BANDS WANTED FOR PAID GIGS

thegrove54

Np promotions are running a string of student night gigs every wedensday night in the pint on eden quey. We will take any band who wants to play as long as you can actually play. There is no set pay rate it is comission on the night.

Hope to hear from you all soon

cheers
evan

www.nppromotions.bebo.com

splitterung

comission??? whats that mean?...is it dependant on how many people the band brings?

thegrove54

no no its depends on how many people show up

omd1969

You're a gas man for the jokes. Do you think musicians have nothing better to be doing with their time than playing gigs and hoping they get paid for it? This won't pay bills or put food on the table.

thegrove54

omd1969 wrote: »

You're a gas man for the jokes. Do you think musicians have nothing better to be doing with their time than playing gigs and hoping they get paid for it? This won't pay bills or put food on the table.

your right it wont pay bills but it will put food on a table im not offering thousands of euro for a gig but im offering to give bands something that they rarely ever get and thats a few quid for doing a 30 or 40 minute set up on stage. So omd1969 i know musicians probally do have better things to with their time but if they want to do this they can do this and id appreciate it if you didn't bad mouth me when you don't even know anything about my company.

evan

www.nppromotions.bebo.com

Royale with Cheese

thegrove54 wrote: »

im offering to give bands something that they rarely ever get and thats a few quid for doing a 30 or 40 minute set up on stage

Nothing original here, this is how most gigs work. You bring a crowd of 20-30 people to see you, you might end up with €50 in your pocket. Nobody turns up and you get nothing. What exactly are you offering for every person that turns up to see the band?

Rigsby

thegrove54 wrote: »

im offering to give bands something that they rarely ever get and thats a few quid for doing a 30 or 40 minute set up on stage.

Obviously, this means there will be more than one band performing on a given night. Somehow, I was under the impression that there would just be one band per night. IMO, it does not make much sense for a band to make the effort for a half hour stint on stage, and the appropriate slice of an already small kitty that would go with it.

thegrove54

well ive been running these gigs for a while now and i can tell you it is no small kitty going with it there is a fair bit of money to be made with this.

Rigsby

thegrove54 wrote: »

well ive been running these gigs for a while now and i can tell you it is no small kitty going with it there is a fair bit of money to be made with this.

OK. So could you elaborate a little more. On average, how many bands would be performing on a given night ? I assume there are amps etc supplied ?

thegrove54

Rigsby wrote: »

OK. So could you elaborate a little more. On average, how many bands would be performing on a given night ? I assume there are amps etc supplied ?

drum kit and mics are supplied the headlining band is asked to bring the amplification we have amps incase this is not possible. We usually have about 4 bands on per night. 8 bands if it is a all ages gig.

Bitsie

Does that mean the other bands then use the headlining bands amps?? How long does the headline act play for?

thegrove54

Bitsie wrote: »

Does that mean the other bands then use the headlining bands amps?? How long does the headline act play for?

yes other bands use the headling acts gear and the headling act gets 45 minutes.

Bitsie

other bands, using our gear.........not a mission! thanks anyway.

thegrove54

Bitsie wrote: »

other bands, using our gear.........not a mission! thanks anyway.

ok all thats happened here is i've had bands ridicule me. Any gig ive ever played or been to the headlining band has always supplied the gear. I'm setting these gigs up to give bands a chance to play a gig get a few quid and have a good time if ur all to stuck up to notice a good thing when ya see it then i dont really care if ya dont want to perform at one of my shows or not.

Bitsie

firstly, i didnt ridicule you, i was simply saying we didnt fancy having our gear used and i did say thanks anyway as you were kind enough to offer us a spot......so saying now that we are stuck up is just bang out of order mate.
I do wish you luck with these gigs but just not our kind of thing.
change your attitude.

thegrove54

Bitsie wrote: »

firstly, i didnt ridicule you, i was simply saying we didnt fancy having our gear used and i did say thanks anyway as you were kind enough to offer us a spot......so saying now that we are stuck up is just bang out of order mate.
I do wish you luck with these gigs but just not our kind of thing.
change your attitude.

change my attitude you are a covers band, you simply assumed that i was going to give you a headlining slot when i cant recall making any offers like that. Bitsie please never contact me looking for gigs again.

As for anyone else im offering bands the chance to make a few quid. If you think that a few quid for playing a show is **** because its not up in the thousands range well then tough. If i was making it i would share it money means nothing to me when it comes to music.

But if you all think that your the next u2 and that my gigs are not good enough for you well then dont get in touch simple as.

-Chris-

Your attitude stinks.

You've been asked some fairly simple questions which potential bands (the guys you're hoping to make money from) would like answered.

If you keep it cloak-and-dagger, or keep with the attitude, you'll have no bands and you'll make no money from them. If you share the information and actually "sell" yourself, you may get some good leads from boards.

At the moment all you're doing is ruining your own reputation.

thegrove54

-Chris- wrote: »

Your attitude stinks.

You've been asked some fairly simple questions which potential bands (the guys you're hoping to make money from) would like answered.

If you keep it cloak-and-dagger, or keep with the attitude, you'll have no bands and you'll make no money from them. If you share the information and actually "sell" yourself, you may get some good leads from boards.

At the moment all you're doing is ruining your own reputation.

ive answered everything thats been asked.

-Chris-

splitterung wrote: »

comission??? whats that mean?...is it dependant on how many people the band brings?

thegrove54 wrote: »

no no its depends on how many people show up

omd1969 wrote: »

You're a gas man for the jokes. Do you think musicians have nothing better to be doing with their time than playing gigs and hoping they get paid for it? This won't pay bills or put food on the table.

thegrove54 wrote: »

well ive been running these gigs for a while now and i can tell you it is no small kitty going with it there is a fair bit of money to be made with this.

OK, it's been asked a few times - if I was a band approaching you, and I asked how much I'd be paid to play, what would your answer be?

Obviously your answer will be something along the lines of "it depends...", so if you feel more comfortable saying something like:

"I expect each band to bring x number of people, and if they do, then I'd give them €y"
or
"I ask at the door who the punter is there to see, and for each person the band brings along, I'll give them €1 of the €5 admission fee"
or
"it's hard to say really, but I ran the first night last Friday, and on average I gave each band €x".

Take your pick!

I'm just trying to get a handle on the "commission" you mentioned earlier in the thread...

-Chris-

splitterung wrote: »

comission??? whats that mean?...is it dependant on how many people the band brings?

thegrove54 wrote: »

no no its depends on how many people show up

omd1969 wrote: »

You're a gas man for the jokes. Do you think musicians have nothing better to be doing with their time than playing gigs and hoping they get paid for it? This won't pay bills or put food on the table.

thegrove54 wrote: »

well ive been running these gigs for a while now and i can tell you it is no small kitty going with it there is a fair bit of money to be made with this.

OK, it's been asked a few times - if I was a band approaching you, and I asked how much I'd be paid to play, what would your answer be?

Obviously your answer will be something along the lines of "it depends...", so if you feel more comfortable saying something like:

"I expect each band to bring x number of people, and if they do, then I'd give them €y"
or
"I ask at the door who the punter is there to see, and for each person the band brings along, I'll give them €1 of the €5 admission fee"
or
"it's hard to say really, but I ran the first night last Friday, and on average I gave each band €x".

Take your pick!

I'm just trying to get a handle on the "commission" you mentioned earlier in the thread...

thegrove54

-Chris- wrote: »

OK, it's been asked a few times - if I was a band approaching you, and I asked how much I'd be paid to play, what would your answer be?

Obviously your answer will be something along the lines of "it depends...", so if you feel more comfortable saying something like:

"I expect each band to bring x number of people, and if they do, then I'd give them €y"
or
"I ask at the door who the punter is there to see, and for each person the band brings along, I'll give them €1 of the €5 admission fee"
or
"it's hard to say really, but I ran the first night last Friday, and on average I gave each band €x".

Take your pick!

I'm just trying to get a handle on the "commission" you mentioned earlier in the thread...

id just like to say to you all im really sorry for losing my temper so much.

for every person that comes in on the night two euro from their admission goes to the bands at the end of the night we count up how much that is and split it four ways between the bands playing and the most you can end up with is about 100 euro if the venue is sold out. it depends on how many people show up on the night.

Lauragoesmad

How much are you paying for the venue? Are there monitors and if so how many?
Thanks,
Laura.

Rigsby

thegrove54 wrote: »

ive answered everything thats been asked.

Yes. Though only after being grilled relentlessly. This thread might have gone a different way if you had supplied all the appropriate information that you could, in your first post.

-Chris-

thegrove54 wrote: »

id just like to say to you all im really sorry for losing my temper so much.

for every person that comes in on the night two euro from their admission goes to the bands at the end of the night we count up how much that is and split it four ways between the bands playing and the most you can end up with is about 100 euro if the venue is sold out. it depends on how many people show up on the night.

That sounds very fair - nice one. The first one was on on Friday I think - I hope it went well!

Lauragoesmad wrote: »

How much are you paying for the venue? Are there monitors and if so how many?
Thanks,
Laura.

A venue the size of the Pint, I don't think you'll need more than one or two monitors - just one per vocal mic.
As for venue rental - I'm not sure if that's a fair question to ask - what Evan makes out of the gig is his own business imho.

thegrove54

Lauragoesmad wrote: »

How much are you paying for the venue? Are there monitors and if so how many?
Thanks,
Laura.

laura at the moment the whole sound system is being revamped so at the moment there are no stage monitors as for how much im paying for the venue that is between me and the owner.

if anyone has any other questions please do get in touch.

thegrove54

-Chris- wrote: »

That sounds very fair - nice one. The first one was on on Friday I think - I hope it went well!


thanks chris and its every wednesday night form 8 till late

tubedude

Lauragoesmad wrote: »

How much are you paying for the venue?

Why are you asking this question???...are you trying to find out how much the organiser will be making if any? Do you begrudge this person making money off a gig they organise?
Bands need to stop being so hostile, this is a fair deal, bring in a crowd and you could make some money, better deal than most places. Getting comission is a common system in most places, not fair to get paid if dont bring any business into the venue...

omd1969

Are you also going to repair the headline band's gear and equipment if it somehow gets damaged by someone in another band who doesn't care about it? People don't have money to be throwing around on repairs...good gear is very expensive...and it's terrible that you ask people to let their gear be used by inexperienced players in the hope that they might make 10 euro out of it.

Sorry...I'm out.

-Chris-

I don't understand what's the problem there - I've played with that arrangement many times.

If you've got 4 bands playing on a given night, do you really want 4 bass amps on stage, 8 guitar amps etc.? Do you really want to make the sound engineer set up the mics etc. for each band and their 30 min set?

The headliners will bring their own gear, and Evan will bring his amps if the headliners won't share. It's par for the course in most venues in Dublin.

MagicMarker

omd1969 wrote: »

Are you also going to repair the headline band's gear and equipment if it somehow gets damaged by someone in another band who doesn't care about it? People don't have money to be throwing around on repairs...good gear is very expensive...and it's terrible that you ask people to let their gear be used by inexperienced players in the hope that they might make 10 euro out of it.

Sorry...I'm out.

It's been a while since I've gigged, but to expect every band to bring their own gear is ridiculous, lots of venues don't supply a kit, do you tell other bands your gigging with to bring their own? Have 3-4 kits up on stage? That must be one huge stage!!

Any gig I ever played we worked out between ourselves which band brought what gear.

thegrove54

omd1969 wrote: »

Are you also going to repair the headline band's gear and equipment if it somehow gets damaged by someone in another band who doesn't care about it? People don't have money to be throwing around on repairs...good gear is very expensive...and it's terrible that you ask people to let their gear be used by inexperienced players in the hope that they might make 10 euro out of it.

Sorry...I'm out.

if the gear was completely destroyed i'd obviously replace it but i really dbout that even the worst musician is going to smash your gear up because if they did then id simply not let that band play id mute everything and tell them to get lost.

If headlining bands dont want to bring their gear ill use my own but i dont yet have huge amps capable of covering that whole venue yet.

raindog.promo

omd1969 wrote: »

Are you also going to repair the headline band's gear and equipment if it somehow gets damaged by someone in another band who doesn't care about it? People don't have money to be throwing around on repairs...good gear is very expensive...and it's terrible that you ask people to let their gear be used by inexperienced players in the hope that they might make 10 euro out of it.

Sorry...I'm out.

The orignal poster is getting a bit of a hard time here. Most gig organisation I know of (on a small scale) involves at the very least most bands using the same drum kit and in most cases sharing amps on the night. What you have to do to damage an amp on stage bar attacking it with a guitar (which I only ever did to my own ) is beyond me, set the eq, keeps drinks away from it and it should be fine. OK, cymbals and snare can be damaged and from what I've seen every drummer brings their own.

From what I've read, I gather that this type or gig is aimed at smaller bands who haven't gathered a large following and are prehaps not a fulltime gigging band.

There's a lot that goes into organising and promoting gigs as well as sound engineering the gig. Sharing amps makes it a lot easier for sound checks and minimising what can go wrong to the bands sound.

thegrove54 made an offer (although sketchy on the details) to anyone who may be interested in the night, as far as I know, he didn't actively seek out particular bands so if you don't like the conditions, don't take the offer. There's no need to then abuse the OP for at least trying to organise a night.

The mind set of some bands can be astounding. If a band wants to act like prima donnas, then at the very least they should be at enough of a level to have their own following and then they can dictate the terms of the gig.

As I see it, with the case here, what's on offer is more the chance to gain gigging experience with a couple of quid for a few pints after. I'd advise thegrove54 next time to make the conditions clear and not skirt around the facts where money is concerned. But don't take too much to heart the negative comments that have been said. I've organised a few gigs and in the most part, pretty much every band had no problem sharing amps or doing what they could to make the gig go as smoothly as possible.

Perhaps a thread on gig equitette/what is expected of and for bands may be useful?

KevArno

I have to agree with raindog here. I feel thegrove is getting a hard time, but bands are used to being rode, and the sketchiness in detail regarding these gigs, along with the hostility when questioned has not helped his cause.

I can't see how local gigs can work without bands sharing gear, and indeed I have never seen small shows in Dublin run in any other way. I like to use my own amp, so I bring it, and Im very aware that it will be used, no big deal. Local shows like this have to have aspects of cooperation to be a success, talk to the other bands, work out who brings what, and make a few friends...Or go in and jealously guard your stuff, dont allow anybody to touch, make things difficult for everybody and see how far you get! Some bands in Dublin seem to have a habit of making music seem really really hard to love.

whodoo

thegrove54 wrote: »

laura at the moment the whole sound system is being revamped so at the moment there are no stage monitors as for how much im paying for the venue that is between me and the owner.

The Pint doesn't charge to rent the venue. So you'd want to up the 'commission' you're giving bands. They're the ones who are bringing people/money in for the night.

8k2q1gfcz9s5d4

if bands are getting a few euro, then its a good idea for young bands that are starting out with no experience. Getting 50 euro for a half hour isn't bad if you just turn up and plug in, not having to set up - take down a PA system and worrying about the overall sound.

as for sharing gear, sh*t happens. Ive had to do it a few times, I dont like doing it too much, but if you are playing gigs like this it has to be done. As long as pints are not left on the amp im happy!

Ive played for **** promoters when we were starting out, and really needed gigs. I dont think im allowed to mention promotion companies, but one of them was on live line last may, for not paying out prize money for a BOTB. A lot of bands are weary of new promoters, as there are very few good ones out there.

helmetjack

Im a singer songwriter in Galway, I would be interested in a support slot at one of these gigs. Could I just arrive with my guitar and plug in and play?

I would only be able to round up 3-5 friends i'd imagine, but I would not necessarily be looking for any money, if its there great, if not I dont mind.

I can send on demo's if required.

Libertine2002

People on this post are giving musicians a bad name. Lads, here's a guy willing to promote live music and you're all acting like there's plenty gigs out there. If you're serious about your art you'll take any gig that won't leave you out of pocket, and the promoters arm and all! What he's offering is absolutely standard practice.

Anyway, to the grove, I suppose the important thing for me is how well the gig is advertised. Do you have a budget for this or is it just word of mouth?

raindog.promo

whodoo wrote: »

The Pint doesn't charge to rent the venue. So you'd want to up the 'commission' you're giving bands. They're the ones who are bringing people/money in for the night.

And he's the one (off the top of my head) organising these bands, organising the night, going between bands to sort backline and stage times, organising a soundman, promoting the night (contacting media, design and putting up posters), sorting any problems up to and including on the night in question......

omd1969

-Chris- wrote: »

I don't understand what's the problem there - I've played with that arrangement many times.

If you've got 4 bands playing on a given night, do you really want 4 bass amps on stage, 8 guitar amps etc.? Do you really want to make the sound engineer set up the mics etc. for each band and their 30 min set?

The headliners will bring their own gear, and Evan will bring his amps if the headliners won't share. It's par for the course in most venues in Dublin.

Of course having all that gear on stage wouldn't make sense. However, all I'm saying is that the venue should supply everything for all the bands.If the fee is going to be so bad..it's the least the venue could do....no?

MagicMarker

omd1969 wrote: »

Of course having all that gear on stage wouldn't make sense. However, all I'm saying is that the venue should supply everything for all the bands.If the fee is going to be so bad..it's the least the venue could do....no?

No.

thegrove54

Anyway, to the grove, I suppose the important thing for me is how well the gig is advertised. Do you have a budget for this or is it just word of mouth?


at the moment i have posters up in about 7 colleges i advertise online on websites like this i get the bands to put it up on their pages but at the moment im at a loss for profits with trying to sort a decent backline and promotions for these gigs.

-Chris-

omd1969 wrote: »

Of course having all that gear on stage wouldn't make sense. However, all I'm saying is that the venue should supply everything for all the bands.If the fee is going to be so bad..it's the least the venue could do....no?

What fee are you expecting? We're not talking about wedding bands or full time musicians, it's just a couple of bands playing some tunes for their mates and hoping to make a name for themselves.

My main concern through the thread is that there's some tranparancy and fairness for anyone interested in playing. I've played too many gigs like these where the place is full and I've paid for taxis etc. and there isn't even any beer money going around.
Some promoters are fair and some take advantage.
I think Evan now has his cards on the table and bands know where they stand. If he messes them around, they'll know exactly how messed they were, rather than just having that sinking, sickening feeling of thinking that you got the short end of the stick.
Alternatively, if he runs it well and keeps his end of the bargain, I'd love to see bands that played for him come on and ive him some praise.


As for the venue supplying the gear, that may be your preference, but I wouldn't think it'll add anything. The venue will buy some crappy backline that sounds like crap. You'll only end up bringing your own gear anyway.
I've always found I end up talking to the guitarist of the headline band before the gig anyway, and if my amp is nicer than his, I'll offer it.
If his amp is nicer than mine, but doesn't suit my sound, I'll bring my own.

A bar manager is just going to buy junk.

-Chris-

raindog.promo wrote: »

And he's the one (off the top of my head) organising these bands, organising the night, going between bands to sort backline and stage times, organising a soundman, promoting the night (contacting media, design and putting up posters), sorting any problems up to and including on the night in question......

This is one of the things that really frustrates me - it seems like there's not enough "promoting" done by promoters in Dublin.
There's money in it if people turn up, but there are only one or two guys who'd give you flyers to hand out (rather than rely on you to make your own), or who pushes the gig on MySpace/Facebook/Phantom FM etc.

Normally it's all up to you.

Malice

thegrove54,

Please don't post duplicate threads. If you need a thread or post edited ask me or one of the other mods on this forum.

thegrove54

Malice_ wrote: »

thegrove54,

Please don't post duplicate threads. If you need a thread or post edited ask me or one of the other mods on this forum.

sorry

raindog.promo

-Chris- wrote: »

This is one of the things that really frustrates me - it seems like there's not enough "promoting" done by promoters in Dublin.
There's money in it if people turn up, but there are only one or two guys who'd give you flyers to hand out (rather than rely on you to make your own), or who pushes the gig on MySpace/Facebook/Phantom FM etc.

Normally it's all up to you.

There was a fine brought in for any flyers found littered on the street, €125 per flyer I think which effectively killed flyering overnight. Another company bought a lot of the spaces that traditionally would be given over to independant promoting (A4 posters in newsagents and so on). I rang them to get quotes for their services, left a message twice and never got a reply so I don't know what they're like to work with (although first impression obviously didn't impress me) or how much they charge).

I've walked many streets around south Dublin postering and there are still places, you just have to put the leg work in, but as there's fewer spaces chances are your poster may get covered up by someone elses in relatively short time although there is a gentlemans agreement to cover the most out of date poster.

johnmayerstrat

:eek::eek:

thegrove54 wrote: »

ok all thats happened here is i've had bands ridicule me. Any gig ive ever played or been to the headlining band has always supplied the gear. I'm setting these gigs up to give bands a chance to play a gig get a few quid and have a good time if ur all to stuck up to notice a good thing when ya see it then i dont really care if ya dont want to perform at one of my shows or not.

:eek::eek:

being honest mate, quit while your ahead.

Your attitude has probably lost total respect of the board.

Realistically, what band is going to haul 1000's worth of gear into a pub to let student bands play through it.......... for maybe 50 quid.

if you say all these bands supply gear, why are they not doing them anymore...........????

not only that, but i would REFUSE to let anyone play through my amp(s)
unless they were professionals

most venues have in-house, as the pub can take a small slice off the top for maintenance.

musicians are not "STUCK UP"....... they are walking bull****e detectors an they can smell it a mile away. if you try to make the scene a ten to a penny job you will lose respect quicker than you can waste credit.

Ive been around this business long enough (15 years) to know bad management/promotion and bull-dung when i hear it!!

and the reason bands ridicule is because YOUR opinion is wrong. i would recommend sitting down with real musicians, in fact..... Ring a REAL band and see how much they'll charge ya to headline and use their PA.

i'll start the bidding at 1K for PA+ Backline, as long as the pub accepts a damage clause in the contract i supply

thegrove54

johnmayerstrat wrote: »

:eek::eek::eek::eek:

being honest mate, quit while your ahead.

Your attitude has probably lost total respect of the board.

Realistically, what band is going to haul 1000's worth of gear into a pub to let student bands play through it.......... for maybe 50 quid.

if you say all these bands supply gear, why are they not doing them anymore...........????

not only that, but i would REFUSE to let anyone play through my amp(s)
unless they were professionals

most venues have in-house, as the pub can take a small slice off the top for maintenance.

musicians are not "STUCK UP"....... they are walking bull****e detectors an they can smell it a mile away. if you try to make the scene a ten to a penny job you will lose respect quicker than you can waste credit.

Ive been around this business long enough (15 years) to know bad management/promotion and bull-dung when i hear it!!

and the reason bands ridicule is because YOUR opinion is wrong. i would recommend sitting down with real musicians, in fact..... Ring a REAL band and see how much they'll charge ya to headline and use their PA.

i'll start the bidding at 1K for PA+ Backline, as long as the pub accepts a damage clause in the contract i supply

Your assuming that im looking for the next u2 to come out of ireland to perform, i'm not any band no matter how inexperienced can have a chance with me.

If your in the music industry 15 years fair enough im at this for 3 weeks and already i have shows booked up untill the end of january with more slots already having offers to be filled by bands.

I know my attitude was rotten at the start of this thread but so was the attitude of the musicians in this thread. I apologize to anyone who is reading this and thinks of me as a dick head, I admit i lost my temper a little but now that everything is back on track i would just like to apologize.

I'm trying to pay bands in the fairest way while at the same time keeping my promotions company afloat paying bands, paying for ink cartrages for posters to promote these nights, buying a backline for these nights so i will not have to ask bands to bring their gear and then paying the people who help me out doing sound and the door for me each night.

Last week I made alot on the door and then i had to pay bands the engineer and the person who did the door for me and i came away with bearlly anything.

Savman

thegrove54 wrote: »

I know my attitude was rotten at the start of this thread but so was the attitude of the musicians in this thread. .

True and true. This thread is doing you more harm than good, best to let it RIP, take a break and make a fresh approach for bands in a week or two.

IMHO, of course.

I'm locking this as it has been fairly derailed. Feel free to start a new Grove,



(With ALL pertinent info )