Tips on making improvements (noob swimmer).

Oryx

Ive read a few of the threads here, and just wanted to ask a few of my own questions.

Always have been confident and able to keep myself afloat in the pool, but no more than that, in spite of lessons as a child and a one to one a few years ago. Now, though, I'm hoping to get into triathlon, and the swimming is the biggest challenge. I have been swimming once a week for the last five weeks, trying to get some sort of front crawl technique down. I am abysmally slow, usually because I cant get the breathing right and I have to recover after every length in a 20m pool. My first time in I couldnt do a length in one go. I can now, but only just. My turnarounds are quicker but still cant bang out multiple lengths yet. Stamina is not my problem, breath is. I breathe every 4th stroke, r/h side only, and can clear the water no problem, but I still dont seem to take in enough air. I've tried every second stroke but my technique gets very ragged.

Should I just work away as I am, and build up more endurance (faster more continuous distance) and improve the technique I've got, or would it be the time to correct any technique issues, by way of a one to one, or say, work on breathing both sides now, when Im still learning it all anyway? I feel like such a pleb in the pool right now, any advice that makes me improve in any way would be appreciated!

nomadic

I'm in the same boat as yourself. I used to swim quite a bit when I was younger until I left school. Thought I'd get back into it easily but I'm fairly patethic at the minute. I've only been swimming 3 weeks now and could manage 50m the first week , 75m last week and go up to 175m today. It kinda snapped with me today to put less effort in(relax probably) and I don't seem to be out of breath as much. I also kicked my legs less today which helped (something about thighs needing a lot of oxygen i think). My stroke is pretty bad i'd say though and i'm hoping to work on that when my swim fitness improves.

I'd also love to hear from someone who knows what there talking about thinks re Keep bashing away/Lessons?

danjo-xx

I would recommend classes from a qualified instructor, I fell into (so to speak) a swimming class in Tara Street baths many moons ago just for a swim, it turned out it was in fact a 'Life Saving Class' but it thought me a lot of the basic's about breathing and strokes etc, and was told I had a left leg screw kick or something, but I still managed to get the advanced live saving badge as it was called then, went on enjoy scuba diving (again by accident) and thoroughly enjoyed it.

promethius

Oryx wrote: »

Ive read a few of the threads here, and just wanted to ask a few of my own questions.

Always have been confident and able to keep myself afloat in the pool, but no more than that, in spite of lessons as a child and a one to one a few years ago. Now, though, I'm hoping to get into triathlon, and the swimming is the biggest challenge. I have been swimming once a week for the last five weeks, trying to get some sort of front crawl technique down. I am abysmally slow, usually because I cant get the breathing right and I have to recover after every length in a 20m pool. My first time in I couldnt do a length in one go. I can now, but only just. My turnarounds are quicker but still cant bang out multiple lengths yet. Stamina is not my problem, breath is. I breathe every 4th stroke, r/h side only, and can clear the water no problem, but I still dont seem to take in enough air. I've tried every second stroke but my technique gets very ragged.

Should I just work away as I am, and build up more endurance (faster more continuous distance) and improve the technique I've got, or would it be the time to correct any technique issues, by way of a one to one, or say, work on breathing both sides now, when Im still learning it all anyway? I feel like such a pleb in the pool right now, any advice that makes me improve in any way would be appreciated!

Hey well done on sticking at it. You're at a stage where you will see huge improvements in fitness and performance since you're starting from a lower level and i mean that with no disrespect.

Defintely don't keep training on your own, any issues on stroke you have you most likely won't even know about or how to fix them. Any training done on your own will only reinforce those faults.

Join a tri club, loads of swimmers with great advice and encouragment.

Do lessons, one on one is def better if you can afford it and will be able to get way more attention than in a large class. Class would still be great and would have some craic with others at the same stage in their swimming.

If you stick at it you will have no problems getting through the swim in the tri but you will really need to get lessons very soon.

Good luck by the way and what area are you in for clubs?

Zuppy

I can only echo that. Swimming is so technical that the only shortcut is to get a few lessons. Depending on how much your willing to pay and whats available near you.

CatFromHue

i would have been in a similar position to yourself.

swam was i younger and in school and then 20 years later got back in the pool.

i took a few group lessons which improved my breast and back stroke but not so much my front crawl. so i kinda just been teaching myself, i wasnt in a rush or anything.

my advice would be less is more.

i used to kick really hard and move my arms really fast and then be in bits after a length.

i'm not a terribly fast swimmer but have managed to get down to 17-19 arm strokes per 25m.

try and get the most out of each arm stroke moreso than getting alot of arm strokes in

Zuppy

Just a few thoughts,

The total immersion book/dvd is easy to follow in case your thinking of grabing a book to try and learn more. I also have a cheaper one called swimming for fitness (i think and can check if you want). Both helped me learn a lot more than the swim coach bible book.

The triathlon 220 magazine had a swimming dvd this month but I haven't seen it. No idea if it would help but even cheaper than a lesson. :-)

Some pools do group adult lessons which are cheaper than one to one. Otherwise find someone who can swim (like i did) and get a few tips till what they say doesn't help anymore. Then you will know if you can swim or need to progress to one to one lessons.

PS: I presume you have read the sticky post on learning to swim?

Oryx

Yes i read all the stickies. Thanks to all who have replied to me here. Seems lessons or someone good to check how im doing are my next step. Not easy to come by locally but something to look for in the new year. I will pick up the total immersion book too. Thanks all.

promethius

Oryx wrote: »

Yes i read all the stickies. Thanks to all who have replied to me here. Seems lessons or someone good to check how im doing are my next step. Not easy to come by locally but something to look for in the new year. I will pick up the total immersion book too. Thanks all.

I did a weekend course with Dan from swim for tri this year, he's the guy behind the 220 DVD and features in it. one hell of a swimmer i can tell you. There's lot of really simple stuff he preaches like getting a good body (horiz) flat position in the water which you should be aiming for from the start. Some of the other stuff is pretty high level, you'd be better to get the lessons and get the basics right and buil;d up a good level of fitness before getting too worried about that stuff.

Best of luck anyways.

tyler71

If your main problem is breathing, maybe you're not letting all your breath out before you take your breaths in, you could try 'singing' your breath out or humming it out - all accepted ways to release all the air in your lungs in a slow controlled manner so that when you turn your head ready to take a breath you can maximise what you take in. If this isn't the problem and you're fully exhaled before taking a breath and still can't last more than a length then you're probably swimming too fast for your capability and need to slow down- regardless of what you think is incredibly slow it doesn't really matter as long as you're capable of completing the distance - that part is technique and fitness related which will be your next steps. Swimming 'slow' was a big revelation to me when I was learning, and makes a huge difference when you go to open water as when you start off in a pool your aim is to make it to the end but when you're out in the open water, as far as your lungs and body are concerned there is no short term 'end' so you might as well start enjoying it.

southsiderosie

I agree that getting technical help is best. I used to be a lifeguard/instructor, and it is amazing how much energy reasonably strong and fit people waste on bad technique, tiring themselves out in the process. You don't need to do it forever, but it is worth it to have someone else watch your stroke and help you make adjustments - you may waste a lot of time and energy otherwise.

The other thing I would suggest is investing in a kick board and pull buoy (the foam thing you hold between your thighs), and adding a few lengths of kicking or pulling only to your workout. Isolating your upper or lower body forces you to slow down and focus on your technique. Using a pull buoy is especially useful because most of the power in your stroke will come from the upper body, and you can really "feel" the difference in your efficiency when you aren't trying to kick and float and do all these other things at the same time. And after a few lengths of arms/legs only, you will feel really fast and efficient when you put it back together again with a full stroke!

One more thing - if you are training for an open water triathlon, once you get the hang of your stroke, you should definitely practice breathing on both sides. Normally most people prefer one side of the other for efficiency, but in an open water swim, if it's choppy, you may need to use your "off" side so you don't end up drinking a few pints during your swim. Unfortunately, I am speaking from sad experience here, as I am a decidedly "breathe on the right" swimmer!

Good luck!

marky boii

Oryx wrote: »

Ive read a few of the threads here, and just wanted to ask a few of my own questions.

Always have been confident and able to keep myself afloat in the pool, but no more than that, in spite of lessons as a child and a one to one a few years ago. Now, though, I'm hoping to get into triathlon, and the swimming is the biggest challenge. I have been swimming once a week for the last five weeks, trying to get some sort of front crawl technique down. I am abysmally slow, usually because I cant get the breathing right and I have to recover after every length in a 20m pool. My first time in I couldnt do a length in one go. I can now, but only just. My turnarounds are quicker but still cant bang out multiple lengths yet. Stamina is not my problem, breath is. I breathe every 4th stroke, r/h side only, and can clear the water no problem, but I still dont seem to take in enough air. I've tried every second stroke but my technique gets very ragged.

Should I just work away as I am, and build up more endurance (faster more continuous distance) and improve the technique I've got, or would it be the time to correct any technique issues, by way of a one to one, or say, work on breathing both sides now, when Im still learning it all anyway? I feel like such a pleb in the pool right now, any advice that makes me improve in any way would be appreciated!

I'm 12 and i can do 112 lenghts without laying a foot on the pool floor so my advice is don't try the triatlon.

Oryx

marky boii wrote: »

I'm 12 and i can do 112 lenghts without laying a foot on the pool floor so my advice is don't try the triatlon.

Thats wonderful. Youre lucky you learned young. I suck right now. Which is why Im here. I wont take your advice, ta. I promise ya, Ill master swimming and tri just fine. Just needs work.

AngryHippie

The way for you to go at the moment is to join a set of lessons for 6 or 8 weeks, and practice at least 3 times a week between them. Progress will be pretty rapid, your breathing will improve and will open up longer distances to you. Don't stress about speed for now, a steady rythm, good balance and a controlled breathing pattern is much more important. As for Marky Boii's 112 lengths, well, thats not really saying much about anything. Feel free to try a sprint triathalon at some stage in the next 12 months. set it as a goal just to finish it, take the lessons, put in the practice, You'll find it all comes together. As for Total Immersion, a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, and TI will give you a lot of information that you won't be able to utilise until you have gotten some muscle memory built up around a solid stroke. Once you're able to lash out a couple of 100m swims in a session, you can consider investing in Total Immersion, but for now, some lessons with a decent instructor or coach would give you far greater benefit.
Stick with it

voxpop

Keep at it Oryx. I only started the front crawl last summer(august) and from not even getting the breathing right and only able to swim half a length, Im now able to pretty comfortable swim 6 lengths - which I know is no big deal to a decent swimmer but Im pretty happy with that progress.

What I did was focus on one thing at a time - so focus on a good pull, down the center line of you body or focus on good body position, or kicking, or gliding,etc. I still have trouble with the kick - its like patting your head and rubbing your tummy to me - seems impossible for my legs and arms to work at different speeds - but im hoping it will click at some stage.

Lessons are a good Idea, just to have someone watching your stroke and giving feedback. I know round by me there are group lessons at 90quid for 10 lessons with is grand- not sure of the number though.

Unpossible

I always recommend explosive breathing. Make sure when you turn your head to breath that all you are doing is breathing in, then when underwater hold it until just before you are going to turn your head for the next breath and then blow it all out in one fast go.
Also its worth pointing out you should always have ample breath, beginners often make the mistake of going until they "need" a breath. If you go watch a local swimming club you will see the swimmers will all be breathing either every two or three strokes unless they are sprinting or doing a drill. Breathing more often (with the explosive breathing) will ensure you have enough oxygen and you will end up with more energy.

For specific advise on your stroke, its best to join a class or try and get a private teacher.

Oryx

Thanks unpossible. I was holding too long, (four strokes) and running out of breath, I have practiced going every two strokes, which is making it all easier. Im working on three, but that means alternating sides which is yet another thing Im trying to learn. Its coming though. Havent talked to the swim coach in the pool yet (just joined) but will in the coming week or two.

Green Hornet

Oryx wrote: »

Thanks unpossible. I was holding too long, (four strokes) and running out of breath, I have practiced going every two strokes, which is making it all easier.

Yep. When I learned a few years ago I was the same. Taught to breathe every 4 strokes but it was not enough and changed to every 2 strokes. Made a huge difference to me. I do around 40 lengths of a 25m pool now. I know you're supposed to breathe on both sides as well but I guess it's not the be all and end all either.

On a slightly different note, I average ca. 18 strokes/25m length but was wondering where the kick off comes into play? Surely some people have a big kick off while others dont so how do you take that into account when counting strokes/length?