Motorway driving

Fcukface

I know this has been done to death but something has to be done about peoples inability to drive on motorways. Is it lazyness, ignorance or just plain stupidity?

Irish people catch on fairly quick when they are in other countries, why can't they do it in their own country.

Is there anything that can be done to solve this problem? Could we get the government to have a campaign for proper motorway driving like they have for drink driving or country driving.

Could the government insist that the guards and traffic corps enforce the rules on the motorway to try and improve the standard of driving.

Anyone have any other suggestions?

alias no.9

Licensed hunting of rubberneckers, lane hoggers and tailgaters. We could market it as a tourist product without upsetting the green lobby who don't like hunting animals. Those new gantry motorway signs could double as shooting platforms.

Absurdum

Ignorance and pure pigheadedness imo, "why should I get out of the fast lane, I'm the bestest and fastest driver in the world" mentality. Or something :pac:

celticbest

alias no.9 wrote: »

Licensed hunting of rubberneckers, lane hoggers and tailgaters. We could market it as a tourist product without upsetting the green lobby who don't like hunting animals. Those new gantry motorway signs could double as shooting platforms.

It's as simple as the Gardai enforcing the current laws that are in place, the revenue that could be made for the state by simply enforcing the laws would be phenomenal for the first few months or until people cop on and start to drive correctly.

The hogging of lanes 2 and 3 on motorways is quite ridiculous in this country and if you flash somebody to get out of the way they never move! It just becomes a challenge to them to make sure you don't get by.

Fcukface

Absurdum wrote: »

Ignorance and pure pigheadedness imo, "why should I get out of the fast lane, I'm the bestest and fastest driver in the world" mentality. Or something :pac:

People thinking its a "fast lane" is another problem, they think its a lane for going fast in, its not, its for overtaking, its called an overtaking lane.

Fcukface

celticbest wrote: »

It's as simple as the Gardai enforcing the current laws that are in place, the revenue that could be made for the state by simply enforcing the laws would be phenomenal for the first few months or until people cop on and start to drive correctly.

The hogging of lanes 2 and 3 on motorways is quite ridiculous in this country and if you flash somebody to get out of the way they never move! It just becomes a challenge to them to make sure you don't get by.

I completly aggree. There would be a few million in fines the government could use to help sort this country out

celticbest

My most hated manoeuvre on a motorway is when a driver flicks on there indicator then pulls straight out in front of you, it's as if the use of the indicator clears the lane just for them.....you then have to jam on to make sure your not the one who ends up rear ending them.

If your unfortunate enough to end up in the back of the vehicle then when the Gardai arrive and see that the fool who pulled in front of you got hit from behind they automatically think it's your fault because you rear ended them. As per the rules of the road!

Fcukface

celticbest wrote: »

My most hated manoeuvre on a motorway is when a driver flicks on there indicator then pulls straight out in front of you, it's as if the use of the indicator clears the lane just for them.....you then have to jam on to make sure your not the one who ends up rear ending them.

If your unfortunate enough to end up in the back of the vehicle then when the Gardai arrive and see that the fool who pulled in front of you got hit from behind they automatically think it's your fault because you rear ended them. As per the rules of the road!

This happened to me except the guy didnt indicate, just pulled out and slammed on his breaks and I went into the back of him. All damage was to my car and nothing to his except a broken bottle of wine. He drove away happy he was ok, I was left siting on the side of the M50 with a dented front end and a bonnet that wouldnt close properly.

Stark

Fcukface wrote: »

This happened to me except the guy didnt indicate, just pulled out and slammed on his breaks and I went into the back of him. All damage was to my car and nothing to his except a broken bottle of wine. He drove away happy he was ok, I was left siting on the side of the M50 with a dented front end and a bonnet that wouldnt close properly.

Did you get his reg?

Fcukface

Stark wrote: »

Did you get his reg?

We stopped and exchanged insurance but I know if I went to court over it he would have won, I hit him and it would have been my word against his.

craichoe

celticbest wrote: »

My most hated manoeuvre on a motorway is when a driver flicks on there indicator then pulls straight out in front of you, it's as if the use of the indicator clears the lane just for them.....you then have to jam on to make sure your not the one who ends up rear ending them.

If your unfortunate enough to end up in the back of the vehicle then when the Gardai arrive and see that the fool who pulled in front of you got hit from behind they automatically think it's your fault because you rear ended them. As per the rules of the road!

Common practise in the Netherlands.

Very well bahaved on the German Autobahn, mainly because there could be a 100km/h difference in speed between you in the fast lane doing 120 and the guy in the Overtaking lane doing 220.

Problem i've seen is a queue of cars on the road in Ireland ... i.e. a queue of at least 10 - 15 cars all wanting the f*cker in his way to get out of it in the overtaking lane and me sitting in the left lane all by myself. The mentality being if they go in they won't get back out.

hobochris

Fcukface wrote: »

We stopped and exchanged insurance but I know if I went to court over it he would have won, I hit him and it would have been my word against his.

Its for this reason I'd be tempted to fit a camera to my car.

celticbest

hobochris wrote: »

Its for this reason I'd be tempted to fit a camera to my car.

That sounds like a good idea but would it stand up in court??.... Is video evidence allowed in court??

alias no.9

celticbest wrote: »

It's as simple as the Gardai enforcing the current laws that are in place, the revenue that could be made for the state by simply enforcing the laws would be phenomenal for the first few months or until people cop on and start to drive correctly.

The hogging of lanes 2 and 3 on motorways is quite ridiculous in this country and if you flash somebody to get out of the way they never move! It just becomes a challenge to them to make sure you don't get by.

For fear you were taking me too literally, the point is that if there was a real possibility of detecting bad behaviour and consequences for the perpetrator, you will quickly see a change in that behaviour.
I wouldn't really advocate the killing of other human beings for sport.

Paulj

Couldn't those new electonic signs that you see on some motorways (eg. m50) be used to occasionally display reminder messages such as: "Keep to left lane unless overtaking" or something to that effect??

Or else just put up some regular stationary signs on motors that says the same thing. I really believe for most people they just don't understand the way its meant to work. And because the vast majority of people seem to be in that category it breeds ignorance in new drivers. After all, its not tested in the driving test. It may come up in a theory question but even then new drivers may not understand how it's meant to work in practice.

Of course it should be introduced in a the driving test too ...

celticbest

Paulj wrote: »

Couldn't those new electonic signs that you see on some motorways (eg. m50) be used to occasionally display reminder messages such as: "Keep to left lane unless overtaking" or something to that effect??

Or else just put up some regular stationary signs on motors that says the same thing. I really believe for most people they just don't understand the way its meant to work. And because the vast majority of people seem to be in that category it breeds ignorance in new drivers. After all, its not tested in the driving test. It may come up in a theory question but even then new drivers may not understand how it's meant to work in practice.

Of course it should be introduced in a the driving test too ...

With the new style Gantry signs on the M50 there is space on each of these to put up electronic signs over each lane, these could be installed and used to supply correct driving information eg, lanes 2 & 3 for overtaking only.

jungleboy

It just seems crazy to me that you can get a driving license without having to drive on the motorway, it is after all one of the most dangerous places to drive?

alias no.9

jungleboy wrote: »

It just seems crazy to me that you can get a driving license without having to drive on the motorway, it is after all one of the most dangerous places to drive?

You are much less likely to be involved in a crash on a motorway. When crashes do happen, they tend to be very serious. Overall, they are much safer per mile driven on them.

Paulj

jungleboy wrote: »

It just seems crazy to me that you can get a driving license without having to drive on the motorway, it is after all one of the most dangerous places to drive?

I guess the main problem is that not everywhere in the country has motorways, and to ensure the test is fair for everyone they must all be tested in the same way.

They should introduce a 2nd stage of the test whereby you'd have to travel to somewhere that you can be tested for motorway driving.

DonJose

Fcukface wrote: »

Is there anything that can be done to solve this problem?

The best way to start would be to copy a driving license system that works, like Germany, so many hours in a class and driving lessons with a qualified driving instructor. We need to scrap the learner permit and only allow people drive who have passed the test. Its beyond a joke when a person who fails a driving test is allowed to drive home, WTF!!!

R.O.R

Paulj wrote: »

Couldn't those new electonic signs that you see on some motorways (eg. m50) be used to occasionally display reminder messages such as: "Keep to left lane unless overtaking" or something to that effect??

Nah, too busy displaying much more important messages such as:
Sign under test (M50 southbound at Red Cow for about 3 weeks now)
Caution Fog
"Drogheda 19
Dundalk 25" (GAA Scores??? :P)

Mossy Monk

jungleboy wrote: »

It just seems crazy to me that you can get a driving license without having to drive on the motorway, it is after all one of the most dangerous places to drive?

No provisional licence holders are allowed on a motorway.

jungleboy

I know that, but when you do a test for a full licence you don't have to travel on a motorway to pass!

Alanstrainor

Mossy Monk wrote: »

No provisional licence holders are allowed on a motorway.

I don't think that was the point. The point is that you can sit a test that does not cover any motorway driving, and after passing jump out onto a motorway without a clue of how they work.

corktina

jungleboy wrote: »

I know that, but when you do a test for a full licence you don't have to travel on a motorway to pass!

that is quite daft isnt it!

The safest roads barred to the most inexperianced drivers....who then (when they pass a test) get a license to travel on them having never done so.... possibly a newly qualified fdriver should be required to take an hours instruction on the Mway with a qualified Instructor before their new license is ratified.

Fcukface

I like the motorway signs idea, that could work.

The point about provisional drivers not being allowed drive on the motorway does not stop them. I work with people who are on provisional licences and they drive to work everyday on the M50, these people definitly don't know how to drive on a motorway.

Their should defintily be a motorway section to the driving test and manditory classes would be very benificial, but are the government going to pay for this now in the current climate.

I don't think its fair to say the the current driving test dosn't take motorway driving into consideration because allot of people in Ireland won't use motorways. Even if you use a motorway once in your life it should still be part of the test, its a part of driving. Most people in Ireland will never have to use the hand signals to indicate where they are going but we still have to know them and we are still tested on them.

Heroditas

Fcukface wrote: »

Their should defintily be a motorway section to the driving test and manditory classes would be very benificial, but are the government going to pay for this now in the current climate.

Make the student pay for it!

Fcukface

Heroditas wrote: »

Make the student pay for it!

Good idea, and another way for the government to make money

jungleboy

maybe the insurance companies should be made to pay?

Fcukface

jungleboy wrote: »

maybe the insurance companies should be made to pay?

It could be considered a good investment for them, if they paid to educate their clients they may save on paying for claims for accidents caused by bad drivers.

rohatch

DonJose wrote: »

The best way to start would be to copy a driving license system that works, like Germany, so many hours in a class and driving lessons with a qualified driving instructor. We need to scrap the learner permit and only allow people drive who have passed the test. Its beyond a joke when a person who fails a driving test is allowed to drive home, WTF!!!

I had some German friends in 92 and they said it was 50 hours compulsory training, it costs about 1,000 euros all up.

We should do at least 30 hours here, the standard of driving is awful, and the condition of our roads just makes it even worse.

1st 10 hours in a sealed car park. Then an assessment to see if you are ready for the road. Then 15 hours on the back roads graduating to larger more built up roads. A competency test to see if you are ready to sit the driving test followed by another 5 hours after you pass your test with at least 3 hours on motorways.

Mossy Monk wrote: »

No provisional licence holders are allowed on a motorway.

Its crazy. If they do go on a motorway unaccompanied .. and have an accident the are still covered by their insurance. Thats the 1st problem.
2nd problem is we need the Gardai to enforce the laws that we have already, and the 3rd problem is we need to speed up the court process.

L1011

R.O.R wrote: »

"Drogheda 19
Dundalk 25" (GAA Scores??? :P)

Tsk, you can tell the Englishman not understanding how GAA scores work

testarossa40

Paulj wrote: »

Couldn't those new electonic signs that you see on some motorways (eg. m50) be used to occasionally display reminder messages such as: "Keep to left lane unless overtaking" or something to that effect??

Or else just put up some regular stationary signs on motors that says the same thing. I really believe for most people they just don't understand the way its meant to work. And because the vast majority of people seem to be in that category it breeds ignorance in new drivers. After all, its not tested in the driving test. It may come up in a theory question but even then new drivers may not understand how it's meant to work in practice.

Of course it should be introduced in a the driving test too ...

I too made this very suggestion over on a thread over on the Commuting & Transport forum & suggested we start a campaign. Since then I've emailed the RSA (researchdept@rsa.ie; info@rsa.ie), AA (publicaffairs@aaireland.ie) & NRA M50 (coz that's my daily commute - https://www.nratraffic.ie/m50/pages/feedback.asp?schemename=n4ballymount).

No reply as yet from the NRA, and, the AA & RSA replied with "Yeah whatever, now PFO"-type scripted responses :mad:.

Maybe if more of us did the same they might bother doing something useful for a change?

Paulj

very good, i just sent RSA a mail there also. Will send a few more tomorrow!

corktina

MYOB wrote: »

Tsk, you can tell the Englishman not understanding how GAA scores work

we dont care how they work either...:D

celticbest

rohatch wrote: »

Its crazy. If they do go on a motorway unaccompanied .. and have an accident the are still covered by their insurance. Thats the 1st problem.2nd problem is we need the Gardai to enforce the laws that we have already, and the 3rd problem is we need to speed up the court process.

My sister-in-law was hit by a provisional driver coming off the M1 last year(on a slip road), the insurance company paid for the damage to my sister-in-laws car but did not pay out on the provisional driver.

The Gardai were following up on the provisional driver as they were on a motorway with only a provisional licence, as far as I know they were pressing charges against her on a few technicalities eg, driving on a motorway, driving unaccompanied, I'd say a few penalty points and having to pay for the damage to her own car thought her a lesson and I'd say her insurance would have gone through the roof !

twistyj

what gets me is people driving at about 100k in the overtaking and staying there!

Pedro K

twistyj wrote: »

what gets me is people driving at about 100k in the overtaking and staying there!

Or worse, the poeple doing 120 in the overtaking lane...

"I'm doing the speed limit so you can wait behind me"

Get the **** out of the overtaking lane if you aint overtaking!

wyrn

Pedro K wrote: »

Or worse, the poeple doing 120 in the overtaking lane...

"I'm doing the speed limit so you can wait behind me"

Get the **** out of the overtaking lane if you aint overtaking!

What's wrong with people doing the speed limit in the overtaking lane? (as long as the move back in at the earliest opportunity)
There seems to be an increase garda checks on the motorways at the moment.

What gets me is that I follow the speed limit in the left lane and occasional I overtake a vehicle that's doing less than ~105 km/h and then someone booting it up the right lane gets impatient while I overtake. Now I try to judge if those people who stick in the right lane and speeding so I'll let them pass before overtaking. The sheer amount of impatience of drivers towards the drivers who are following the rules of the road (not talking about drivers who drivers at 60 km/h on the motorway).

Stark

wyrn wrote: »

What's wrong with people doing the speed limit in the overtaking lane? (as long as the move back in at the earliest opportunity)

It's fine when you move in when you have a chance. It's the dolts who sit there indefinitely, creating a tailback that traps anyone who tries to use the driving lane correctly and effectively reducing the road to a one-lane road that are the problem.

wyrn

Stark wrote: »

It's fine when you move in when you have a chance. It's the dolts who sit there indefinitely, creating a tailback that traps anyone who tries to use the driving lane correctly and effectively reducing the road to a one-lane road that are the problem.

Oh I completely agree with that. It's the ones who think it's their right to drive in the right land >120 km/h the whole way up. They really irk me.

I always move back in as soon as possible after overtaking, but sometimes feel a bit under pressure to speed to move back in so the driver behind can speed away.

TestTransmission

Fcukface wrote: »

Good idea, and another way for the government to make money

Now you're thinking

Pedro K

wyrn wrote: »

Oh I completely agree with that. It's the ones who think it's their right to drive in the right land >120 km/h the whole way up. They really irk me.

That's what I meant.

Hence my comment, Get out of the overtaking lane if you aren't overtaking.

rohatch

Pedro K wrote: »

Get out of the overtaking lane if you aren't overtaking.

Someone should make this as a banner and hang it off the bridges

celticbest

dolanbaker wrote: »

This section is still two lanes, but this muppet tried to open up a third one. (M50 Edmondstown)

Hows about this bit of driving as posted on a different thread by dolanbaker.:eek:

munchkin_utd

The best i saw was a lad doing the 120kmh on the busy section of the M7 leaving Dublin with a small trailer attached bouncing all over the place.

On the continent every trailer has to have its own version of the NCT and even then 80 is the max unless you have a specially designed trailer that is fit for 100!
When I first heard this I though its german bureauracy gone wrong.

Thing is though, if that trailer for any reason hops off its coupling on the motorway, it stops DEAD pretty much on the spot, and the person behind hits it at full motorway speed possibly causing a motorway pileup.
How does the lad know that his suspension in the trailer is fit for 120 before bouncing violently (or 100 or 140 or what is it actually fit for???? Maybe warp speed is the official design limit!!).
How can he guarantee that his trailer WONT hop off at 120kmh, or is the plan to have a go and find out the hard way?

Of course, untested, uncertified trailers dont hop off their coupling in Ireland so hurtling down the road at 120 with a rickety trailer is perfectly safe and ok.

I think theres going to have to be accidents and deaths before Ireland actually clamps down on stupidity on the motorways, rickety trailers at colossal speeds being one point to sort out.

Del2005

munchkin_utd wrote: »

The best i saw was a lad doing the 120kmh on the busy section of the M7 leaving Dublin with a small trailer attached bouncing all over the place.

On the continent every trailer has to have its own version of the NCT and even then 80 is the max unless you have a specially designed trailer that is fit for 100!
When I first heard this I though its german bureauracy gone wrong.

Any vehicle towing a trailer here is restricted to 80km/h.

Thing is though, if that trailer for any reason hops off its coupling on the motorway, it stops DEAD pretty much on the spot, and the person behind hits it at full motorway speed possibly causing a motorway pileup.
How does the lad know that his suspension in the trailer is fit for 120 before bouncing violently (or 100 or 140 or what is it actually fit for???? Maybe warp speed is the official design limit!!).
How can he guarantee that his trailer WONT hop off at 120kmh, or is the plan to have a go and find out the hard way?

Of course, untested, uncertified trailers dont hop off their coupling in Ireland so hurtling down the road at 120 with a rickety trailer is perfectly safe and ok.

I think theres going to have to be accidents and deaths before Ireland actually clamps down on stupidity on the motorways, rickety trailers at colossal speeds being one point to sort out.

There are currently no tests for car trailers here but our DOE for HGV trailers isn't up to scratch anyway. It took the UK police to tell us our HGV's where dangerous.

Don't forget that if the person behind hits the trailer then it's partially their fault, you shouldn't be driving so close, what would happen if a car ahead suddenly stopped dead in the road?

Mc Love

Was on the N7 just before you come to M7 heading south and there was an absolute dick driving a Honda Accord. Was behind me since red cow and then when passed Bewleys you could see him trying to get past going from the rhl to the middle lane to the lhl and back again, in and out like a fecking yo yo.

He even tried following a boy racer but that wasnt good enough. So stuck behind a truck in the middle lane and trying to get in rhl he put on his indicator and practically pushed his way in front of me, there wasnt even any space, just went over the white lines (knew he was going to do it) and i fecking blew him out of it. I never have had to use my car horn with so much force before, even turned on my full beams - yer man couldnt give a crap - just kept going!

Never seen the like of it ever before!

Stark

People wouldn't have to do that to make progress if everyone else bothered to keep left. What's a truck doing in the middle lane for instance?

Mc Love

Heavy traffic, and yeah a truck shouldnt be in the middle

Del2005

Mc Love wrote: »

Heavy traffic, and yeah a truck shouldnt be in the middle

The truck has as much right to be in the middle lane as anyone else on the road. The only place they can't go is the outer lane of a 120km/h motorway.