The Influence of Irish Law in other Countries

walrusgumble

Hi

Considering we say a similar type of system/attitude with other countries that make up the common law system; considering in areas like land law and say tort law or equity & trust law we have looked to systems England/Wales for influence (whether the courts/legislature applies or departed from same)

have there being many occassions, (possibly in Constitutional-unnumerated rights matters?), where judgements in Irish courts have been greatly considered (whether agreed, modified, influenced, rejected) by other jurisdictions? (excluding non eu/ecthr case matters involving ireland)

How influential have Irish judgements have been to other countries as some judges like denning (well after birmingam 6 many would be aware of him regardless if they ever looked at a text book) or america. It's not like Ireland have always followed English law. What areas have Ireland have led to the front compared to other countries.

(This is ore for debate as a student, not legal advice/for exams.)

If mods think this thread is naff, please close

Victor

I think one needs to appreciate that Ireland uses precedents from other jurisdictions because they have a much wider range of possibility, what with them having larger populations, different / emerging circumstances, different cultural interactions. etc. Whereas in Ireland, the constitution and statute law are the only things that are new.

walrusgumble

Victor wrote: »

I think one needs to appreciate that Ireland uses precedents from other jurisdictions because they have a much wider range of possibility, what with them having larger populations, different / emerging circumstances, different cultural interactions. etc. Whereas in Ireland, the constitution and statute law are the only things that are new.

Yes. Thanks, I do fully appreciate this. By no means do I slag or complain the use of precedent from other jurisdictions. It would be nuts to do so, considering how say some judges/barristers during the 1960's may have trained/be influence with what went on in America. Nor would I or do I complain of where the source of precedent comes from

In light of what you say (or anyone would say)That is why I ask the question; that considering Ireland's position, history and circumstances and constitution, whether some time in other bigger/diverse/dare I say more developed countries a judge or counsel from those countries may have argued/considered/rejected or accepted a certain judgement/comment or intrepration from Irish law. (excluding say when Ireland is in the docks at Strasbourg)

Or is it a case that often, when something big/major etc happens either by referendum, Dail or court, it has normally already occurred elsewhere in the common law areas?

Tom Young

Here are some remarks:

1. The Irish Courts are similar in system e.g., Common Law to some states that you refer to above;

2. Ireland will consider persuasive only, elements of judgments handed down in these jurisdictions and as such lawyers have to take great care in bringing in precedent from other jurisdictions, as they may be incompatible with binding decisions;

3. EU Law is now more of a feature of Irish Jurisprudence e.g., Competition Law, Copyright Law, Privacy and Data Protection, Enforcement of Judgments and Contract Law modifications via Rome I and II;

4. It took 50 years to ratify the ECHR, we have it in place now via an Act, 2003 ECHR Act. It is small and limited in nature. The Bench merely need to take notice of it, nothing more. It is featuring a little more now in relation to certain actions e.g., Article 6, 8 and 10. A telling view on this arises in the Judgment of Macken J in the Supreme Court Ruling in Desmond v MGN - remarks are obiter. This was was a restoration of an 11 year old libel case. Miss Justice Laffoy included a review of Articles of the Convention in Grace v Ireland & Anor; and

5. I have found a couple of Judgments of the Irish Courts which have been referred to in the UK Appeal Courts and House of Lords, I believe the most recent one I found was in relation to the construction of commercial lease clauses and the activation of notice to quit Mannai Investment Co Ltd v Eagle Star Life Assurance Co Ltd, [1997] 3 All ER 352.

One thing I have been looking at of late is the catastrophic mess that is the issue of Dismissal of cases for Want of Prosecution or delay in other words. The Primor test still lives but is incompatible with Article 6 of the ECHR and indeed the test is now botched. The test was 1. Ascertain whether the delay in question is inordinate and inexcusable; and 2. If it is so established the court must decide where the balance of justice lies.

It seems that the bench deals with this in the following manner now. Balance of Justice test - Actual versus presumed prejudice testing .... temporal prejudice/presumed prejudice can be validly excused. This actions dismissing in lower courts can be restored through smart advice!

So much for precedent!

Tom

dermot_sheehan

Searching uk or us judgements in justis or lexis for "I.R." or "Irish Reports" seems to bring up some interesting references to irish law.