Body Shakes

Apip99

Body shakes:

Morning all.

Looking for some advice Here is the back ground.

Whilst Woking out I am getting about ¾ of the way through my work out and finding hard (if not impossible) to continue. Its not being a big girls blouse about it either and wanting to finish up. My body gets the full on shakes, and the weakness kicks in so that even lifting a medicine ball is near on impossible. It’s frustrating as I want to continue, but my body is just waving a white flag.

I am eating about an hour before work out. A medium large bowl of pasta with Cottage cheese, nuts, mozzarella, pesto and feta. Also Lot of water as well before and during

I’m also eating so much more the past few weeks. I’m 6ft1 and used to weigh 11.5 stone at Christmas and I’m now 12.5 stone, and I have upped my calorie intake dramatically so now getting between 2700 and 3000 per day. Up from around 2000. So the weight is going on and being turned in to muscle, so I’m happy with that, but what can take of do to prolong my time at the gym.

Here is my work out:

Treadmill 5 minutes warm up

Reps x10 x8 x6
Lat Pull Down 70 72.5 75
Seated Row 60 62.5 65
Sholder press 25 27.5 30
Fly 65 67.5 70
Chest Press 57.5 60 62.5

Leg Curls 47.5 50 52.5
Leg Extensions 25 27.5 30

Rowing 100m Flat out then 100m slow up to 1500m

Bike 15 minutes on a veriable setting

Floor Work
Push Ups x10 x8 x6
Streight into a 30 second plank after each set

Russian Twist 16 16 16
With medicen ball and streight into
15 bicycle crunches in-between sets

Side planks 20 reps on each side x 2

30 sit ups with Ab Machine
And If I can manage it, 3 sets of 5 pull ups

Any thoughts or advise on what I can eat/drink or do to be able to make it though the full session and maybe even fit a bit more in?

Many thanks, and sorry for the long post.

Apip

Apip99

Yer, I thought thats way it could be!!

TommyKnocker

Hi There

Can I ask a couple of questions

1. What are your goals (muscle gain, fat loss, improve aerobic/anerobic fitness, training for a specific sport etc
2. Age & Sex (I am assumig male)
3. Can you give a detailed account of an average days food intake (time and amounts)
4. How many times a week do you workout
5. Do you do the same routine each workout
6. How much rest are you taking between sets/exercises
7. Do you have a manual (builder etc) or office type job

I am no expert and there are lots of more experienced folks on here who would be better able to help, but here are my thoughts

• 12st 7lb is not very heavy for a 6' 1" guy. I am only 5' 6" and currently weigh 12 st 2lb with around 12% body fat and have resonable strength and definition. At 6' 1" I imagine you as being quite thin.
• 2,700 - 3,000 calories daily does not seem much for a guy of 6' 1" depending of course on your goals and number of workout days.
• IMHO your workout is way too busy and I imagine it takes quite a while to complete. You start off with a cardio warmup, then go into resistance work, then you go into a cardio workout and then back to resistance and core work.

Personally I would recommend that you firstly visit your GP and make sure that you have no under laying health issues such as anemia (low iron etc). Secondly I would recommend switching to a more structured workout routine, based on the compound lifts.

Check out

• Starting Strenght http://startingstrength.wikia.com/wiki/Starting_Strength_Wiki
• Strong Lifts http://stronglifts.com/

IMHO thesse are good solid programs for beginners. They are built around the compound lifts and are progressive, so you make progres quite quickly. I would advise that you get either one of the trainers in your gym to show you the correct form for these lifts or else book 1 or 2 sessions with a PT to show you the correct form. Bad form on the compound lifts when the weight gets heavy is a sure way to get injured.

Start off with an empty bar or really light weights until you have nailed the technique and then start adding the weight. I have been using the Strong Lifts program for the last 9 months and am quite pleased with the results.

I workout 6 times a week. Weights on Sunday, Tuesday and Thursday and Cardio & Core on Saturday, Monday and Wednesday.

Finally I am going to reiterate that I stongly advise that you visit your GP for a checkup before going any further with your training. It's not normal IMHO to get so fatigued in the gym unless you totally deplete your muscle glycogen before you finish your workout or are anemic (these are my guesses as to possible causes)

Again I am no expert, so don't take the above as gosple. It's just my thoughts. I hope it gives you some things to think about.


Best Regards & Good luck,

M

Apip99

Hi M,

Thank you for getting back in so much detail.

I’ve always been skinny. I used to weigh about 10 stone in my late teens, (that was in my clubbing days. Must have been all the dancing:rolleyes:) Since then I have always been around 11-11.5 stone. My dad and brothers are all the same build. I need to get some weight gain, this I know, but it was a tight month in arch, but hoping to order today or tomorrow.

You are right, the work out is ‘busy’ about an hour and a half or so, But it does feel like I’m all over the shop. I do however get the cardio done first as its not my favourite thing.

I will check with GP. Seeing him next week on another matter any way.
1. What are your goal: Muscle gain would be high prioriaty, but also increasing my over all fitness
2. Age & Sex (I am assumig male) Correct, Male. 34
3. Can you give a detailed account of an average days food intake (time and amounts) See Below
4. How many times a week do you workout: 3 times a week
5. Do you do the same routine each workout: Yes
6. How much rest are you taking between sets/exercises: 1 minute between sets and a little longer between exercises
7. Do you have a manual (builder etc) or office type job. I used to be a landscaper, but now at a desk job for the past 18 months :mad:

8am: 3 pieces of toast with butter and peanut butter, Pint Milk, and shot of wheatgrass.
10am: Large bowl of porridge with a large banana and pint milk
12:30: Either pasta dish (always including cottage cheese nets etc) or 2 rounds of sandwich and Pint Milk
2pm: A few pieces if fruit and Pint Milk
5:30 Snack on way home, 2 bananas or sandwich
7:30 Dinner, Pasta dish or cooked meal, salmon and veg etc. Something along those lines. Pint of milk
In the evening I would probable have a snack later on, although not after 10pm. Oh yer, and a pint of milk. Although through the day there will be a couple of snacks. If I can!


Thanks for the links, upon a quick scan on the sites, I want to get to the gym now!!! I’ll have a chat with the trainer at the gym, he’s been pretty good so far imo.

“I workout 6 times a week. Weights on Sunday, Tuesday and Thursday and Cardio & Core on Saturday, Monday and Wednesday” I’ve 2 kids and unfortunately 6 times a week would be a no go. But I’ll be able to step it up to 4 times a week.

Thanks a million for all you tips and advice. Let me know if you have any other suggestions after reading my reply.

Kind regards,

Apip

Canis Lupus

Sigh... wrote a post and the internet swallowed it.

Short version. Reset your weights and start Starting Strength.

Don't do cardio during a weights routine, you're tiring yourself out. Lift heavy on weights days Leave cardio for other days.

Apip99

Okay been reading the PDF 5x5 strong lifts PDF and looks like a great system and seems to be more fitting to my goals, and time frame.

I'll have a chat with my instructor down at the gym and see if he knows much about it and get some advice on it.

It looks a lot less 'busy' (Thanks M) than what am am doing at the moment.

Thanks for the head up,

Apip

TommyKnocker

Hi Apip

Again please take this as it is meant, hopefully helpful guidelines. As I stated before I am no expert. I am an IT engineer with an interest in being healthy.

I have absolutely no qualifications in the fitenss/nutrition fields, and all my "knowledge" comes from the web.

Basically as your stated goal is to gain weight while improving your fitness/strength, you need to consume more calories each day, then you expend. I use 2 methods to work out calorie requirements

• The Harris Benedict Formula (if body fat % is unknown) See http://www.bmi-calculator.net/bmr-calculator/harris-benedict-equation/
• The Katch McArdle Formula (if body fat % is known) See http://thebestwaytolosefat.com/diet/

So work out your BMR (Basal Metabolic Rate, the number of calories you required if you just lay in bed all day doing nothing) and then multiply it by the Activity multiplier figure. This will give you a ballpark figure as to the number of calories you should eat each day to maintain your current weight.

From here there are 2 schools of thought

• The See Food Diet (if you see food, you eat it )

The benefit of this method is fast weight gain. The downside is that a good proportion of the gain will be fat, which must then be burned (dieted) off at a later time.

• Add between 350 - 500 calories to your daily maintenance calorie requirement figure. These calories should come from good "clean" food sources (not junk foods)

The benefit of this method is that given that good qualtiy foods sources are eaten, then there should be less fat gained, so less to be burned off at a later date. The downside is that weight gain is much slower, maybe around 1 -1.5lb per week if you are lucky. (This is my preferred method)

Personally I have found that getting my daily calories at the following ratio has worked well for me. 40% of calories from Lean protein (incl. whey shakes), 30%-35% of calories from good fat sources and 25%-30% from Carbs, mostly from fruit and veg. I limit the amount of starch based carbs (breads, pasta rice, cereals etc) that I eat.

When I am looking to gain weight I increase carb intake and decrease fat intake. When I am looking to lean out, I drop the carbs and increase the fats. Protein intake stays constant.

The last point I will make on nutrition is that as your weight increases, then so also does your daily calorie requirement. For instance if at 12.5 st your daily calories requirement is 2,800, at 13 st this might have increased to 3,100. So as your weight increases you will need to recalculate your calorie requirements.

As far as working out goes, the general consensus is that if cardio and weights are done on the same day, then cardio is done after weights. The reason being that doing cardio before weights can tire you out which can lead to not being able to lift the weights you are capable of and also if you are tired, then your form is more likely to go to pot, which can lead to injury.

If you must do cardio and weights on the same day, then 20-30 minutes of HIIT at the end of your weight session will keep you in good shape (you'll be able to keep up with the kids ). If you have the option of going to the gym a 4th day, then you could do 2 days weights and 2 days cardio & core (i.e. Monday & Wednesday weights, Tuesday & Thursday cardio 'n' core).

Finally for this post, though your diet is not the worst I have seen, IMHO it is very carb heavy and lots of starchy carbs too. Personally I would cut out a lot of the bread and pasta and add more protein (Tuna, chicken etc) and veg (specially green leafy veg) and some more healthy fats (nuts, nut butters fish oil supplements).

An idea of my diet is as follows (and I am not suggesting that this is a great diet to be followed)

05:15 Breakfast
60g Oats, 5 almonds, 4 brazil nuts, 6 hazel nuts, 6 half walnuts, 20g gogi berries, 6 grapes, some blueberries, raspberries, blackberries and strawberries with 200ml no fat milk.
1 Muller Vitality yogurt drink
200ml Cranberry juice
1 mug green tea

Supps: Fish oil, Multi vit, Echinacea & Advanced C-Jointin (for joints)

08:30 Snack
1 scoop of whey, 5g Creatine, 5g Glutamine .5 scoop Glucose with 300ml Skimmed milk
3oatcakes with PB
Mug of green tea

10:00 Tea break
1 Apple & 1 Banana, handful of mixed nuts

13:00 Lunch
Wholemeal Pitta with roast beef (home cooked), mixed salad leaves, mixed peppers, red onion, spring onion and cherry tomatoes
1 kiwi & 1 mandrin
1 muller vitality yogurt drink

16:00 Pre workout snack
1 scoop of whey with 300ml skimmed milk
1 cottage cheese and fruit mousse (from recipe thread)
2 oat cakes with PB

18:00 - 20:00 Gym
Strong lifts 5x5 routine or Cardio & Core

20:15 PWO Shake
2 scoops of whey, 5g Creatine, 5g Glutamine, 1.5 scoops of Glucose mixed with 450ml water

21:00 Dinner
1 5oz chicken breast, 1 6oz fillet steak, 400g mixed veg (sprouts, broccoli, green beans, carrots),
Mug of green tea
2 squares of 90% dark chocolate on weight training days

I would also drink about 2.5L of water throughout the day


Best Regards,

M

Apip99

Hi M,

Again, thank you so much for such a details response. I really appreciate it. I will need to have a proper read and digest all the dietary information (pun intended!)

I eat a fair bit of Tuna, and will look to up it. Although Chicken is of the menu as I do not eat meat.

Your diet is very strict by the looks of it, But I guess once you get into a routine then its easy.

Again, I will have a proper read tonight, after the gym. To which I will do weights tonight and arrange some one to go the rough the 5x5 and the cardio on Saturday.

Cheers buddy,

Apip99

Just saw your Breakfast time: 05:15!!!

I used to rise at 6am for a while last year and that was a push, but 5:15. Fair play to you.

TommyKnocker

Hi Apip

Yep, 5:15 breakfast. Up at 04:45 :eek: then shave, shower and dress (30 mins) then breakfast.

Stuck with public transport and need two busses to get to work :rolleyes:

But I chose to get to work early so I can leave early and go to the gym. I just could not lift as heavy first thing in the morning.


Best Regards,

M

Apip99

I have to say that when I got up at 6 I always felt better, and that buy the time I left the house I had got so much done, leaving my evenings free. Our little lad has started to wake at 6am, and where its been frustrating I am now thinking of getting up with him. If you cant beat em.....

shootermacg

Canis Lupus wrote: »

Sigh... wrote a post and the internet swallowed it.

Short version. Reset your weights and start Starting Strength.

Don't do cardio during a weights routine, you're tiring yourself out. Lift heavy on weights days Leave cardio for other days.

What he said. I would give Doug's four day split a try, it gives similar rep ranges but is balanced to provide more rest time for your muscles.

Doing the same exercises 3 days a week could well result in overtraining. if this is the case and you're actually lifting heavy; you'll probably be making the gains in fat as opposed to muscle. Also vary your exercise program with different exercises to target the same muscle groups.

The shakes I got them too ^ ^, I was doing a mix of high intensity cardio and weights at the same time. Jumping with weights etc, lots of pushups, chins, sprints etc.

The reason you're getting the shakes is because you ARE shagged.
Great for building endurance not so great for making gains in muscle mass. This kind of workout turns you into a fat burning furnace and you'd usually be doing more reps with lighter weights for this.

You wouldn't be able to lift as heavy or do cardio as heavy when mixing the two, but it depends on what you want to get out of it.

I still get the shakes on one arm bent over rows for some reason, but I lift real heavy (heavy for me ^ ^) on back day.

How long do you spend in the gym? I'd not be in there more than an 1 hour and then that's a little bit too long IMO.

So my advice, feel free to ignore it:

Remember to rest for at least 30 secs (maybe 45 secs) between sets.
Split out your cardio/workouts(I've heard if you have to do them then do the cardio after).
Stick with a good program that provides maximum rest for the muscle groups
http://www.muscleandstrength.com/workouts/dougs-4-day-split-workout.html
Possibly change your program approximately every 2 months (or when you stop making gains).
Never workout a muscle that still feels sore, NEVER!
Ensure you eat enough but not too much protein/carbs/fat maybe a 40%/40%/20% split.
Buy some whey/glucose for a post workout shake.
Don't try to spend too long in the gym, put in the earphones and ignore everyone, you're there to work!
Stay hydrated, bring a 2 litre water bottle with you and take a sip after every set and aim for at least 3 or 4 litres a day.
Stretch frequently.
Don't dry your balls with the hair dryer.
Don't use the shakeweight, you can't handle it!

Apip99

shootermacg: I didn't mean to ignore you! Missed you post there. Your right on speaking to a few others I was doing too much in the one session. Kanckering myself out going from exercise to exercise! I've left out the cardio for a the past few sessions and have found the shakes are not there as badly.

Thanks for the advice. You and B-Builder have put me no the track of the 5x5 system. Which I will be starting tonight. Run through the free weights with my instructor so I know I'm doing them right: http://pix.motivatedphotos.com/2009/7/9/633827006163126815-WeightLifting.jpg

I've also upped my food intake, and also hit a weight gain, to give me a bit of a boost. Have to say its been great after session at the gym

So fingers crossed all will go well for me.

Cheers

Apip99

Oh and the shakeweight, I really wouldn't want to handle it. Saw a rather shocking video, and the chic was not using it to tone her arms