Buses & Weight Limits

irish1967

OK . So there is a bridge near me with a 7.5 tonne weight limit on it. Its clearly marked with the usual sign on both sides. It Just happens to be on the quickest but not the only route to the towns bus station. (there are 2 other possible routes which would take about 2 minutes more to travel). On a very regular basis I see Bus Eireann Express coaches crossing this bridge.

Are the buses made from a super light material that means they are under 7.5 tonne?

Are buses under 7.5 tonne anyways?

Are they breaking the law by crossing if they are over the limit?

Should they be reported? And who to?

Just wondering.

trad

I've had a look at the RSA's Rules of the Road on line
http://www.rotr.ie/understanding-traffic-signs/regulatory-traffic-signs.html

It only refers to "large vehicles" but the graphic shows a commercial vehicle so it would be reasonable to assume that it applies to commercial vehicles only... or does it?

Buses tend to be very heavy, some are 13tonne unladen.

As ever the Gardai are responsible for enforcing this but the vehicle has to be brought to a weighbridge within, I think, 8 kilometers of where the vehicle was stopped which in most cases makes it difficult to enforce.

Cookie_Monster

Why would the limit only be commercial vehicles though. either the bridge is rated to take the weight or not regardless of what it is crossing it. Wouldn't a bus push more pressure on it too as possibly a higher axle load than a large truck or artic?

trad

I think the purpose of the restriction is to restrict the movement of commercial vehicles however buses can weigh more than a lot of commercial vehicles and can be up to 12m long.

Cardiff Bridge on Rathoath Road Dublin is a good example. It currently has a skew bridge over the Royal Canal. It has a weight restriction (can't remember if it's 3.5 or 7.5t). There were no busses on this route when the restriction was imposed. Articulated trucks were regularly getting stuck between the paraphets of the 200 year old bridge causing lenghty delays and damage.
The bridge is now used by Dublin Bus on a regular basis. You still meet the occasional artic having a go at getting over the bridge (avoids the M50 toll).

godtabh

Isnt it more to do with the axle load?

irish1967

Thanks for the info.. I was wondering did Bus Eireann drivers imagine they were above the law.

The other thing I note is that the sign on the bridge says.. something like "Weight limit 7.5 tonnes per vehicle or combination thereof" something like that. I always found this funny.. I mean.. if you are driving a vehicle that weighs 3 tonne and you approach this bridge and there is another 4 tonne vehicle coming the other way... what do you do ? Get out and ask the other guy how much his vehicle weighs??? :rolleyes:

Victor

Two types of weight limits apply.

1. Bridge limits, which are essentially absolute (fire brigade may be exempt, but are they going to try it?)

2. Road / area limits that are designed to exclude heavy vehicles from an area. Scheduled bus services are exempt from these.

Raise the matter with the Garda, council and the bus operator.

irish1967 wrote: »

The other thing I note is that the sign on the bridge says.. something like "Weight limit 7.5 tonnes per vehicle or combination thereof" something like that.

That refers to vehicles with trailers and/or towing another vehicle.

corktina

Often these limits are qualified as "except for access" which clearly the buses would be doing if they have to go that way to the bus station. Its more to do (often) with restricting routes for large vehicles rather than a weak bridge.

godtabh

corktina wrote: »

Often these limits are qualified as "except for access" which clearly the buses would be doing if they have to go that way to the bus station. Its more to do (often) with restricting routes for large vehicles rather than a weak bridge.

There is alternative routes

antoinolachtnai

I looked at this recently. SI 182/1997 is the relevant legislation I think. Basically, you can pass a weight limit sign if you are accessing a premises that is only accessible by this means. If there is a bus stop within the limit or even close to the edge of the limit of the limit, that probably qualifies as a premises.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1997/en/si/0182.html

If you are breaking the law, you are breaking the law. The intent of a particular ban doesn't really come into it. However, the Garda or the DPP might decide it was not in the public interest to prosecute. It really would depend on the local circumstances.

The unladen weight of the bus is often written on it somewhere (not sure about the regulation on this).

The issue with a bridge is never going to be a single over-heavy vehicle crossing it. It's the regular usage of over-heavy vehicles that will cause damage over the years.

From an engineering point of view, there is a difference between a bridge limit and other kinds of limit, but not in the law, from what I can see (though I could be missing something).

Cookie_Monster

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

The issue with a bridge is never going to be a single over-heavy vehicle crossing it. It's the regular usage of over-heavy vehicles that will cause damage over the years.

Didn't some truck in Kerry ignore a sign late last year and cause a bridge to collapse due to its weight being over the limit?

antoinolachtnai

The straw that broke the camel's back!

I doubt if he was the first HGV ever to go over it, but for sure, depending on how bad the bridge is. I grudgingly withdraw my use of the word 'never'.

Cookie_Monster

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

The straw that broke the camel's back!

I doubt if he was the first HGV ever to go over it, but for sure, depending on how bad the bridge is. I grudgingly withdraw my use of the word 'never'.

I'm not dis-agreeing with you here at all, but I seem to remember this bridge being very remote and un-used and collapsed as soon as he drove on it.

Now I'm sure there were trucks that drove on it before, but very rarely I'd imagine.

Victor

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055214726

trad

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/plweb-cgi/fastweb?state_id=1268225261&view=ag-view&docrank=6&numhitsfound=43&query_rule=%28%28$query1%29%3C%3DYEAR%3C%3D%28$query2%29%29%20AND%20%28%28$query3%29%29%3Alegtitle%20AND%20%28%28$query4%29%29%3Anumber%20AND%20%28%28$query5%29%29%3Asectionno%20%20AND%20%28%28$query0%29%29&query3=Traffic%20Signs&docid=22327&docdb=SIs&dbname=SIs&sorting=none&operator=and&TemplateName=predoc.tmpl&setCookie=1

Look at Sign RUS 015, it specifies HGV's entering a road, so on the face of it, it look like the ban applies only to HGV's of which a bus is not.

Victor

trad wrote: »

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/plweb-cgi/fastweb?state_id=1268225261&view=ag-view&docrank=6&numhitsfound=43&query_rule=%28%28$query1%29%3C%3DYEAR%3C%3D%28$query2%29%29%20AND%20%28%28$query3%29%29%3Alegtitle%20AND%20%28%28$query4%29%29%3Anumber%20AND%20%28%28$query5%29%29%3Asectionno%20%20AND%20%28%28$query0%29%29&query3=Traffic%20Signs&docid=22327&docdb=SIs&dbname=SIs&sorting=none&operator=and&TemplateName=predoc.tmpl&setCookie=1

Look at Sign RUS 015, it specifies HGV's entering a road, so on the face of it, it look like the ban applies only to HGV's of which a bus is not.

You need to read it with S.I. No. 182/1997 — Road Traffic (Traffic and Parking) Regulations, 1997.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1997/en/si/0182.html

Weight Restriction on Vehicles Entering a Road

17. (1) Where traffic sign number RUS 015 is provided at the entrance to a road, the driver of a vehicle, the unladen weight of which exceeds the weight specified on the sign, shall not proceed beyond the sign.

(2) Sub-article (1) shall not apply where it is necessary for a vehicle to enter a road solely for the purpose of gaining access to or egress from premises accessible only from that road.

The text "Sign No. RUS 015 Ban on HGV's entering a road" is merely for convenience (and not grammatically correct).

trad

Victor, the text on the sign is contained within the SI and not in the explanitary note so therefore it is to be read in conjunction with SI 182 /97 and in my humble opinion it applies to commercial vehicles only. People who draw up legislation are not always legally trained hence the confusion within some regulations.

Victor

The Road Traffic (Signs) Regulations define what the sign looks like.

The Road Traffic (Traffic and Parking) Regulations define what the sign does.

And yes, there are glitches.

irish1967

Thanks folks for the indepth answers. I wish every forum was a thorough.

By the way the bridge was weight limited last year because of concerns about it's age and ability to carry heavy loads. It's an old railway bridge I assume over a river. Cast iron & masonary.