international event with an irish twist

johnboyire

http://www.cqbchallenge.com/?event_id=36

event in california, check out the warmongering Gay Byrne.

Firekitten

Why does this event make me cringe?

Craigsy

Firekitten wrote: »

Why does this event make me cringe?

+1

whydave

class, always wanted to be in the Guards !

Firekitten

whydave wrote: »

class, always wanted to be in the Guards !

they're screwed enough already!:D


Once again the good old usa makes the world cringe with thier plastic paddy fetish.

Leftyflip

Ugh, fail...

Lemming

I died a little more inside reading that ...

barry181091

''Two of Northern Ireland's police forces, The Garda Siochana and its Emergency Response Unit''

:eek: Am I missing something ?!

Blasphemy !

Firekitten

barry181091 wrote: »

''Two of Northern Ireland's police forces, The Garda Siochana and its Emergency Response Unit''

:eek: Am I missing something ?!

Blasphemy !

It was so bad I didn't think it needed mentioning...

Puding

its interesting to see people reactions, the topic is clearly very close to people hearts in Ireland and a lot of memory's very close to the surface, i hope people can remember there feelings about this when dealing with any scenario in airsoft based on the real world be it events based on conflicts in iraq, israel, russia, anywhere, these all has the possibility of effecting others and has to be dealt with with respect

somthing i thought i had to say just my 2 cents

Witcher

The "Gardai" have to wear multicam epic lol:pac:

OzCam

Roundhouse Productions are really letting themselves down here.

The level of detail in the back-story suggests to me that someone with a political agenda has set this event up. There's no way anyone in California just decided to have a scenario about Corribb off the top of their heads. I'll be writing to both RHP and AEX to tell them they've lost a customer.

Not impressed at all. :mad:

Firekitten

OzCam wrote: »

Roundhouse Productions are really letting themselves down here.

The level of detail in the back-story suggests to me that someone with a political agenda has set this event up. There's no way anyone in California just decided to have a scenario about Corribb off the top of their heads. I'll be writing to both RHP and AEX to tell them they've lost a customer.

Not impressed at all. :mad:

if they had an agenda, surely they'd have gotten the RUC involved not the gardai?

Masada

Plus that photo of the ERU is actually the regional support unit.



That Gay Byrne photo was most likely media coverage of one of the road safety compaigns too (since he represents the RSA)

seems a bit of a silly story really.

Witcher

OzCam wrote: »

Roundhouse Productions are really letting themselves down here.

The level of detail in the back-story suggests to me that someone with a political agenda has set this event up. There's no way anyone in California just decided to have a scenario about Corribb off the top of their heads. I'll be writing to both RHP and AEX to tell them they've lost a customer.

Not impressed at all. :mad:

Don't think Americans are bothered by the crap going on in the back arse of Mayo in fairness, and an airsoft event..in America isn't really the best place to air a political agenda.:rolleyes:

Firekitten wrote: »

if they had an agenda, surely they'd have gotten the RUC involved not the gardai?

Yeah, they would have..if the event was 8 years ago:P:pac:

Firekitten

PSNI then... old habits what?

Alzir

That is comical! But sure hey why not. We make up just as silly plots in scenarios over here based on the yanks and what not.

Wasn't operation anvil carried out to seize illegal firearms to crack down on gangland shootings...?

Firekitten

Lets make up a scenario where we invade a small country muttering incoherantly about where we left our nuke and then steal all thier oil while they aren't looking and forget to make a getaway....










oh woops, plagarism.

gungun

lol gonna look bad pretending to be the gardai with eotechs,m203s etc
"Pistols required for fighting in the homes." made me lol:D

Firekitten

gungun wrote: »

lol gonna look bad pretending to be the gardai with eotechs,m203s etc
"Pistols required for fighting in the homes." made me lol:D

1 gbb per 4 players would be accurate no?

Lemming

gungun wrote: »

lol gonna look bad pretending to be the gardai with eotechs,m203s etc
"Pistols required for fighting in the homes." made me lol:D

Firekitten wrote: »

1 gbb per 4 players would be accurate no?

When the one with the rifle is shot ....

Masada

Alzir wrote: »

Wasn't operation anvil carried out to seize illegal firearms to crack down on gangland shootings...?

Yup, its the Garda operation to clamp down on the movements of gangland figures mostly in the Finglas/Blanch area.

A bit poorly researched by those making the game but hey, it probably only looks that way coz its close to home for us.
I'm sure they'd laugh at some of the mad russian Vs American scenario's we come up with.

bravestar

Masada wrote: »

Yup, its the Garda operation to clamp down on the movements of gangland figures mostly in the Finglas/Blanch area.

A bit poorly researched by those making the game but hey, it probably only looks that way coz its close to home for us.
I'm sure they'd laugh at some of the mad russian Vs American scenario's we come up with.

Operational Anvil is nationwide, not just Finglas/Blanch/Cabra AKA the "K" District.

KonFusion

*facepalm*

Smokerkl

I reckon sod berget lets go to the good ol US of A and play this???
Whos side would you be on???

S..

Masada

bravestar wrote: »

Operational Anvil is nationwide, not just Finglas/Blanch/Cabra AKA the "K" District.

Emphasis on "Mostly", as it came about as a response to increased gangland activity, primarily in north Dublin.

Well off topic though.,

Leftyflip

Smokerkl wrote: »

I reckon sod berget lets go to the good ol US of A and play this???
Whos side would you be on???

S..

The one that gets very very annoyed and disgusted at the event orgnanisers... Of every possible thing they could have run, they chose that?
Tossers...

Smokerkl

Leftyflip wrote: »

The one that gets very very annoyed and disgusted at the event orgnanisers... Of every possible thing they could have run, they chose that?
Tossers...

Is Airsoft not about milsim and real world scenarios anymore? Wake up and smell the real world buddy its a historical war by now dammitt there is movies about it why not re enact and play it??
S..

P.S. No offence meant to anyone but come on??

Leftyflip

To be honest I don't like the idea of this event because they have facts wrong, imagine trying to run something like that over here, it would cause so much anger and controversy, I'm not trying to start a fight or a debate, I jsut gave my opinion, its hardly a "war" anyway.

Puding

yes the fact are wrong, but so are the fact in nearly all the airsoft events i've seen be it in ireland or abroad, does it make it right? no but is the truth imagine people anger and frustration at airsofters with events based on vietnam for example, i;ve read some interesting debates and articles about the on going use of 'film history' and how people are know accepting these events as real and correct history is being eroded

i would imagine they researched, unfortuntlay as is normally the case nowadays its a copy and passed job with skim reading for details that are then throw again into google for more information and pictures, the original details loss focus as they get diluted with each search, people don;t understand the context and do not truly understand the history on snippits so the over all picture is lost and out of context

Stone.cold

i wonder do people sit at their pc's in russia, iraq, usa etc and look at the games we run and think they got that all wrong the tossers, we run game's based on real world events from those countries so why cant they run one based on us

As smokerkl said there are films about the troubles etc and most of those facts are wrong so why not a re-enactment, of course people will take offence to it but then people will take offence to me wearing a u.s flag or putting a picture up of a friend in a british uniform so we get over it and move on

Leftyflip

I apologise if I came across as a bit of an idiot, I just feel strongly about the subject,

Stone.cold

Leftyflip wrote: »

I apologise if I came across as a bit of an idiot, I just feel strongly about the subject,

you didnt!! and no more than most of us would, everyone is entitled to their opinion mate

Firekitten

Leftyflip wrote: »

The one that gets very very annoyed and disgusted at the event orgnanisers... Of every possible thing they could have run, they chose that?
Tossers...

To be honest lefty, nearly any scenario can be too close to the bone... it takes something like this to bring it home to you.

Russians vs rebels, Americans vs iraqis, IDF vs whoever.... its all got someone that is upset by it, but we do it anyway, because airsoft isnt about offending people, its about the fight, and if milsim uses that, well its historical, not meant to offend. We need to separate the two.

Masada wrote: »

I'm sure they'd laugh at some of the mad russian Vs American scenario's we come up with.

Nah, there are mid level analysts in the pentagon currently scribbling down all the milsim game scenarios.... Where else could the yanks get thier battle plans?

Hivemind187

Firekitten wrote: »

Nah, there are mid level analysts in the pentagon currently scribbling down all the milsim game scenarios.... Where else could the yanks get thier battle plans?

... I am suddenly very deeply worried.

*expects the arrival of a cruise missile*

Firekitten

Hivemind187 wrote: »

... I am suddenly very deeply worried.

*expects the arrival of a Cruise missile Job offer*

Fixed

weeder

So let me get this straight, 2 of northern irelands police forces, led by gay byrne have to defend a place in the REPUBLIC OF IRELAND, and defend against the ra who are trying to blow the place up. so the eru dressed in there multicam have to stop it,now this is all good so far, but i mean is there a weapon restriction on the game, after all they cant arm the garda side with more than sticks.



so all in all, is this somthing to get offended by? hell no! is it somthing to lol and poke fun at, of course.

DICEMAN7

Firekitten wrote: »

To be honest lefty, nearly any scenario can be too close to the bone... it takes something like this to bring it home to you.

Russians vs rebels, Americans vs iraqis, IDF vs whoever.... its all got someone that is upset by it, but we do it anyway, because airsoft isnt about offending people, its about the fight, and if milsim uses that, well its historical, not meant to offend. We need to separate the two.




Nah, there are mid level analysts in the pentagon currently scribbling down all the milsim game scenarios.... Where else could the yanks get thier battle plans?

says who?

DICEMAN7

one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter quoted many a time

Lemming

DICEMAN7 wrote: »

says who?

Says who what?

That we need to seperate airsoft from real-politik? I would have thought that's a no-brainer.

Or that the US government probably has a small army of analysts scowering the airsoft and paintball world for mention of keywords like "tactic" and "maneuver" to come up with crazy battle plans. To be perfectly honest, I would not bat an eyelid if the above actually was true ...The US armed forces have many, many experimental and crazy programs on the boil alongside the more pragmatic. Can anyone here say DARPA fast enough? How about "internet"? Crazy at the time ... yet here we are. Do you know what the internet (at a fundamental level) was originally intended for? Telecomms. redundancy during nuclear strikes; i.e. the re-routing of comms since points along the route could ... well ... be around the 1 million degrees Farenheit mark at that moment in time.

tonyj_mc

as many have already said most of the mil sim scenarios involve some kind army going up against another army or terrorists of some description. Now no matter how sensitive you are there will always be some group offended by the theme of the day. But what you have to remember is that it is not real, it’s all there for some good natured fun

gandalf

LOL stupid yanks !!!! "Northern Irish Police Forces" ROFLOL that is pathetic. Oh god are all the IRA team going to have fake Northern Accents ala Sean "Ya killed ma babeeee brother" Bean in Patriot Games

Firekitten

DICEMAN7 wrote: »

says who?

Well as i'm not sure what the 'says who?' is to,

Russia and Chechnya

Russia defending thier protectorate, South Ocetia against Georgia.

Rebel is a useall term here for iregular forces. Perhaps inacorrect technically, but suitable to the generic nature of some airsoft events.

Hell look at berget this year.... its VERY close in theme to the Bosnian war.... VERY.

USA, Iraq..... lets not go there.

Israel and Palestine,

Vietnam.... Jeeezz.... can you smell the un political correctness? I'm sure namsoft isnt too popular down Saigon Airsoft sites.... Its all relative really. Anything can offend anyone, we need to take a measure of whats.... apropriate.

We play war. Invariably, someones wrong, someones right, and someone gets shot, and someone doesn't.

One mans terrorist is another's freedom fighter, but in this day, holding that view exlusive, is nieve. Terrorism for terrorism's sake exists.

Says who? Me. But its an opinion. It carries no more weight, and no less weight, than yours, or anyone elses. Its not right, or wrong. Its a view.

fletch...

Just put it down as a taste of our own medacine, we make senario's about other military/police forces that we honestly know feck all about so we cant be offended by this, to be honest i'd love to see some footage of it, Bring on the 1J batons!

Puding

Leftyflip wrote: »

I apologise if I came across as a bit of an idiot, I just feel strongly about the subject,

I don,t think you have any thing you need to apologize for, you have strong feeling and show you should that's impotant and I would say so do a lot of people that have read this.

We play a game/sport that is inherently controversial, we are as they say tarred by the sins of the past just as reenactors and living history is at times, but we are even more open to criticizem as we are seen as being childish and devaluing history at time. For any uniform you put on or impression you put together there is a lot of baggage great things could have Been done by those wearing it but so have horrible things, and it can generate strong responses from people we need to be aware of.

Have respect and knowledge of what you do it's all you can do

sorry for speech but I feel rather strongly about this

Smokerkl

fletch... wrote: »

Bring on the 1J batons!

I reckon the batons will be normal but the whistle's will be really loud like ..
S..

Hivemind187

from the perspective of someone who regularly writes games you have basically two options.

1) Try not to be sensitive to the feelings of others. This is essentially impossible since without complete family histories and complete life histories of every individual likely to even hear about your game you are going to offend someone. Even when you use fictional countries and fictional scenario's. So you try to make as innoffensive to as many people as you can until its a kind of bland mush with some vaguely tan people and some vaguely green people. Kind of like pitching Alan Titchmarsh and that bloke off Bargain Hunt into a war.

2) Ignore other peoples personal feelings and view what you are doing as an art form. If it offends people, fine, at least they are paying attention. You have more freedom to develop a rich story with complex plots and genuine moral/ethical decisions - things that captures the imagination. You dont see games developers shying away from blaming the Chinese for a nuclear War in Fallout 3, you dont see much sympathy expressed for the concerns of eastern and middle eastern jihadi types in CoD4 do you?

The only place where imitation becomes a problem is when that imitation is intended to be directly offensive to a particular group. For example, a team of players deliberately dressing as SS Einsatzgruppen during the visit of Israeli airsofters as a means of insulting them. Or a group of players dressing as Tiger Force (Vietnam era soldiers) to offend South East Asian players. But thats less about imitation and more about intimidation.

fayer

Puding wrote: »

I don,t think you have any thing you need to apologize for, you have strong feeling and show you should that's impotant and I would say so do a lot of people that have read this.

We play a game/sport that is inherently controversial, we are as they say tarred by the sins of the past just as reenactors and living history is at times, but we are even more open to criticizem as we are seen as being childish and devaluing history at time. For any uniform you put on or impression you put together there is a lot of baggage great things could have Been done by those wearing it but so have horrible things, and it can generate strong responses from people we need to be aware of.

Have respect and knowledge of what you do it's all you can do

sorry for speech but I feel rather strongly about this

Pudding is right, we are still an unknown entity to most and controversial to others in this country no matter how "established" and secured we now are.

The elements this group are drawing on for the game are real word issues in Ireland that have cost lives, it wont matter where this game is being played it will be linked to us if the media so wish to.

The IAA has had the topic of true to life skirmish scenarios brought to it by the authorities in the past and it is something we must avoid, very few sites in Ireland, if any, now use recent historical events / real world people and issues in games. (Good taste seems to prevail)

The Association will be lodging an objection about this game to the company running it and the American association.

Steve

Firekitten

In all seriousness Fayer, I would be one saying the association Shouldn't object. As Hivemind, puding, myself, and others have said. We have done the same with other nations, why should we expect them to shy away from the subject? It's a little hypocritical in my view. But I'm not a member, so it counts for squat. I just think verbal official complaints would do no real good here. Internationally.

Hivemind187

fayer wrote: »

Pudding is right, we are still an unknown entity to most and controversial to others in this country no matter how "established" and secured we now are.

The elements this group are drawing on for the game are real word issues in Ireland that have cost lives, it wont matter where this game is being played it will be linked to us if the media so wish to.

The IAA has had the topic of true to life skirmish scenarios brought to it by the authorities in the past and it is something we must avoid, very few sites in Ireland, if any, now use recent historical events / real world people and issues in games. (Good taste seems to prevail)

The Association will be lodging an objection about this game to the company running it and the American association.

Steve

... tell me you are ****ing kidding.

Hivemind187

With the greatest respect.

In regard to Stephen Fay's assertion that the IAA will lodge a complaint with the organisers of this game and the assertion that it is in bad taste.

Firstly, this game, its organisers and it location are all in the United States. They are not a part of the Irish Airsoft Association (and I would be surprised if they had even heard of us), they are simply engaging in a game with a theme much as many of us do of a weekend. The content of that game may be viewed as offensive to some people - no doubt the words "raw", "too soon" and "current events" are applicable - but I sincerely doubt that it is the intention of American airsofters to deliberately insult, antagonise or offend anyone in the Republic of Ireland.

The only evidence I have of this is the flavour text given - I dont think any more evidence is really necessary. The research is lacking in many areas - a pretty good indicator that the idea of "balaclavas and Ireland" was latched onto and a concept hastily cobbled around it.

In order to be offended by this you need to be consciously making the effort. Their is no intention here, it's not a personal slight. It is simply art imitating life - something we are all pretty familiar with.

Second, there is no remit within the IAA constitution nor was it ever intended as a body to become the moral dictator to the membership or the sport as a whole. While many people would find the contents of the game unpalatable (and indeed I would be inclined to agree with them) it is categorically not the place of the IAA to say what is tasteful or not-tasteful to the individual, let alone the community or organisations, players and companies outside of the Republic of Ireland and outside of the associations membership base.

I personally find the idea that one individual or a group of individuals (be it the government, church or the IAA) can decide for me - without consultation - what is appropriate material for me to see, read, hear or take part in repulsive to a degree I find hard to articulate.

I have already said that I find the content of that game distasteful - but that is my personal emotional reaction to it. Personal emotional reaction is not fact or evidence and will not change either the content of the game or the reality of current events. I have the choice not to take part. I have the choice not to become involved. That is my right and I will make use of them.

I do not have the right to tell someone else that they should not take part. I do not have the right to tell someone else that they should not get involved.

This, in my opinion is the thin end of the wedge. Once we decide that anything that someone may choose to find offensive is off limits then we are condemning ourselves to a diminishing set of resources. Real world locations - offensive. Real world scenarios - offensive. Real world uniforms - offensive. Real world replicas - offensive. Real world communications - offensive. Real world anything - offensive.

For example, I could write a game tomorrow intricately constructed to provide the closest approximation of a certain two-day incident in Mogadishu. Chances of anyone in Ireland being offended by it are small and the chances of anyone who is offended by it speaking up are smaller still. Yet the BHD incident is regarded with infamy and sadness by the people of Mogadishu where hundreds of people were killed in the days of fighting that occurred. No significant objection to the half dozen video games, several table-top games and literally hundreds of airsoft games that this has inspired has ever been made. Why? Because these people rank lower in our estimation than say ... our own people?

Another example, I write a SWAT game tomorrow about a fictional encounter between the ERU and some semi-fictional Limerick gang. The situation may never have happened and gang may be only loosely based on a real gang. Would this be unacceptable? Why? Because its set in Ireland? Because it reflects the reality of what is happening in the world?

Then why is ploughing around a fictional Baghdad shooting insurgents roleplaying as a US Marine in CoD4 not unacceptable? Why are World War 2 games Vietnam games re-enacting the likes of MARKET GARDEN or Khe Sahn or any of these things unacceptable? What of games re-enacting things like the Tora Bora campaign or any of the current war in the gulf not unacceptable?

And if they are, who are they unacceptable to - this I have to ask because I want to know whether they have a choice in participating or are being forced by a court order to attend.