You hate Religion. I get it.

Overheal

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055855125

at this stage, i have no respect for anyone who goes to mass anymore. i used to think hey, live and let live, but it has gotten to the stage where anyone who attends, and gives them money is a fcuking idiot. they raped you, they raped your kids, and they blame it on satan. and then they asked for you to donate the money to pay the legal bills. and you still go, and you still give it to them. fcuk all you catholics.

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055856350

The simple fact is that your god would forgive the rapists/murderer's, rather than an innocent atheist or a practising homosexual.

If you cannot see the problem in this, or how this highlights the stupidity of religion then go to mass. Prop up this insane bronze age mish mash of unknown writings.

Anyone who still attends a church is a fool.

Shame on any parents about to hand their kids over to this communion and confirmation b0ll0x. Open your minds and do something productive instead.

My intention is not to single out the Authors of these comments and I have omitted their names.

The fact is, its a sentiment that is apparently being shared by more and more people in the last month, and its bleeding out into all corners of Boards. Even, the Games Category:

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055858369

I've no problem with people being religious as long as they don't force it on to others, including children. He's looking for something to use to brainwash kids, imo religion should not be forced onto kids it should be something they can make a logical decision on when they've reached a mature age.

There is no evidence to support this accusation, by the way.

But seeing it in the Games Category of all places has set off alarm bells. Usually this kind of unfettered outrage is reserved exclusively for Politics After Hours or even the Religion Category.

I don't know what else to say about it. Enough is enough. I'm an Atheist but even I am sick to death of the way Current Events have manifested in almost a pure rage against all/most forms of Faith and Religion. In particular Christianity. I realize this is an Irish site, with Irish people, and I am fully aware of the Gravity and the Culture of recent events but its clear that cooler heads need to prevail.

Condemnation for the Catholic Priesthood is one thing; Sectarian outrage toward everyone who practices a belief in God is quite another. It needs clamping down on before it grows wildly out of control.

mike65

Boards is a site with a youngish demographic and the yoof are revolting against the Catholic Church who have disgraced themselves at every turn. The anger will pass but only in a substantial way when the RCC changes.

Did you mean secular outrage?

Overheal

Sectarianism,

"is bigotry, discrimination or hatred arising from attaching importance to perceived differences between subdivisions within a group, such as between different denominations of a religion or the factions of a political movement."

Secularity is about the separation of Church and state, not Atheists up in torches and pitchforks. At this point its no longer that much to do with the State's involvement.

Dohnny Jepp

I have to disagree with you here Overheal. In my opinion the users have the right to complain about whatever it is they want to complain about as long as it's done in the apropriate forums which your first two links are. In regards to the third link the moderator in question had everythin under control, he warned yourself and another user when an argument was bringing it off topic.

Mods on their respective forums are not incompetent and will deal with any case that deem to be over the top.

I think you are also being harsh claiming that its a hate for the religion as the reason for peoples posts. TBH its more shock and disbelief and can we blame people for feeling like this?

Red Hand

Like Sarah Palin and Jedward, it will pass.

My name is URL

Attack the Pope, not the parishioners

Mjollnir

Overheal wrote: »

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055855125
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055856350
My intention is not to single out the Authors of these comments and I have omitted their names.

The fact is, its a sentiment that is apparently being shared by more and more people in the last month, and its bleeding out into all corners of Boards. Even, the Games Category:

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055858369
There is no evidence to support this accusation, by the way.

But seeing it in the Games Category of all places has set off alarm bells. Usually this kind of unfettered outrage is reserved exclusively for Politics After Hours or even the Religion Category.

I don't know what else to say about it. Enough is enough. I'm an Atheist but even I am sick to death of the way Current Events have manifested in almost a pure rage against all/most forms of Faith and Religion. In particular Christianity. I realize this is an Irish site, with Irish people, and I am fully aware of the Gravity and the Culture of recent events but its clear that cooler heads need to prevail.

Condemnation for the Catholic Priesthood is one thing; Sectarian outrage toward everyone who practices a belief in God is quite another. It needs clamping down on before it grows wildly out of control.

Does it?

Tell me, on what assumptions do you base the rather histrionic claim that it will 'grow wildly out of control'?

Nevyn

I don't think it is anti religion, I do think it is the populus being sick of the catholic church and it is time this happened. It's a big growing pain for the country and it will wash over into other forums.

Overheal

Dohnny Jepp wrote: »

can we blame people for feeling like this?

No I can sympathize with it, but to direct it at the wrong people in the wrong places in the wrong way, is what Im taking exception to.

Strikes me fairly familiar of some pretty Real violence aimed at bystander Muslims in the wake of 9/11. Parishoners were not responsible for the cover-ups. I don't think its fair to Hang them. Im not suggesting anyone will take to violence but in the context of this Website things are going to get messy.

Mods on their respective forums are not incompetent and will deal with any case that deem to be over the top.

Of course not. The Politics and AH mods and the Religion Mods are used to this on a weekly basis and thats why there was no reason to have this discussion sooner. The bleed-over is an issue though and worth raising with Feedback.

Thaedydal wrote:

I don't think it is anti religion, I do think it is the populus being sick of the catholic church and it is time this happened. It's a big growing pain for the country and it will wash over into other forums.

Over another cup of coffee I think you're dead right. I guess its not how I imagined the country would become more Secular but it is the nature of it. Still, if its going to be washing through the Forums, it shouldn't be left carte blanche; accusing other users of being sheep and rape facilitators etc. and other personalized assaults are just some of the stuff being seen already in a pretty large volume.

Dades

Overheal wrote: »

Still, if its going to be washing through the Forums, it shouldn't be left carte blanche; accusing other users of being sheep and rape facilitators etc. and other personalized assaults are just some of the stuff being seen already in a pretty large volume.

I'd agree with this.

We've seen a lot of this in the last fortnight in A&A. A lot of 'righteous anger'. We had to sticky an "Ongoing religious scandals" thread to stop new posters clogging up the forum with rants.

Posts like you linked to above wouldn't have gone unaddressed. Don't get me wrong - the catholic church is (imo) an insidious organisation but at some point we all think "You hate the church. I get it."

Ickle Magoo

Overheal wrote: »

Parishoners were not responsible for the cover-ups. I don't think its fair to Hang them.

From what I've read, there seems to be a lot of anger that people are still supporting the catholic church, applauding certain clergy, giving money and defending their actions. I think there is an awful lot of very angry, disappointed people who seem to be directing their rage at anyone who is associated with the church viewing them as facilitators or supporters, not always a fair representation but there has been quite a few defenders of church actions stirring things up as well.

I agree it has become a bit all pervasive and anti-church rants seem to appear in the strangest places for very little reason but I suspect that will stop when the natural conclusion of events is reached. I hope.

It can be an eye-sore but I think it's better to see and be reminded of it..

Sparks

Thaedydal wrote: »

I don't think it is anti religion, I do think it is the populus being sick of the catholic church and it is time this happened. It's a big growing pain for the country and it will wash over into other forums.

I wish it was a growing pain. At least growing pains are encountered during changes. But in six months time, this will all be off the front pages and with the tragic exception of the victims, the focus will be on something else.

In the meantime, if someone wants to burn something down or nail someone up, I'd rather it wasn't us.

Nevyn

Overheal wrote: »

Strikes me fairly familiar of some pretty Real violence aimed at bystander Muslims in the wake of 9/11. Parishoners were not responsible for the cover-ups.

I disagree people knew and didn't go to the garda and said nothing.
There were two dodgy priest over the years when I was growning up and it was known that 1 wasn't to be left alone with boys and the other wasn't to be left alone with girls. So yes in relation to this I do blame the laity and everyone else for not calling a halt.

Overheal wrote: »

Of course not. The Politics and AH mods and the Religion Mods are used to this on a weekly basis and thats why there was no reason to have this discussion sooner. The bleed-over is an issue though and worth raising with Feedback.Over another cup of coffee I think you're dead right. I guess its not how I imagined the country would become more Secular but it is the nature of it. Still, if its going to be washing through the Forums, it shouldn't be left carte blanche; accusing other users of being sheep and rape facilitators etc. and other personalized assaults are just some of the stuff being seen already in a pretty large volume.

When this happens report the posts and push for action on them.

Sparks wrote: »

I wish it was a growing pain. At least growing pains are encountered during changes. But in six months time, this will all be off the front pages and with the tragic exception of the victims, the focus will be on something else.

In the meantime, if someone wants to burn something down or nail someone up, I'd rather it wasn't us.

I honestly pray that this will not be the case, that the awfully suffering of children and adults who were those children and their family who have had to live with the fall out will not be for nothing and there will be some justice.

Sparks

Thaedydal wrote: »

I honestly pray that this will not be the case, the the awfully suffering of children and adults who were those children and their family who have had to live with the fall out will not be for nothing and there will be some justice.

Tanj. Not round here, at least.

epgc3fyqirnbsx

there's a real lack of common courtesy, and I'm a complete atheist

I believe in free speech etc in the larger sense but there are lots of things disallowed on this site to preserve the sense of community etc

Religion provides great comfort for a lot of people, there's a lot of people I know that would be in a terrible state without it

Basic jist is everyone can have their objections but don't assume people are idiots and condemn them and insult them as being such because of their beliefs

This goes for religious and atheist beliefs alike

It really is akin to attacking the poster...

Cunny-Funt

Overheal wrote: »

The fact is, its a sentiment that is apparently being shared by more and more people in the last month, and its bleeding out into all corners of Boards. Even, the Games Category:

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055858369
There is no evidence to support this accusation, by the way.

Since you quoting me here , of which my comment was in fact a response to you after you turned the thread into a religious debate by attacking my comment after making a similar one of your own... I think I should explain that A:

Indeed the guy did not say he was looking for the game for kids but it was implied. He refused to take anyones realistic input seriously.

Also my opinion on religion has nothing to do with the recent outrages etc btw.

Overheal wrote: »

But seeing it in the Games Category of all places has set off alarm bells. Usually this kind of unfettered outrage is reserved exclusively for Politics After Hours or even the Religion Category.

Of all places? This is going to come up anywhere religion is brought up. How is that so shocking. There's all sorts of issues regarding the gaming industry and religion.

I'm no militant atheist , I don't even consider myself atheist. But I'm not gonna tip toe around subjects either when the facts are there.

Dohnny Jepp wrote: »

In regards to the third link the moderator in question had everythin under control, he warned yourself and another user when an argument was bringing it off topic.

Mods on their respective forums are not incompetent and will deal with any case that deem to be over the top.

Yeah he warned not to post again about it, so overheal thanked his post, then proceeded to edit his previous post so as to add a dig with out making a new post...:rolleyes: Don't think that wasn't spotted

Overheal

CF: Retr0gamer has already dealt with the thread. Its locked now.

I wrote this thread to discuss the situation as it affects the Entire Web Site. If you want to discuss the particulars of a single thread discuss it with Retr0gamer or the Help Desk.

I made an edit to my last post @ 14:10. Retr0gamer banned the argument @ 14:10. Consipiracy?!?! No. Actually after I read Retr0s comment I PMd him about making this thread for the outlined reasons.

I don't pretend to know your Posting Habits CF. Except to say you spent 5 minutes or more writing the above post, between however long it took to write the original @ 21:20 and the final draft @ 21:25. I guess I need to ask: Do you refresh the page every time you make an edit?

Thaedydal wrote: »

When this happens report the posts and push for action on them.

On a broad scale, I thought that was what I was doing here. By pooling together what look to be themselves like isolated incidents into one issue it calls attention to the need for a unified approach on a unified problem: The moral outrage in the wake of the RCC goings on.

There were two dodgy priest over the years when I was growning up and it was known that 1 wasn't to be left alone with boys and the other wasn't to be left alone with girls. So yes in relation to this I do blame the laity and everyone else for not calling a halt.

Yeah but like so many other things you cant blame Bob for something Jill knew about and covered up/did her best to ignore. Im sure you would find the majority of Practicing Catholics had nothing to do with it whatsoever. Im not talking about "I heard on the Radio that a Bishop in Waterford was XYZ'ng the Altar Boys" I mean more like your own case, "I knew my Priest couldn't be left alone with boys but I said nothing".

I could see why and how, if Jill started a thread and finally said to the community "I knew and I said nothing" I could see how she could expect to see some near-justified scorning levied her way. But not Bill, who was not involved in any way whatsoever, and all he asked was where he should get his Daughter Baptised, etc.

Ultimately its unreasonable to demand all Catholics Boycott the Catholic Church or be scorned by society. If you were a Devout Catholic, the RCC has a monopoly on your faith, quite frankly. But *that* is a discussion probably best elaborated in Christianity to be discussed among Catholics themselves.

WindSock

lol @ religious intolerant fundamentalist Athiests :pac:


So much for live & let live

Nevyn

Overheal wrote: »

Ultimately its unreasonable to demand all Catholics Boycott the Catholic Church or be scorned by society. If you were a Devout Catholic, the RCC has a monopoly on your faith, quite frankly. But *that* is a discussion probably best elaborated in Christianity to be discussed among Catholics themselves.

Is it?
Surely it is time to think What Would Jesus Do?
He condemned and walked away from the Temple and it's corrupt priests and Pharisees.

We had the Celtic Catholic Church here before the Roman Catholic church and it's something which if the people wanted could go back to it again.
So no the RC does not have a monopoly on Catholicism, hence is being called Roman Catholicism.

I get that people may view boards.ie as an escape on the internet to have discussion and get away from what is going on in the world but when it's something like this, it can't be done imho.

It's something we have to bear with, but I am sure that any posts which break the forum and sites rules will be acted on.

Doctor DooM

Thaedydal wrote: »

Is it?
Surely it is time to think What Would Jesus Do?
He condemned and walked away from the Temple and it's corrupt priests and Pharisees.

We had the Celtic Catholic Church here before the Roman Catholic church and it's something which if the people wanted could go back to it again.
So no the RC does not have a monopoly on Catholicism, hence is being called Roman Catholicism.

I get that people may view boards.ie as an escape on the internet to have discussion and get away from what is going on in the world but when it's something like this, it can't be done imho.

It's something we have to bear with, but I am sure that any posts which break the forum and sites rules will be acted on.

In fact not to long ago I had a very interesting chat with a fairly prominent Protestant priest in Kildare who is also quite outgoing in correcting people who think the roman catholic church monopolises the term "catholic".

That said- this is kinda annoying me too.

I think it's an interesting shift in the dynamic of the country and as always AH is the mirror of Ireland's soul. When we were rich, anyone who said something mildy against anti immigration / sexism etc was instantly labelled a pc fool.

Now it's swung the other way and people are hopping on the anti church train.

Now don't get me wrong they deserve it and I do feel personally I couldn't be happier than if the RC were run out of this country but I can also see it becoming the basis of boring, repetetive thoughtless attacks the same way "PC brigade" was back when we all had money and could look down our nose at Johnny Foreigner.

metrovelvet

Arent the majority of the church sex abuse scandals connected to the Irish catholic church, and Boston, which is really another extended parish of it?

I'd rather be part of the roman catholic church than the celtic one if this is the case.

Doctor DooM

metrovelvet wrote: »

Arent the majority of the church sex abuse scandals connected to the Irish catholic church, and Boston, which is really another extended parish of it?

I'd rather be part of the roman catholic church than the celtic one if this is the case.

This isn't the place for it but there is some amount of evidence that Roman Catholic hierarchy all the way up to the current pope when he was head of the congregation for the doctrine of the faith were aware what was happening and were implicit in the cover up.

AckwelFoley

People need to separate god from their anger for the catholic church.

Im more than disgusted by the church and im not going to go on about them, they only anger me, but you absolutely cannot disrespect and look down your nose at people that have faith in a god. I dont believe in a god, perhaps some day i will find faith again, but my rational thinking brain when switched on cannot reason one.

But people are entitled to have a faith, and the comfort and solice it povides them is unquestionable.

Doctor DooM

the pope has finally made a statement.

I'd say this is about to kick into overdrive.

Nevyn

I've read it, weasely worded is the best description of it so far.
Personally I often wonder why the country has not gone shifted to The Episcopal Church.

Dohnny Jepp

Doctor DooM wrote: »

the pope has finally made a statement.

I'd say this is about to kick into overdrive.

Poor AH mods. They are gonna have a great day :P

cornbb

Overheal wrote: »

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055855125
Condemnation for the Catholic Priesthood is one thing; Sectarian outrage toward everyone who practices a belief in God is quite another. It needs clamping down on before it grows wildly out of control.

Belief in a higher being is one issue. It is superstition at best, a comfort blanket for people who are uncomfortable with unanswered questions and would rather make things up instead. It is silly but harmless.

But a more serious thing is showing support for an organisation that has consistently covered up the sexual abuse of children, and STILL refuses to seriously address this. The only true agendas the Catholic Church has ever had (and still has) are self-protection and self-propogation. Anyone who still shows support for them needs to take a reality check. Anyone who gives them money should be ashamed at what they are supporting.

I don't hate many things in life. I don't hate religion. But I wouldn't blame anyone for hating the Catholic Church.

Sparks

Overheal wrote: »

. Im sure you would find the majority of Practicing Catholics had nothing to do with it whatsoever.

"Majority" in this case could quite possibly be qualified by "slim"...

Ultimately its unreasonable to demand all Catholics Boycott the Catholic Church or be scorned by society.

Well, there's the minor point of comparing the asserted primacy of canon law over state law and how that contrasts with the criminal codes surrounding treason...

And there's a line between demanding boycotts and demanding that the raping of children be protested against, investigated and the culpable punished...

Sparks

WindSock wrote: »

lol @ religious intolerant fundamentalist Athiests :pac:

I just love how "atheist" is always translated to "has no faith" instead of its correct translation "has faith there is no god"; and I love even more how that then gets transmuted into "have a crack at them, they're not allowed to get irate when someone questions their religious stance 'cos they don't got none, hur, hur, hur".

It makes for great conversations in the real world when you tell a religious person that you're not getting married in a church. Views on how marriage requires a church to be 'real' are always amusing to hear. (And let's not discuss the mirth that emerges from discussions on the benefits of baptism/communion/confession/confirmation of your children, that really would have folks rolling in the aisles).

Apropos to the OP, if people ditched that attitude in here, it might reduce the magnitude of the outrage from those of us that don't believe in teapots orbiting mars when those who are pro-easter-bunny express an opinion we find difficult to accept. (whoops, I appear to have exercised the belief that turnabout is fair play...)

Sparks

snyper wrote: »

I dont believe in a god, perhaps some day i will find faith again

*ahem*
That's pretty much what I was talking about.
Not believing in a god != not having faith.

DeVore

I've been trying my damnedest to get done under the blasphemy laws...

I'm sure its annoying to have the "tastes" of some of your group repeatedly pointed out but to be fair, what would you like us to do

I agree that posters shouldnt be attacked for their religion but that goes as far as calling someone a "dirty child-touching Catholic"... but I dont see much of that being reported. Anger at the institution of the RC church is not going to go away because we step in to protect them... not that I think we should.

DeV.

hopalong85

My name is URL wrote: »

Attack the Pope, not the parishioners

In this case I believe parishioners have left themselves open to attack. For continuing to attend mass and support the Church financially I believe they do deserve to be ridiculed.

Sparks

hopalong85 wrote: »

In this case I believe parishioners have left themselves open to attack. For continuing to attend mass and support the Church financially I believe they do deserve to be ridiculed.

Not that I have much sympathy for those who continue to act like an egyptian crocodile, but all Irish taxpayers are supporting the Church financially at the moment and have been for some time.

Sparks

DeVore wrote: »

I've been trying my damnedest to get done under the blasphemy laws...

Wait till after Ahern is out of the Minister for Justice's office and you'll have better luck - anyone getting done under those laws before he leaves and the new incumbent can blame the mess on him isn't very likely...

hopalong85

Sparks wrote: »

Not that I have much sympathy for those who continue to act like an egyptian crocodile, but all Irish taxpayers are supporting the Church financially at the moment and have been for some time.

Didn't realise that. Thanks for the links. Pretty shocking, just reinforces my determination to emigrate immediately upon graduation.

Orion

Overheal wrote: »

Condemnation for the Catholic Priesthood is one thing; Sectarian outrage toward everyone who practices a belief in God is quite another. It needs clamping down on before it grows wildly out of control.

+1. It's the equivalent of attack the post not the poster. I'm vehemently opposed to the Catholic Church, it's institutional corruption and abuse of power and Ratzinger himself. But I don't ever criticise people for having faith. While I'm also an athiest I am a firm believer in freedom to practise religion as you see fit.

It does amaze me that people still accept dogma from Rome - particularly in relation to child abuse. One guy (in AH I think) referred to the letter today as a "letter from our Holy Father" and implies that it should not be questioned. Blind faith and acceptance like that just amazes me.

Cunny-Funt

hopalong85 wrote: »

Didn't realise that. Thanks for the links. Pretty shocking, just reinforces my determination to emigrate immediately upon graduation.

Yeah I feel the same way tbh.

Overheal wrote: »

I don't pretend to know your Posting Habits CF. Except to say you spent 5 minutes or more writing the above post, between however long it took to write the original @ 21:20 and the final draft @ 21:25. I guess I need to ask: Do you refresh the page every time you make an edit?

No I don't edit my posts after people already replied to them to add extra digs, I merely replied to your post 1st. Then read the rest of the thread and replied to Dohnny Jepp's post. Editing it in so as not to make a double post since no one posted after my last post.

dr.bollocko

Nobody expects the atheist inquisition!

The catholic church in Ireland has hidden and covered up the abuse of innocent children by evil men. These men weren't shunned or vilified or sent to jail. They were moved to another parish to do it again. People need an avenue to express the kind of ire that that type of evil inspires. Hopefully it isn't confined to just boards tbh.

Dr Galen

snyper wrote: »

but you absolutely cannot disrespect and look down your nose at people that have faith in a god. I dont believe in a god, perhaps some day i will find faith again, but my rational thinking brain when switched on cannot reason one.

Why not?

While I agree with the OP that sometimes people are going to far with some comments, I fail to see why we can't "look down our nose" at those who believe in a fairytale. Within the bounds of site policy on personal abuse of course.

If someone believes in something mental, then of course I'll have less respect for them. If someone wants to believe that the earth is flat, of course I'll think less of them. Likewise if someone wants to tell me they want to believe in the Romes version of sleeping beauty, well then same follows.

But people are entitled to have a faith, and the comfort and solice it povides them is unquestionable.

I agree that people are free to believe in what they want, and would be a defender of that right totally, the fact that they take comfort and solice from it is not my concern.

Going back to what I said above, I don't think people with faith deserve any more or less protection than anyone else on this site. No more than the public servants regularly getting slated as being lazy so and so's (we all know that most aren't), no more than the people who made a few euro during the boom being called money grabbing thieves ( again, most weren't) etc etc. I could go on, pointing out other groups of people who regularly come in for attack not just here but across all society. Certainly, personal abuse should not be tolerated whatsoever, but additional protection just because religion makes people feel warm and fuzzy is not a good road.

Handsome Bob

There was a recent thread in A&A which sums up my feelings on this. A number of posters had ganged up on a certain poster, some of the posts crossed the line to personally abusive in my humble opinion. Here's the thread;

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055852556

I reported them and they went unacknowledged. A mod note was posted in the thread on page 1 or 2 but it was by and large ignored.

I have noticed an ever increasing amount of posters being unable to discuss religion without getting personal and crossing the line so I completely agree Overheal.

Just for background, I'm not religious myself, so this is not the opinion of someone who feels persecuted. Rather it's just the opinion of someone who was brought up to have manners, common courtesy and to not patronise or look down on people.

Chinafoot

I don't really get how this warrants its own thread. If you see a post attacking someone personally report it and let the moderators deal with it. If its a case that you don't agree then state your case. Debate the issue. Should we stop all discussion on the issue? Should we only allow posts that you deem to be nice regarding the church?

The sex abuse scandals are a hot topic at the moment and people are justified in their outrage. It'll pass. Next month it'll be something else to get riled about. I don't see why religion deserves special treatment. People are entitled to their religious beliefs and equally people are entitled to think that its a pile of crap and both sides should be free to express that here. Personal abuse is never warranted but someone making the point that the laiety were in some way implicit to what went on and should be ashamed is not personal abuse as far as I'd be concerned. It absolutely baffles me that people still support that church, just like it baffles me that people still support this government. I do have a lower opinion of those people. Why shouldn't I?

As Mystik Monkey pointed out there have been numerous topics where people have voiced their outrage in this way. I'm a public sector worker, should I go reporting every post that says "The public sector are all lazys gits who do nothing, make thousands a week, and then hold the country to ransom to get what they want"? That view has been expressed on boards countless times and people are entitled to that opinion, even if I completely disagree with them.

In short (I'm very hungover and not being very coherent) report the posts you deem abusive and leave it to the mods.

Ickle Magoo

LZ5by5 wrote: »

I have noticed an ever increasing amount of posters being unable to discuss religion without getting personal and crossing the line....

See, I kind of agree with that. There does seem to be some quite rabid anti-theists about and sometimes their comments make me cringe - but in the interests of fairness, there is still a lot of double standards. Perhaps there needs to be some more obvious rules in the charter with regards to religion or religious comments too?

I'm not sure what makes it okay for a theist to tell a poster in PI that they have no morals, or that a parent is cruel for not introducing their child to god in parenting or post in a forum dedicated to people who lack belief in a god theistic proclamations about their nearest and dearest suffering bringing them closer to god but argue that no-one can tell the theist that their faith based proclamations regarding others are nonsense & not appreciated.

There seems to be an all pervasive religious agenda by certain posters who assume they have carte blanche to judge and make rather inappropriate judgements and suggestions because that is what their faith tells them they - and everyone else - should believe. I agree that personal insults should treated the same way as any other kind of insult in line with the charter but I don't see why theists should automatically have the right to foist religious views on others unabated or unquestioned outside of the forums dedicated to them, either.

AckwelFoley

Mystik Monkey wrote: »

Why not?

While I agree with the OP that sometimes people are going to far with some comments, I fail to see why we can't "look down our nose" at those who believe in a fairytale. Within the bounds of site policy on personal abuse of course.

If someone believes in something mental, then of course I'll have less respect for them. If someone wants to believe that the earth is flat, of course I'll think less of them. Likewise if someone wants to tell me they want to believe in the Romes version of sleeping beauty, well then same follows.
.

Because to "look down ones nose" at someone else, is to assume your views or social standing is greater than the other. Its the single biggest cause of conflict among mankind. At some point Hitler was sitting having a beer and a bratwurst and thought to himself, them jews are a lesser group than us germans (although he was austrian).

My point is this, dont look down on other people due to what may be their opinion or beliefs no matter how daft they may seem. It shows a level of intolerance and snobbery that relfects more on the one that holds it than the person they have the view of

Dr Galen

i should clarify then, what I'm talking about is "looking down ones nose" purely on an intellectual level. Not a personal one.

I do think we're in agreement though that the personal side of things should be removed from any debate or discussion around religion.

--amadeus--

Firstly Boards is a medium, not a message. We don't set agendas we just facilitate people discussing them. The RCC attitude to the serial abusers in thier employ is a hot topic and will stay so unless and until people feel it's being addressed and I don't think we should in any way try to stifle that debate.

And I'm totally with MM - no-one should face personal abuse. But we should be free to point out the many, many flaws in the RCC. As in no-one should be told "you're catholic therfore you're a child rapist" but we should be free to say "teh RCC covered up decades of child rape"

And there are two sides in teh debate. A lot of teh posts from teh RCC apologists have been very unpleasent:

ISAW wrote: »

<waffle>

Rape was not committed as there was not law of raping boys!

<waffle>

People can't crib looking for protection from people attacking religion on teh one hand and post stuff like that on teh other.

WindSock

Sparks wrote: »

I just love how "atheist" is always translated to "has no faith" instead of its correct translation "has faith there is no god"; and I love even more how that then gets transmuted into "have a crack at them, they're not allowed to get irate when someone questions their religious stance 'cos they don't got none, hur, hur, hur".

That's not what I was saying at all. By the term 'fundamentalist Athiest', I wasn't having a go at all athiests, just the ones who act in the same manner as fundamentalist religious; those who berate any one for not having the same belief as them.
I am not religious myself, less do I care about the church, but I have to say some of the most intolerant people I have come across call themselves athiests.

Overheal

Mystik Monkey wrote: »

Going back to what I said above, I don't think people with faith deserve any more or less protection than anyone else on this site. No more than the public servants regularly getting slated as being lazy so and so's (we all know that most aren't), no more than the people who made a few euro during the boom being called money grabbing thieves ( again, most weren't) etc etc. I could go on, pointing out other groups of people who regularly come in for attack not just here but across all society. Certainly, personal abuse should not be tolerated whatsoever, but additional protection just because religion makes people feel warm and fuzzy is not a good road.

dr.bollocko wrote: »

Nobody expects the atheist inquisition!

The catholic church in Ireland has hidden and covered up the abuse of innocent children by evil men. These men weren't shunned or vilified or sent to jail. They were moved to another parish to do it again. People need an avenue to express the kind of ire that that type of evil inspires. Hopefully it isn't confined to just boards tbh.

--amadeus-- wrote: »

Firstly Boards is a medium, not a message. We don't set agendas we just facilitate people discussing them. The RCC attitude to the serial abusers in thier employ is a hot topic and will stay so unless and until people feel it's being addressed and I don't think we should in any way try to stifle that debate.

And I'm totally with MM - no-one should face personal abuse. But we should be free to point out the many, many flaws in the RCC. As in no-one should be told "you're catholic therfore you're a child rapist" but we should be free to say "teh RCC covered up decades of child rape"

That's all I'm trying to say. When you're going off-topic in a thread to attack someone and say they are trying to brainwash their children because they are Religious, is going way out of line. I am not at all trying to defend the Church itself or stifle the topic and I'm appalled but unsurprised at the Pope's recent admission that they effectively feel they are above the law. Those are totally valid concerns and discussions but thats not a license to permit Discrimination and Bigotry. And surely if you want to express disappointment at the Laity you can still maintain the Decorum that has Always been expected here, regardless of the issue; and not resort to this.

If I had said the same thing about the Republican Party in a Healthcare debate for example, I'd have been rightly banned. However to the contrary, posts like these are being actively supported and encouraged.

Ickle Magoo wrote:

I'm not sure what makes it okay for a theist to tell a poster in PI that they have no morals, or that a parent is cruel for not introducing their child to god in parenting or post in a forum dedicated to people who lack belief in a god theistic proclamations about their nearest and dearest suffering bringing them closer to god but argue that no-one can tell the theist that their faith based proclamations regarding others are nonsense & not appreciated.

I don't defend the right of anyone to make such claims and accusations either and when they've been levied at me in the past I have always been quick to report them. But just as I expected to be defended from those accusations when it was directed at me; they deserve the same courtesy now that it is directed at them.

Maximilian

The depth and scale of grotesquerie of the catholic church is just incredible to me. And if I read the article in the paper correctly (or enough) this morning the Pope has pretty much much said it's our own fault for not being devout enough and sapping their jedi powers or whatever.

To a real atheist, it's nothing short of astonishing that anybody can believe in religion at all. To those who now come to question and thereafter reject the beliefs drilled into them since childhood, anger is a perfectly natural response.

It's surprising to see a supposedly self-confessed atheist say that we should shut up or just be more quiet/respectful about it all. Why aren't there more such threads?

Ickle Magoo

Overheal wrote: »

If I had said the same thing about the Republican Party in a Healthcare debate for example, I'd have been rightly banned. However to the contrary, posts like these are being actively supported and encouraged.

But, ironically, you think having a sig calling someone fcuking unbelievably retarded is okay?

Overheal

Ickle Magoo wrote: »

But, ironically, you think having a sig calling someone fcuking unbelievably retarded is okay?

If you follow the link I clearly explain the rationale that brought me to that proclamation.

Youre also welcome to peruse all of my other posts discussing Palin. I've often defended her right to privacy to what she does as a Private Citizen. I do however find that what she chooses to do as a Politician is open to scrutiny. And by that record, she's made all the wrong moves.

Did I mention Im a big Family Guy fan?