Ketosis/atkins diet on the cheap

Bottle_of_Smoke

I'm currently 5'7 and 11.5stone. Though did eat a lot of food in the last hour. Haven't checked in a while but remember when I did I usually tended to be just over 11stone.

I want to have a go at a ketosis/ketogenic diet for a few weeks to cut out some bodyfat.

My workout is deadlift, 3 other back sets + 3 bicep sets on day 1

Benchpress, incline bench press and 2 other chest sets + 3/4 tricep sets on day 2

day 3 is Backsquat, leg extension, calf raises, leg press and set which does the hamstring area. Will also do shoulder presses this day

Do 60 crunches the odd time when i'm waiting to use the bench but prob not more than once a week

The last 2/3 weeks I've been going 4-5 days a week but the last few months have been very inconsistant. Going to try regularise my training to 2days on then 1 day off going forward.

Regards the ketosis diet remember trying it a few years ago through a program at a tony quinn gym, remember it seemed to cost a lot, but did seem to get good results.

Hoping someone may have advice/links reguards doing the diet inexpensively, I'm in college and don't have much money for meat so usually eat eggs/beans/whey powder for protein. Though the cutting out alcohol is bound to help of course.

Perhaps if anyone could suggest cheap foodstuffs to make up the protein/fat, buying salmon/steak/philadelphia cheese cost a lot last time

I'm aware the diet's not gonna be great for muscle gain but hoping not to be on it for more than 2 weeks, would that be long enough? I'm not overweight looking just the bellys a bit big


cheers guys

metamorphosis

Tinned tuna from aldi/lidl costs next to nothing.
Same with their eggs.

How many grams of carbs are you limiting yourself to p/day?

Sapsorrow

I don't really know anything about this type of diet strategy, but I'd imagine it'd be hard to get into ketosis using beans or legumes for protein to any extent. Is it 20g of carbs a day or something like that to go into ketosis?
Good point by UL there about tinned fish though, maybe lidl frozen fish too? Aldi also do very cheap bags of nuts and seeds, although maybe they're too high carb

El_Dangeroso

I don't think you have to get into ketosis to lose the belly. You could try a moderate carb approach, with 100-150g carbs a day, given your activity levels. Get carbs from fruit and vegetables mostly but you can have a bit of white rice or fermented porridge once in a while if you want too.

Ground organic mince, stewing beef, and lamb gigot chops are cheap cuts of meat, never forgetting the humble egg, which cost 50c per egg for even the most expensive one. Go to the market if you have one and buy eggs and vegetables direct from farmers. I get my pastured eggs from the market, 88c for 6!. Bones make wonderfully nutritious soups and butchers give these away for free! Tinned sardines are uber-cheap and have loads of omega 3, don't eat them every day though as it's best to eat fresh food most of the time.

The best strategy is to make massive portions and buy some little containers in the two euro shop to freeze leftovers.

In my fridge right now is:

Lots of chicken and vegetable soup.
Homemade Shepard's pie.
Homemade red chicken curry (aldi is the only brand that don't put industrial veg oil in their curry paste).

But if I'm feeling lazy, I'll just grill up a gigot chop with a little rosemary sprinkled on it and some sauteed spinach and broccoli with a side of mashed carrots and parsnips with butter. Or boiled eggs with butter and grilled asparagus 'soldiers'

Also another strategy to cut the belly fat is intermittent fasting. Do two 20hr fasts a week, which is basically just waiting to eat until dinner. If you can do a workout right before you break a fast then all the better to get the maximum benefit (although bear in mind your performance will be slightly reduced). Eat to complete satiety once you break the fast, don't intentionally restrict calories, your body needs to know it's not actually starving.

I can basically sum up good food choices by making everything yourself as much as possible from meat, vegetables and fruit, using processed food as no more than a condiment for example curry paste. The 80:20 rule is always a good guide.

Eating this way shouldn't be two expensive if you plan ahead and cook in bulk.

Best of luck!

ApeXaviour

khrystyna100 wrote: »

Is it 20g of carbs a day or something like that to go into ketosis?

I think <40-50 will usually do it.

Though I agree with Temple Grandin, just keeping your insulin down with low to moderate carb (<200g per day) will work wonders and will significantly increase the variety of foods you can eat. Ketosis isn't necessary, it's more like a side effect.
If you're looking to shed it'd be wise to keep the fat in moderation too, you want to keep your protein intake high while running a calorie deficit!

Lean low carb protein sources I've found (the relatively low fat ones actually mean more protein per €):

-Pork Steak (in the US it's called tenderloin) looks like this. Pound for pound it's a better protein source than chicken breast.
-Tesco Healthy Living Cheese (30g protein, 15g fat /100g)
-Tesco Healthy living minced beef (~€3.50 for 500g, <5% fat, surprisingly way more protein per € than cheap fatty mince)
-I get my chicken breasts from the butcher, 12 for €12.
-Tuna tins, I can't remember the brand I buy but tesco have been doing a deal on 4 for €3 something.
-Serrano/Parma ham are amazingly good high protein snacks too, get them from lidl/aldi.

Beans are not a good low carb source of protein...

In terms of veg, frozen broccolli/spinach/green beans are super cheap, and will keep your micronutrient profile and bowels in top notch.

Have a look at Lyle McDonald's stuff. Ultimate Diet 2 and Rapid Fat Loss. They're the sanest (and IMO best) of these you'll come across.

khrystyna100 wrote:

Aldi also do very cheap bags of nuts and seeds, although maybe they're too high carb

Nuts and seeds are very low carb and are an excellent source of (good) fat, especially nuts (not peanuts). However they're rather calorie dense, and if one is trying to lose weight then it might be wise to keep them in moderation. If you're not trying to lose weight then go nuts with them. They seem paradoxical in that people can eat 4000 calories per day mostly of nuts and not gain weight (they won't lose weight either mind you), it's not understood why this is.

Sapsorrow

ApeXaviour wrote: »

They seem paradoxical in that people can eat 4000 calories per day mostly of nuts and not gain weight (they won't lose weight either mind you), it's not understood why this is.

Ya it's wierd I've been eating between 600 and 800 and sometimes even 1000kcal per day (apx) from nuts and seeds and still losing weight! I'm not sure how it's happening tbh.

El_Dangeroso

I agree with everything that apexaviour said, 'cept for the lean protein bit. IMO if your gonna lower carbs you just can't go lower fat too. Plus the fatty cuts are cheaper! Fat is very filling, it's nigh on impossible to overeat fatty meat, the protein takes care of that. The only exception is meat of dubious origin, in which case it's better to choose the lean cut and plonk some butter on top.

El_Dangeroso

khrystyna100 wrote: »

Ya it's wierd I've been eating between 600 and 800 and sometimes even 1000kcal per day (apx) from nuts and seeds and still losing weight! I'm not sure how it's happening tbh.

I've heard that your body only has enough bile salts to digest 40g fat at a time, is that true? I'd imagine it takes a little while to replenish them to so I'd imagine you'd excrete the rest. Sorry if TMI!

EileenG

A good keto diet can be extremely cheap. You are eating perhaps three whole eggs for breakfast instead of 12 egg whites. Roast chicken (and boil the bones for soup) rather than just chicken breasts. You do need to eat a lot of green veg, but if you buy whatever is cheap and in season, it won't cost a fortune.

A keto diet means you can eat fat again. Don't make the mistake of going low carb and low fat at the same time, you'll feel hungry and tired and miserable. Instead, eat whole eggs, oily fish, full fat dairy, olive oil, nuts and seeds.

corkcomp

ApeXaviour wrote: »

just keeping your insulin down with low to moderate carb (<200g per day) will work wonders and will significantly increase the variety of foods you can eat. Ketosis isn't necessary, it's more like a side effect.
If you're looking to shed it'd be wise to keep the fat in moderation too, you want to keep your protein intake high while running a calorie deficit!

Lean low carb protein sources I've found (the relatively low fat ones actually mean more protein per €):

-Pork Steak (in the US it's called tenderloin) looks like this. Pound for pound it's a better protein source than chicken breast.
-Tesco Healthy Living Cheese (30g protein, 15g fat /100g)
-Tesco Healthy living minced beef (~€3.50 for 500g, <5% fat, surprisingly way more protein per € than cheap fatty mince)
-I get my chicken breasts from the butcher, 12 for €12.
-Tuna tins, I can't remember the brand I buy but tesco have been doing a deal on 4 for €3 something.
-Serrano/Parma ham are amazingly good high protein snacks too, get them from lidl/aldi.

+1

Bottle_of_Smoke

EileenG wrote: »

A good keto diet can be extremely cheap. You are eating perhaps three whole eggs for breakfast instead of 12 egg whites. Roast chicken (and boil the bones for soup) rather than just chicken breasts. You do need to eat a lot of green veg, but if you buy whatever is cheap and in season, it won't cost a fortune.

A keto diet means you can eat fat again. Don't make the mistake of going low carb and low fat at the same time, you'll feel hungry and tired and miserable. Instead, eat whole eggs, oily fish, full fat dairy, olive oil, nuts and seeds.

Right I'm working from memory but I'm thinking something along the lines of

Breakfast:

3 eggs scrambled with some double cream/butter

Lunch: Tin of tuna with cream cheese and some broccoli

Dinner: Beef mince(can I add garlic/spices?) with green beans or peas(for some reason i'm thinking peas are a no-no)

Can I drink protein shakes as well? I remember last time I had casein shakes and mixed them with double cream. I've only got some whey at the moment - would that be ok to mix with the cream?

Also are nuts ok to eat? Any particular types?

El_Dangeroso

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

Right I'm working from memory but I'm thinking something along the lines of

Breakfast:

3 eggs scrambled with some double cream/butter

Lunch: Tin of tuna with cream cheese and some broccoli

Dinner: Beef mince(can I add garlic/spices?) with green beans or peas(for some reason i'm thinking peas are a no-no)

Can I drink protein shakes as well? I remember last time I had casein shakes and mixed them with double cream. I've only got some whey at the moment - would that be ok to mix with the cream?

Also are nuts ok to eat? Any particular types?

The best nuts are macademias or brazil nuts, v low in carbs, you can get big bags in health food shops that are sometimes cheaper than supermarkets. Julian Graves is one that does great bulk offers on nuts.

Protein shakes are fine, I always thought whey was superior to casein, don't know why, maybe just from a dairy allergy point of view.

Other than that looking good, if not a tiny bit low in calories, let your hunger be your guide on keto, squeeze in another meal there somewhere if you feel you need it, also try and keep as much variety as your budget allows, it's tedious eating the same thing day in day out. It does take a few days for the hunger suppression to kick in, and look out for 'induction 'flu' or 'the day fives', this is the critical juncture for switching from a glucose based metabolism to a fat based one. You will feel like a truck has hit you sideways. It tends to last for 1-2 days for most people followed by an unbelievable burst of energy.

Start introducing carbs one at a time at the end, seeing which ones you feel best eating. If you do it gradually you won't get a big rush of weight back on, but do keep in mind you will replenish glycogen and water which is normally about 4lb, but can vary if your muscley.

Replenishing glycogen is rather fun, you get to watch your muscles inflate over the course of a few hours!

brianthebard

Temple_Grandin wrote: »

Protein shakes are fine, I always thought whey was superior to casein, don't know why, maybe just from a dairy allergy point of view.

Its absorbed by the body quicker than casein, that's all.

EileenG

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

Right I'm working from memory but I'm thinking something along the lines of

Breakfast:

3 eggs scrambled with some double cream/butter

Lunch: Tin of tuna with cream cheese and some broccoli

Dinner: Beef mince(can I add garlic/spices?) with green beans or peas(for some reason i'm thinking peas are a no-no)

Can I drink protein shakes as well? I remember last time I had casein shakes and mixed them with double cream. I've only got some whey at the moment - would that be ok to mix with the cream?

Also are nuts ok to eat? Any particular types?

Garlic is fine, be mean with peas. Lash on the spinach, celery, cauliflower, asparagus, aubergine, broccoli, cabbage, dandelion, fennel, chard, courgette, green beans, kale, mushroom, peppers, rhubarb, radishes, salad in general, baby sweetcorn (the kind where you eat the whole thing), mangetout, watercress etc.

Whey shake after lifting is a good idea. Keep the PWO shake fat free to maximise protein absorption.

Casein with a fat can be a handy meal replacement, but eat real food as much as possible.

Most nuts are fine, just be a bit careful with peanuts. Almonds and walnuts are good, brazil nuts are a great source of selenium. Macadamia are a great fat source.

banquet

EileenG wrote: »

Most nuts are fine, just be a bit careful with peanuts. Almonds and walnuts are good, brazil nuts are a great source of selenium. Macadamia are a great fat source.

Whats reason for avoiding peanuts? I try to eat a decent variety but sometimes find myself munching them more often then the rest due to their availability.

EileenG

Strictly speaking, they are not really nuts, they're legumes. They are also higher carb than most other nuts, and they are more likely to cause allergy problems. In reasonable amounts, they're fine, but other nuts are better.

Also, they're addictive!

moonage

Although these are processed, if they have a high meat content and not too many additives they're not so bad:

Beefburgers
Tinned corned beef
Sausages (with an 80%+ pork content)

Lidl have tins of chopped pork and ham with 87% pork.

If you're getting rashers or pork chops make sure they have a good bit of fat on them.

Bottle_of_Smoke

cheers for the advice guys.

Eileen about the protein with fat, would whey/cream be ok or just casein?

moonage prob gonna make my own beefburgers - usually do it with mince, egg, an onion, garlic, a chilli, turmeric, cumin powder, should i take the onion/chilli out?

as reguards rashers gonna try avoid, hate eating the the visible fat. sausages - aren't they usually made of grain as well as pork?

ApeXaviour

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

should i take the onion/chilli out?

I'm pretty sure they're fine to leave in

Vegetables to avoid on a low carb diet are the starchy ones like potatoes, carrots, parsnips, celariacs, sweet potato etc.

EileenG

Whey on its own after lifting, or even with a little glucose to provoke a brief insulin spike to speed up uptake of protein by the muscles. No fat post workout.

Casein plus cream (or olive or coconut oil, or a nut butter) as a meal/snack would be fine.

Chili is always fine. The amount of onions you use as an ingredient is fine, just watch things like baked onions on their own.

Oddly, celeriac is a very low carb root veg. If you are missing spuds, you could try mashing some celeriac instead.

Iristxo

EileenG wrote: »

The amount of onions you use as an ingredient is fine, just watch things like baked onions on their own.

Why is that?

EileenG

Iristxo wrote: »

Why is that?

Quantity. If you are using onion as an ingredient in a sauce, you'll maybe use half an onion. If you are baking them, or making French onion soup, you'll use half a dozen.

Iristxo

EileenG wrote: »

Quantity. If you are using onion as an ingredient in a sauce, you'll maybe use half an onion. If you are baking them, or making French onion soup, you'll use half a dozen.

Bt why do you have to watch them? I eat one a day or so in my roast. Is thre anything wrong with onion? Or is it just carb-high?

banquet

Iristxo wrote: »

Bt why do you have to watch them? I eat one a day or so in my roast. Is thre anything wrong with onion? Or is it just carb-high?

Nothing wrong with it, it would just be counter productive to eat a LOT of onion when low carbing with the aim of putting your body into ketosis.

Iristxo

banquet wrote: »

Nothing wrong with it, it would just be counter productive to eat a LOT of onion when low carbing with the aim of putting your body into ketosis.

Oh, I see, onions are high-carb. Didn't realize

EileenG

Well, moderate carb. I wouldn't worry too much about them, as long as you are avoiding the sugar/bread/pasta/cornflakes etc.