Question about becoming self employed in heating industry.

items

I've a question for once, now that things have slowed right down here I've two options, either jump ship and go abroad or set up my own business. I've always kept away from setting up own business, owning a business means working 24 / 7, I'm a drop tools at 5 o'clock person and forget about work but willing to change.

For me to set up own business I'd have to find a market, I don't want to go down full plumbing route as that means big vans, garage, storage and everything else, this adds work and costs. I'd like to be able to provide a service that doesn't cost much compared to benefits customers could receive.

From all the posts I've seen here along with my own experience working with plumbing / heating one thing is certain most homeowners could have their plumbing / heating system overall improved with just a few hours work.

Question is,

If you knew someone who could service boiler Oil or Gas, clean out heating system, fill with inhibitor and balance system in a way that all rads work correctly and heating return temperature is at optimum temp to gain optimum boiler efficiency, then go over plumbing system to make sure all's well and finish off by labeling every valve, gauge and control so you know whats doing what should you need to. All this in a day for a price not much more than average boiler service, would you believe its possible, if so would you hire someone who could do this?

This is the kind of work I have in mind to set up own business, in a round about way its possible but before looking into it more putting the idea out to see if it could work.

All criticism welcome along with ideas.

For the mods I'm not trying to promote business, hopefully this type of post is allowed if not feel free to do as you please with it, Cheers.

Micky Dolenz

I have changed the title of your thread so it explains the content more accurately.

There would be a big outlay to began with, depending on what equipment you already have. A power flush machine is essential in mantaining/restoring heating systems, cost €1200 to €1500. Flue analazyer €800 to €1200.

Other stuff to has to be considered, income tax, VAT, public liability insurance, transport, insured and taxed.

Being a member of RGI €250 a year, membership of OFTEC, think it's €150.There is much more hidden costs to think about before you start off.


how much would you charge for what you stated?

Joey the lips

items wrote: »

I've a question for once, now that things have slowed right down here I've two options, either jump ship and go abroad or set up my own business. I've always kept away from setting up own business, owning a business means working 24 / 7, I'm a drop tools at 5 o'clock person and forget about work but willing to change.

For me to set up own business I'd have to find a market, I don't want to go down full plumbing route as that means big vans, garage, storage and everything else, this adds work and costs. I'd like to be able to provide a service that doesn't cost much compared to benefits customers could receive.

From all the posts I've seen here along with my own experience working with plumbing / heating one thing is certain most homeowners could have their plumbing / heating system overall improved with just a few hours work.

Question is,

If you knew someone who could service boiler Oil or Gas, clean out heating system, fill with inhibitor and balance system in a way that all rads work correctly and heating return temperature is at optimum temp to gain optimum boiler efficiency, then go over plumbing system to make sure all's well and finish off by labeling every valve, gauge and control so you know whats doing what should you need to. All this in a day for a price not much more than average boiler service, would you believe its possible, if so would you hire someone who could do this?

This is the kind of work I have in mind to set up own business, in a round about way its possible but before looking into it more putting the idea out to see if it could work.

All criticism welcome along with ideas.

For the mods I'm not trying to promote business, hopefully this type of post is allowed if not feel free to do as you please with it, Cheers.

Hi Items, have to say have total admiration with your plans. I dont know weather to try be honest and burst your bubble or pass on my ideas(Which of course you may not listen to ) anyway here it goes

I think your idea is great. However the one thing i have learned by the trade is most of joe pubics dont give a dam. You will get the job by the fact that you are know here but how do you communicate your feelings to joe public. See the problem with joe public is they dont trust the trade. Its not because you are bad. Its because the trade is poor and dishonest.

The only person that you will truly make a difference to is a. Someone with problems or b. someone that understands what youw are talking about. The standard service customer will not give a rats arse.

My feelins are the best thing for you to do is produce a typed report with every job. Tell the customer what exactly you done as part of the service and tell the customer what "Extras" free you dont to show your dedication to the trade. I reckon 1 out of 10 will actually investigate this and provided she/He speaks to an honest plumber. She he will be told you carried out above duty which means you will have a recomendation. A recomendation is above anything.

Now.... How you build on this is you tell each customer that if they get you 4 jobs you will service there boiler for free. Its worth 100 euro to them and only your time. If they get you 3 do it anyway... You will build the other reputation.

My honest feeling is not many are getting services at the moment. You need as many as possible to rec you as the trade is poor.

Best of luck. Will let you know if I can get anything.

items

Cheers Micky,

No idea on price at moment I have to do some homework and work out an average amount of whats needed in way of materials / chemical to complete all tasks based on average type of heating / plumbing system.

I'm going to spend a few days fiddling around with a few friends heating systems lucky for them to see if I can do all in one day apart from boiler service and flush.

One is open vented the other is sealed, both new enough systems, I'm going to clean them out with just chemical and heat re fill with inhibitor then balance entire system, I'm going to work with return temperatures more than I have before just to see how far I can restrict a system before heating suffers.

I'm not RGI, I can service Oil and have most of required kit, I'm good friends with an RGI person and we've talked about this idea before, I can sub out the RGI work to friend all above board at much lower cost, its a favor should I go this route until becoming RGI myself.

I hope to have an end figure not much higher than average boiler service, I doubt its possible for a business to run and do all mentioned in first post with all kinds of heating systems for such a small fee. If heating system is in good overall condition modern enough then I can see most tasks being completed in a days time frame within a good price, if system is bad and old then obviously time and price will go up. I've seen power flush figures hitting over the 1000 figure mark, cant see any justification in that price, I've power flushed a few systems so I've a fair idea on time / effort involved, I'd defo be able to do power flush for less.

Hundreds of thousands of houses have been recently built yet not commissioned into proper use, an extra few hours work along with boiler service can have things working perfect.

Most service persons haven't the interest or ability to commission heating systems, none I know of any way. If someone had a choice between hiring a service person who'll only service boiler and another who'll service boiler and entire heating / plumbing system so everything is at its best but at a slightly extra cost, I'd like to think most would go for the latter, not sure yet. Price can be kept down as very little material used, transportation costs lower, storage lower, insurance lower etc.

How many heating systems have never been balanced, wrong cap on rad valves, both rad valves wide open, cylinder coil wide open, no inhibitor, the list is endless, its all simple stuff that should have been sorted after install but seems to be avoided out of sheer laziness, once corrected their is a big difference in performance and lifespan.

Do you think its worth looking into it more to work out some actual figures, not fully sure if homeowners are interested in improving plumbing / heating to this kind of extent. I'd have to find a way to compare the two kinds of systems to prove disadvantage against proven advantages, can be done but not sure if worth the effort involved.

items

Cheers Joey, good idea with promoting work, like sky find some friends to join up, 50 euro for each that joins.

I know what you mean, most are skeptical about trades men and tend to less interested in plumbing / heating once things are working on a basic level.

Reason I brought all this up is the amount of people who are unaware of how a system works, if you can explain in a way they understand then point out whats wrong with system the suddenly become more interested.

Only yesterday I was working in a house, the homeowner always used immersion to heat water even though a coil fitted and connected to heating system. Coil was connected upside down meaning return top, flow bottom but the balance valve was on bottom meaning flow was restricted to a point coil failed to heat cylinder, home owner never knew about the coil or how it worked, been using an immersion for 10+ years. They were shocked and as a result wanted rest of system looked at.

The above is one of many systems I've noticed, this is the kind of stuff found all over the place, if homeowners knew more about heating / plumbing systems I'd say they'd soon become more interested in having them run proper.

Joey the lips

again items...I will say that your work will be hard.... I use to do an awful lot of extras when i had my own business. I found it hard because its hard to explain it to people. They just seem to want the job done. Where you get all the praise is in the recomendations.... But remember there is always a [EMAIL="boll@x"]boll@x[/EMAIL] in the trade that will knock you. This is why i am suggesting the incentive. Its a way of saying tanks.

Seriously. If I had no kids I would be gone... But where to go.... Best off with you own...;)

items

Joey the lips wrote: »

again items...I will say that your work will be hard.... I use to do an awful lot of extras when i had my own business. I found it hard because its hard to explain it to people. They just seem to want the job done. Where you get all the praise is in the recomendations.... But remember there is always a boll@x in the trade that will knock you. This is why i am suggesting the incentive. Its a way of saying tanks.

Seriously. If I had no kids I would be gone... But where to go.... Best off with you own...;)

True, I'm lucky enough to be able to up and leave, I've already gained some interest abroad so that option is their. It be a shame to up a leave wasting all the experience I've gained here, not being a big head or anything just know how things are done here (badly) so I've a good idea on how to improve systems. I'm going to give this some thought and possible shot while I'm here, take it as far as I can. I've fired off an email to local enterprise board to see if their is any interest in backing, for me to do this right I'd need that kind of backing, I would'nt attempt this half arsed with basic's and hope to build up something, although many have no choice but to start out that way fair play to them for doing it, I couldn't.

This country is full of cack installations as you know, so there is tons of work if you catch the right ear, i would target large sites that have known installation faults via their community forums and management agencies who want a quite life, the only problem is home owners ain't convinced the works needed, they don't see the need in what your selling unless their desperate, they want the minimum done and they won't want to pay you, any work i do is cash up front, i don't like it but i have been screwed so many times here it's shameful and they won't trust you unless your Board Gais.

The sort of work for large sites you could look at is removing the balancing valve all together and fitting cylinder stats/valves or retro fitting auto bypass which tend not to be fitted but can make a big difference to a system, converting to a fully sealed system, fitting proper drain points to a system, fitting auto air releases to poorly designed systems, you will be draining down anyway so the pipe work should be easy but as you know, where do you start:eek:, Gary

Joey the lips

gary71 wrote: »

This country is full of cack installations

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

items

gary71 wrote: »

This country is full of cack installations as you know, so there is tons of work if you catch the right ear, i would target large sites that have known installation faults via their community forums and management agencies who want a quite life, the only problem is home owners ain't convinced the works needed, they don't see the need in what your selling unless their desperate, they want the minimum done and they won't want to pay you, any work i do is cash up front, i don't like it but i have been screwed so many times here it's shameful and they won't trust you unless your Board Gais.

The sort of work for large sites you could look at is removing the balancing valve all together and fitting cylinder stats/valves or retro fitting auto bypass which tend not to be fitted but can make a big difference to a system, converting to a fully sealed system, fitting proper drain points to a system, fitting auto air releases to poorly designed systems, you will be draining down anyway so the pipe work should be easy but as you know, where do you start:eek:, Gary

Your singing from the same hymn sheet I have, cheers for that. The worst systems tend to be in large scale developments when the notorious house bashing took place, the whole idea was spend as little as possible on heating system fit system as quick as possible but charge as much as possible. Too many things when on unnoticed as nobody knew who was going to buy house, the only time trouble arises is when its too late.

I reckon if a way can be found to make people more aware of how much a badly fitted system costs in long run on top of inconvenience they'll be more interested in fixing. I believe SEI haven't made people aware enough, it takes more than fitting a condensate boiler along with a few TRV's to improve efficiency, more should be done might look into that now that I've more time.

With water rates possibly coming out along with new Oil boiler regulation and carbon tax, everything adds up to trouble should plumbing / heating not be set up right. Soon its going to be in every homeowners interest to keep on top of plumbing / heating and make sure things are in order.

I know all about peoples unwillingness to pay, father was self employed and I've worked in family business. Lost count of amount of times shafted. The laws are funny when it comes to being shafted on a job, if you happen to buy and fit a boiler for someone yet they don't pay, you cant really take it out, possession 9 tenths of law and all that, yet same person is not allowed walk out of a clothes shop with a pair of jeans without paying.

slavetothegrind

From my perspective being self employed in a similar trade but industrial i applaud your enterprise.

Getting paid and on time is the most important thing.
Without cashflow you will be fecked before you have really started, i know this from bitter experience.

I now tell people upfront how much for basic service, detailing the work, and also tell them i expect payment on delivery of that service. ( nicely obviously!)

I was guilty of being too nice and accepting the " oh thats fine i'll give it to you on friday if you call round then"
cue you having to waste time collecting money, if they don't fob you off again with the most inventive excuses known to man!

" i'll sort you out when you finish this other job for me which has come up"

NO, please sort me out for this one and then we'll progress from there. This could go on and on with lots of parts etc.

I do think you could do well, i have read a lot of your posts on here and you seem to be a true professional in approach.

The interweb is your friend as said by others here, in your game as Joey says references are everything.

As for Bord Gais and SEI, a neighbour of mine in his 70's needed his boiler sorting out. Same as mine, ferroli 18kw system boiler. So he went through two RGII servicemen, two service charges, and still had the problem.
So he calls bord gais and they recommend this SEI registered company.
They call out and insist he replace the boiler with a ferroli optima condenser.
They do this, eventually, and leave it not working properly.
Futile attempts were made by neighbour to get the company back out and in desperation they rang ferroli who got a tech out who was not impressed with the install at all. He rang the company and hey presto serviceman comes out to it next day.
I first heard of this after the events and went in to have a look.
They paid 3000 euro for a boiler swap that was handy, trust me.
I asked why there was a basin under the boiler and they said water was leaking out of it when on?
Condensate pipe.:mad:

That went on a bit sorry, ranting and raving thataway.....:o

Point is even starting with here, i think it would be allowed for you to pm people offering service?
Then feedback posted.
Every job done = recommendation

Give it a try items. you can always go abroad if it doesn't work out in a year!

Register with revenue straight away, job insurance will be about 1500 i guess and i am sure you have most kit already.


And finally.
We are being told by government to reduce the temp in our houses by 1 degree to save x.
How?
Most of these thrown up homes(like mine) had only rubbish stats fitted in the hall. 1 degree my hole, the error margin with these is feckin 5 degrees!
You can buy digistats for 22 euro plus vat, accurate to 0.1 degrees and will help with the bills.
Most recent and old homes have very simple systems, this is a very cheap improvement should they not want to, or be able to afford to, do much more.

Any how my fingers are sore now...best of luck what ever you decide fella!

items

Nice one cheers for that, sounds like an unfortunate story with condensate.

Are insurance rates that low, I had imagined public liability would be a bit more especially working with Oil / Gas etc, if the above is average rate thats good news.

Defo a market in maintenance, not many people have money to re fit anymore, most are trying to squeeze the most out of what they have.

Cheers.

PL 500 euro, 61/2 mill cover, PM me if you want to know where, Gary.

slavetothegrind

Jebus gary ! PM on the way!

JohnnieK

Gary
I too would like to know where?

JohnnieK

Hi Items

I took the leap of fate at the start of January. I got let go in October and my wife also last May, so with a morgatge a 2 year old and a new born I said right I have to do something, so out on my own I went.

I do domestic and commercial plumbing and heating. I've probably spent about €5000 so far on start up costs. Most of the expensive stuff has been got now so hopefully I will start getting some income now. paid my self €400 today since Jan 4th because I was terrified to go near it in respects to income tax and PRSI and all that.

I also joined Tradesmen.ie but the jury is still out on that one haven't got a whole lot out of it and they charge you for every lead and text message so your credit with them is been constantly eaten up. Also I was not asked for a shred of evidence of how qualified I was to do the job so God knows what's out there doing the jobs. I got a lead before to service a boiler, I gave her the price and she said she got someone else from the site for €60. How or what he done to the boiler I will never know but there was no way he serviced it properly and made a profit with that price.

The hardest part is getting your name out there. Iv got a couple of jobs now from word of mouth and that is the best form of advertisement going.

I just hope for my family's sake that the business goes from strengh to strengh.

Best of luck with your venture if you go ahead with it.:)

Joey the lips

Just for info. I got my boiler serviced by a lad in drogheda for 60 euro vert and all. I know whats involved in a service but am not certified to do it. He done it all and he did not know me. There is lads doing it for 60 and TBH the service the gas board gets you for 110 is not worth the money.

JohnnieK

Hi Joey

I certainly dont charge €110 and I agree with you on this one, most people that I do plumbing jobs for automatically ring board Gais because they supply the stuff and think because of this they have to get them to service the boiler. People are not informed enough.

I'm starting a course on Wednesday, Gas appliance servicing, fault diagnostic and repair (just to get it on paper) a boiler service should take an hour (to complete all the checks and flue gas analyse) so I will decide after the course weather to decrease the price I charge (I reckon I will have to to get the work).

Micky Dolenz

A service will take at least an hour. Going by the book, a soundness test should be conducted before and after servce. Thats 14 mins already, it should be observed. It is good practice to conduct a let-by test. These leaves 40 mins to take burner out, fan out and test safety devices. An hour isn't really long enough and €60 inc VAT is far too cheap.

JohnnieK

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

A service will take at least an hour. An hour isn't really long enough and €60 inc VAT is far too cheap.

Micky
I serviced a Mynute 12HE last Friday and it took me a 1hr 15mins to do the lot I think my €85(VAT In) was well earned. I dout the €60 guy done everything you described, but my problem is Iv only just started out on my own and all I can see around the place is "boiler service for €60, €70 and €75" I'm starting to loose hart in this matter, I think I need some one to tell me that my price is o.k. at one stage I was thinking of slashing to €50 but I would have to do probably 10 services a day to make a profit.

Aaaaggghhh. My head is melted.

Micky Dolenz

€75 plus VAT would be fair, as long as proper service is carried out of course including Cert of compliance.

It is impossible to do 10 services in a day every day, unless you have a contract in one building and plan to work long hours.

JohnnieK

My price includes VAT so i will stick with that so.

How are these guys operating charging such low prices?????

I charge 90 including vat, but for that not only do i do a bloody good boiler service, i do strange things like explain boiler controls and how they work, also what a filling loop does and why it would be handy to know, i don't panic when external controls are mentioned:eek:, as some of my new colleagues do, and as for the new "gas service engineers" under cutting, over time when it dawns on them the risks involved and a few start going to prison, then i think they well go and do something else, with proper enforcement it's not such a easy job, as i have seen working in London when Corgi first started enforcing the regs, Gary.

realmadrid

I got let go in 09 and went out on my own. A couple of things Ive seen:

• There is always someone who will do the job cheaper than you.
• At least 10% of people will not pay you for your work.
• You have to be available to work after 5 and Sats too.
• I was always taught you can only have two out of the three following: Speed,cost and quality.
• Everything is down to price!

I dont know if its worth it after you pay your ins,tax,diesel,material and every thing else. You should probably have at least 3 full days of billable work a week to cover everything. Even though people do have p[roblems with their heating and plumbing I dont know how many of them are willing to spend money on fixing them. (Floods and boiler breakdowns aside). Also take a look around you when you are driving the amount of RGI stickers on vans. €60 to service a boiler when in real terms you probably have spent 3 hrs all included. So take your tax and overhead out of that and your only taking €10 an hour for yourself.
I honestly dont know the answer to stay or go but I do wish you the best of luck if you do go out on your own and hopefully you can make a success of it.

items

Have to go about obtaining more papers first, I've got some oil service certs through fas along with boiler manufacture service certs, ideally I'd like to top it all off with OFTEC. Gas has to be included, I've got some certs from G1, G2 times but their almost not accepted any more have to go back to board gas to find out more about moving into RGI.

Once I've paper work sorted I'm going to plague Co Councils / CWO's around my area along with plumbing distributors / bathroom suppliers to try and work out some service works, I've to look into emergency side of things also as I'm prepared to be avail 24 / 7 but not sure who to approach, might be some big business / factory's / hotels etc that require some kind of 24 hour maintenance person.

I'm lucky enough to have experience in both domestic and industrial, be great if I could include industrial side of things, will see how it goes.

Cheers.

Micky Dolenz

If you are serouis about this, you should start small. Stick an add in a local paper or shops "plumber availible" etc. Change taps, replace ballcocks. do all the jobs other lads are too busy/lazy/don't want the hassle, to do.

Do them at a fair price and not getting paid shouldn't be an issue.

Don't run before you can walk.
Once you are making money you can trade up qualifications. Industrial is quite an ambitious sector to get into, first off you will need expensive equipment (pipe threaders/welders etc) and parts may be expensive, so correct diagnosis and credit at suppliers to purchase parts is essential. You've seen some plant rooms, are you confident of picking out a fault if you have no one to ask?

Go for it, but start off small, you'll grow into it the bigger projects as you go, and best of luck, You can do it

items

That's the plan, hopefully find some work in maintenance end of things, I don't mind doing all the odd jobs, I'd prefer smaller end of things, less need for big vans and big head aches designing / pricing jobs. Their is not that much work in new jobs, everyone is undercutting so if I can I'm going to steer away from that end.

Industrial end of things again maintenance side of works, hospitals, hotels, gyms, factory's and so on all require maintenance of heating / cooling / plumbing / air conditioning / filtration. Some of the works is contracted out while others just hire in as needed. I've to do more homework to find out how to gain work from the above.

It's possible to rent welding and threading equipment for the one off jobs so plenty of options avail, finding the work is the hardest part. I've no problems with bigger heating systems, I've fitted and maintained a good few, the idea is pretty much the same only everything is bigger, boilers / pumps / expansion vessels controls etc.

kay 9

Just wondering to all the lads that are ou on their own, do ye supply anything or get the customer to supply all required to do the job? I've been stung a few times and have changed my tune.:mad:

JohnnieK

kay 9 wrote: »

Just wondering to all the lads that are ou on their own, do ye supply anything or get the customer to supply all required to do the job? I've been stung a few times and have changed my tune.:mad:

It all deppends on customer prefrence. But if I am asked to source parts I charge what I paid for them if the supplier is local enough, if you are sourcing a special part and have to travel a distance to get it I would charge a bit extra, this would be made clear to the customer.

Sorry you were stung:(

JohnnieK

items wrote: »

Have to go about obtaining more papers first, I've got some oil service certs through fas along with boiler manufacture service certs, ideally I'd like to top it all off with OFTEC.

Hi items

Hold of on the OFTEC thing at the moment. OFTEC is not compulsory in Ireland at the moment. Wait to see what the Commission for Energy Regulation dose with the oil industry first. The OFTEC course is expensive and you have to do the final module up the north, and OFTEC might not get the license for the industry in Ireland and if you pay all that money for this to happen it would be a waste.

Micky Dolenz

JohnnieK wrote: »

Sorry you were stung:(

I remember being told years ago, when self employed it is never a matter of if you get stung, It is only a matter on how much you get stung for. As you probably know.

It is not unreasonable to ask for 60% as soon as materials land on job. Although small jobs are always a risk and those €60's add up.

yoshytoshy

If anyone on here does oil servicing in Dublin ,pm me and I'll give your number to anyone who rings us.

We get the occasional call for oil and I don't know anyone myself ,I only work on gas.

M cebee

gary71 wrote: »

This country is full of cack installations as you know, so there is tons of work if you catch the right ear, i would target large sites that have known installation faults via their community forums and management agencies who want a quite life, the only problem is home owners ain't convinced the works needed, they don't see the need in what your selling unless their desperate, they want the minimum done and they won't want to pay you, any work i do is cash up front, i don't like it but i have been screwed so many times here it's shameful and they won't trust you unless your Board Gais.

The sort of work for large sites you could look at is removing the balancing valve all together and fitting cylinder stats/valves or retro fitting auto bypass which tend not to be fitted but can make a big difference to a system, converting to a fully sealed system, fitting proper drain points to a system, fitting auto air releases to poorly designed systems, you will be draining down anyway so the pipe work should be easy but as you know, where do you start:eek:, Gary

ime .trying to repair or improve another contractors installation can be problematic.

but i am on the electrical side

OliverD

Hi JohnnieK,
In relation to your earlier post about Tradesmen.ie on this thread, there are up to 300 jobs per week posted on Tradesmen.ie so if you haven't had any luck it may be worthwhile to look at your profile and other details in relation to your overall strategy. If you like to forward me your contact details I can check out your profile and offer some advice. Also, in relation to qualifications, customers are advised to check references, qualifications and insurance details etc. so if you can't supply this information you will not be successful.

Here are some tips on getting the most from Tradesmen.ie:-

1. Make sure that you have your description up to date in your profile. Your description and contact details are sent to the customer when you buy a lead for that job. Your description should be as comprehensive as possible and as well as explaining the services you provide should include references, qualifications, insurance details and anything else that will help the customer choose the most suitable tradesman for their job. If you don't have a good description you will have less of a chance of being successful with your quote.

2. Get references from customers. You can do this in two ways. You can request references from previous customers and you can also ask customers who you have worked for on Tradesmen.ie to rate you. This is vitally important, you must have references to have any chance of being successful with your quote.

3. A copy of the email that is sent to the customer is sent to your email also. Look at the copies of the emails that are sent to them and read the description of yourself and the references that are included on them to see if you were a customer would you hire yourself.

4. You may be tempted to only request the large jobs but it is a good idea to buy leads for some small jobs because you will get work from these and you can get a reference from the customer when the job is complete. This will help you when competing for the bigger jobs.

5. Don't buy leads that are too far outside your area, customers prefer to deal with someone local so if you buy a lead that is 100 miles away you will have less chance of success and you may be wasting your money.

6. Unless requested to ring at a certain time, ring the customer as soon as you receive the details. Don't text the customer unless you can't get through and you are following up to let them know you rang. Always make several efforts to contact the customer, don't just make one phone call.

7. Always keep appointments and if you need to cancel, give at least a days notice. If you fail to keep appointments the customer will select a different tradesman instead. If we receive a number complaints about a tradesman missing appointments we reserve the right to discontinue his/her membership.

8. At present it is the first 4 tradesmen who reply by text message and have the required funds who get a chance to quote for the job. For medium to large scale jobs in the larger urban areas you need to reply in less than a minute to a text message in order to have a chance of being one of the first 4 tradesmen. Some jobs go in less than 15 seconds so you need to be quick to text back. Smaller jobs outside of these areas don't go as quick but you can always log in to the website to see which jobs are still available. Most of the new mobile phones allow you to access the Internet so you can log in from your phone even when out of the office. As stated above at present it is the first 4 tradesmen to reply who get to quote for the job. In the future we may employ other methods to select the first 4 tradesmen such as a ranking/bidding system.

9. In the evening time or on a Saturday not as many tradesmen have their phone on and so you often have a better chance during these off peak times.

10. There is very little competition for trades like gutters and fascia, window cleaning, appliance repairs, upholstery and mechanics. In fact outside of the main building, renovation, extensions, attic conversions, carpentry and electrical there are not as many tradesmen on our database so if you specialise in these areas you will not have as much competition.

11. If you log into Tradesmen.ie after you register you will be able to see what leads are still available and what price they are. Just click on the link that says 'View Recent Leads' when you log into your account. You can also search by trade and search county.

12. Give a fair price for the job and don't waste money buying leads if you are too expensive on your quotes for the quality of your work. The customer is getting up to 4 quotes for their job so if you are way too expensive for the same quality work you are less likely to succeed. Be careful about taking pricing advice on forums. If your competitors are clever they will advise you to price your work high and then they will price their work below yours and get all the work. That's business, there's nothing wrong with it but just be alert to it!:-)

13. Be appropriately dressed, be polite and courteous and carry the tools that are needed for the task. For example if you are there to price a job you will look more professional if you have your note book, pencil and measuring tape than if you are empty handed. If you are there to carry out work bring the tools that you need and make sure your overalls and boots or shoes are clean so that the customer won't mind letting you into the house. This might sound obvious to most people but it is worth mentioning all the same.

14. Select the Minimum and Maximum Job Value for each area that you want to work. For example let's say you live in Swords and a job comes up in Blackrock with a budget of less than €100. You may not be interested in small jobs like this that are outside of your area so you can choose a higher minimum job value for Dublin County South and you won't be sent text messages about these kind of jobs for that area. To set the Minimum and Maximum Job Value for each area you can log into your account and click the second link from the top on the Welcome page which says,
'Edit Counties/Areas and job values that you wish to receive leads for'.

15. You probably read these when you signed up but you can refer to our user agreement and fees policy at any time

We want you and the customer to be happy with the service we provide so we will continue to do whatever we can to improve it, make it faster, more efficient, more reliable and to improve the support that we can provide to you and the customer. We are constantly adding new features every week to improve the service. If you ever have a comment, a suggestion or a complaint you can contact us


Best Wishes
Oliver Dempsey, Tradesmen.ie

yoshytoshy

OliverD wrote: »

13. Be appropriately dressed, be polite and courteous and carry the tools that are needed for the task. For example if you are there to price a job you will look more professional if you have your note book, pencil and measuring tape than if you are empty handed. If you are there to carry out work bring the tools that you need and make sure your overalls and boots or shoes are clean so that the customer won't mind letting you into the house. This might sound obvious to most people but it is worth mentioning all the same.


15. You probably read these when you signed up but you can refer to our user agreement and fees policy at any time

We want you and the customer to be happy with the service we provide so we will continue to do whatever we can to improve it, make it faster, more efficient, more reliable and to improve the support that we can provide to you and the customer. We are constantly adding new features every week to improve the service. If you ever have a comment, a suggestion or a complaint you can contact us


Best Wishes
Oliver Dempsey, Tradesmen.ie

Anyone can buy a sim card and advertise as a tradesman on your site.
Am I missing something here ? ,how do I know who is entering my house ?

Also ,what security has your site got ?

Joey the lips

yoshytoshy wrote: »

Anyone can buy a sim card and advertise as a tradesman on your site.
Am I missing something here ? ,how do I know who is entering my house ?

Also ,what security has your site got ?

This is exactly what happened to me. I wanted a roofer and a carpenter applied.Only i asked him the questions I would have never known

But having said that anyone can advertise in golden pages and word of mouth is not always reliable,

The best check is a reference check

yoshytoshy

Joey the lips wrote: »

This is exactly what happened to me. I wanted a roofer and a carpenter applied.Only i asked him the questions I would have never known

But having said that anyone can advertise in golden pages and word of mouth is not always reliable,

The best check is a reference check

Same goes on this site for references ,anyone can register and give references.

Whats stopping tenants getting quotes and work done ,then not paying.

Theres no solid proof here of either customer or tradesman.

OliverD

Hi yoshytoshy,

Thanks for bringing up this point. We recommend that you look for qualifications, references and insurance details etc before you invite a tradesman or any service provider into your home. We recommend this for all sources of referral.

What Tradesmen.ie offers is a quick and easy method for a home or business owner to get up to 4 quotes for their job. It takes the hassle out of making phone calls and leaving messages and waiting for people to get back to you. Just fill in the simple form and Tradesmen.ie will endeavour to get you up to 4 tradesmen who are available and willing to quote within an hour. You also get a chance to rate the tradesman when the job is finished.

You will receive an email with details about each tradesman who is interested in your job. In that email will be the contact details of the tradesman and references from 1. previous customers of that tradesman and 2. customers who the tradesman have worked for on Tradesmen.ie. If the tradesman has done a lot of work previously for users of the website he/she will have many references.

If the tradesman is very new to the website they may have very few or no references on their profile. When the tradesmen contact you, you can ask them for their details over the phone and ask them to forward their company registration details, references of previous work carried out and any other information that you need so that you are completely happy and satisfied before allowing the tradesman to carry out the work.

In relation to security we use SSL Secure Socket Layer for security on the website.

I hope this answers your questions. If you have any other questions let me know.

Best Regards
Oliver Dempsey, Tradesmen.ie

yoshytoshy

OliverD wrote: »

In relation to security we use SSL Secure Socket Layer for security on the website.

I hope this answers your questions. If you have any other questions let me know.

Best Regards
Oliver Dempsey, Tradesmen.ie

Hi ,
I was going to log on to have a look around ,but the page that wants all my personal details ,doesn't seem to be secure:(

Is there a log on screen ? ,how does the tradesman log on and see what jobs are available ?

OliverD

Hi yoshytoshy,
don't worry, you are only putting in your contact details. When you are putting in your credit card details it will be on https:-)



If you have any questions you can post it here

Best Regards
Oliver Dempsey, Tradesmen.ie

items

OliverD, whats stopping you guys making up your own jobs? Not fully sure on tradesman.ie details, from sounds of things trades person bids for jobs @ a cost.

How can a trades person tell if job is 100% legitimate before bidding?

OliverD

Hi Items,
Thanks for your question. It would be difficult to make up 300 jobs a week and then we'd need to employ 300 people to answer the phone for each job:-) Seriously though, we go to great lengths to ensure that all jobs posted on Tradesmen.ie are posted by real people. When a person posts a job on Tradesmen.ie we ask them to send us a message to verify that they are the person who posted the job.

We also have a 30 day money back guarantee so you can see for yourself if you are happy with the jobs that are offered and that the people are real.

We have a hints and tips section on Tradesmen.ie which covers a lot of these questions you are asking so please feel free to log in and have a look or contact us through the contact page on the website if you have any further questions and we'd be delighted to answer them

Kind Regards
Oliver Dempsey, Tradesmen.ie

JohnnieK

Hi Oliver

Just regarding references. I have had only one customer give a refrence about me since joining. Even after calling and texting them to do so, they just dont bother, so i wouldn't take references as gospel. I have a feeling there is a lot of nixer kings on the site.

One thing I do like is I have been refunded on leads from customers who couldn't bother there arse's to get back to me or answer the phone.

OliverD

Hi JohnnieK,
Thanks for the feedback. We would recommend that tradesmen submit their earnings to the Revenue Commissioners. Tradesmen and customers should retain copies of quotations and customers should request a receipt for all work carried out.

With regard to the references, it is very important to follow up on them. If you only have one reference and another tradesman has ten references, he will have a better chance of getting the job even if he is a little more expensive than you. The best time to request a reference is immediately the job is finished. Let us know if you have a problem getting a reference and we will be happy to follow it up for you.

Regards Oliver, Tradesmen.ie