Question about MPG for an upcoming LONG trip

Berty

So next year Im driving to the South West of France and have 2 questions about MPG.

1. Why is it MPG when we use Kilometres(pedantic pat moment)?

2. Im considering driving either from North Tipp through Dublin-Holyhead-Folkestone(Tunnel)-Calais to South West France as it appears to be the "fastest" and generally ALL motorway driving.

I assume this would be the best option for MPG because I can keep a constant speed for the most part without a lot of up and down speeds, stopping and starting on the Rosslare-Fishguard-Swansea(joining motorway) and onwards to Folkestone.

The Rosslare journey is actually only 31kms shorter than the Holyhead route anyway BUT

Which is the best option for MPG. For me my understanding of MPG is that keeping my windows closed, the air con off and no driving it hard will keep a comfortable MPG.

BTW I am NOT considering the Rosslare/Cork to France ferry because it costs many many many €€€€€€€€€'s :mad:

robbie_998

not sure how to work out your mpg's, sat nav does it all.

but for your route it would be shorter and im not sure but could be cheaper to go rosslare to france. no real point in going by boat and paying more €€€'s and then having to pay even more €€€'s for another train or boat depending on what you choose.

Greenman

Where in SW France?

Captain Slow IRL

http://www.accommodationz.co.nz/economycalculator.html

Owen

I'd recommend the Cork Ferry - even if it is more expensive, surely travelling through the UK and having another water crossing between the UK & France is going to even it out?

Berty

robbie_998 wrote: »

not sure how to work out your mpg's, sat nav does it all.

My current car does not work out MPG. My current Sat Nav does not work out MPG either.

robbie_998 wrote: »

but for your route it would be shorter and im not sure but could be cheaper to go rosslare to france. no real point in going by boat and paying more €€€'s and then having to pay even more €€€'s for another train or boat depending on what you choose.

Rosslare - France is €950
Cork to France is €1280

Irl - France through the UK is €605 which includes two hotels and a tank of diesel and all ferries and tunnel for a return trip.

Rosslare although cheaper is still too damned expensive.

Greenman wrote: »

Where in SW France?

Les Mathes region of the Royan

Berty

PaintDoctor wrote: »

I'd recommend the Cork Ferry - even if it is more expensive, surely travelling through the UK and having another water crossing between the UK & France is going to even it out?

See ^^^^^

Its all down to what kind of MPG per each route I can get now.

unkel

When in France, sticking to Route Nationals rather than Autoroutes will save you a lot more money (in tolls) than trying to drive economically!

Berty wrote: »

keeping my windows closed, the air con off

G'luck with that if your trip is in the summer

Berty

unkel wrote: »

When in France, sticking to Route Nationals rather than Autoroutes will save you a lot more money (in tolls) than trying to drive economically!

The trip from Calais to the first campsite will cost €42.15 each way in Tolls and if I use the M6 Toll around Birmingham it costs £4.50 each way.

unkel wrote: »

G'luck with that if your trip is in the summer

I might try the Jeremy Clarkson Chevy Camaro option of putting a shower head with a water pump above my head.

Mailman

If you are able to sleep while on the Ferry, take the direct Ireland/France route.
Burn someone else's fuel not your own.
Depending on the Ferry you take you might find facilities to keep yourself amused.
I watched Star Trek, the only one in the Cinema on the ferry from Wales a few months ago.
Only go via the UK if there is sight-seeing you want to do en route. Make a proper road trip of it or else just go direct.
The traffic around London is hell even when you are on Motorway.

Berty

Mailman wrote: »

If you are able to sleep while on the Ferry, take the direct Ireland/France route.
Burn someone else's fuel not your own.
Depending on the Ferry you take you might find facilities to keep yourself amused.
I watched Star Trek, the only one in the Cinema on the ferry from Wales a few months ago.
Only go via the UK if there is sight-seeing you want to do en route. Make a proper road trip of it or else just go direct.
The traffic around London is hell even when you are on Motorway.

I love driving. I hate paying over the odds for services. Brittany ferries direct to France and Irish Ferries direct to France are thieving b*starts for High Season and the price of cabins is close to extortion. :mad:

Use somebody elses fuel? Sure Im paying for it in their highly inflated prices anyway so they can go to hell unless they reduce their prices to at least €600 return.

EDIT Sleep on the Ferry, SLEEP? When you book the cheapest cabin at €98 each way in High Season you are pitted in with all the screaming babies and basically tracing paper for walls between you. OR you can upgrade to their better cabins(different sheets and a window and 14" tv) for extortionate money!

amacachi

Depending on your car somewhere between 80-110 km/h would be optimal for MPG. Get that right before you worry about AC or having a window open, especially if you're going to be doing it in summer.

Mailman

Berty wrote: »

I love driving. I hate paying over the odds for services. Brittany ferries direct to France and Irish Ferries direct to France are thieving b*starts for High Season and the price of cabins is close to extortion. :mad:

Use somebody elses fuel? Sure Im paying for it in their highly inflated prices anyway so they can go to hell unless they reduce their prices to at least €600 return.

EDIT Sleep on the Ferry, SLEEP? When you book the cheapest cabin at €98 each way in High Season you are pitted in with all the screaming babies and basically tracing paper for walls between you. OR you can upgrade to their better cabins(different sheets and a window and 14" tv) for extortionate money!

Your choice. I'd prefer to fly and hire a car for the duration of the trip. Driving through UK would be my last option unless I could break up the journey.

Berty

Mailman wrote: »

Your choice. I'd prefer to fly and hire a car for the duration of the trip. Driving through UK would be my last option unless I could break up the journey.

True and I have had that argument with many people including my boss who went for 6 nights this year with his family all only bringing carry on luggage.

The flight is very restrictive with how much you can bring and the car hire is an added annoyance as well. I would prefer to be able to bring my cooler box, own duvet and pillows and bring back lots of beer and wine as well.

I grew up going to France every year with 2 adults and three kids direct and through the UK so for me as an adult now I am trying to replicate those years except for my fathers incesent smoking and REM/Cat Stevens tape playing on a loop.

Im also planning on picking up a mountain bike in the UK on my way there which is around €150 cheaper than buying it here.

L1011

PaintDoctor wrote: »

I'd recommend the Cork Ferry - even if it is more expensive, surely travelling through the UK and having another water crossing between the UK & France is going to even it out?

Realistically, not a chance.

Unless you are actually going to Brittany, its cheaper and FAR quicker to landbridge it over Britain. I'd argue it could be quicker and possibly cheaper to drive to Roscoff via Holyhead and the tunnel at times...

Holyhead ferry = 200 euro return, or less depending how far in advance you book it. Tunnel can be done for under £100 return. I used £40 of petrol getting from Holyhead to Folkestone last time. Rosslare->France was about 500 euro return at the time.

You spend upwards of 12 to NINETEEN HOURS route dependent on what is basically a glorified airport with bunk beds (for more money again). Expensive food, expensive drink (that you can't risk taking), a 'cinema' that's more like watching a big TV with old films. Never again.

Summer time when the fast cat's can run reliably on the Holyhead route and theres a channel tunnel ever 20mins - and you can turn up and go up to 2 hours before your booked time, no questions asked - spending the best part of a day on a cruise ferry becomes insanity.

edit: I've never priced going via Cork before, but a random date in April is 362 euro return for a car+driver, 562 euro return for a car+driver with a cabin. :eek:

killbillvol2

Surely it makes more sense to go Rosslare-Fishguard than Dublin-Holyhead? Much easier drive through Wales to the South East.

Absurdum

Berty wrote: »

if I use the M6 Toll around Birmingham it costs £4.50 each way.

the tolled motorway is empty, well worth it imo

JHMEG

Departing from Rosslare or Dublin/Dun Laoghaire is usually the same price, in which case I'd go from Rosslare if heading from Tipp.

Downside is the roads from Tipp to Rosslare are poor (especially in Wexford) compared to M7 to Dublin. Upside is hundreds of miles of free motorway on the UK side.

Temptation on the motorway is to drive at the limit. Depending on the car this will hammer MPG, and moreso if it's a smaller engined car. 90km/h is probably about the optimal speed for economy.

Controversially driving behind an articulated lorry has a very positive effect on fuel economy, and you don't have to drive too close to make a noticeable difference. Also inflate your tyres to say 40 psi. You won't notice any decrease in comfort on the motorway.

Berty

I have the routes priced already as much as I can possibly. In the next few weeks Irish Ferries, Stena Line and Brittany Ferries should be releasing their prices for Landbridge. At the moment all you can do is get a price from Irish Ferries from Ireland to the UK and from the UK to France I can get Sea France(Dover), Brittany(Poole and Portsmouth), Condor(Poole), Celtic Ferries(Portsmouth), and Eurotunnel.

Using my dates in JUNE Out, July Return I am getting

Using Irish Ferries and Eurotunnel = €397 Return excl accomodation and fuel

Using Irish Ferries and Brittany Ferries €601 Return excluding accomodation and fuel

Using Irish Ferries direct = €950 Return

Using Brittany Ferries direct = €1280 Return

Guess which one is currently winning?

That is what provoked my question on MPG.

Also I live around 5kms off the new M7 Motorway in North Tipp so it would be easier to use this to Dublin rather than drive south along the N24 towards Rosslare.

I wouldn't actually meet a motorway until I hit Swansea if I take the Rosslare-Fishguard/Pembroke direction which could have an adverse affect on my fuel. However, I would also miss the M6 Toll meaning I would not have to pay the £4.50

However again, I would have to pay the £5.40 when using it. Except the toll is payable only one way whereas the M6 Toll is payable in both directions.

I could use the M6(non toll) but the traffic is renowned to be busier, hence the building of the M6 Toll.

Marlow

killbillvol2 wrote: »

Surely it makes more sense to go Rosslare-Fishguard than Dublin-Holyhead? Much easier drive through Wales to the South East.

Holyhead is also Wales.

Downside of going via South Wales (Fishguard) is that you'll have a toll bridge (5+ £ each way) and the roads aren't as good as out of Holyhead. Same on the irish side. The roads are pretty crap.

So I recommend Dun Laoghaire or Dublin to Holyhead.

Now, for the tunnel, it costs more than twice compared to the ferry Dover->Calais. Tunnel takes 35 minutes (excluding loading/offloading), ferry takes 90 minutes and they go every 60-90 minutes. If you pre-book the ferry you get it even cheaper.

Take Irish Ferries out of Dublin, book a cabin, so you get a few hours sleep, oh and book Club Class. It costs like 15 EUR, but you get free coffee, snacks, juice and a nice seat for the money and honestly, 15 EUR = 2 coffees.

I do the same trip at least once a year going to Denmark and I don't like being stuck on a ferry for 17 hours. Did that once (Rosslare -> Cherbourgh), never again. Not my thing.

The trip through the UK is easy, nice scenery and well worth it. You can stop for food etc. whenever you like it.

As for your MPG question. There's various ways to measure it: MPG, km/l og l/100 km. I guess everybody sticks with what they are used to.

Hope it helps.

/M

BDW

If you are going via england i'd reccomend trying to get a late ferry from rosslare to fishguard.
Yes there is no motorway till you get to swansea, but depending on what times they are running, if you can get a late one there is very little traffic all the way to london.

If you drive during the night, the motorway from swansea is pretty much empty and I'd reckon you could get past london before traffic starts building for the morning rush hour...

Berty

Marlow wrote: »

Holyhead is also Wales.

Downside of going via South Wales (Fishguard) is that you'll have a toll bridge (5+ £ each way) and the roads aren't as good as out of Holyhead.

So I recommend Dun Laoghaire or Dublin to Holyhead. Same on the irish side. The roads are pretty crap.

Marlow wrote: »

Now, for the tunnel, it costs more than twice compared to the ferry Dover->Calais. Tunnel takes 35 minutes (excluding loading/offloading), ferry takes 90 minutes and they go every 60-90 minutes. If you pre-book the ferry you get it even cheaper.

The Tunnel is costing €154 Return at 8:00am ish. Cheaper at 6:00am but I cannot be a*rsed getting up for that. It is only 35 minutes and the ferry is much longer but then again much cheaper. I could book Sea France for £17 each way but I actually want to get the Tunnel. €154 return is still good value as far as I am concerned for where its get you, your car, two adults and a bike.

Imagine it though £17 each way on a friggin ferry. How much does a return trip on a bus in this country cost FFS?

Marlow wrote: »

Take Irish Ferries out of Dublin, book a cabin, so you get a few hours sleep, oh and book Club Class. It costs like 15 EUR, but you get free coffee, snacks, juice and a nice seat for the money and honestly, 15 EUR = 2 coffees.

Now €18 but of course it includes Express boarding which is friggin great when arriving into the UK. Im not too bothered about getting it back but for the free newspaper and beverages I will spend the extra few quid.

Marlow wrote: »

The trip through the UK is easy, nice scenery and well worth it. You can stop for food etc. whenever you like it.

True which is the major plus point, also the chance of stopping off in Bluewater shopping centre off the M25 is also a bonus. Im going to get my car valeted whilst. £7 for a wash and wax. The same here is €20!!

Overly organised!

Marlow wrote: »

As for your MPG question. There's various ways to measure it: MPG, km/l og l/100 km. I guess everybody sticks with what they are used to.

Im sure I will have a trip computer in my new car if I "do" actually move job in Jan. If not then my "current" employer is going to upgrade my car in April. Who knows, it might even have a trip computer.

I currently have a 06 Audi A4 where EVERYTHING is an extra. Thank god they have mended their ways a bit.

Marlow

BDW wrote: »

If you are going via england i'd reccomend trying to get a late ferry from rosslare to fishguard.
Yes there is no motorway till you get to swansea, but depending on what times they are running, if you can get a late one there is very little traffic all the way to london.

If you drive during the night, the motorway from swansea is pretty much empty and I'd reckon you could get past london before traffic starts building for the morning rush hour...

I'd agree on the night driving bit, but honestly, last ferry out of Dublin with Irish Ferries is 20:55, that arrives in Holyhead by 00:20, take 5-6 hours max from that before you pass London and you won't see rushhour. Brings you into the harbour in Dover or to the train around 8-9am, easy.

/M

testicle

Marlow wrote: »

Downside of going via South Wales (Fishguard) is that you'll have a toll bridge (5+ £ each way) and the roads aren't as good as out of Holyhead. Same on the irish side. The roads are pretty crap.

Severn Bridges? They're only tolled in one direction (towards Wales)

Berty

BDW wrote: »

If you are going via england i'd reccomend trying to get a late ferry from rosslare to fishguard.
Yes there is no motorway till you get to swansea, but depending on what times they are running, if you can get a late one there is very little traffic all the way to london.

If you drive during the night, the motorway from swansea is pretty much empty and I'd reckon you could get past london before traffic starts building for the morning rush hour...

I had considered getting the late ferry arriving in to Fishguard/Pembroke at 12:30am and jumping into the nearest Travelodge going shopping for the day in Cardiff and travelling to Folkestone,Poole,Pembroke and staying another night having a few pints and getting the early train or ferry to France.

I had also considered arriving in at 12:30am and driving straight through to Folkestone and getting the Train, arriving into France and driving all the way to the campsite.

Then I realised I would possibly DIE!

testicle

The important question, that no one has asked when advising to go Cork/Rosslare/Dublin/Dun Laoghaire etc is where you're starting from!

If you live in Dublin, you're hardly going to go to Cork or Rosslare!

Marlow

testicle wrote: »

Severn Bridges? They're only tolled in one direction (towards Wales)

Ah. That could be. Funny bit, I only use Holyhead outbound and Fishguard on the return due to the way the ferry times are working out, so I would never have noticed

And yes, it was the Severn Valley Bridge I was referring to.

/M

Marlow

testicle wrote: »

If you live in Dublin, you're hardly going to go to Cork or Rosslare!

Why not ? I was using Rosslare when the times suited better and I lived in Dublin. Still, not to go to France, but only to go via the UK.

/M

Berty

testicle wrote: »

The important question, that no one has asked when advising to go Cork/Rosslare/Dublin/Dun Laoghaire etc is where you're starting from!

If you live in Dublin, you're hardly going to go to Cork or Rosslare!

If you read back through the thread you will see copious references to North Tipperary.

So its either or. Dublin Port from my house is 205k and Rosslare is 189km from my house.

No Major differenc there.

Holyhead to Folkestone is 365miles whereas Fishguard to Folkestone is 331miles.

So no major differences between each but the longer routes are mostly motorways which "should" provide a better return on the diesel.

Marlow

Berty wrote: »

The Tunnel is costing €154 Return at 8:00am ish. Cheaper at 6:00am but I cannot be a*rsed getting up for that. It is only 35 minutes and the ferry is much longer but then again much cheaper. I could book Sea France for £17 each way but I actually want to get the Tunnel. €154 return is still good value as far as I am concerned for where its get you, your car, two adults and a bike.

Imagine it though £17 each way on a friggin ferry. How much does a return trip on a bus in this country cost FFS?

I think I usually end up around £40 because I don't prebook, still half the price of the tunnel. The ferry is 90 minutes, only just about enough to relax a wee bit and drink some coffee, but if it is, like you said, that you want to take the train/tunnel, then so be it. Money isn't everything, after all, it's holidays and you want some experiences out of it, too.

Berty wrote: »

Now €18 but of course it includes Express boarding which is friggin great when arriving into the UK. Im not too bothered about getting it back but for the free newspaper and beverages I will spend the extra few quid.

Correct. Express boarding, free beverages, snacks, newspaper, a reserved seat. Pretty decent for the money.

/M

Marlow

Berty wrote: »

If you read back through the thread you will see copious references to North Tipperary.

So its either or. Dublin Port from my house is 205k and Rosslare is 189km from my house.

No Major differenc there.

Holyhead to Folkestone is 365miles whereas Fishguard to Folkestone is 331miles.

So no major differences between each but the longer routes are mostly motorways which "should" provide a better return on the diesel.

You really want to use Dublin or Dun Laoghaire port so. The trip from North Tipp to Rosslare is somewhat ..... *********** ...

Much more hassle free on both the irish and UK side and yes, you get better fuel economy out of the trip, because it's mostly motorways. There are also less chances for getting "lost"

/M

Berty

The price of the Fast Craft from Dun Laoighre is the exact same price(to the cent) as the Fastcraft(smaller) from Rosslare so truly it is either or.

There is no point asking "herself" because she is a procrastinator. :rolleyes:

Stenaline e-mailed me a few days back to say their prices for 2010(post Jan) will be released by the 3rd week in December.

And again, Fastnet(Cork - Swansea) said their prices will be released next week hopefully.

Marlow

Never used the Cork one, but Irish Ferries always turns out cheaper than Stenaline I'm afraid and recently I also find that the customer service is better on Irish Ferries.

The only thing Stena Line has going for them is wireless broadband while you're at sea. Dead handy for doing some work, however, when I'm on holidays, that's not what I need.

/M

BigEejit

Just in relation to the traffic into and around London ...

From 6am lots of traffic going into london on the M4 from the west (heaviest where it meets the M25).
On the south side of the M25 itself the traffic is usually busiest (i.e. stopped) going clockwise in the morning and anticlockwise in the afternoon/evening.
The M20 down to Folkstone/Dover is usually trouble free except when the french ferry workers/dock workers go on strike, when that happens the M20 is closed to cars and they use the inside and outside lanes as truck parking (operation stack as they call it). When that happens take the A21 to Hastings and take the coast road to the ferry/chunnel.

If you come onto the M25 from the north and travel across the north of london you will pass over the qe2 bridge that is tolled (£1.50)

BigEejit

Berty wrote: »

And again, Fastnet(Cork - Swansea) said their prices will be released next week hopefully.

If you have kids avoid the Cork - Swansea ferry .... from UK to Cork is fine as it is nighttime and so sleep all the way, coming back is all freaking day ... with bored kids and shagall to do.

Berty

BigEejit wrote: »

If you have kids avoid the Cork - Swansea ferry .... from UK to Cork is fine as it is nighttime and so sleep all the way, coming back is all freaking day ... with bored kids and shagall to do.

Not anymore, the service has not restarted yet but here is a link to the proposed timetable.

http://www.fastnetline.com/prices.html

Both legs would be overnight however I have no aversion to heading out on one route and back on another route.

I.e Dublin - Holyhead - Folkestone - Calais - Cherbourg - Poole - Fishguard - Rosslare - Home

Cork - Swansea - Folkestone - Calais - Calais - Folkestone - Swansea - Cork - Home

or many other possibilities.

BigEejit

I didnt know that, might consider using them in that case

Quazzie

Apologies if I've missed it but how come no one has mentioned the Rosslare to Pembroke Route? Its a route I've used before on numerous occasions and one that has always got me into London very early morning thus avoiding most of the heavy traffic.

Marlow

Quazzie wrote: »

Apologies if I've missed it but how come no one has mentioned the Rosslare to Pembroke Route? Its a route I've used before on numerous occasions and one that has always got me into London very early morning thus avoiding most of the heavy traffic.

Rosslare -> Pembroke would be Irish Ferries, while Rosslare -> Fishguard is Stena Line, so depending on what Bertie goes for price wise and if he takes Rosslare, that would be automatically the choice. Not much of a difference going to Fishguard or Pembroke, only pricing.

/M

Greenman

I've travelled Plymouth/Santander it was a lovely cruise. Just a thought, then travel up to your destination:):):)

Quazzie

Does Pembrioke not get you onto the Motorway, or at least A-Class road a lot earlier.

Google maps has the journey being 15 minutes quicker. From memory I've always set the cruise control not too far outside Pembroke and not touched it till we got to London.

corkswansea

BigEejit wrote: »

If you have kids avoid the Cork - Swansea ferry .... from UK to Cork is fine as it is nighttime and so sleep all the way, coming back is all freaking day ... with bored kids and shagall to do.

Hi,

Just to let you know Cork/Swansea sailings will be night time sailings at 21:00. There will be extra daytime sailings from mid July & all Aug.

Pat O Neill

Fastnet Line

Berty

Quazzie wrote: »

Does Pembrioke not get you onto the Motorway, or at least A-Class road a lot earlier.

Google maps has the journey being 15 minutes quicker. From memory I've always set the cruise control not too far outside Pembroke and not touched it till we got to London.

The connection to the Motorway from Pembroke is better than the connection from Fishguard, this is true from the looks of it.

It was in the early 90's the last time I was on these roads so Im sure a lot has changed.

corkswansea wrote: »

Hi,

Just to let you know Cork/Swansea sailings will be night time sailings at 21:00. There will be extra daytime sailings from mid July & all Aug.

Pat O Neill

Fastnet Line

Many thanks Pat for your reply. I wish you best of luck with your pricing structure and future sailings.

I am also pleased to read about your decision to put together a Landbridge option with UK Channel operators.

I am also impressed by the photo gallery which was added to your Blog this morning.