A note about Heels.

jaykhunter

Seems like a great time to shed light on why a lot of veteran fans boo the faces and cheer the heels. If you've ever wondered why, read on!

(Just in case anyone's wondering, a heel is a bad guy (eg CM Punk) and a face is a good guy (eg John Cena))

The premise : In general, it's the heels that dictate storylines, not faces.



The heels antagonise the crowd, do dastardly deeds, and incite the face into action. By virtue of the face going against the heel, he's more important, likable and popular, and everyone wins. What I'm saying is that without the heels, there wouldn't be any faces, because the heel supplies the motivation for faces. Have a look at this video :

Fast forward until Sherri Martel's interview. What do you see?
http://www.vbox7.com/play:5495e142

When I saw this almost 20 years ago, I loved the warrior because he shut Sherri up. He told that windbag to stuff it, no-one can contain the Warrior! I reckon most people who watch wrestling would come to the same conclusion.

Watching it again recently, I saw just how good Sherri is - she CARRIED this segment. She basically talked to herself for 7 minutes, all Warrior had to do was react when she was done - and HE gets all the credit! She (the heel) did all the work but the Warrior (the face - who's much less talented) got all the credit. We were duped into thinking how awesome the Warrior is, despite him doing very, very little. It's just great booking - highlight people's strengths and hide their flaws.

I just wanted to highlight this particular segment because in terms of promos, I can't think of another female cutting a good a promo as this. Ever!


Something a big more recent :



A more recent example is the CM Punk vs Jeff Hardy feud. Can you remember any of Hardy's promos? The dude can barely speak! A few Punk promos instantly spring to mind "Say yes to a Straight Edge tomorrow!" By virtue of shutting up the heel Punk, Hardy is a bigger face. It was Punk who "lead" the feud by the nose, he created the instances and the reason for Hardy to fight. Punk had a bigger agenda, but Hardy was just the anti-Punk.


How this applies to heels in general :

The same analogy can be applied to other heels and great feuds. Of course it's not always the case, when you have very strong faces (which is really, really hard to do) like Hogan, Austin, Rock, who can hold their own against the heels. But in general, Heels lead because they're more creatively free to get the crowd to hate them. Not to mention it's easier to get fans to hate you than like you. But you could find that every big face was made by overcoming the odds and beating the big heel. (Cena beating JBL, Hogan beating Sheik, Austin beating McMahon, Batista beating Hunter etc).

A small point, but Cena's doing all the heavy lifting in his feud with Sheamus. A bone of contention people have with Cena (but might not realise it) is that he can't really lead, despite his many years at the top, working with the best talent WWE have to offer - but he is capable of great matches with the right people, and even crap talent (like Batista and Khali, for example)



Orton is a great heel. He's despicable, cold-hearted and also a coward....although his talents (his facials are amazing, you can see that he really "gets" wrestling by the way he carries himself) haven't gone unnoticed by a lot of WWE fans as well. It's also a great reason why really talented heels become faces - it's because fans recognise their talent and cheer them regardless of their actions (see The Rock in 1998 - his heel antics became so popular he had to be turned face).




A parting thought :

Anyway, I'm not here to tell anyone what's the "right way" to watch wrestling - because you should enjoy wrestling as much as you can - cheer for who you want to and boo the ones you hate. I personally don't see wrestling as a show, but more of isolated pockets of awesome talent I can appreciate, be it in-ring wrestling, gimmick or promo skills. It's a bit weird alright. But this is how I view wrestling and why hardcore veteran fans like me cheer for the heels - the guys who really pull the stings onstage Aw, Snap!

waltersobchak

the thing about WWEs heels these days,is that they're the most entertaining and complelling characters, Edge, Jerico, Punk, Orton, its no coincidence that most people prefer and would sooner cheer them than Cena(for example), thats the differance between now and the past, were you actually hated the heels and always wanted to see them get their comeuppance, now its basically the other way around..

jaykhunter

I agree. Although we were all huge marks back in the 80s and early 90s! I said my prayers, took my vitamins, I believed in all things Warrior and Hogan-related It's a great point - many people gravitate towards whoever 'provides the entertainment' if they watch wrestling (closely) for long enough. Being heel is being completely free to say and do whatever you want, unlike the faces, who are more constrained into doing everything that will be fan-friendly (in general)

waltersobchak

jaykhunter wrote: »

I agree. Although we were all huge marks back in the 80s and early 90s! I said my prayers, took my vitamins, I believed in all things Warrior and Hogan-related It's a great point - many people gravitate towards whoever 'provides the entertainment' if they watch wrestling (closely) for long enough. Being heel is being completely free to say and do whatever you want, unlike the faces, who are more constrained into doing everything that will be fan-friendly (in general)

Absolutely, back in the day it was cool to be a Hogan/Warrior fan, but i dunno if its cool for kids of this generation to love the uber faces, bar maybe Mysterio or Jeff Hardy, but i do think its a mark of where wrestling is now, by the fact that the line between Heel/Face are slightly blurred, and arent as widely divided as they were in the 1980's!!

jaykhunter

Alternative link to that Sherri Martel segment :
http://www.motionbox.com/videos/d497d1b0181de2c95b/

gerrybbadd

I think the majority of wrestlers, given the chance, would prefer to be heel. It's usually the heel that calls the moves in ring also. Great post OP!

flahavaj

I should've voted jaykhunter as best newcomer in the boards awards.

Awesome awesome OP, not for the first time.

D2D

flahavaj wrote: »

I should've voted jaykhunter as best newcomer in the boards awards.

Awesome awesome OP, not for the first time.

Just edit it.

Really, really good read. First the TNA year review then TNA roster review and now this. Fair play jaykhunter, top class OP's

michael.etc...

Another great read. Too busy atm to really respond, but it's good to get your latest thought-provoking post.

Rjd2

The faces these days are bed wetting nerds, and the heels are cool young mofo's essentially.

flahavaj

Dare_2_defy wrote: »

Just edit it.

Really, really good read. First the TNA year review then TNA roster review and now this. Fair play jaykhunter, top class OP's

Cheers. Meant most improved.

jaykhunter

Thanks for the wonderful feedback guys! Over the last few months I've been frequenting my usual haunts less and less in favour of this forum. You've no idea how great it is to find a forum -and an irish one to boot! - to talk wrestling intelligently, in respectful discussions and not worry about the "xbox live crowd" that infest so many boards! :):):o

I should add the point that my main point is that the general overarching storyline (focus) in wrestling is the journey of the faces, how they overcome various tribulations...but it's the varying heels that lead the individual feuds (in general).

What I mean by that is that WWE is based around faces Cena, DX and Taker (and formerly Jeff Hardy). Over the last year it's been Cena vs Jericho, then Cena vs Orton, now Cena vs Sheamus. The heels shuffle/rotate around the faces. Does that make sense?

(DX and Taker are bad examples, because they're more than capable of calling world-class matches, but u get my drift!)

Terry

One name: Steve Austin.

He blurred the line between heels and faces forever.

Before him it was Hogan the face and whoever was against Hogan as the heel. It was stale and Austin changed that completely.
Austin took on his boss and knocked the crap out of him. He gave hope to the average working class person by doing that.
We all want to knock the crap out of our boss. Austin did it on tv and everyone cheered.

On the other side, and at the same time, you had Scott Hall and Kevin Nash doing the same thing on WCW. They basically told vince to "Suck it" by defecting to the main competition at the time.
Hall nailed it with his "you know who I am" promo.
He instantly blurred the lines between the marks and the smarks with that promo.

Those in the know cheered him and the marks booed him. It was television gold.

flahavaj

I think the emergence of heels in current wrestling today highlights the difference between a good babyface and a great babyface.

Basically a great babyface like Hogan didn't need a heel to get him over. He was such a compelling character to 80's wrestling fans that the standard of heel she faced was generally quite mediocre (the likes of Zeus etc) simply because they didn't have to be that great. Hogan was over all on his own.

However in an era such as wrestling nowadays when truly great babyfaces are so hard to come by, its the heels that are shining. Basically modern babyfaces lie Jeff hardy need guys as incredibly good at gaining heat such as Edge amnd punk simply to get them heat.

Its interesting that in pro wrestling history, when heels have been strong truly great babyfaces are few and far between, and vice versa. Which validates the point so well made by the OP.

*****************************************

Btw to echo what jaykhunter said, this is the most enjoyable this board has been in my time on it. Good debate, good banter, no mods on a powertrip and barely an ounce of trouble to speak of. Long may it continue.

Terry

flahavaj wrote: »

I think the emergence of heels in current wrestling today highlights the difference between a good babyface and a great babyface.

Basically a great babyface like Hogan didn't need a heel to get him over. He was such a compelling character to 80's wrestling fans that the standard of heel she faced was generally quite mediocre (the likes of Zeus etc) simply because they didn't have to be that great. Hogan was over all on his own.

However in an era such as wrestling nowadays when truly great babyfaces are so hard to come by, its the heels that are shining. Basically modern babyfaces lie Jeff hardy need guys as incredibly good at gaining heat such as Edge amnd punk simply to get them heat.

Its interesting that in pro wrestling history, when heels have been strong truly great babyfaces are few and far between, and vice versa. Which validates the point so well made by the OP.

*****************************************

Btw to echo what jaykhunter said, this is the most enjoyable this board has been in my time on it. Good debate, good banter, no mods on a powertrip and barely an ounce of trouble to speak of. Long may it continue.

Banned.
Nah. I'm just kidding.
I do agree with you on most parts of your post.
The only part I disagree with is on Jeff Hardy.
I remember the debut of the Hardy Boys and they were over instantly. Now that was before all the tattoos and face paint and Lita and all that. I remember thinking of them as the new Rockers (not to be confused with the sham created by Marty Janetty).

Regarding the mod thing; the title is under my name, but I don't pretend to know half as much about PW as some of you.
I'm open to correction and I'm not going to ban you for disagreeing with me.
If anything, I encourage you to point out faults in my posts when it comes to facts.
The only indulgence I ask is that you recognise the difference between my opinion and fact.
I'm not likely to argue facts with anyone. My far more educated (PW wise) co-mods will do that.
Just be nice.

flahavaj

Terry wrote: »

Banned.
Nah. I'm just kidding.
I do agree with you on most parts of your post.
The only part I disagree with is on Jeff Hardy.
I remember the debut of the Hardy Boys and they were over instantly. Now that was before all the tattoos and face paint and Lita and all that. I remember thinking of them as the new Rockers (not to be confused with the sham created by Marty Janetty).

Regarding the mod thing; the title is under my name, but I don't pretend to know half as much about PW as some of you.
I'm open to correction and I'm not going to ban you for disagreeing with me.
If anything, I encourage you to point out faults in my posts when it comes to facts.
The only indulgence I ask is that you recognise the difference between my opinion and fact.
I'm not likely to argue facts with anyone. My far more educated (PW wise) co-mods will do that.
Just be nice.

I suppose my point with Hardy is that while yes he has always been over with live crowds etc, he has never been over in way that big draws like Hogan, Rock or Austin were. The difference I see between those guys and Jeff is that those guys were all spectacular talkers and were able to get themselves over with their promo cutting abilities. Whereas Jeff would need a great heel like Punk or Edge to carry the talking side of a feud as the antagonist for him to play off.

Tricity Bendix

One way of getting faces over in this new era is the Rock/Eddie route. Eddie got over as an entertaining heel who was allowed break out of the mind-numbingly stale chin-hold based wrestling that is the staple of the modern heel. He was just so entertaining, the fans demanded he turn face. Same can be said of the Rock. But even after they turned face, Eddie still cheated and The Rock still ran his mouth off. Cena just bores the hell outta me, and I want his opponent to win in every match of his that I see.

jaykhunter

Getting a bit off-topic, but I'd consider Jeff Hardy as one of those "It-Factor" wrestlers who, for some unknown reason, have a direct connection with the fans. It's an odd case of indefinable charisma. He doesn't really do anything special yet everyone is crazy about him. At least with someone like Batista, he's really over because he's a Titan-infused monster, a real-life Bane (from Batman)

Why is Jeff so popular? Maybe it's because himself and V1 never "properly" learned how to wrestle. Maybe it's because they were childhood wrestling fans, or maybe it's because he's more teenager-like rock than the other straight-laced guys. Maybe it's because he's a fu-k up...I can't explain why he's been so hot over the past two years. Maybe the crowd just latched onto him. Tripper did him no favours and he only has himself to blame for Hardy's botched runs. For a certain period this year though, he was the biggest face in the company. Doing that without being able to talk is an amazing feat.

Another with such a trait is Edge. I never understood why fans cheered him so much even in his first year, and again in 2002-onwards in his midcard stuff. His face promos we just not that great, and his wrestling wasn't either. (i'm purposely excluding his awesome E&C heel tag run) It wasn't until his main-event heel run in 2005 when I saw just how awesome his promos and wrestling can be.

waltersobchak

jaykhunter wrote: »

Getting a bit off-topic, but I'd consider Jeff Hardy as one of those "It-Factor" wrestlers who, for some unknown reason, have a direct connection with the fans. It's an odd case of indefinable charisma. He doesn't really do anything special yet everyone is crazy about him. At least with someone like Batista, he's really over because he's a Titan-infused monster, a real-life Bane (from Batman)

Why is Jeff so popular? Maybe it's because himself and V1 never "properly" learned how to wrestle. Maybe it's because they were childhood wrestling fans, or maybe it's because he's more teenager-like rock than the other straight-laced guys. Maybe it's because he's a fu-k up...I can't explain why he's been so hot over the past two years. Maybe the crowd just latched onto him. Tripper did him no favours and he only has himself to blame for Hardy's botched runs. For a certain period this year though, he was the biggest face in the company. Doing that without being able to talk is an amazing feat.

Another with such a trait is Edge. I never understood why fans cheered him so much even in his first year, and again in 2002-onwards in his midcard stuff. His face promos we just not that great, and his wrestling wasn't either. (i'm purposely excluding his awesome E&C heel tag run) It wasn't until his main-event heel run in 2005 when I saw just how awesome his promos and wrestling can be.

In my opinion, its simply because he's differant, same thing with Edge.. There really are so so many wrestlers cut from the same cloth in WWE. that when you have someone like Jeff Hardy, who you never know, what he'll do next,its unpredictable, and therefore he stands out

Red Sleeping Beauty

flahavaj wrote: »

Its interesting that in pro wrestling history, when heels have been strong truly great babyfaces are few and far between, and vice versa. Which validates the point so well made by the OP..

I can't think of many, or any points in time when there was that great heel vs. great face and it wasn't one leading the other. Austin vs. Triple H 2000/2001 came to mind but I think that was Triple H leading the way even though Austin was out for revenge for getting "run over".

I think the change in the WWF happened in 1996 when Mankind decimated the Undertaker and fans started cheering Austin (the heel). Lines were blurred and I suppose it was only a couple of years ago "balance" was restored back to good vs. bad rather than the shades of grey there was with tweeners.




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