Injury in rented house - what are the options re recovering medical costs

tomcollins97

Hi,

A friend was seriously injured in a house earlier in the week that is rented by a group of students. He does not reside in the house but was attending a party at that location.

To cut a long story short, whist a 3rd party was making a late night cup of tea a boiling kettle of water was dropped onto his legs. He has suffered 2nd degree burns to both thighs and lower legs. The groin area was saved due to clothing being looser in that area. An ambulance was called and he was admitted to hospital over night. The wounds are currently being dressed daily and there is the possibility of skin grafts but that will not be known for a few days.

As he is a student and of limited means he does not have private health insurance. Can he sue the landlord to recover the costs of medical treatment and associated costs in getting to daily appointments? Is this a simple or complicated procedure?

I have already advised that he contact a solicitor but before doing this we would like to know if it is even a possibility considering a landlord had no control over what activities are carried out on the premises by his tenants.

Cheers,
Tom

jon1981

What about pursuing the guy that actually dropped the kettle on him? considering he was directly responsible.

sweetie

Sorry to hear about your friend. I'm not sure of the legalities but I think the morality if sueing the landlord is wrong. Was there alcohol involved? Why not sue the drink company? or the ESB? or city council for providing water? or the shop where the kettle was bought?

tomcollins97

jon1981 wrote: »

What about pursuing the guy that actually dropped the kettle on him? considering he was directly responsible.

He's a student so not much point I would think.

tomcollins97

sweetie wrote: »

Sorry to hear about your friend. I'm not sure of the legalities but I think the morality if sueing the landlord is wrong. Was there alcohol involved? Why not sue the drink company? or the ESB? or city council for providing water? or the shop where the kettle was bought?

I am not taking about sueing for compensation, just cost recovery. That is the whole point of insurance.

A bit like if you have a roofer in your house who doesn't have is own public liability insurance and he falls off the roof he can sue the householder even though the householder was not responsible for the fall it just happened on the householders property.

Gurgle

tomcollins97 wrote: »

I am not taking about sueing for compensation, just cost recovery. That is the whole point of insurance.

No, actually its not.

drBill

Is there a lease agreement? I believe a lease will typically indemnify the landlord against any injury or damages claims. i.e. it's usually the responsibility of the tenant to insure themselves and their possessions within the property.

tomcollins97

Gurgle wrote: »

No, actually its not.

What is the point then if it not recover costs?

jon1981

thats like saying my friend cooked me dinner and i got food poisoning ...should i sue the landlord, the butcher, the supermarket...

or some guy at a house party stabbed me, can i sue the land lord...


I mean come on, this is completely ridiculous.

tomcollins97

jon1981 wrote: »

or some guy at a house party stabbed me, can i sue the land lord...

.

You would sue the criminal injuries compensation board, funded by the tax payer, who had absolutely nothing to do with the criminals actions but you still as a victim get compensation. Do you also think that this is ridiculous?

A Garda was awarded 19k last week after a man under arrest broke her nose - that was not the fault of the Garda Comissioner but he still had to pay.

tomcollins97

Mods - please close this thread. I was requesting legal discussion and opionion not peoples opinions on the morality or otherwise of insurance cliams.

Reloc8

Actually the claim under Garda Compensation Scheme is against the Minister for Finance.

Garda Compensation Acts are provided to give compensation to members for criminal injuries suffered in recognition that they put themselves in harms way in the course of their employment in protection of society and its members.

OP...you told your mate to go to a solicitor...that's about all that can be said. It doesn't sound to me like the landlord has any case to answer but you'd need to see the lease and get full instructions on whether the property was being used in accordance with same etc. etc. etc. I think its speculative at best. Obviously the person who actually injured the chap is clearly open to be sued.

edit : lol you're not allowed to look for legal advise anyway

tomcollins97

Reloc8 wrote: »

Garda Compensation Acts are provided to give compensation to members for criminal injuries suffered in recognition that they put themselves in harms way in the course of their employment in protection of society and its members.

Thats a choice they make when they take on the job - why should the tax payer have to compensate for criminal acts?

Miaireland

Depending on the College/University he goes to there might be free legal aid available to the students there, they would probably be better able to advice him.

I would think whether the house was a privately rented house or a house in a students complex would be relevant in this matter.

a lawyer

the option regarding recovering anything is to sue for some form of wrong that has been done (even if you only want medical costs)

get legal advice whether this is likely to be successful against the landlord in this context however (no imho).

more likely to be an action against the lad who dropped the kettle - but what would be the point?

insurance is there to provide profit to insurance companies, unless you can pry money out of their hands which they are (correctly) no anxious to part with. only common form of no-fault insurance is comprehensive insurance for car damage - otherwise you are suing someone

oldyouth

tomcollins97 wrote: »

I am not taking about sueing for compensation, just cost recovery. That is the whole point of insurance.

A bit like if you have a roofer in your house who doesn't have is own public liability insurance and he falls off the roof he can sue the householder even though the householder was not responsible for the fall it just happened on the householders property.

Firstly, looking to recover costs is a claim for compensation, simple as. It does not refer to the amount involved.

As for your example of the roofer falling, your argument is technically all over the shop. The fact that he does not have a policy, does not make the householder liable. Yes, the householder can be sued but to be successful, he must prove negligence against the home owner. And Public Liability does not protect the policy holder (roofer), only those around him affected by his actions

Back to the specific problem, it has nothing to do with the landlord. Nothing that he did, or provided you with, caused the injury. OP can sue the person who spilled the water or leave it at that

Victor

Assuming the injured party is treated in a public hospital, costs are likely to be modest.

If costs are to be recovered and compensation for pain and suffering to be paid, then the best person to talk to is a solicitor, while detailing all the facts.

Liability incurred on a premises tends to lie with the occupier (tenant), not the owner (landlord).

munstergirl

Ended up in hospital recently for a small op (emergency) under general anaesthetic was only in 1 day, wanted to keep me overnight, but I was feeling great, told them to give the bed to someone who needed it.

My point!
No medical card or private health insurance. Total Cost 75 euro..
(I was impressed not bad for all the meds, prescription, operation, theatre, nurses, doctors, surgeon etc) ok it was emergency, and if it wasn't I'd probably still be on a list waiting to be seen...

On the bill, says max charge is 75 euro a day for 10 days (within a year)

Your friend is lucky, (all anyone has to do it look around a hospital and see people dying!!) Wish him a speedy recovery, nothing worse than being in pain, If he can't afford the bill ask everyone at the party to chip in a few quid..:)

tomcollins97

So far:

A&E charge: €100
Pain meds: €15 approx
5 days transport by taxi to & from hospital for dressings: €30 return, so €150 to date. Daily visits for dressings for the next 3 days will be another €90 than every other day for up to 3 weeks. Potentially another €270.
Skin grafts: not known yet but he would prefer not to have to wait for a public apointment
Scarring: cost of treatment in the future

Munstergirl - there is always someone worse off, that doesn't mean that his financial situation is any better. Also, I honestly don't think asking fellow broke students for money is really going to work :rolleyes:

Jo King

The landlord will have no personal liability cover in respect of this injury. He would have, if the incident happened in a house in which he resides as head of the household and has home insurance. The incident did not happen due to the state of the premises and there is no suggestion that any equipment supplied by the landlord was faulty.
The fault appears to be lie with the householders, i.e. the tenants.
Even if there was insurance cover, the insurer would not admit liability straight away. They would wait for PIAB to look at it and then wait for court proceedings. It would take years to get money out of them. Meantime fees would have to be paid for medical reports etc.
Guy will have to be more careful when he goes to parties!

Del2005

tomcollins97 wrote: »

So far:

A&E charge: €100
Pain meds: €15 approx
5 days transport by taxi to & from hospital for dressings: €30 return, so €150 to date. Daily visits for dressings for the next 3 days will be another €90 than every other day for up to 3 weeks. Potentially another €270.
Skin grafts: not known yet but he would prefer not to have to wait for a public apointment
Scarring: cost of treatment in the future

Munstergirl - there is always someone worse off, that doesn't mean that his financial situation is any better. Also, I honestly don't think asking fellow broke students for money is really going to work :rolleyes:

If the students have any sense they should have renters insurance. Some of these have public liability cover, has your friend asked any of them about this?

Kristopherus

tomcollins97 wrote: »

So far:

A&E charge: €100
Pain meds: €15 approx
5 days transport by taxi to & from hospital for dressings: €30 return, so €150 to date. Daily visits for dressings for the next 3 days will be another €90 than every other day for up to 3 weeks. Potentially another €270.
Skin grafts: not known yet but he would prefer not to have to wait for a public apointment
Scarring: cost of treatment in the future

Munstergirl - there is always someone worse off, that doesn't mean that his financial situation is any better. Also, I honestly don't think asking fellow broke students for money is really going to work :rolleyes:

Last time I was in A & E the €100 covered the initial visit and all susequent visits for the same complaint/illness, so that will reduce your estimate quite a bit. Taxi fares, where are his family in all this? Any suppotr at all or do they even know??

StanByrneGalway

some useful articles on this website and an option to get some free advice about the claim.
http://www.injury-compensation.ie/haveaclaim/
best of luck, stan.