Am I being a bad person here?

LegacyUser

I just need to ask for opinions on a matter that has been nagging away at me for some time now.

I have a friend (lets call her Carrie) that i have known for many years. We do get on great and I used to consider her to be one of my closest friends until maybe a year or so ago. For a long time (due to a huge lack of confidence and self esteem issues) i was very happy to be in her shadow so to speak, or be the sidekick that didnt get as much attention. she is very much attention seeking, loves having drama in her life etc. Everything is very much all her, her, her.

Over the past few years the rest of our social group has branched off and done their own things.However they have all said to me at different times that they too have felt used by Carrie, not appreciated etc. They have all very much pulled away from her, just seeing her as an acquaintance. They have also told me they think she uses me for money, for just someone who will always be there etc. I have found it hard to pull away from Carrie myself, mostly due to a lack of self esteem, feelings of guilt and fear of shaking up my life like that.

I very much take pride in my friendships and most of my friends are supportive and we have balanced friendships.

My friendship with Carrie is very much one sided, or used to be until recently. Over the past year i have been attending counselling, recognising that i ALWAYS put others before myself. And i am working on this and have come on in leaps and bounds.
I have stopped lending her money (and i was such a fool to do it for long) and i think she is very angry about this yet hasnt directly addressed me or asked me what has changed. She has made comments to some of our friends like "she's been strict with me" or "she's cut me off" and made a few nasty digs at me, although never directly to me.
I havent discussed it with her as i knew she was going through some issues with her boyfriend. i find it hard to confront her about things as she gets really really nasty when it comes to confrontation but i know it has to be discussed. She always manages to make some sort of dig or find a way to put people down. I know it isnt just me who feels this way.

However, something happened at the wkend (not a huge issue but significant one) which led to her being very upset. I was with mutual friends at the time and i spoke to her over the phone. She then spoke to one of the girls on the phone. We pretty much both said the same things to her and she didnt ask us to come down to her etc. After the phone call, myself and the girls realised we couldnt go down to her anyways as we had been drinking and it seemed that she didnt want us down.

I was told yesterday that Carrie is livid with me for not going down to be with her that evening. She has told two of my friends this. I tried talking to her online (not the best option but she was in work) but got cold responses. I tried ringing her in the evening but she refused to speak to me, yet she is fine with our other friends. They have been sticking up for me saying that Carrie cant use me as a scapegoat. I know Carrie finds it easier to be angry than upset or feel guilty but i dont understand why I am the one singled out as the bad guy and why she is acting this way.

Now im supposed to be meeting her tonight (with mutual friends there too) and i am just wondering what i should do or say. I dont want an arguement (even though she does), i dont want to say something i will regret but at the same time I dont feel like i have done anything wrong. Am i making too much of an issue here? Should i just ignore the way she is acting and then bring things up at a later stage?

I understand that I am the one bringing about changes in the friendship which is rocking it a bit but am i being unfair here? I dont want to lose her as a friend completely but i dont want to feel used all the time. Any advice or opinions would be great

LegacyUser

Hey OP, I know what you're going through. About a year ago i decided to cut contact with an old friend for various reasons.

I would say that you should try your best to speak to carrie about what is going on. Like Sunflower said, don't act apologetic or nervous. When you're next talking, and she asks you whats wrong, maybe tell her in a nice way.

I did this and my friend was taken aback, but she agreed that she was being incredibly selfish and negitive. Unfortunately, her new better way of showing friendship lasted until she basicially told me she didn't want me meeting her new bf in case I gave a bad impression of her. Needless to say, I immediately cut all contact. I had spent years being there for her when she needed me. Letting her live in my house. Sitting up until 3am when whatever bloke she was "madly in love with" broke up with her. She was never there when I needed her, she had lost most of her frends because of this by the time I cut contact with her.

To be honest, I do sometimes regret not seeing her. And even talking about it I'm upset about it but very very angry at the way she made me feel, and the fact now that she's telling people I'm awful for ignoring her. She has no idea WHY I cut her off and is the victim in her own mind. That makes me so mad, I'd love to let her know that she brought it on herself. However, I tried. It didn't work. She's too far into herself and her idea of how life should be, that she listened to what I said and then filed it away to never be thought of again. She lost a good friend in the process and I'm not the only one she lost.

Looking back - 90% of her conversation was slagging her other friends. Horrible really to think of now.

I think you should try talk to her about it. Give her a chance, and if that doesn't work, you'll know you did all you could to save your friendship.

mood

sunflower27 wrote: »

No, you are not being unfair at all.

Carrie is used to having you at her disposal financially, for someone to go out with, lean on. You've realised the friendship is one-sided and have rightly sorted yourself out and backed off a bit.

Your counselling has done you good. Time to put into practice what you know.

If she starts on you, politely say 'I was unable to visit you, I had been drinking. I'm not getting into a domestic here with you now. I'm out to enjoy my evening. We can talk about this another time.'

Do not look weak and afraid of her - she's banking on it. She wants the old you back - the one that did what she told you to. I dare say this is about much more than just you not going to see her. This is about the whole change in you, the not lending her money etc.

If she wants to carry on like a spoilt brat, let her. By the sounds of it you are going to outgrow this friendship the longer time goes on and the more you boost your self esteem.

You've done nothing wrong, so in her comapny, don't act like you feel you have.

sf xx

+1

Also stop trying to contact her as it make you look as if you are in the wrong.

Cunsiderthis

dontknowwhat2do wrote: »

I was told yesterday that Carrie is livid with me for not going down to be with her that evening. She has told two of my friends this. I tried talking to her online (not the best option but she was in work) but got cold responses. I tried ringing her in the evening but she refused to speak to me, yet she is fine with our other friends. They have been sticking up for me saying that Carrie cant use me as a scapegoat.

It’s interesting that Carrie is not able to tell you this, but feels she can only tell you through a mutual friend or friends, for she must be sure the mutual friend(s) would tell you.

It’s also interesting that she refuses to speak to you, and uses not speaking as a weapon to try to manipulate you.

dontknowwhat2do wrote: »

Now im supposed to be meeting her tonight (with mutual friends there too) and i am just wondering what i should do or say. I dont want an arguement (even though she does), i dont want to say something i will regret but at the same time I dont feel like i have done anything wrong. Am i making too much of an issue here? Should i just ignore the way she is acting and then bring things up at a later stage?

Remember, it takes two to argue and even though she may want an argument, no one can force you to join in. You don’t have to say anything you have to regret, and you haven’t done anything wrong.

Of course you are not making too much of an issue of it. Friends outgrow each other as they develop, and it seems you are maturing and developing in a direction which possibly means your friendship with Carrie will change too. It already has as you have decided to no longer lend her money and no longer are content to play second fiddle to her.

I wouldn’t say or do anything you might regret, and just play it as if it’s a normal evening. If Carrie wants to pick a fight, then don’t respond in kind. Consider just listening to her, and when she runs out of steam , just say “I’m sorry” or “I’m sorry you feel like that” or something bland which doesn’t give her an option to attack.

If it were me, and she continued the argument after that, I’d listen and let her rant on a bit, and at the appropriate time my only response would be that we are out for an evening with friends, and I’m not going to get into an argument and spoil the evening. If she continues and won’t let it go, then I’d get up, apologise to everyone else, and say that I think it best if I go as I don’t want to stay and make it unpleasant for everyone else.. Then I’d leave and go home.

Sometimes we outgrow our friends and perhaps that’s what is happening here with your friend Carrie.

Denerick

Carrie sounds like an awfully immature tit who most people feel compelled to 'put up with' because of her natural negative charisma (As in, she tends to alienate rather than encourage people) Better off without.

OS119

yeah, get rid.

it sounds like she has twigged that people are getting bored of her, and that she intends to 'guilt trip' you into getting back into her good books.

given that, in effect, you've decided that this friendship is just circling the plughole and all thats left is the shouting, i'd suggest actually having the confrontation/argument with her. get it overwith, on a subject you're happy to argue over - and i'd do it while you're with people who, you think are going to pretty much be on your side.

assuming she starts up with 'why didn't you come over when i needed you - too busy enjoying yourself were you?' (typical woe is me stuff...), i'd return with a very calm 'i'm sorry carrie, but as you knew at the time we'd all had a drink - not that you asked us to come over anyway - and it would have been both unsafe and illegal for any of us to drive. if you really believe that your problem was sufficiently serious that we, as your friends, should have risked our own lives, the lives of others, and a conviction for drink-driving, to come and be with you, then i think we have very different priorities.'

that leaves her with two possible replies - yes you should have risked death and prison to come and console her over being dumped by this weeks boyfriend, or no, i'm a whining cow with my head up my arse who honks off at my friends because i like being the centre of attention.

either answer would be a 'dumping offence' in a freindship for me....

LegacyUser

thanks very much for the swift replies. Its funny cos everything that has been suggested and advised i already have said to myself but its just good to hear it from objective viewpoints.

i feel that Carrie has singled me out on this occasion as she knows i tend to take on guilt that isnt always mine (or of my own doing..does that make sense?) Some mentioned manipulation...thats exactly how i feel with her. and i dont want to feel like that anymore, with her or with anyone else.
I feel like a weak person around her- that my generosity is just weakness and my caring nature and easy goingness with my friends is just me being a walk over. I hate feeling that way.

In looking back, Carrie has rarely been there for me or indeed our other friends when times have been bad, unless it suited her to be there (eg nothing better to do, makes her feel virtuous or has something on us to 'owe' her). Standing on a bridge ready to jump she wouldnt be the one id call, yet i feel she demands this of me....nearly by default because her other friends have pulled away.

im just so bad when it comes to confrontation (even when its not an argument) especially with her and i tend to get very upset and end up apologising usually for things i havent done. I suppose this has to do with my insecurities.

I dont know how to shake off the feelings of guilt i feel for pulling back from this friendship, even if i dont abandon it completely. I suppose its something for me to bring to my counsellor!
thanks for the words of wisdom and ill definately be keeping them in mind when i do meet up with her!

Peggypeg

dontknowwhat2do wrote: »

thanks very much for the swift replies. Its funny cos everything that has been suggested and advised i already have said to myself but its just good to hear it from objective viewpoints.

i feel that Carrie has singled me out on this occasion as she knows i tend to take on guilt that isnt always mine (or of my own doing..does that make sense?) Some mentioned manipulation...thats exactly how i feel with her. and i dont want to feel like that anymore, with her or with anyone else.
I feel like a weak person around her- that my generosity is just weakness and my caring nature and easy goingness with my friends is just me being a walk over. I hate feeling that way.

In looking back, Carrie has rarely been there for me or indeed our other friends when times have been bad, unless it suited her to be there (eg nothing better to do, makes her feel virtuous or has something on us to 'owe' her). Standing on a bridge ready to jump she wouldnt be the one id call, yet i feel she demands this of me....nearly by default because her other friends have pulled away.

im just so bad when it comes to confrontation (even when its not an argument) especially with her and i tend to get very upset and end up apologising usually for things i havent done. I suppose this has to do with my insecurities.

I dont know how to shake off the feelings of guilt i feel for pulling back from this friendship, even if i dont abandon it completely. I suppose its something for me to bring to my counsellor!
thanks for the words of wisdom and ill definately be keeping them in mind when i do meet up with her!

You should print that out and take it to your councellor, s/he'd be so proud of you. You're completely in full view of your own actions and feelings and honestly you have answered your own question really. You know you were a good friend to Carrie but you weren't good to yourself by allowing people to walk on you. Now that you're saying "no, I won't be treated this way" Carrie is getting angry and treating you like cr*p because she wants you to stay the handholding, money lending second fiddle to her. You don't want to be that anymore so I would suggest trying one more time for your own sake to talk it out but if she's having none of it then cut her out. If she can't agree to not manipulate and put you down then you really don't need her anyways. I know it's sad when a friendship ends but sometimes they turn toxic and they'll only drag you down. Best of luck.

Kimia

You are not at fault here OP.

I had a similar problem with a toxic friend. Basically she used to tell me about myself, as if she was doing me a favour. She'd look at me and say stuff like "You know, you're very negative", if I was having a bad day, or I remember telling her something about my childhood which affected me deeply and she said "Don't be so silly - it was years ago!". Needless to say we're not friends anymore.

These people are toxic. I don't know why they don't realise it, maybe people have tiptoed about them their whole lives. Whatever. It's not our problem to figure them out and fix them. We're only responsible for ourselves so if she makes you feel bad about yourself you get rid of her. Life's too short.

LegacyUser

just a msg to update.

Went out for the evening with my friends and Carrie was extremely short and rude with me. I didnt want to bring up anything to make the others uncomfortable so i kept my cool and remained polite and friendly to her but not overly so. I told her that if she had a problem with me she could contact me during the week to discuss it in private. She ignored this and pretty much ignored me for the rest of the night.

I made an effort to thouroughly(sp?) enjoy my night and ended up having fun with the others while she sat with a face on. She was so rude to one of the other girls as well (lets call her Miranda) who just ignored her behaviour.

Anyways myself and Miranda ended up heading home on the train together and she told me something that had been bugging her, something she had not wanted to tell me in case it upset me. Basically a week previous Miranda mentioned something to Carrie about how she thought my counselling sessions were doing me a world of good and that she could see some positive changes in me....to which Carrie replied, "oh is this where she has got the notion of cutting me off with money?"

I think that remark just says it all about her really! and im neither angry nor upset with her, i just think its pathetic behaviour. I think i will discuss everything with Carrie but i just want to do it for my own benefit.

I really think its time to end the friendship...and i feel content, and even relieved, to have come to that conclusion!

thanks again for the advice, its very much appreciated! x