Noisy hot water cylinder and rusty water!

AMS2010

Once I get a good fire going the following has started to happen... exceptionally loud gurgle which happens maybe twice at the most in the hot water cylinder (like an air bubble)
there'll also be rust coloured water from the bathroom sink hot tap.

Nothing else that I've noticed. It doesn't happen when the central heating is on - only with the fire.

Should I worry? What's causing this? And what should I do?
All advice greatly appreciated.

Joey the lips

Do you live in a house with a back boiler. ie you lite the fire to run the heating. Have you only moved in or have you been running the heating this way a while and onl;y noticed the new change.

volvo 240

What sort of system is it? Oil boiler and back boiler setup? What make is the fire/backboiler? Have you had any more radiators added or plumbing work done?

Could you post some pictures of your cylinder and fire?

Are the pipe(s) to the hot tap in steel or what material?
How many cold water tanks are there?
Is the large cold water tank feeding the hot water cylinder made out of galvanised steel? Is the water dirty/rusty inside? Check the smaller heating one too.

Is it a standard hot water cylinder or does it say primatic on it?


What age as a guess is the plumbing and heating system?

Can't think of anything else yet but enough to get started. James:)

yoshytoshy

Sounds like you have a direct feed from your back boiler to the cylinder.

AMS2010

Let's see...
Have a back boiler (it heats the water but I was told that the pump had seized years ago and so it doesn't really pump hot water to the rads)
I'm guessing there's a direct feed from the back boiler to the hot water cylinder. That is a guess but if it helps the hot water cylinder is only a few feet from the fireplace.
The original set-up is years old. Open fire, copper cylinder. But there was extensive re-plumbing done about 4 years ago - new plastic water tank in the attic, new firebird boiler for the central heating, new immersion coil, some new pipework. It's never caused any hassle since then... until now!
The recent cold snap left me with airlocks upstairs (which I managed to fix) and low water pressure/rationing for a few weeks. Now that I think of it the airlocks were only in cold water taps.Could that have caused me problems with the hot water cylinder?
The noise has been just for the last couple of fires. Last night was extraordinarily loud - and just once. Incidentally, I use the central heating more often than the fire.
Sorry, my knowledge of plumbing is limited. Does that info make anything clearer?

demanufactured

can you take a few pics of yyour fire/back boiloer and hotpress/cylender so we can figure out whats going on?

ART6

If the pump for the back boiler isn't working then the circulation through the boiler will be restricted, and the water will boil. That would explain the gurling noise in the cylinder as the boiling water expands into steam bubbles in the coil. The stained hot water could be resulting from the steam being formed in the back boiler causing its circulation water being forced out of the vent pipe and into the tank in the roof. That water will always be dark brown or even black as it normally just keeps going round the system. I would say you urgently need to replace the pump before you do some real damage, and check the vent pipe. If it opens over the cold tank, move it so that it opens over the heating system header tank.

Micky Dolenz

Agree with above, change the pump.

Sounds like the system is pitching like mad. Check to ensure the expansion tank from back boiler isn't over the storage tank, it should be over small Feed and expansion tank. This would explain the coloured water.

I doubt very much the cylinder is a direct type or the water would be yellow all the time.

AMS2010

Thanks for the advice
Couldn't for the life of me find the camera yesterday- heaven knows where it went...
Anyway, I tried a smaller fire in the grate last night. Had plenty of hot water without any of the gurgling or discolouration. Which would make sense of the water just being too hot in the cylinder with a bigger fire and the fact that the central heating had been on for a while earlier in the day.
Pipes and tanks in the attic all lined up perfectly.


I agree I need to get the pump sorted out. Another job to add to the list!
Thanks to all. Much appreciated.

yoshytoshy

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

I doubt very much the cylinder is a direct type or the water would be yellow all the time.

Not true actually ,nearly all cylinders have sediment in them after a few years. A good strong fire would lift the sediment and give the water a colour.

Micky Dolenz

yoshytoshy wrote: »

Not true actually ,nearly all cylinders have sediment in them after a few years. A good strong fire would lift the sediment and give the water a colour.

OP has already stated that the back boiler is connected to rad system, if so, the same water that travels through the rads and the oil boiler would be the same as the water that comes out of hot tap.If it were a direct cylinder the water would be discloured all of the time, and if the storage tank fed both oil boiler, rad system, back boiler and plumbing. All plumbing water would be discouloured.

Very unlikely that it is a direct cylinder as already stated.

yoshytoshy

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

OP has already stated that the back boiler is connected to rad system, if so, the same water that travels through the rads and the oil boiler would be the same as the water that comes out of hot tap.If it were a direct cylinder the water would be discloured all of the time, and if the storage tank fed both oil boiler, rad system, back boiler and plumbing. All plumbing water would be discouloured.

Very unlikely that it is a direct cylinder as already stated.

The original post said nothing about radiators connected to the fire ,a quote was

"Nothing else that I've noticed. It doesn't happen when the central heating is on - only with the fire. "

Central heating ,as in radiators ...

No mention of radiators working off the back boiler.

Micky Dolenz

yoshytoshy wrote: »

The original post said nothing about radiators connected to the fire ,a quote was

"Nothing else that I've noticed. It doesn't happen when the central heating is on - only with the fire. "

Central heating ,as in radiators ...

No mention of radiators working off the back boiler.

AMS2010 wrote: »

Let's see...
Have a back boiler (it heats the water but I was told that the pump had seized years ago and so it doesn't really pump hot water to the rads)
I'm guessing there's a direct feed from the back boiler to the hot water cylinder. That is a guess but if it helps the hot water cylinder is only a few feet from the fireplace.
The original set-up is years old. Open fire, copper cylinder. But there was extensive re-plumbing done about 4 years ago - new plastic water tank in the attic, new firebird boiler for the central heating, new immersion coil, some new pipework. It's never caused any hassle since then... until now!
The recent cold snap left me with airlocks upstairs (which I managed to fix) and low water pressure/rationing for a few weeks. Now that I think of it the airlocks were only in cold water taps.Could that have caused me problems with the hot water cylinder?
The noise has been just for the last couple of fires. Last night was extraordinarily loud - and just once. Incidentally, I use the central heating more often than the fire.
Sorry, my knowledge of plumbing is limited. Does that info make anything clearer?

.

yoshytoshy

Thats not the original post.

Micky Dolenz

yoshytoshy wrote: »

Thats not the original post.

OP = Original Poster.

yoshytoshy

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

OP = Original Poster.

Plumber = Yoshytoshy

Micky Dolenz

yoshytoshy wrote: »

Plumber = Yoshytoshy

Are you serouisly telling me,. that after reading the entire thread that you belive the cylinder is a direct cylinder?

yoshytoshy

Considering your a mod on boards ,I'm disgusted I have to make this post:mad:

The only person who mention direct feed ,was me. Then AMS2010 replied mentioning a pump.
So it's obvious that the cylinder wouldn't be a direct feed ,but you still felt the need to point out I was "wrong". When in fact ,given the info in AMS2010's opening post I could well of been correct.

I just think thats a bit rude to be honest ,I was only trying to help.

Micky Dolenz

yoshytoshy wrote: »

Considering your a mod on boards ,I'm disgusted I have to make this post:mad:

The only person who mention direct feed ,was me. Then AMS2010 replied mentioning a pump.
So it's obvious that the cylinder wouldn't be a direct feed ,but you still felt the need to point out I was "wrong". When in fact ,given the info in AMS2010's opening post I could well of been correct.

I just think thats a bit rude to be honest ,I was only trying to help.

we are all trying to help AMS2010, it is healthy to discuss different points and opinions,. Because I debate a point made by you or any other poster does not mean it is meant in rudeness, far from it. I have learned a lot from these forums by reading other professionals opinions.We should work together to solve other posters problems, not against each other

I didn't mean to offend you in any way, I just pointed out that a direct cylinder could be discounted. You decided to make an issue of it.

Me being a mod has nothing to do with it, I am just like every other poster in this forum and would be treated as such.