F/A-18E Pilots Suspended for this..

Steyr

Is it maybe a bit harsh to suspend them for this flyby? I don't see any 'nearly tragic' consequences. Why not just give them the mother of all talk downs instead of clipping their wings, the conditions from the video show near if not perfect conditions for a flyby and those "E" Hornets have more than ample power if needed be and the flyby itself looks very well under contol and professional.

Video A: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBM8kGao_ao

Video B: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vdnpAAoVeYQ&NR=1

Video C: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KZPMD6okw0&NR=1

Report: http://www.navytimes.com/news/2010/03/navy_pilots_punished_031910w/

Pilots grounded for good after low flyover

By Mark D. Faram - Staff writer
Posted : Friday Mar 19, 2010 14:34:44 EDT

NORFOLK, Va. — Two F/A-18E Super Hornet pilots from Strike Fighter Squadron 136 have been permanently grounded for flying too low before a Georgia Tech football game Nov. 7, according to a source.

The pilots, both mid-’90s graduates of Georgia Tech, flew over Bobby Dodd Stadium in downtown Atlanta at just a few hundred feet above the stadium, under the 1,000 feet minimum required by Navy rules.

Multiple videos of the flyover, posted on YouTube, show the planes screaming low over the stadium.

“I can confirm the incident did happen,” said Lt. Cmdr. Phil Rosi, spokesman for Naval Air Force Atlantic. “But it would be inappropriate to comment further as these are not public figures and have an expectation of privacy.”

But documents obtained by Navy Times and authenticated by a senior Navy official familiar with the investigation name the pilots as Lt. Cmdr. Marc Fryman and Lt. Cmdr. Christopher Condon. Both were assigned to non-flying jobs through an administrative process called a Field Naval Aviator Evaluation Board, the results of which are not released by the Navy.

In the documents, Rear Adm. R.J. O’Hanlon, commander of AirLant, was unforgiving in his assessment of the incident and in Fryman and Condon’s future in naval aviation.

“Fryman failed to provide effective [crew resource management] for his flight lead and allowed an unsafe flyby to occur with nearly tragic consequences,” O’Hanlon wrote of the mission commander. “Despite his spotless record, his complacent, passive response to a major altitude transgression is unforgivable in my view.

“Continued aviation service involving flying is not in the best interest of Lt. Cmdr. Fryman or the United States Navy.”

O’Hanlon’s judgment of Condon was equally tough. The admiral wrote that Condon ignored low-altitude warnings and didn’t “keep altitude in his scan” and that the incident could have ended “tragically.”

O’Hanlon dismissed the conclusion by some of the reviewers of the board’s results that the altitude error was unintentional.

“The arguments written by prior endorsers that Lt. Cmdr. Condon’s actions were an honest mistake are not persuasive,” he wrote. “He is a senior, very experienced department head who placed his aircraft and wingman in a very dangerous position.”

Both will stay in the Navy, but O’Hanlon recommended both have a “warfare transition” to another officer community.

The pilots reported the low pass themselves upon landing and the Navy convened the evaluation board immediately to determine if the officers violated Navy rules.

Navy records show that Condon was reassigned to AirLant on Feb. 12, but Fryman’s record still shows him at VFA 136. However, sources say that he, too, is at AirLant.

“The results are tough for sure, but they broke the rules and got a proper punishment for what they did,” said the senior Navy official, who asked not to be named because he was not authorized to speak on the matter. “It may seem tough, but it’s a safety issue and the admiral made the right call.”

ronnie3585

Low, slow and back of the drag curve - over a very public gathering.

IMO the punishment is a little excessive but I can see why the bosses were pissed off.

Blue Punto

This one looks worse

Wonder what happened this guy and he is named in the commentry

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLPC-4Mj3N8&feature=related

smellslikeshoes

Blue Punto wrote: »

This one looks worse

Wonder what happened this guy and he is named in the commentry

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLPC-4Mj3N8&feature=related

That really could have been a disaster :eek::eek:

pclancy

Sigh. Rules are there for a reason. Those jocks deserve to lose their wings imo. Very low and slow for a flight over a built up city such as Atlanta...what would have happened if either of them lost their engines or had some other failure? Sure the pilots could have bailed but people on the ground would have died.

There are many Americans out of work and sleeping rough these days thanks to their stupid government squandering money on the military. $663.8 Billion is the defense budget for 2010. That money would do a huge amount of good elsewhere.

bandit197

^^+1

There is a serious risk of a bird-strike at that altitude over a populated area. Factor in the slow speed and altitude and an incident like that would be very hard to recover from. Surely higher and faster would look just as impressive anyway?

smellslikeshoes

bandit197 wrote: »

^^+1

There is a serious risk of a bird-strike at that altitude over a populated area. Factor in the slow speed and altitude and an incident like that would be very hard to recover from. Surely higher and faster would look just as impressive anyway?

Safety aside, those vids are absolutely breath taking, doubtful it would be near as impressive at a higher speed and altitude.

unclecessna

I don't particulary think the punishment is harsh OP, would you have the same opinion if it was an airline jet that was supposed to do the fly-by and the pilot broke the rules and dropped down to just several hundred feet above the ground to show off.....

Another thing that needs to be remembered is F-18's aren't really designed to fly well at low airspeeds such as these two were flying at - as someone else said they are at the back of the drag curve - these jets are inherently unstable anyway so if they had run into turbulence, windshear, lost an engine, lost their electronics system, suffered a birdstrike or even flew a few knots slower there would have been absolutely no margin for error and the stadium would have become the world's largest outdoor barbeque right there and then.

And Pilot's with these two guys level of experience knew that too unfortunately.

- I'd be the first to admit that the videos are very impressive but I think my opinion would change in a millisecond if I had been there in the stadium and one of the F-18's engines had happened to flame out below single engine Vmc and next thing was hurtling inverted directly at me and several thousand others!