hunting" and "hunting for foxes".
For those of you that have lived in a cave for your entire life, fox hunting has long been considered to be a great British sport. It's normally just "played" by the ultra-rich upper class twits that unfortunately have yet to understand that we're not living in the 1600s any more. Foxes are scared out of their dens and are chased for hours by idiots on horseback. When the fox eventually begins to tire, trained dogs are allowed to rip the foxes to shreds.

The long justification for this sport is that foxes are vermin and need to be killed. There is some truth in this statement. I grew up in a rural area and have witnessed the damage that foxes cause to livestock. A single fox can easily wipe out a chicken coop in an evening. They don't just take what they need to survive; they will just slaughter everything. It is supposedly possible to make a coop "fox-proof", but these methods are not particularly effective - especially if you want your chickens to remain free-range. Therefore, there are some people that hold that fox hunting is the only way to cull the fox population in Ireland.



there was a time i could shoot a fox at 300 meters or a rabbit at 120meters with only a .22 single shot rifle with a 3-9-40 sight and that was in the head but then i was younger and gung-ho, could get a 4" grouping at 25 meters with a 9mm browning.

this i am not proud of now

times have changed find the balance.

Surfing_Xboxer

gavlaw wrote: »

but do you agree with killing rats that get into your house and eat your food

Sorry , but is quite frankly an obsurd comparsion.... REALLY!

But as I say , every one has their own view and I accept that

gavlaw

DERICKOO wrote: »

There is a difference between "fox hunting" and "hunting for foxes".
For those of you that have lived in a cave for your entire life, fox hunting has long been considered to be a great British sport. It's normally just "played" by the ultra-rich upper class twits that unfortunately have yet to understand that we're not living in the 1600s any more. Foxes are scared out of their dens and are chased for hours by idiots on horseback. When the fox eventually begins to tire, trained dogs are allowed to rip the foxes to shreds.

The long justification for this sport is that foxes are vermin and need to be killed. There is some truth in this statement. I grew up in a rural area and have witnessed the damage that foxes cause to livestock. A single fox can easily wipe out a chicken coop in an evening. They don't just take what they need to survive; they will just slaughter everything. It is supposedly possible to make a coop "fox-proof", but these methods are not particularly effective - especially if you want your chickens to remain free-range. Therefore, there are some people that hold that fox hunting is the only way to cull the fox population in Ireland.



there was a time i could shoot a fox at 300 meters or a rabbit at 120meters with only a .22 single shot rifle with a 3-9-40 sight and that was in the head but then i was younger and gung-ho, could get a 4" grouping at 25 meters with a 9mm browning.

this i am not proud of now

times have changed find the balance.

i dont think at any stage did any person that is a regular on this hunting forum mention that they were hunting for foxes all we talk about is fox hunting

gavlaw

Surfing_Xboxer wrote: »

Sorry , but is quite frankly an obsurd comparsion.... REALLY!

But as I say , every one has their own view and I accept that

a rat is vermin so is a fox:p:p:p:p:p:p:p

Brian

Have you seen what humans can and will do to just about any other species of animal, themselves included?

Tackleberrywho

DERICKOO wrote: »

There is a difference between "fox hunting" and "hunting for foxes".
For those of you that have lived in a cave for your entire life, fox hunting has long been considered to be a great British sport. It's normally just "played" by the ultra-rich upper class twits that unfortunately have yet to understand that we're not living in the 1600s any more. Foxes are scared out of their dens and are chased for hours by idiots on horseback. When the fox eventually begins to tire, trained dogs are allowed to rip the foxes to shreds.

The long justification for this sport is that foxes are vermin and need to be killed. There is some truth in this statement. I grew up in a rural area and have witnessed the damage that foxes cause to livestock. A single fox can easily wipe out a chicken coop in an evening. They don't just take what they need to survive; they will just slaughter everything. It is supposedly possible to make a coop "fox-proof", but these methods are not particularly effective - especially if you want your chickens to remain free-range. Therefore, there are some people that hold that fox hunting is the only way to cull the fox population in Ireland.



there was a time i could shoot a fox at 300 meters or a rabbit at 120meters with only a .22 single shot rifle with a 3-9-40 sight and that was in the head but then i was younger and gung-ho, could get a 4" grouping at 25 meters with a 9mm browning.

this i am not proud of now

times have changed find the balance.

Foxes are very cunning Hence Vulpine!
My Gran kept foxes for years. she found a headless chicken once that was pecking out through a tiny hole in the chicken wire, the fox took advantage.

This thread was started about fox Shooting.
The issue is being clouded, The Pics show damage of foxes and carrion Birds. Hence the eyes missing.

I was sunbathing in a field one day after shooting 4 rabbits i was awaiting there return. After 30 mins half asleep with my eyes blurred by the sun shining through my eye lids I was awoke by a fox 2 metres from me, had i not moved I was looking like dinner.
Don't ever think for one second that a fox is mans best friend, they split from Lupine and Canine a long long time ago, in fact they can not even cross bred!

Also as a result of Humans being Dirty and leaving out waste etc foxes are on the increase not decrease.

I have the Luxury of shift work and see another side of Foxes, The night hunter predator/scavenger.

I admire the fox for his success where others have failed.

Fact, there are less Hunters than there every was, Times was every farmer hunted foxes.
I have shot foxes with a .22lr, but I prefer the .223 to ensure a quick dispatch.

How is it a farmers fault for Lambs being eaten? My neighbours tried flashing lights amongst other things. Foxes will get used and after a night or so take the lambs.
the Fox by the way was Introduced by the English so if you want to blame anybody blame them.

There was sheep in Ireland before foxes!!

Does that not mean the sheep has more rights

Surfing_Xboxer

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

Foxes are very cunning Hence Vulpine!
My Gran kept foxes for years. she found a headless chicken once that was pecking out through a tiny hole in the chicken wire, the fox took advantage.

This thread was started about fox Shooting.
The issue is being clouded, The Pics show damage of foxes and carrion Birds. Hence the eyes missing.

I was sunbathing in a field one day after shooting 4 rabbits i was awaiting there return. After 30 mins half asleep with my eyes blurred by the sun shining through my eye lids I was awoke by a fox 2 metres from me, had i not moved I was looking like dinner.
Don't ever think for one second that a fox is mans best friend, they split from Lupine and Canine a long long time ago, in fact they can not even cross bred!

Also as a result of Humans being Dirty and leaving out waste etc foxes are on the increase not decrease.

I have the Luxury of shift work and see another side of Foxes, The night hunter predator/scavenger.

I admire the fox for his success where others have failed.

Fact, there are less Hunters than there every was, Times was every farmer hunted foxes.
I have shot foxes with a .22lr, but I prefer the .223 to ensure a quick dispatch.

How is it a farmers fault for Lambs being eaten? My neighbours tried flashing lights amongst other things. Foxes will get used and after a night or so take the lambs.
the Fox by the way was Introduced by the English so if you want to blame anybody blame them.

There was sheep in Ireland before foxes!!

Does that not mean the sheep has more rights

Great post... Appreciate the info..... and the lack of hostility :P .... I can see your point...

night

johngalway

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

The Pics show damage of foxes and carrion Birds. Hence the eyes missing.

There was no carrion bird damage, no eyes are missing from either lamb.

Tackleberrywho

Surfing_Xboxer wrote: »

Great post... Appreciate the info..... and the lack of hostility :P .... I can see your point...

night

I'm a lover not a fighter!

I found a cow that was about ~4 hours dead, it was still warish, uthers were eaten off it and eyes were gone.

nature at its best.
Some talk about leaving rabbits after shooting, but they feed teh grey crow magpie and fox

Nature is cruel, you watch a bit of David Attenborough and you might realise how so.
A vixen if food is scarce will eat the weaker cubs so have energy to make milk for strong cubs;)

Again Nature is cold but fair, survival of the fittest or smartest! Or Luckiest in some cases!!

Good night Sir!;)

kumate_champ07

foxes eat rabbits and sometimes farmers shoot rabbits, would it be ok then for the fox to kill the farmer?

Tackleberrywho

johngalway wrote: »

There was no carrion bird damage, no eyes are missing from either lamb.

From here it looks so, but you saw first hand.
Normally after a fox a bird arrives

I stand corrected sir.

johngalway

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

From here it looks so, but you saw first hand.
Normally after a fox a bird arrives

I stand corrected sir.

Nope, all eyes accounted for, I can email you the original shots?

Tackleberrywho

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

foxes eat rabbits and sometimes farmers shoot rabbits, would it be ok then for the fox to kill the farmer?

he would if he could!!
Did you not read my previous post a fox was considering eating me one sunny July afternoon in 2006.

And again, For every fox shot at least 4 more a re killed by cars.

So we will ban cars too!
:D:D

gavlaw

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

foxes eat rabbits and sometimes farmers shoot rabbits, would it be ok then for the fox to kill the farmer?

your child bites your pet dog is it ok for your dog to bite your child back

Tackleberrywho

johngalway wrote: »

Nope, all eyes accounted for, I can email you the original shots?

I'll take you at your word John I was not doubting you.

I might even do a bit of foxing down your way in the Summer!

As i work shifts I have no problem shooting all night if needs be!

I take payment in Pints and Fodder