Stuck in a vicious circle

poconnor16

Hi all,

I'm looking for advice. I've recently (over the last 3 months) focussed on exercise and training. Prior to this I was a bit of a yo-yo dieter, I was always a size 12 ranging from 10 st 5lb up to just below 11st at a bad time. I'm 5'7'' and was always medium build.
I am now 11st 4lbs which is just too much for me and I'm now a size 14.
My exercise? Its great, I cycle to work 3 mornings a week, train in taekwondo 2 sometimes 3 times a week....cycle at the weekends too. My diet is generally ok. Because I carry most of the weight around my middle I tried low carb a few times but could not stick to it so the weight piled back on.
I find that I am very tired everyday and this leaves me reaching for sugar foods to wake me up. So I can be very good, then fall off the wagon.
I dont understand why the weight wont shift given the exercise and ok diet (see below). Any ideas on the tiredness?? I'm starting to get discouraged. My muscles on my legs, bum and arms have all increased in size too so I am feeling a little bit too large. I dont want to give up training but I dont like feeling so 'beefed'. :(

Typical diet:
Glass of V8 juice - then cycle to work
Porridge made with water, tsp honey, coffee
Apple
Lunch - tuna, salad greens, palm sized portion of wholegrain pasta mixed in
Orange, or apple, or bag of popcorn
Cycle home
Dinner - chicken & veg & maybe baby potato or rice or pasta (larger serving)

or on a training night I'll just have an Actvia yogurt, 4 ryvita and low fat spread.
2 litres of water a day, multi vitamin, cod liver oil too.

weekend - could be the downfall but I am very relaxed, maybe a bottle of wine and pizza on friday.

Any help without having to go back to low carb?

Sapsorrow

I'd say just try moderate carb and low GL rather than low carb which is hard to stick to for some I guess. Have porridge for breakfast (lose the honey) and try and have no other bread or grains for the rest of the day but allow yourself some root veg instead. Snacking on juice and fruits won't help try having nuts, seeds, eggs, veg crudite and dip etc..

poconnor16

khrystyna100 wrote: »

I'd say just try moderate carb and low GL rather than low carb which is hard to stick to for some I guess. Have porridge for breakfast (lose the honey) and try and have no other bread or grains for the rest of the day but allow yourself some root veg instead. Snacking on juice and fruits won't help try having nuts, seeds, eggs, veg crudite and dip etc..

I find it hard to get my head around the 'no fruit' thing. At about 3pm, when I'm just dying for some chocolate, I'm tired and cranky - I try to have an apple....surely that is not a bad thing?

Sapsorrow

oh ya its way better than chocolate but when you look at your diet overall its jammed full of carbs so I'm not suprised you get cravings, have low energy or are finding it hard to lose. Like an apple or two is grand sugar wise but when you've already had 2 juices, porridge, honey, pasta and rice/potatos etc then you see how it all adds up to a hell of a lot of sugar for one day. Its a trade off if you love having the apples and it saves you from the choc then try and figure out some way to leave out some of the other carbs. If you do nothing else at least lose the juices, honey and make sure the pasta is wholegrain and preferably not wheat. I find coffee with sweetner (xylitol) great for cravings and mid-day energy lags. In particular inthe evenings carbs can be pretty uneccessary for most people as they're usually chilling out and not doing much by then so its not hard to have meat and veg alone.

EDIT: sorry getting my posts crossed, thought you were having an orange juice too!

EileenG

One thing I learned at the last Young Scientists Exhibition in the RDS. Porridge on its own is a very low gi food (one group did studies to demonstate this). However, as soon as you add honey or sugar or syrup, the gi of the whole meal shoots right up.

So you may feel virtuous eating porridge and honey. As far as your body is concerned, you're eating Coco Pops.

Cutting edge research here.

If you want to keep the porridge, you're actually better having it with no sweetener, and either some milk or even a splash of cream. When my father was a kid, everyone ate porridge with butter and/or salt. Never sugar.

corkcomp

if you are constantly tired and carrying a lot of weight around your middle maybe you should have a fasting glucose test done.. IMO

Sapsorrow

EileenG wrote: »

When my father was a kid, everyone ate porridge with butter and/or salt. Never sugar.

That sounds delicious, definately gonna try that soon! Hmm got me thinking about lovely porridge now, think I'll have some for dinner now!

Sapsorrow

corkcomp wrote: »

if you are constantly tired and carrying a lot of weight around your middle maybe you should have a fasting glucose test done.. IMO

Good thinking!

Darkginger

If you're constantly tired and carrying your weight around your middle, then you might just have to come to terms with eating low carb. Sorry about that. On the other hand - have you found any of the wonderful low carb support sites out there that might make you look at low carbing in a whole new light? I am SUCH a foodie it's silly, and yet I low carb - and I really, really enjoy it. It doesn't have to be Atkins, there are tons of options - please feel free to drop me a PM for links etc.

Tonight, I am indulging (every meal feels like an indulgence) in low carb moussaka with a handful of salad leaves. Tomorrow I'm planning a rich quiche (crustless) with mushrooms and broccoli, and possibly a steak with garlic butter for dinner. I've lost 2 stone since Christmas eating this way - and it is soooo enjoyable. I even make cheesecake, and adorn it with berries and whipped cream Even a bottle of red wine is only between 7 and 9 carbs. What's so undo-able about that?

When it comes down to it, the carby 'white' foods - spuds, rice, bread, pasta - have no taste of their own - it's all about mouthfeel. There are ways of getting yer crunch and crisp on

OK, will shut up, was having an evangelical moment, my bad But it has been SUCH a revelation to me - after 25 + years of attempting to low fat diet, that I just feel I want to share the good news with everyone. I think I'm just about on year 7 of low carbing, so it really IS sustainable long term

Getwellsoon

I'd say try some different exercise. I have done a lot of cycling all my life and sometimes I'd be out all day on my bike and was very fit but wondered why the weight wouldn't shift and I was constantly a size 14. I changed a lot about my diet and the weight did come off, but then I hit a plateau and nothing would work even though I was still cycling loads and eating well. I came to the conclusion that my body was just so used to cycling that it didn't do anything for me any more. So I started walking to work instead... yes it took me about 45mins instead of 10-15mins, but it really worked and the weight melted off me! So maybe you should vary your exercise a little more? Your diet seems grand to me, maybe not perfect (pasta should be cut down on for sure), but definitely nothing that should make you overweight.

cafecolour

2nd the blood test. Check iron levels and the like as well.

Also, how aerobic are your workouts? As in are you actually getting to the point of heavy breathing, sweating, etc. when you cycle, or are you just taking a steady pace? When I cycled to work, I often didn't push that hard since I didn't want to get sweaty for my arrival. Luckily it was downhill too work and uphill back

poconnor16

Thanks all for your responses....

Blood test - am definitley going to get the once over from my doctor. Will do no harm to check anyway.
Exercise - think I am ok here. Taekwondo definitley is aerobic enough, no doubt there.:) I might just do some walking at my lunch break for a bit of variation.
The diet is what I have to consider. Giving up porridge is just not going to happen. I eat brekkie at work and I guess it is the convenience of it and the fact that it keeps me full. I tried the Abs Diet, thought it was rubbish. One diet that I found great was South Beach, it really works. But the amount of planning was difficult because I am always on the go plus I though my food bills were a bit expensive.
I might give the South Beach another go and see what happens. I just feel really 'bla' at training when I am low carbing.

J-Fit

I just have a few things to add here that I'm surprised nobody has suggested yet. Especially you corkcomp!

The OP's diet is very low in protein, I count in or around 60+ grams there! It may not be that she has to drastically go low carb but simply that she reduces them somewhat and replaces it with lean sources that will both stabilise blood sugar and raise metabolic rate.

Dito for omega 3s etc. I don't see one primary source of fat in there and I think most of us can vouch for the benefits of fish oil consumed with a carb meal. No wonder you are feeling sluggish and storing abdominal fat!

Rather than just go low carb tomorrow, I suggest transitioning to a more rounded diet that reduces carbs but pays more attention to the vital macronutrients that you've avoided until now. More lean meats, fish, olive oil, fish oil caps, cottage cheese, eggs etc. I think you'll see quite favourable results amid all the suggestions of blood tests etc. If then you are not satisfied, try something else but the fix is an easy one and is probably staring you in the face!

Regarding the cycling, I think many people do not realise that of the much time on the bike is spent just cruising down hills or flat ground and you are essentially in a seated position most of the time. If the cycle is taking you 15 mins or so, the calories burned would be negligible unless your doing intermittent hill sprints at 90% intensity! If you enjoy doing weights, (or even if you don't) it would be a good idea to include a couple of full body sessions every week. It would compliment both your taekwondo and your new diet (should you take on my suggestions).

There are some good suggestions made here and I'm not syaing mine are any better. Just simply another option.

Sapsorrow

Tuna for lunch and chicken for dinner would seem like an adequate amount of protein for the average joe if they are proper sizes, I've eaten less than that for years and never shown any signs of problems. I think more healthy fats would be a good idea.

J-Fit

khrystyna100 wrote: »

Tuna for lunch and chicken for dinner would seem like an adequate amount of protein for the average joe if they are proper sizes, I've eaten less than that for years and never shown any signs of problems. I think more healthy fats would be a good idea.

Fair enough, at the end of the day it is down to you how you eat. My point was that an increase in protein would create a greater thermic effect and were you to keep calorie count stable, you'd be eating less carbohydrates by default. If you combine this with weight training you'd magnify the effects.

Sapsorrow

J-Fit wrote: »

Fair enough, at the end of the day it is down to you how you eat. My point was that an increase in protein would create a greater thermic effect and were you to keep calorie count stable, you'd be eating less carbohydrates by default. If you combine this with weight training you'd magnify the effects.

Oh ya from that perspective yer dead right, I just meant that I don't think the amount of protein listed there is inadequate for someone who's not particularly trying to cut carbs. The more protein you eat the easier it is to eat less of the other macronutrients (and overall kcal) for sure.

poconnor16

J-Fit wrote: »

I just have a few things to add here that I'm surprised nobody has suggested yet. Especially you corkcomp!

The OP's diet is very low in protein, I count in or around 60+ grams there! It may not be that she has to drastically go low carb but simply that she reduces them somewhat and replaces it with lean sources that will both stabilise blood sugar and raise metabolic rate.

Dito for omega 3s etc. I don't see one primary source of fat in there and I think most of us can vouch for the benefits of fish oil consumed with a carb meal. No wonder you are feeling sluggish and storing abdominal fat!

Rather than just go low carb tomorrow, I suggest transitioning to a more rounded diet that reduces carbs but pays more attention to the vital macronutrients that you've avoided until now. More lean meats, fish, olive oil, fish oil caps, cottage cheese, eggs etc. I think you'll see quite favourable results amid all the suggestions of blood tests etc. If then you are not satisfied, try something else but the fix is an easy one and is probably staring you in the face!

Regarding the cycling, I think many people do not realise that of the much time on the bike is spent just cruising down hills or flat ground and you are essentially in a seated position most of the time. If the cycle is taking you 15 mins or so, the calories burned would be negligible unless your doing intermittent hill sprints at 90% intensity! If you enjoy doing weights, (or even if you don't) it would be a good idea to include a couple of full body sessions every week. It would compliment both your taekwondo and your new diet (should you take on my suggestions).

There are some good suggestions made here and I'm not syaing mine are any better. Just simply another option.

Thanks for this JFit - its an interesting approach....could you recommend more information on this? Is there anything I can read up on?

J-Fit

poconnor16 wrote: »

Thanks for this JFit - its an interesting approach....could you recommend more information on this? Is there anything I can read up on?

Anything by John Berardi. Precision Nutrition, Gourmet Nutrition.

--Kaiser--

poconnor16 wrote: »

I find it hard to get my head around the 'no fruit' thing. At about 3pm, when I'm just dying for some chocolate, I'm tired and cranky - I try to have an apple....surely that is not a bad thing?

Most modern apples have huge amounts of sugar in them, probably the same as a bar of chocolate.

IMO craving sugar is not a normal state for the body to be in unless you have hypoglycaemia or other medical condtitions, I think it comes from eating too much carbohydrates.

poconnor16

well......

I'm back to low carb. Following the South Beach diet (I like this approach) but really hoping I can stick to it. I'm in the induction Phase at the moment so training might be difficult tonight. Amazing how 24 hours of no starchy carbs does leave your insides feeling cleaner.
Here's an average food plan for your review (please )

Breakfast - 3 quiche cups (egg, cheese, sping onion, pepper), coffee with skim milk
Snack - organic, plain yoghurt
Lunch - tuna, spinach and mixed salad
Snack - mini cheese string, 15 almonds
Dinner - roast chicken breast stuffed with spinach, large mushroom caps stuffed with chopped veg and cheese. (Dinner is always protein and veg)
Snack - low cal, sugar free jelly

2 litres of water a day, lots of herbal tea, vit supp, cod liver oil and a berooca in the morning to get me going.

This combined with training should be interesting.....

El_Dangeroso

poconnor16 wrote: »

well......

I'm back to low carb. Following the South Beach diet (I like this approach) but really hoping I can stick to it. I'm in the induction Phase at the moment so training might be difficult tonight. Amazing how 24 hours of no starchy carbs does leave your insides feeling cleaner.
Here's an average food plan for your review (please )

Breakfast - 3 quiche cups (egg, cheese, sping onion, pepper), coffee with skim milk
Snack - organic, plain yoghurt
Lunch - tuna, spinach and mixed salad
Snack - mini cheese string, 15 almonds
Dinner - roast chicken breast stuffed with spinach, large mushroom caps stuffed with chopped veg and cheese. (Dinner is always protein and veg)
Snack - low cal, sugar free jelly

2 litres of water a day, lots of herbal tea, vit supp, cod liver oil and a berooca in the morning to get me going.

This combined with training should be interesting.....

That looks like a perfect version of south beach induction.. best of luck!

poconnor16

Oh and I meant to ask....what are everyone's thoughts on Whey Protein? Do you think I could fit that into a low carb diet (mixed with milk) or is there any real need? From my experience, too much milk is bad....

EileenG

Whey can be a good addition to your diet, if you are doing intense exercise (it's excellent after lifting weights) or if you are skipping meals. I'd mix with water rather than milk. Throw into a blender with water and ice cubes and it tastes like milkshake.

El_Dangeroso

poconnor16 wrote: »

Oh and I meant to ask....what are everyone's thoughts on Whey Protein? Do you think I could fit that into a low carb diet (mixed with milk) or is there any real need? From my experience, too much milk is bad....

Whey's ok (and it rhymes!)

If milk gives you jip, then leave it out and make it with water. Lactofree brand milk is low carb if that's what you're concerned about.

poconnor16

EileenG wrote: »

Whey can be a good addition to your diet, if you are doing intense exercise (it's excellent after lifting weights) or if you are skipping meals. I'd mix with water rather than milk. Throw into a blender with water and ice cubes and it tastes like milkshake.

Sounds much better than the milk - and sometimes I am stuck for time, going from work to training so need something good and quick afterwards.

poconnor16

Temple_Grandin wrote: »

Whey's ok (and it rhymes!)

If milk gives you jip, then leave it out and make it with water. Lactofree brand milk is low carb if that's what you're concerned about.

Yeah I just find I get little or no results if I have more milk than 2 cups of coffee's worth. Yogurts are fine though.
Didn't realise that about Lactofree, interesting.
I wont be over doing the Whey anyway (rhymes again, ba boom!)...am definitley not trying to build muscle etc; I'm fairly well built for a girl as is. For competition I would actually prefer to drop weight so I can spar at the edge of a lower weight division.

Unwilling

OK - it's summer time and I am off to the SOUTH BEACH....
I tried this before recently and was very successful but I got a bit cocky then... can't seem to find my mojo to get back on the wagon.
But I've just committed to a 6 week bootcamp so I want to couple this with the South Beach and watch the pounds fall off.

IS ANYONE INTERESTED IN BEING MY ON LINE BUDDY?

poconnor16

My update....

I didn't stick to South Beach...the tiredness got ridiculous! So finally went to my doc and it turns out i had a virus. Thankfully 6 weeks later I'm back to myself.
Exercise has been sorted - I've taken up running 3 nights a week by following the couch to 5k plan. I'm not losing weight (yet) but I am feeling good.
Food - the reason I have not lost weight yet is that I have not focussed on my diet yet. I really want to make a life change here so am taking baby steps as they say! But I know what I have to do - cut out the crap i.e processed junk and ease off on the carbs, especially in the evening.

Overall - the advice on this thread was excellent, thank you to all. I am going to continue to post so feel free to have a nosy and comment, you guys are great.

Next steps - diet...to be continued....

poconnor16

Unwilling wrote: »

OK - it's summer time and I am off to the SOUTH BEACH....
I tried this before recently and was very successful but I got a bit cocky then... can't seem to find my mojo to get back on the wagon.
But I've just committed to a 6 week bootcamp so I want to couple this with the South Beach and watch the pounds fall off.

IS ANYONE INTERESTED IN BEING MY ON LINE BUDDY?

Hi Unwilling!

only thing I would ask is how fit/active are you so far? The first weeks of the south beach are a bit extreme and you might be a bit tired. Would you consider maybe skipping the induction? Boot camps are fairly intense.....

I am planning on doing some form of low carbing. But given how active I am I might re-read the SBD and shoose to skip to second phase. Will let you know!;)