Pubs providing transport for customers

Cianos

With the latest restrictions being put in place against drink driving I would have thought rural pubs would be looking in to ways to provide transport for their own customers at night. Seeing as though everyone is going on about the death of rural Ireland and how those living in remote areas will be even further isolated if they can't drive to the pub, I'm wondering why more pubs aren't taking this as an opportunity to attract customers to their bar?

Is this primarily a logistical problem or just a lack of entrepreneurship?

antoinolachtnai

It does take a bit of organization to do it, but I would have thought someone with an 8-seater taxi in a rural area could set up a route and make a business of it. Maybe not though. It does take a bit of organization. Would be interesting to do a pilot somewhere.

serfboard

Cianos wrote: »

Seeing as though everyone is going on about the death of rural Ireland and how those living in remote areas will be even further isolated if they can't drive to the pub

1. The "everyone" you refer to are rural backbench Fianna Fail TDs who are in the hock to the publicans. (Many "clinics" are often held in the pub, or in a room upstairs). The same guys who objected to Mickey McDowells cafe/bar licensing proposal.

Typical example: Jackie-Healy Rae (may as well be Fianna Fail) who is still going to vote against the legislation.

2. Nobody is stopping anybody driving to the pub. However, they
a) can't drive home if they want to drink alcohol or
b) they can't drink alcohol if they want to drive home. The possibility that anyone could go to the pub and not drink alcohol seems to have passed these people by.

3. It would be much more in their interest to investigate rural isolation and to try and remedy it. It would mean that they might have to provide facilities in rural areas other than the pub :eek: (e.g. community centres) and this would
a) involve work ... instead of just spouting nonsense
b) mean the pubs might have less customers. And by God, we can't have that.

4. Pubs could easily do things like organise card games, pub quizes, bingo nights etc. the focus of which is not alcohol. Where my Uncle lives that's what happens - he is elderly, doesn't drink and so has no problem driving to and from the pub.

Stark

They could also try doing what people outside rural Ireland do and get a taxi home.

antoinolachtnai

The problem seems to be that if someone is living off a pension, and they are some distance from the pub, the cost of a taxi both ways is prohibitive.

The other problem is that these pubs are very near the end anyway. It's very difficult to pay a barman minimum wage to just keep the doors open.

Overall, this is makes for a big problem. The more pubs you close, the greater the distances become. The way to resolve this problem would appear to be to have a well organized flexi-route (i.e, demand-driven service) or taxi service. Unfortunately the new public transport regulation bill largely forbids operators from initiating flexi-routes.

hmmm

The real way to fix this is to stop the building of one off houses in isolated rural areas where there is no sensible way for anyone to provide transport to and from amenities. The European model of small villages where services including transport can be concentrated is much more sensible.

antoinolachtnai

This is an excellent plan but does nothing to resolve the immediate problem.

Chris_533976

The pub up the road from me does precisely this. A minibus to take the punters home.

IMO it proves that some publicans are still good people, and not just in it for the money.

Run_to_da_hills

Pubs are not doing too well at the moment, I could see a few smiley face transits mini busses being recommissioned.

Serving a designated driver free soft drinks would be a better option.

the bolt

Stark wrote: »

They could also try doing what people outside rural Ireland do and get a taxi home.

and get a taxi to work the following morning and home again in the evening:D

byhookorbycrook

hmmm wrote: »

The real way to fix this is to stop the building of one off houses in isolated rural areas where there is no sensible way for anyone to provide transport to and from amenities. The European model of small villages where services including transport can be concentrated is much more sensible.

Gosh, how silly of those farmers to want to live on their farms :mad:

mikemac

hmmm wrote: »

The real way to fix this is to stop the building of one off houses in isolated rural areas where there is no sensible way for anyone to provide transport to and from amenities.

And farmers who need to get at 2am, 4am and 6am during lambing season should sell their rural house and move to nearest town? Would that make you happy?

Rural people have their own transport.
Pensioners have a travel scheme in place and students pay for Bus Eireann buses.

Stark

Not everyone who lives in a house in the middle of nowhere is a farmer. Some people are living there because they think they're saving money by living in a house that's miles from any sort of facility or because they think they'll like "country living" until they find out it carries disadvantages like no transport and the like. I have relatives who's moved from towns and cities to be away from it all. Wasn't much of a dream once they started getting old and losing their licenses and having to have hip operations meaning they couldn't drive and the like.

Irjudge1

serfboard wrote: »

4. Pubs could easily do things like organise card games, pub quizes, bingo nights etc. the focus of which is not alcohol. Where my Uncle lives that's what happens - he is elderly, doesn't drink and so has no problem driving to and from the pub.

Eh Pubs earn money from selling alcohol.

hmmm wrote: »

The real way to fix this is to stop the building of one off houses in isolated rural areas where there is no sensible way for anyone to provide transport to and from amenities. The European model of small villages where services including transport can be concentrated is much more sensible.

Stark wrote: »

Not everyone who lives in a house in the middle of nowhere is a farmer. Some people are living there because they think they're saving money by living in a house that's miles from any sort of facility or because they think they'll like "country living" until they find out it carries disadvantages like no transport and the like. I have relatives who's moved from towns and cities to be away from it all. Wasn't much of a dream once they started getting old and losing their licenses and having to have hip operations meaning they couldn't drive and the like.

Not all of us moved from cities or towns, some of us were actually raised in the rural areas of Ireland. And some of us like it in the areas where we were raised where we can live beside our parents and families.

AND yes publicans should at least try to sort out transport. It may be expensive but I think most people would be willing to shell out the price of a pint if they were guaranteed a lift home at the end of the night.

bog master

Cianos wrote: »

With the latest restrictions being put in place against drink driving I would have thought rural pubs would be looking in to ways to provide transport for their own customers at night. Seeing as though everyone is going on about the death of rural Ireland and how those living in remote areas will be even further isolated if they can't drive to the pub, I'm wondering why more pubs aren't taking this as an opportunity to attract customers to their bar?

Is this primarily a logistical problem or just a lack of entrepreneurship?

I believe it is a bit of both. First there is the cost, excluding the capital purchase of the mini bus, you would have insurance for a PSV vehicle, road tax, maintenance, and fuel. Furthermore, you have the time element, last drinks at half 12, drinking up time, then staff are busy cleaning up, restocking etc. So you would have one less worker doing these duties and bear in mind, many rural pubs are small and may have only two people working.

Also, you have to bear in mind, the time required to do this run. In one of the pubs I used to frequent, the publican who was leasing the premises, would often give lifts home to people, but being to only take four at a time would often take him two hours. Bear in mind, not everyone lives in a straight line or route home, you have people living in the four directions, down boreens etc.

Furthermore, some people like to go out, have their few pints and then head home well before closing time. It could be argued that waiting for the mini-bus pub taxi would tempt them to drink more.

Mrs OBumble

Irjudge1 wrote: »

Eh Pubs earn money from selling alcohol.

Pubs in the rest of the world make money from selling non-alcoholic drink, food, running quiz nights, hiring rooms out as meetng venues, selling merchandise (tee-shirts etc), etc.

Rural people, like the rest of us, do not HAVE to drink alcohol. They choose to. And that choice has certain consequences.

bk

bog master wrote: »

Furthermore, some people like to go out, have their few pints and then head home well before closing time. It could be argued that waiting for the mini-bus pub taxi would tempt them to drink more.

So, what do you suggest we do?

Leave them drink and drive, simply unacceptable.

bog master

bk wrote: »

So, what do you suggest we do?

Leave them drink and drive, simply unacceptable.

Never said that! I was simply pointing out some of the difficulties and feasibility of small rural pubs trying to run a mini bus/taxi service to those that think it is a simple manner.

Cianos

bog master wrote: »

I believe it is a bit of both. First there is the cost, excluding the capital purchase of the mini bus, you would have insurance for a PSV vehicle, road tax, maintenance, and fuel. Furthermore, you have the time element, last drinks at half 12, drinking up time, then staff are busy cleaning up, restocking etc. So you would have one less worker doing these duties and bear in mind, many rural pubs are small and may have only two people working.

Also, you have to bear in mind, the time required to do this run. In one of the pubs I used to frequent, the publican who was leasing the premises, would often give lifts home to people, but being to only take four at a time would often take him two hours. Bear in mind, not everyone lives in a straight line or route home, you have people living in the four directions, down boreens etc.

Furthermore, some people like to go out, have their few pints and then head home well before closing time. It could be argued that waiting for the mini-bus pub taxi would tempt them to drink more.

Well the question is would it be worth the extra hassle for the publican in the long wrong. If he's the only pub in the area offering a lift-home service (or, only pub in the area at all) then it'd encourage people to go out for a drink who otherwise would have stayed in because of the trouble and cost associated with getting a taxi. It could mean a lot of extra business for the publican and the set up costs would probably be covered and it'd help sustain his business for the long term if the service proves popular.

Do you think the service itself could be another source of profit, or would it always be running at a loss but acceptingly so for the sake of increasing profit at the bar?

bog master

JustMary wrote: »

Pubs in the rest of the world make money from selling non-alcoholic drink, food, running quiz nights, hiring rooms out as meetng venues, selling merchandise (tee-shirts etc), etc.

Rural people, like the rest of us, do not HAVE to drink alcohol. They choose to. And that choice has certain consequences.

Dont know about pubs in the rest of the world, I will stick to the ones I know here in Ireland.

Yes, agreed publicans make money from selling soft drinks.

Food is not a viable option for many pubs, you need a certain turnover to pay for staff and even simple food options ie toasted sandwiches and soup require extensive facilities and hygiene requirements.

The pubs I know often have quiz nights, usually to benefit the local GAA, Senior Citizens or whatever. Yes they benefit from a larger crowd, but often end up making a substantial donation to that organisation or end up paying for a quizmaster, pa, and or prizes.

None of the local pubs I am familiar with, having lived in three different rural areas charge for the use of a room for meetings etc. Generally provided as a service to the community and if they get some sale of drink or minerals out of it, its a bonus.

Selling tee shirts? A rural pub has a limited customer base and purchasing in shirts in a small number is uneconomical. The local tried it with the local GAA, polo shirts in the team colours and crest cost €25.00. I dont feel many would be happy to buy a shirt for €25.00 just cuz it has a pub name on it.

I am not defending drink driving in any way in my posts, it just seems there are many that offer simple solutions but have no idea how they would work or not work in real life.

bog master

Cianos wrote: »

Well the question is would it be worth the extra hassle for the publican in the long wrong. If he's the only pub in the area offering a lift-home service (or, only pub in the area at all) then it'd encourage people to go out for a drink who otherwise would have stayed in because of the trouble and cost associated with getting a taxi. It could mean a lot of extra business for the publican and the set up costs would probably be covered and it'd help sustain his business for the long term if the service proves popular.

Do you think the service itself could be another source of profit, or would it always be running at a loss but acceptingly so for the sake of increasing profit at the bar?

A very valid question, and yes it all ends up being down to economics and costing AND, as you point out if it is the only pub in the area. In my village there are 3 pubs.

I do accounts for two pubs, not my locals, but similiar in other respects. With one client we went through costings. First is buying the vehicle. Insurance would be quite high as one would need PSV ie taxi insurance as advised by his solicitor. Insurance,rd tax, and one annual service we costed at €40.00 per week. Add in even a €10.00 in diesel and your cost is up to €50.00 without paying a driver or the extra work the staff would have after closing due to one of the staff and or the owner driving. You have the issue also of getting PSV license. Now, we have not factored in the cost of purchase.

Also, as I stated before, not everyone wants to stay until closing.

I believe it may work in some cases and not in others.

Irjudge1

JustMary wrote: »

Pubs in the rest of the world make money from selling non-alcoholic drink, food, running quiz nights, hiring rooms out as meetng venues, selling merchandise (tee-shirts etc), etc.

You're right of course, you dont have to drink alcohol, nobody has to drink alcohol. If people dont want to drink alcohol they may go to elsewhere. If they do want to drink alcohol they generally go to the pub. If pubs dont serve alcohol they loose their actual function. They are no longer pubs.

JustMary wrote: »

Rural people, like the rest of us, do not HAVE to drink alcohol. They choose to. And that choice has certain consequences.

Absolutely the choice has consequences. And obvously the consequences for people living in the country are more severe in terms of access to and from the pub without driving. I know many people who walk home up to a mile and a half on narrow dark roads. This in itself is very dangerous.

I dont think that it is viable in most cases for publicans to provide transport. In some areas including my own we do have a local taxi / mini bus which could run on a route between the 5-6 pubs within a 5 mile radius. The problem as stated before is that people do not want to go at the same time and inevitably at closing time there will be people left standing outside in the cold and wet waiting for some time for transport to arrive. (No chipper or chinese to go to )

Cianos

bog master wrote: »

A very valid question, and yes it all ends up being down to economics and costing AND, as you point out if it is the only pub in the area. In my village there are 3 pubs.

I do accounts for two pubs, not my locals, but similiar in other respects. With one client we went through costings. First is buying the vehicle. Insurance would be quite high as one would need PSV ie taxi insurance as advised by his solicitor. Insurance,rd tax, and one annual service we costed at €40.00 per week. Add in even a €10.00 in diesel and your cost is up to €50.00 without paying a driver or the extra work the staff would have after closing due to one of the staff and or the owner driving. You have the issue also of getting PSV license. Now, we have not factored in the cost of purchase.

Also, as I stated before, not everyone wants to stay until closing.

I believe it may work in some cases and not in others.

Right, a lot of assoicated costs alright. You'd need to be carrying 20+ people at a fiver a head to barely cover the costs of running the vehicle and paying someone to drive it.

Arnold Layne

Irjudge1 wrote: »

Eh Pubs earn money from selling alcohol.

There is a lot of profit in selling soft drinks. I worked in a pub some years ago and couldn't believe the profit that is received from the sales of all the major soft drinks brands.

murphaph

Is it not just a fact or rural life that getting home without a car is generally very difficult? It is in most other rural locations throughout Europe-why should Ireland be any different?

murphaph

Arnold Layne wrote: »

There is a lot of profit in selling soft drinks. I worked in a pub some years ago and couldn't believe the profit that is received from the sales of all the major soft drinks brands.

Me too, when I was in college I worked behind the bar and saw the cost of things on the dockets. Soft drinks cost feck all cos there's no excise duty on them, yet pubs in Ireland often charge MORE for a pint of coke than a pint of beer. Pure rip off.

dowlingm

It seems to me that a lot of rural transport issues are disconnected. For instance, a small bus could do school transport morning and evening, rural transport midday and pub transport at night. Does at least the first two happen, or do school and rural transport buses spend most of their days waiting to be called into action?

MPB

Theres a pub/country hotel not too far from my parents place that do provide a courtesy lift home at the end of the night. Just need to ask the barman in good time. It works well for them. Thing is this place is quite rural but in a scenic setting. Have availed of it myself the odd time. Gr8 service.

bk

Look it is very simple, if their customers numbers are going down, then they have two choices, find ways to increase numbers or close down.

I know it is harsh, but just because you have a pub license, doesn't guarantee you a job, people go out of business every day and we don't hear a big song and dance about it.

Propellerhead

How about scrapping all drink driving limits and enforcing dangerous driving laws, which are a separate offence.

That would get the Nanny State off our backs for a start, and reduce the whiny high moral tone of those who can get to their urban latte-houses easily

:mad:

Victor

Propellerhead wrote: »

How about scrapping all drink driving limits and enforcing dangerous driving laws, which are a separate offence.

2m+ drivers -v- 14,000 gardaí. Not everyone is sensible and lots of people would die (not jus the drink drivers). That said, yes, enforcement needs to be done.

murphaph wrote: »

Is it not just a fact or rural life that getting home without a car is generally very difficult? It is in most other rural locations throughout Europe-why should Ireland be any different?

Many people in rural France actually live in villages and commute to their farms.

murphaph wrote: »

Me too, when I was in college I worked behind the bar and saw the cost of things on the dockets. Soft drinks cost feck all cos there's no excise duty on them, yet pubs in Ireland often charge MORE for a pint of coke than a pint of beer. Pure rip off.

the problem with soft drinks in pubs is that they come in small bottles. If you had a coke machine liek they have in McDonalds, coke would be much cheaper.

BrianD

Stark wrote: »

Not everyone who lives in a house in the middle of nowhere is a farmer. Some people are living there because they think they're saving money by living in a house that's miles from any sort of facility or because they think they'll like "country living" until they find out it carries disadvantages like no transport and the like. I have relatives who's moved from towns and cities to be away from it all. Wasn't much of a dream once they started getting old and losing their licenses and having to have hip operations meaning they couldn't drive and the like.

Not only that, the rest of us who are living in sustainable developments are subsidising those who live in one-off housing! In fact one report stated that it could be as high as €30K pa per house. How is this made up? Through more expensive services and additional taxes/service charges.

dowlingm

Victor wrote: »

the problem with soft drinks in pubs is that they come in small bottles. If you had a coke machine liek they have in McDonalds, coke would be much cheaper.

I doubt it Victor, or at least only at the margin. I've been in plenty of places with saucy soft drink prices where the drink came from a fountain hose (the type with four or six buttons on).

mattman

bk wrote: »

Look it is very simple, if their customers numbers are going down, then they have two choices, find ways to increase numbers or close down.

I know it is harsh, but just because you have a pub license, doesn't guarantee you a job, people go out of business every day and we don't hear a big song and dance about it.

ah shur thats fine. just close down , possible after 100 years in buiness. obviously you have NO idea what its like to own a rural pub, which many rural publicians love.

just close down. what a attitude. you would be great at your own business! ah shur i cant sll shoes so ill just close down , go on the dole , and dont care.

what passion. "JUST close down"..its not that simple....I know rural publicians put everything into there pub, its not just a job, its a passion, a love of the job. serving local community. Just close down, WHAT A MORON.

be it rural or urban.

jesus.


m.

buzzwell

I'm a bit late replying to this thread, however here goes-

There are more than enough licensed and insured existing minibus and taxi operators in rural Ireland without having a load of publicans setting up in opposition.

Publicans wouldnt be happy if the taxi drivers started selling beer so.......

The only problem is that the punters having had their few scoops are invariably too tight to pay a fiver each to get home.

I know from experience.

Enough of the nanny state, surely these people can organise and pay for a lift home from their local operators?

Cookie_Monster

buzzwell wrote: »

I'm a bit late replying to this thread, however here goes-

There are more than enough licensed and insured existing minibus and taxi operators in rural Ireland without having a load of publicans setting up in opposition.

Publicans wouldnt be happy if the taxi drivers started selling beer so.......

The only problem is that the punters having had their few scoops are invariably too tight to pay a fiver each to get home.

I know from experience.

Enough of the nanny state, surely these people can organise and pay for a lift home from their local operators?

well no, cos their local operator are probably rip off merchants while the pub will do it for free or 1-2 Euro. If local operators though they could provide such a service cheaply then they'd do it, but obviously they can't or simply don't want to.

buzzwell

Fine, go with the publican, clutching your 1 euro, in a manky old bus full of drunks, then have an accident,and see how you're covered by your local friendly publican cum transport operator.

You are correct, most professional operators couldnt be bothered with the hassle of carrying a load of tight fisted alcos anywhere. However some do and provide a reliable service too

However I would have much better things to be doing, like counting the spoils of another rip off week.

Been there, done that, try it yourself then come back to us with an educated opinion.

Cookie_Monster

Lovely attitude you got there.

What company do you work for / operate then?

Cianos

buzzwell wrote: »

I'm a bit late replying to this thread, however here goes-

There are more than enough licensed and insured existing minibus and taxi operators in rural Ireland without having a load of publicans setting up in opposition.

Publicans wouldnt be happy if the taxi drivers started selling beer so.......

The only problem is that the punters having had their few scoops are invariably too tight to pay a fiver each to get home.

I know from experience.

Enough of the nanny state, surely these people can organise and pay for a lift home from their local operators?

I doubt the average publican wants the hassle of running their own bus service. Here's a thought, rather than getting up in arms against the proposition how about working in tandem with the publicans by organising transportation. A Bus/Buses could leave at set times in specified directions, bar staff could promote the service and punters could buy their ticket from behind the bar while getting pints in, to guarantee themselves a seat for later on. The more pubs you have in the surrounding area the more likely they'd compete for your services. Some publicans may even subsidise the tickets for their customers to encourage more custom.

buzzwell

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

Lovely attitude you got there.

What company do you work for / operate then?

I am a self employed minibus operator in business for the last 15 years, and as anyone who deals with people who are under the influence of alcohol will tell you (taxi drivers, door staff, A+E staff) it is often quite a different story than dealing with the same people when they are sober.

I have had experiences of people fouling themselves, vomiting, becoming violent with their own "friends" refusing to pay, not knowing their own name etc. etc. etc. , in the course of providing a professional public service.

So as you can imagine, I am not very attracted to that kind of work.

As you said at the outset:

"well no, cos their local operator are probably rip off merchants while the pub will do it for free or 1-2 Euro. If local operators though they could provide such a service cheaply then they'd do it, but obviously they can't or simply don't want to.",

I dont think I'm the one with the attitude!!

Cookie_Monster

buzzwell wrote: »

I dont think I'm the one with the attitude!!

Fine, go with the publican, clutching your 1 euro, in a manky old bus full of drunks, then have an accident,and see how you're covered by your local friendly publican cum transport operator.

that smacks of bitterness and resentment to me...

I live in Dublin so thankfully have numerous options to get home. Why would I get a 30+ euro taxi when I can take a nitelink for a fiver.

Same way if I lived in a rural village where a publican arranged a bus, why would I pay 10-15 for a taxi when I can use the pub bus for 1-2 quid. Also builds goodwill with the pub, making it more likely for me to come back in future, benefit both parties and whoever the bus company the pub hires also benefits.

buzzwell

The reason you would get a taxi is that you would be brought quickly and directly to your destination in relative comfort, albeit for a fee, rather than going around for perhaps an hour or more particularly if you live the furthest away, and this is true whether in an urban or rural setting.

Plus, some people may not not feel safe on a Nitelink type service.

Private hire will obviously cost much more than the massively subsidised state services.

6 million euro public liability insurance does not come cheap, I know because thats the cover I have per vehicle.

Compare that to the publicans' vehicle insurance.
"For Hire and Reward" are the essential terms relating to the carriage of passengers; it then also must be licensed and tested by various authorities.

It may be argued that a "Free Bus Home" operated by a publican technically generates "Hire and Reward" in kind.

Stark

buzzwell wrote:

Private hire will obviously cost much more than the massively subsidised state services.

The Nitelink isn't subsidised.

Milan Cobian

Many people in rural France actually live in villages and commute to their farms.

Good point. In essence the question is why is it necessary to live at your place of work. Most people don't do it, why should farmers?

The level of entitlementitis publicans and rural patrons have is extraordinary. Society, laws, people, businesses evolve. You either change or die, like any other business. So if publicans can't be innovative in drumming up business, then tough. If patrons really need to socialise in a pub so much, then drink a coke.
If you don't like that, you can sit at home and reflect on whether it was actually a good idea to buy that one-off house after all. As has been pointed out above, the rest of us massively subsidise one-off housing in many ways. This is the price you pay.

buzzwell

Stark wrote: »

The Nitelink isn't subsidised.

Pull the other one!

Who owns the buses? Dublin Bus.
Who maintains, fuels, insures and pays the drivers? Dublin Bus.
Dublin Bus was subsidised (Given Tax Payers Money) to the tune of 80.1 million euros in 2008) but do correct me if I am wrong, but I dont think Nitelink is owned and run as a private enterprise.

markpb

buzzwell wrote: »

Pull the other one!

Who owns the buses? Dublin Bus.
Who maintains, fuels, insures and pays the drivers? Dublin Bus.
Dublin Bus was subsidised (Given Tax Payers Money) to the tune of 80.1 million euros in 2008) but do correct me if I am wrong, but I dont think Nitelink is owned and run as a private enterprise.

Consider yourself corrected. Nightlink and Airlink are run as separate services. The diesel, wages, etc are all paid from nightlink tickets. The state does not subsidize them at all. The only exception is that they use the same buses (which are, of course, are subsidized).

bog master

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

that smacks of bitterness and resentment to me...

I live in Dublin so thankfully have numerous options to get home. Why would I get a 30+ euro taxi when I can take a nitelink for a fiver.

Same way if I lived in a rural village where a publican arranged a bus, why would I pay 10-15 for a taxi when I can use the pub bus for 1-2 quid. Also builds goodwill with the pub, making it more likely for me to come back in future, benefit both parties and whoever the bus company the pub hires also benefits.

As one who lives in a rural area, please tell me where I can get a pub buss to bring me home for 1 or 2 Euros?

buzzwell

markpb wrote: »

Consider yourself corrected. Nightlink and Airlink are run as separate services. The diesel, wages, etc are all paid from nightlink tickets. The state does not subsidize them at all. The only exception is that they use the same buses (which are, of course, are subsidized).

Point taken, exception noted. Pun intended.

antoinolachtnai

markpb wrote: »

Consider yourself corrected. Nightlink and Airlink are run as separate services. The diesel, wages, etc are all paid from nightlink tickets. The state does not subsidize them at all. The only exception is that they use the same buses (which are, of course, are subsidized).

Markpb,

I don't think this is correct in the case of Nitelink. Nitelink is a subsidised service. It is covered on page 3 of Schedule A of the public service contract.

It is true that these services were originally to be run on a for-profit basis.