Visiting friend in psychotic/manic state

Crumble Froo

heya, just a quick post here as im at work at the moment, wasnt sure whether to go to long term illnesses or psychology, but figured here is a bit of a catch-all.

my best mate is bipolar, stopped taking her lithium and has ended up in hospital, in the really acute ward, last night. she's ended up there twice before, and has described it as her idea of hell. im gutted for her that she's ended up back in there, but in the meantime, do want to visit her.

i know that it's gonna be really rough to visit her, was just talking to her sister who said her and her other sister will be going in together, as they'll often need a shoulder to cry on afterwards. (*deep breath*, just that thought is making me cry a little).

just wondered if anyone here could help me prepare myself for what to expect with her. ive not had to deal directly with someone in a manic state before, particularly someone so close to me, so any help, pointers would be great.

i know she's not gonna be 'herself' and i know she could well be offensive or ... i dont know, i really dont. what do i expect?

alias06

I have many years experience of this. Visted my brother for months at a time in the acute ward during his manic episodes.

First off your friend is in hospital therefore she is safe. If she is in the middle of a manic episode then she needs to be in hospital and really it is something to be thankful for that she is in there and not out on the street. Believe me that would be way worse.

Secondly, don't catastrophise about her being in the acute ward. Its really not that bad. A patients first night in a psychiatric hospital is the most frightening and after that they lose their fear of it. They realise they are safe and most of the time nothing happens. You might be thinking 'God, isn't this awful' but really it just where she needs to be right now to stay safe.

As regards what to expect, if she is manic and psychotic as you say then she will probably say things that are clearly untrue (delusions) such as I am a millionaire, I am famous, I have special powers etc and she may have paranoid thoughts such as 'the CIA are after me'. Just ignore them, don't try and convince her that she is wrong. She will come around within a few weeks when the lithium takes effect. Just be polite and friendly. She will appreciate the fact you came to see her when she gets better. If she says anything hurtful to you just ignore it and understand that she is sick and is not in control of her mind. Find out if there is anything she needs like batteries for a walkman or whatever so you can bring them next time.

In a couple of weeks time she will be laughing about all the crazy things she said and she'll be getting ready to go home and get on with life.

Crumble Froo

thanks for that

alias06 wrote: »

First off your friend is in hospital therefore she is safe. If she is in the middle of a manic episode then she needs to be in hospital and really it is something to be thankful for that she is in there and not out on the street. Believe me that would be way worse.

yep, she got picked up by the cops on the street, hence ending up there. i'd been worrying about her on wednesday, and the plan was, if i couldnt get in touch with her on thursday, i was going to get in touch with her sister on friday to let her know my worries, but of course, got a phonecall from her sister instead on thursday evening.

Secondly, don't catastrophise about her being in the acute ward. Its really not that bad. A patients first night in a psychiatric hospital is the most frightening and after that they lose their fear of it. They realise they are safe and most of the time nothing happens. You might be thinking 'God, isn't this awful' but really it just where she needs to be right now to stay safe.

honestly, what's really breaking my heart right now is knowing just how much she hates it there. like i said, she's been in twice before, and it really is actually her version of hell. her absolute worst night mare was to end up back in hospital and im just so gutted for her that she has again.

As regards what to expect, if she is manic and psychotic as you say then she will probably say things that are clearly untrue (delusions) such as I am a millionaire, I am famous, I have special powers etc

yeah, apparently last time she got manic she was really really in touch with god.

and she may have paranoid thoughts such as 'the CIA are after me'.

yeah, she can tend quite towards paranoia, and i know she suffered it extremely badly when she was in hospital before, particularly around the staff, food and medicines. even last wednesday when i last saw her, she was freaking out a little bout electricity (the concept of downloading music vs playing the cd, she couldnt handle the downloading), and was really paranoid about me closing the gate behind me for security at her house (up till a week ago when she started pet sitting, her gates were NEVER shut, and she was at her boyfriend's with the dog at that point)....

*sigh*

was just talking to her boyfriend today, we kinda caught up with each other to see what each other knew about the situation, and apparently mid sentence on wednesday she said 'it's happening again'. arrrgh, we're both so frustrated with a thousand and one 'shoulda woulda couldas'. it's hard.

Just ignore them, don't try and convince her that she is wrong. She will come around within a few weeks when the lithium takes effect. Just be polite and friendly. She will appreciate the fact you came to see her when she gets better. If she says anything hurtful to you just ignore it and understand that she is sick and is not in control of her mind. Find out if there is anything she needs like batteries for a walkman or whatever so you can bring them next time.

that's really helpful, thanks ive got some paints and a canvas and brushes for her in my bag at the moment, and i can see what she needs when i go in later.

In a couple of weeks time she will be laughing about all the crazy things she said and she'll be getting ready to go home and get on with life.

fingers crossed

thanks

sam34

yep, i second what the above poster said.

dont get into arguments/discussions with ehr if she says some odd stuff, dont try convinving her shes wrong etc, just plamas her and distract her, otherwise yuo will only agitate her.

dont get offended if dhe says something nasty and caustic, or totally inappropriate - shes not in control of what shes saying

dont get upset if she tells you to f off 30 seconds after you walk in, you may just have to leave

it ounds like you are a good friend to her, shes lucky to have someone like that

LegacyUser

Hi There

My sister was in accute ward for 2 months last summer and she was there a year previous to this.I would say brace yourself,its not fun seeing someone you love like this.You need to be tough as nails not showing you are upset keeping things light asking them questions engaging them.

I would bring maybe some clothes with you get her out of her PJs something comfy tho like a new tracky from pennys or somethiing just to keep her thinking positively,also mags are good and maybe sweets.

I always visited on my own it was hard time in my life but you can do it and my sister still talks about how good i was coming to visit her so your friend will really appreciate it x

best of luck

sam34

crazy 07 wrote: »

I would bring maybe some clothes with you get her out of her PJs something comfy tho like a new tracky from pennys or somethiing just to keep her thinking positively,also mags are good and maybe sweets.

just a point on this, while the intention is good, when someone is evry unwell staff like to keep them in night attire initially for two reasons - it makes them less likely to try do a runner from the unit, and if they do do a runner, its easier for staff to spot them whereever they are if theyre in PJs.

so speak to the staff before you bring in day clothes

Victor

You might have a word with staff about what to expect. Also check with them as to what she needs / is allowed have.

Gillo

Hi OP. Can I suggest before you go into the ward itself ask one of the nurses what to expect, they should be able to give you a better picture. Having stayed in an acute ward myself I can imagine it's pretty daunting for visitors coming in. Chances are she won't be allowed the paint and brushes, but believe me a book or a magazine would actually mean a lot. Maybe I was lucky with the hospital I went to but I can tell you it's nothing like Hollywood makes out, it's a hell of a lot better. If you want to know more about it feel free to drop me a pm, I'll give you an idea what it's like from the inside, luckily I'm off the acute ward now but bar the utter boredom (it's meant to be low stimulus) it's not too bad.

Crumble Froo

thanks everyone.

apparently she's started taking her meds voluntarily yesterday, and is eating now, and has been moved out of seclusion. just rang up to see how she is, and apparently im allowed visit today!

so gonna head in, definitely speak to the nurses etc before seeing her, but yeah. wow. haha, kinda scared what to expect, but ill just take it as it comes, and do my best for her. might bring in a few surf mags. im really conscious of bringing her in something she can find negative in, even on meds, she can be a bit paranoid or interpret some things very strangely, but i *think* that some surf mags could be cool oh, ill see what the nurses say anyway.

right. logging off now to brush teeth and check bus times.

*deep breath*

Crumble Froo

im so so so so so happy i went in just there! just back. she's ok! she's ok she's ok she's ok!

a wee bit scatty, and a bit drugged up, but she's alright, stoked to see me, ive made a list of things to bring in to her, and yay! she's ok she's ok she's ok. im so glad i went in, i woulda totally psyched myself out all day at work tomorrow if i'd left it till then

happy happy happy!

Gillo

That's great you got in. Hope she's doing ok. Really hope also it wasn't too bad for you. Nice one for making the visit, sounds like you made her day.

Crumble Froo

yeah, thanks so stoked i made the visit. me and her boyfriend been keeping each other up to date on the situation and stuff, and i texted him after i left, to get a phonecall back just going "im so jealous". hehe, she's well loved anyway, between the two of us. it was really really good for me though, actually. im sure the meds have a lot to do with it, but she was really calm. predictably paranoid re the food/water in the place. gonna bring her in some fresh fruit and soymilk and that tomorrow (she's vegan normally, but they've not got great vegan options in there).

ohhh, im just so relieved. i had no idea what state she'd be in, particularly after her sister rang me to prepare me for seeing her. oh man, and ive cried after just about every phonecall where ive had a status update on her, even today, when her boyfriend rang to say she'd been let out of isolation, i bawled, just cos i was so happy/relieved to hear she was improving and eating. im just so happy that she's so ok. i got a really big hug when i was leaving too ^__^


hahahaha, sorry. kinda hard to contain myself at the moment.

Victor

Crumble Froo wrote: »

im so so so so so happy i went in just there! just back. she's ok! she's ok she's ok she's ok!

a wee bit scatty, and a bit drugged up, but she's alright, stoked to see me, ive made a list of things to bring in to her, and yay! she's ok she's ok she's ok. im so glad i went in, i woulda totally psyched myself out all day at work tomorrow if i'd left it till then

happy happy happy!

The mania is catching?

Crumble Froo

Goat Mouth

Crumble Froo wrote: »

Hi, long time no see

It's great that she was in a good mood for the visit. I can actually picture jittering in sheer happiness. alas, she could be in a very different state the next time you go.

Daithio

This may sound extremely harsh, but it's my 2c. My Mum suffers from severe bi-polar disorder, and has been hospitalised countless times. If your friend is really manic and delusional, and you're not used to seeing her like that, then I'm not sure how wise it is to go in at all. Thing is, she more than likely won't remember it anyway, and she will probably say some quite hurtful/ cruel things. I'd find out from her sisters exactly what sort of state she is in before going in. If you do decide to go in, just remember that it's not really her talking and try not to take any of it on board. Also try not to react to the stuff she says, often they will say things to get a reaction if they are high like that, and if you do react they'll sometimes get worse.

She'll need visitors the most when she is coming down off the high though, try to get in as much as possible then.

Daithio

Really should have read more than just the first post! Nice one that she's getting better, best of luck.

irish_bob

hi there op , i take it your mate was admitted volluntarily

LadyMayBelle

Well done OP. I worked in an acute Psych ward earlier this year and wasnt sure at all what to expect. Can imagine it is so much more difficult when a close friend is in there. Mind yourself OP, youre important too.

Crumble Froo

Goat Mouth wrote: »

Hi, long time no see

It's great that she was in a good mood for the visit. I can actually picture jittering in sheer happiness. alas, she could be in a very different state the next time you go.

hey dude! good to see ya! gotta catch up again soon, been aaaaaaaaages
saw her again today, and she was actually a bit better. she knew that i'd been there yesterday, but couldnt remember a lot of details, it'll be interesting to see how much she remembers tomorrow of today.

Daithio wrote: »

Really should have read more than just the first post! Nice one that she's getting better, best of luck.

no worries, thanks

irish_bob wrote: »

hi there op , i take it your mate was admitted volluntarily

nope. picked up by police and sectioned under the mental health act.

LadyPennyworth wrote: »

Well done OP. I worked in an acute Psych ward earlier this year and wasnt sure at all what to expect. Can imagine it is so much more difficult when a close friend is in there. Mind yourself OP, youre important too.

yeah. couldnt stay in there too long today, just too tired and couldnt really handle it. didnt feel too bad about it though cos her boyfreind was in there while i was, and he wont be leaving till he gets kicked out after visiting hours, so ill do a short visit again tomorrow, then do the longer one on wednesday when he's working.

alias06

Hey Crumble Foo, just in case you wanted to learn more about bipolar disorder and mania Kay Redfield Jamison's book The Unquiet Mind is fascinating.

Apart from the whole mental illness thing, its just a great story, well told, by someone that is mature, reflective and kind. It might be a good present for your friend too.

An Bhanríon

A few pointers from my own experience:

Pace yourself. Don't visit too often. Remember this may not be the only time your friend ends up in hospital. And you have to take care of yourself.

Try and be calm before going to visit so you can cope with whatever you are confronted with in the hospital. Sit down quietly for a while, do a bit of meditation, go out for a walk - whatever settles you down. It may not even be your friend who bothers you. It can be upsetting to see some of the other patients too.

As much as possible talk about normal things outside the hospital - your family, friends, what's in the news, your interests. No harm asking a bit about how the hospital is and how your friend is feeling but keep this to the middle of your conversation and not for the beginning or end.

Have somebody to talk to afterwards and not always the same person - if possible. It's important not to burden the same person with your stories all the time.

And finally fair play to you for standing by your friend. It's not always easy and I know lots of mentally ill people who have lost most of their friends because their friends could not cope with their condition. You are one in a million!

Good luck.

nesf

alias06 wrote: »

As regards what to expect, if she is manic and psychotic as you say then she will probably say things that are clearly untrue (delusions) such as I am a millionaire, I am famous, I have special powers etc and she may have paranoid thoughts such as 'the CIA are after me'. Just ignore them, don't try and convince her that she is wrong. She will come around within a few weeks when the lithium takes effect.

Just on this, psychosis can be far more insidious than this and involve paranoia and delusions about friends, family and acquaintances and can be extremely hurtful (i.e. your best friend can turn around and accuse you of hating her, undermining her, wanting to be with her boyfriend or whatever and at the time truly believe it which is extremely hard for family and friends to take). You're "lucky" if the delusions and paranoia are about the CIA and being the King of Tara and similar.

littlefriend

To the OP - you sound like a wonderful person and your friend is so lucky to have you. The warmth in your post has a lump in my throat.

I was in a situation a couple of years ago when I was really not well. I ended up in John of Gods but I couldn't cope with it and walked out. Wasn't sectioned or anything, I just had to sign a load of stuff to say I was leaving against their advice. I really remember how awful I felt and unfortunately my friends weren't able to handle being around me when I was so down. I was terrified of everything and used to spend lots of time sitting in my wardrobe [no I have no idea why either] so they kind of disappeared. Its all fine now between us all but I don't think I'll ever look at them in the same way as I used to. Recently, I was at a wedding and a person I used to hang out with all the time actually said to me maybe we could start hanging out again now that I'm not sick anymore? :rolleyes: Another guy that I grew up with and had always been very, very close to disappeared from my life then too. Whenever I see him now [usually drink involved] he asks me why do I have to be crazy & that we'd be fine still if I wasn't:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Your friend is truly lucky to have you in her life. She will always appreciate it, even if she doesn't really know what is going on now.

Best wishes to you all.

irish_bob

Crumble Froo wrote: »

hey dude! good to see ya! gotta catch up again soon, been aaaaaaaaages
saw her again today, and she was actually a bit better. she knew that i'd been there yesterday, but couldnt remember a lot of details, it'll be interesting to see how much she remembers tomorrow of today.



no worries, thanks



nope. picked up by police and sectioned under the mental health act.



yeah. couldnt stay in there too long today, just too tired and couldnt really handle it. didnt feel too bad about it though cos her boyfreind was in there while i was, and he wont be leaving till he gets kicked out after visiting hours, so ill do a short visit again tomorrow, then do the longer one on wednesday when he's working.

the guards have no authority to do that unless they get the signature of two doctors , one of them a psychiatricst , irelands laws re mental health are extremley liberal and its extremley difficult to have someone committed against thier will unless they seriously hurt someone

[Mod edit] See posts below

Crumble Froo

An Bhanríon wrote: »

A few pointers from my own experience:

Pace yourself. Don't visit too often. Remember this may not be the only time your friend ends up in hospital. And you have to take care of yourself.

yep. that's become very very apparent to me in the last day. i have quite a lot going on for myself at the moment, and have found the experience of being with my mate in the hospital a little bit of a trigger, so im quite conscious of that. didn't spend much more than a half hour in there yesterday, and her boyfreind was in too. my partner will be in for a bit today while im in there, and it'll only be a short visit today (cos her boyfriend will be there still). he's working tomorrow, so ill probably have a longer visit then, and bring in some dvds etc to watch. but i am quite conscious of the fact that she doesnt want to spend too much time with the other patients, as they too easily influence her headspace (quite a few of them she knows from previous stays in the hospital).

Try and be calm before going to visit so you can cope with whatever you are confronted with in the hospital. Sit down quietly for a while, do a bit of meditation, go out for a walk - whatever settles you down. It may not even be your friend who bothers you. It can be upsetting to see some of the other patients too.

yep, i totally get that. really had to psyche myself up particularly for the first visit. ha, ran into a freind of a freind at teh bustop and was really really jittery, almost crying, but i feel a lot more confident going in now, between the busride there, and the skate from the bustop, there's lots of time to chill out, listen to music and take in the greenery around teh area.:)

As much as possible talk about normal things outside the hospital - your family, friends, what's in the news, your interests. No harm asking a bit about how the hospital is and how your friend is feeling but keep this to the middle of your conversation and not for the beginning or end.

yep, been doing that alright. bit tricky as lots of my news isnt all that good at the moment, but im just glossing over those bits for now, and talking crap about how work was, and how the surf's meant to be for the next few days and all that. we talk about the hospital a bit too, her mind will wander a bit and she'll make a comment about the hospital or her meds, or how she ended up there.

Have somebody to talk to afterwards and not always the same person - if possible. It's important not to burden the same person with your stories all the time.

yeah, between her boyfriend, my partner, my boss and a friend who doesnt know her, im handling it

And finally fair play to you for standing by your friend. It's not always easy and I know lots of mentally ill people who have lost most of their friends because their friends could not cope with their condition. You are one in a million!

Good luck.

thanks it probably helps that we met each other through a mental health peer support training group, so while im not bipolar, i can certainly empathise with certain aspects of her mental health that other people could find a lot more difficult to understand or come to terms with.

nesf wrote: »

Just on this, psychosis can be far more insidious than this and involve paranoia and delusions about friends, family and acquaintances and can be extremely hurtful (i.e. your best friend can turn around and accuse you of hating her, undermining her, wanting to be with her boyfriend or whatever and at the time truly believe it which is extremely hard for family and friends to take). You're "lucky" if the delusions and paranoia are about the CIA and being the King of Tara and similar.

that was my biggest fear, and i think the nail on the head, really. she has displayed tendencies like that in the past, particularly while drinknig, ive found myself to have to be quite careful about certain things i'd say, etc, but she's more or less ok on that front, at least with me at teh moment. she did wonder if her sister and boyfreind had run off together, or if id been in her room at all, and things like that, but i think she's pretty comfortable around me and her fella and maybe one other freind... i think it's more around her family that she's a lot more resentful or unwilling to talk to, for various reasons.

littlefriend wrote: »

To the OP - you sound like a wonderful person and your friend is so lucky to have you. The warmth in your post has a lump in my throat.

thanks im lucky to have her too.

I was in a situation a couple of years ago when I was really not well. I ended up in John of Gods but I couldn't cope with it and walked out. Wasn't sectioned or anything, I just had to sign a load of stuff to say I was leaving against their advice. I really remember how awful I felt and unfortunately my friends weren't able to handle being around me when I was so down. I was terrified of everything and used to spend lots of time sitting in my wardrobe [no I have no idea why either] so they kind of disappeared. Its all fine now between us all but I don't think I'll ever look at them in the same way as I used to. Recently, I was at a wedding and a person I used to hang out with all the time actually said to me maybe we could start hanging out again now that I'm not sick anymore? :rolleyes: Another guy that I grew up with and had always been very, very close to disappeared from my life then too. Whenever I see him now [usually drink involved] he asks me why do I have to be crazy & that we'd be fine still if I wasn't:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

really sorry you had to go through with that. some people i think just can't understand, no matter how much they try, i think the difference is in teh ones who want to understand, and the ones who just dont want to know. i know having suffered eating disorders, social anxiety and depression, that some people really just got so frustrated because i wouldnt eat/go out/cheer up, and did just get sick of me. i appreciate the ones who gave me the time and encouragement to figure my stuff out more than i can ever say. really sorry your mates reacted the way they did though. that sucks

Your friend is truly lucky to have you in her life. She will always appreciate it, even if she doesn't really know what is going on now.

Best wishes to you all.

yeah, got a very big hug and a kiss goodbye the last two times i was in. i know she appreciates it, and it makes me smile to know that.

irish_bob wrote: »

the guards have no authority to do that unless they get the signature of two doctors , one of them a psychiatricst , irelands laws re mental health are extremley liberal and its extremley difficult to have someone committed against thier will unless they seriously hurt someone

im not actually in ireland, and as far as i know, she signed herself voluntarily in to be sectioned, (while in police custody) as she realised she needed help, but also aware that her mood swings and perceptions were liable to swing dramatically and that she could later sign herself out, so sectioning her meant she couldnt do that.

that's my understanding of it anyway, but that was explained to me in a very short phonecall when her sister rang to let me know she was going into hospital.

Crumble Froo

thanks to everyone who's posted in this thread, btw. it's been really helpful for me to have this here to come back to. i hope things'll get easier over the next few weeks as she continues to stabilise and look toward coming home again.

sam34

irish_bob wrote: »

the guards have no authority to do that unless they get the signature of two doctors , one of them a psychiatricst , irelands laws re mental health are extremley liberal and its extremley difficult to have someone committed against thier will unless they seriously hurt someone

Crumble Froo wrote: »

im not actually in ireland, and as far as i know, she signed herself voluntarily in to be sectioned, (while in police custody) as she realised she needed help, but also aware that her mood swings and perceptions were liable to swing dramatically and that she could later sign herself out, so sectioning her meant she couldnt do that.

that's my understanding of it anyway, but that was explained to me in a very short phonecall when her sister rang to let me know she was going into hospital.

if the guards suspect someone is suffering from a mental illness, they have both the authority and the duty to bring that person to a gp (or to a garda station and get the gp to come to them)

if the gp feels they need a psychiatric assessment, then the gardai are obliged to transport them to the psych unit.

you cant really sign yourself in voluntarily to be sectioned - there is no such legal concept. if someone is willing to stay voluntarily they have to be allowed do that. if they change their mind ten minutes later, then they may be detained/sectioned, depending on the circumstances.

they do not have to seriously hurt someone before they can be detained.
the mental health act states that someone can be detained if because of a mental illness they pose a threat to themselves or others, OR if their condition is going to deteriorate without treatment and that treatment can only be given in hospital and they are expected to benefit from that treatment.

over 4000 people were detained in ireland in teh last two years alone.

nesf

Crumble Froo wrote: »

that was my biggest fear, and i think the nail on the head, really. she has displayed tendencies like that in the past, particularly while drinknig, ive found myself to have to be quite careful about certain things i'd say, etc, but she's more or less ok on that front, at least with me at teh moment. she did wonder if her sister and boyfreind had run off together, or if id been in her room at all, and things like that, but i think she's pretty comfortable around me and her fella and maybe one other freind... i think it's more around her family that she's a lot more resentful or unwilling to talk to, for various reasons.

It's a serious issue, I have bipolar and years ago before I was getting treatment I lost a lot of friends over a few such incidents (didn't help that neither I nor anyone else understood what was happening to me). The only thing is the medication really does help you get control of these things once you get on it and stick with it.

nesf

sam34 wrote: »

if the guards suspect someone is suffering from a mental illness, they have both the authority and the duty to bring that person to a gp (or to a garda station and get the gp to come to them)

if the gp feels they need a psychiatric assessment, then the gardai are obliged to transport them to the psych unit.

you cant really sign yourself in voluntarily to be sectioned - there is no such legal concept. if someone is willing to stay voluntarily they have to be allowed do that. if they change their mind ten minutes later, then they may be detained/sectioned, depending on the circumstances.

they do not have to seriously hurt someone before they can be detained.
the mental health act states that someone can be detained if because of a mental illness they pose a threat to themselves or others, OR if their condition is going to deteriorate without treatment and that treatment can only be given in hospital and they are expected to benefit from that treatment.

over 4000 people were detained in ireland in teh last two years alone.

Yarr. I could definitely have been sectioned at least once (probably twice) if the Gardaí had been made aware of my condition which they weren't (and they probably should have but my friends at the time didn't know what to do). And I've never been close to being a threat to myself or someone else, it just would have been very obvious that I was manic and suffering from psychosis.

Victor

irish_bob wrote: »

the guards have no authority to do that unless they get the signature of two doctors , one of them a psychiatricst , irelands laws re mental health are extremley liberal and its extremley difficult to have someone committed against thier will unless they seriously hurt someone

While the Garda will need a medical decision to continue to detain someone, they can temporarily detain anyone who appears likely to harm themselves, others or property. All that needs to be demonstrated is intent, they don't need to wait until someone has been stabbed.

Now, that said, there are practical limits - gardaí can't be everywhere. And many an alcohol abuser isn't addressed by the system.

irish_bob

Victor wrote: »

While the Garda will need a medical decision to continue to detain someone, they can temporarily detain anyone who appears likely to harm themselves, others or property. All that needs to be demonstrated is intent, they don't need to wait until someone has been stabbed.

Now, that said, there are practical limits - gardaí can't be everywhere. And many an alcohol abuser isn't addressed by the system.

i have a cousin who is not the full schilling , on an almost daily basis , he rants at home and occasionally in public about how the world will end in the coming weeks , in the past few months , the guards were called because he threatened to kill his brother , when the arrived , they brought with them a doctor , the guards and the doctor then told my aunt thier was nothing could be done unless actual violence was committed

i myself have spoken to my cousins GP , i was told that the liberals own legislation when it comes to mental health in this country and that the rights of the person who is not right at all times supercede every other consideration and that includes the safety of those around them , both family and otherwise

thier have been many deaths over the years due to this politically correct system , where my mom comes from in co galway , thier was a guy who lived across the border in clare named brendan o donnell , he murdered a priest , a young mom and her son , this guy was notorious in the area he was from years in advance of this attrocity yet he could not be touched

thier was a case a few years ago where a young man from the midlands was up in dublin for his cousins stag party , on his way back to his cousins appartment later that night , he was attacked in the corridor by a guy with a knife and stabbed 72 times to death , when arrested , the guy said he had just killed the devil , thier are numerous other examples and storys which expose the folly of our wooly liberal laws regarding the mentally unwell

The Recliner

irish_bob wrote: »

i have a cousin who is not the full schilling , on an almost daily basis , he rants at home and occasionally in public about how the world will end in the coming weeks , in the past few months , the guards were called because he threatened to kill his brother , when the arrived , they brought with them a doctor , the guards and the doctor then told my aunt thier was nothing could be done unless actual violence was committed

i myself have spoken to my cousins GP , i was told that the liberals own legislation when it comes to mental health in this country and that the rights of the person who is not right at all times supercede every other consideration and that includes the safety of those around them , both family and otherwise

thier have been many deaths over the years due to this politically correct system , where my mom comes from in co galway , thier was a guy who lived across the border in clare named brendan o donnell , he murdered a priest , a young mom and her son , this guy was notorious in the area he was from years in advance of this attrocity yet he could not be touched

thier was a case a few years ago where a young man from the midlands was up in dublin for his cousins stag party , on his way back to his cousins appartment later that night , he was attacked in the corridor by a guy with a knife and stabbed 72 times to death , when arrested , the guy said he had just killed the devil , thier are numerous other examples and storys which expose the folly of our wooly liberal laws regarding the mentally unwell

I sympathise with your cousin and family but what if anything has this got to do with the OP and this thread

And this is a general comment to everyone in this thread if you want a general discussion on this then there are other places to have it, the OP is not in Ireland so Irish laws and their rights and wrongs have nothing to do with this thread

Crumble Froo

thanks Recliner


arrrgh. trying to find the line between being there for her and being there for me. it's happened at this really weird time, where all of a sudden she isnt there, and 2 days later my other best friend isnt there (long story), at the same time im struggling with my own mental health issues and ive suddenly got two extra stresses in the form of my two best mates and nobody to talk to about it.

bit :eek: at the moment.

The Recliner

Crumble Froo wrote: »

arrrgh. trying to find the line between being there for her and being there for me. it's happened at this really weird time, where all of a sudden she isnt there, and 2 days later my other best friend isnt there (long story), at the same time im struggling with my own mental health issues and ive suddenly got two extra stresses in the form of my two best mates and nobody to talk to about it.

bit :eek: at the moment.

Well the most important thing is that you look after yourself first, no point looking after her at the expense of your health, but I am sure you know that

It can't be easy having to look out for someone and being vunerable yourself due to people not being around you at the same time and being away from home, although it probably is home for you over there now

It might not be all the help that you need but this thread will be here for you for as long as you need it and hopefully in its own small way Boards and the good people here can help you through it

An Bhanríon

Take good care of yourself OP, even if you think you need to be taking care of somebody else more. You are number one, remember!!! Been there, so I know what it's like to have to pull back and say, ok I'm only going to visit this person once a week, although I feel in my heart I should be checking on them every day. You can't take care of other people if you don't take care of yourself first.

Another thing which occurred to me reading one of your posts: Don't be afraid to tell your friend (very nicely and mindfully and at a good time in the conversation!) that your own life isn't perfect at the moment and even that you are finding it hard coping with her troubles. You don't always need to put on a brave face. I don't mean offloading all your troubles on to your friend, of course. Just an observation of mine that people tend to wrap psychiatric patients in cotton wool, making them end up thinking that nobody else but them has problems, that everybody else's life is perfect, and that even if somebody else had a problem they would probably be useless helping them anyway...

Crumble Froo

The Recliner wrote: »

Well the most important thing is that you look after yourself first, no point looking after her at the expense of your health, but I am sure you know that

yep ... well, the theory anyway. im really good at knowing the theory of things and messing up with the practical ends of it.

It can't be easy having to look out for someone and being vunerable yourself due to people not being around you at the same time and being away from home, although it probably is home for you over there now

yeah, it is more or less home here by now, though at the same time, it was just the most amazing thing to come home yesterday, just so mentally exhausted, and my best mate from ireland had messaged me saying all sorts of lovely things, so feeling a little more capable and energised today.

It might not be all the help that you need but this thread will be here for you for as long as you need it and hopefully in its own small way Boards and the good people here can help you through it

yep, i really appreciate that, thanks i generally tend to be better able to make sense of things via the written (typed, whatever) word than the spoken one. definitely helps to have this here.

An Bhanríon wrote: »

Take good care of yourself OP, even if you think you need to be taking care of somebody else more. You are number one, remember!!! Been there, so I know what it's like to have to pull back and say, ok I'm only going to visit this person once a week, although I feel in my heart I should be checking on them every day. You can't take care of other people if you don't take care of yourself first.

true yeah, as it looks at the moment, i think i may not be going in on friday, as a friend is coming up from the coast to go to a gig, so probably wont have the time to visit her between work and him arriving. so in a way, im probably gonna feel a bit guilty, but it'll be nice to have a day off. i simply couldnt do just the one day a week thing, but i think 3-5 days could be a bit more reasonable, depending on my mood by the time im finished work. might chat with her about it today.

Another thing which occurred to me reading one of your posts: Don't be afraid to tell your friend (very nicely and mindfully and at a good time in the conversation!) that your own life isn't perfect at the moment and even that you are finding it hard coping with her troubles. You don't always need to put on a brave face. I don't mean offloading all your troubles on to your friend, of course.

actually, that did come up yesterday. i have a few wee anxietal quirks that tend to become more pronounced the more stressed out i am, and she did notice yesterday that i *had* to close doors behind me, and that i was quite conscious of open space, so she asked me what was up, and i told her i just wasn't in the greatest of spaces, and she said she'd noticed that i hadnt been eating properly, and told me to look after myself. i wouldnt do the cotton wool thing with her, but she's got more than enough on her plate to sort out at the moment, i certainly couldnt/wouldnt offload on her.

argggh, im just really frustrated on the first part that ive let my own health lag so much, and that im falling back into a place i really really dont want to be back in, but i feel like im not doing enough to counteract that, while at the same time just feeling a bit overwhelmed and isolated with the rest of things going on in life. *sigh* better go now anyway, get ready for work .:rolleyes: