Gardai stopping people at random

weiss

Good day.

Do plain clothes Gardai have the right to stop anyone they want and ask questions about your name and where you live, what you're doing..etc even if you haven't done anything wrong or have never been in trouble with them before?

just curious since this happened the other night when I was at the shop, when I asked what i'd done wrong and why they were asking me questions, they replied "it's just routine check"

Buffy the bitch

A lot of poeple always say it's illegal to not tell a Garda your name and address, that's false. You don't have to tell them anything and it's none of their business what you are doing.

Sleipnir

Buffy the bitch wrote: »

A lot of poeple always say it's illegal to not tell a Garda your name and address, that's false. You don't have to tell them anything and it's none of their business what you are doing.

It's not quite that simple.

An example of this would be where a Garda observes you acting suspiciously late at night, in an area where a lot of crimes are being committed. The Garda is entitled to stop you in order to detect and prevent crime. You are under no legal obligation to co-operate with the Garda and the Garda cannot use force to restrain your freedom under common law, short of arresting you.

However, if the Garda has reasonable grounds for suspecting that you committed an offence, the Garda can use a statutory power to demand your name and address. If you refuse to provide them, then the Garda can arrest you.

Most of the powers given to the Gardaí to stop and question members of the public are set out in law (known as statutory powers). There are, however, a number of instances where a Garda is entitled to stop and question you where no statutory power exists. This is known as a common law power.

An example of this would be where a Garda observes you acting suspiciously late at night, in an area where a lot of crimes are being committed. The Garda is entitled to stop you in order to detect and prevent crime. You are under no legal obligation to co-operate with the Garda and the Garda cannot use force to restrain your freedom under common law, short of arresting you.

However, if the Garda has reasonable grounds for suspecting that you committed an offence, the Garda can use a statutory power to demand your name and address. If you refuse to provide them, then the Garda can arrest you.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/justice/arrests/questioning_and_surveillance

MarkR

Buffy the bitch wrote: »

A lot of poeple always say it's illegal to not tell a Garda your name and address, that's false. You don't have to tell them anything and it's none of their business what you are doing.

If you're driving or the designated full licence holder for a provisional licence you would also be required to identify yourself to show that the vehicle and drivers are insured.

Why wouldn't you want to give your name?

Buffy the bitch

MarkR wrote: »

If you're driving or the designated full licence holder for a provisional licence you would also be required to identify yourself to show that the vehicle and drivers are insured.

Well that's obvious really isn't it.

MarkR wrote: »

Why wouldn't you want to give your name?

Better yet, why would I want to?

meditraitor

Why do people have such a problem with this, if the gardai ask your name just give it, be polite and tell him what your are up to... No big deal unless your a criminal.

You would be quick enough giving your name if you need help!

seamus

Buffy the bitch wrote: »

Better yet, why would I want to?

So you don't waste your time and the time of the Garda who's doing nothing more than trying to protect you.

If you've done nothing wrong, what's the problem with identifying yourself?

Buffy the bitch

seamus wrote: »

So you don't waste your time and the time of the Garda who's doing nothing more than trying to protect you.

If you've done nothing wrong, what's the problem with identifying yourself?

Well it's Garda who is wasting time isn't it by asking him questions.

Yeah the Garda is trying to protect him by asking questions.

Stainless_Steel

Some people consider privacy important!

I resent the gardai for asking where I work and where I'm coming from when they couldn't possibly have suspicion I'm a bold boy.

The_Conductor

Probable cause?

Buffy the bitch

smccarrick wrote: »

Probable cause?

And what would the probable cause be to support the probable cause?

Some people consider privacy important!

So do I, but it would appear most people would answer any question.

seamus

Buffy the bitch wrote: »

Well it's Garda who is wasting time isn't it by asking him questions.

Sorry, I forgot about the magic psychic powers that Gardai have which tells them who is and isn't out to cause trouble. How is the Garda supposed to determine if he's wasting his time questioning someone, if he doesn't ask them some basic questions in the first place? By your logic, questioning anyone is time wasting and Gardai should rely on luck to catch criminals.

Yeah the Garda is trying to protect him by asking questions.

Sorry, yeah, actually the Garda is out to abuse his power because he gets such a power rush asking people for their name and address. He has no interest in upholding the law at all :rolleyes:

Some people consider privacy important!

Asking you for your name is not breaching your privacy by a longshot. Refusing to give your name could easily give the Garda cause to invoke one of the drugs acts and perform a search on your person which will annoy you a good deal more than having a Garda know your name and address. Such a search is a waste of both your times.

Buffy the bitch

seamus wrote: »

Asking you for your name is not breaching your privacy by a longshot. Refusing to give your name could easily give the Garda cause to invoke one of the drugs acts and perform a search on your person which will annoy you a good deal more than having a Garda know your name and address. Such a search is a waste of both your times.

And giving your name and refusing to give other answers can give the Gardai probable cause.

I have nothing against giving my name and where I live it's jsut all the questions after.

Where you going? Where you coming from? Where do you work? Who is your boss? And let's say something did happen in an area you walked from the Garda can arrest you on suspicion of doing something.

There's an old saying never tell the Gardai anything even a solicitor would tell you that, just because you don't answer a Garda question doesn't make you a criminal.

Anyways the question OP asked is answered.

Trojan911

OP,

Here is a recent post which is similar to your Q. Read through the whole thread for an idea.

But no, is the answer. An officer can stop and chat to you, but you are not obliged to stay and answer. An officer can only detain you for the purpose of a search with reasonable grounds and if in plain clothes, ask for ID if it not produced.

Incidentally, Labour Justice Minister, Pat Rabbitte, released figures to the News of the World yesterday on state payouts in the region of €32m in the past five years because of unlawful arrests and assault allegations by the public against officers of AGS.

(This figure covers all i.e. payouts, out of court settlements and lawyers).

triple-M

meditraitor wrote: »

Why do people have such a problem with this, if the gardai ask your name just give it, be polite and tell him what your are up to...

because a plain clothes garda could be anybody pretending to be a garda

Cróga

What if you dont have or forget your name and address?

meditraitor

triple-M wrote: »

because a plain clothes garda could be anybody pretending to be a garda

A plain clothes garda cannot be just anyone......... What you mean is anyone could be/pretend a plain clothes officer which is a fair point but as one previous poster said you should request ID and then be polite and answer his questions...

Its not a big deal and privacy doesnt even come into it....

Some people have serious issues if they think this is an infringment on personal liberty.

meditraitor

Croga wrote: »

What if you dont have or forget your name and address?

Then its lucky a gardai is on the spot to help you :pac:

Cróga

meditraitor wrote: »

request ID

..and his oath of office which he/she needs to prove they work for the government.

and then be polite and answer his questions...

Its not a big deal and privacy doesnt even come into it....

Some people have serious issues if they think this is an infringment on personal liberty.

Privary does come into it because your name can be used against you. If he/she wants to "protect" you he/she doesnt need a name.

The_Conductor

I'm sorry- but it sounds as though you're implying a conspiracy theory....... Just because a Garda asks you your name and where you're coming from or going to- in no manner implies he is going to set you up to 'protect' someone else......

Also- so what if he/she is unable to receit their oath of office to you. Try getting someone who is party to the official secrets act to quote even a small portion of it to you- good luck finding someone.......

This is the legal discussion forum- not the conspiracy forum........

Cróga

smccarrick wrote: »

I'm sorry- but it sounds as though you're implying a conspiracy theory

I never mentioned conspiracy theory. I think you should look it up in a dictionary to see what it is.

....... Just because a Garda asks you your name and where you're coming from or going to- in no manner implies he is going to set you up to 'protect' someone else......

Did i say the Garda was going to set someone up? lol re-read what i said. by the way im not bothered about a Garda asking me for a name, they can ask all they like, doesnt mean they'll get it :P (talking in the context of the thread - stopped randomly on the street)

Also- so what if he/she is unable to receit their oath of office to you.

ANyone who works in the government has an oath of office. If they cannot recall it thats fine they can ring their superiors or you can give them one - then there is a binding contract.

Try getting someone who is party to the official secrets act to quote even a small portion of it to you- good luck finding someone.......

Dunno what you're saying here... please explain...

This is the legal discussion forum- not the conspiracy forum........

Im aware of that, doesnt seem to me that you are lol

Cróga

meditraitor wrote: »

Then its lucky a gardai is on the spot to help you :pac:

Actually its unlucky for the garda but i'll let you figure out why

Buffy the bitch

Croga wrote: »

..and his oath of office which he/she needs to prove they work for the government.

If someone was to do that is there something the Gardai are suppose to do?

GerardKeating

Croga wrote: »

What if you dont have or forget your name and address?

If that is the case, the Gardai should take you to the nearest hospital for your own safety, in this state you might be a danger to yourself or others, or maybe the victim of an accident or assault.

pirelli

Well if your an orphan and choose to grow up as a hippie child in squats with neo liberal lefties then you might be called "skippy" all your youth and your trade is a toy maker in arts and crafts. You might find it hard to remember your dead parents name and not have a reason to as of yet find out.To your closer friends you might say they can call you skip .

You might recall you were called david but you cant recall the surname because you were too young to recall what the nun had written in the custody book in her dusty old office.

Its hardly a crime now is it so how would you lock skip up in a mental institution just for being called skip.

Cróga

Well if the garda is just looking for a name to what you're commonly known as that's fine but if they want a first name/last name (government created) thats a problem to me because not everyone has these and also there's no reason for him/her to know this if they're acting lawfully. If they're looking for first name/last name i doubt very much they're out their to protect me (or maybe the Garda simply isnt aware) because they use this name against you - its the only way they can enforce statutes.

buffy the bitch wrote:

If someone was to do that is there something the Gardai are suppose to do?

What do u mean? they are suppose to have an oath. They're only men/women at the end of the day. Their power and authority derived from you. They're acting on your behalf and by your consent, ask them this. Ask them for their oath, if they cant recall give them one. If they dont accept they have just vacated their position. Ask them are they a peace officer acting in your best interests. If you havent harmed anyone or if there is no claim against you this should not be a problem. Dont assume they have, ask questions, silence is consent in their eyes. They like to use intimidation but watch them cowar away when you start ask questions, but do it in a peaceful way. Getting in a huff gets you no where. Act like an adult and not a child. Only a child asks permission "mommy can i have a cookie" but when you're old enough you just take the cookie. Remember, you're already free. Also this is an internet forum so dont take what i say without studying it... you need to know and understand what you're doing, if you dont just give them what they want so you can get on your way, and even if you do sometimes its practical to answer their questions; thats if you're not under duress. Gardai are great people with the best intentions if you allow them to do their job. You may have had bad dealings with the police but those same folk would jump into a river after you if you're drowning.

pirelli wrote: »

Well if your an orphan and choose to grow up as a hippie child in squats with neo liberal lefties then you might be called "skippy" all your youth and your trade is a toy maker in arts and crafts. You might find it hard to remember your dead parents name and not have a reason to as of yet find out.To your closer friends you might say they can call you skip .

You might recall you were called david but you cant recall the surname because you were too young to recall what the nun had written in the custody book in her dusty old office.

Its hardly a crime now is it so how would you lock skip up in a mental institution just for being called skip.

Travelling community ring a bell? Some of them never gave up their freedom and applied (legal definition means 'beg' - blacks law dictionary) for a birth certificate for the benefits - welfare etc. This is the reason why Gardai have problems moving them from land etc.

peace

Victor

Croga wrote: »

Well if the garda is just looking for a name to what you're commonly known as that's fine but if they want a first name/last name (government created) thats a problem to me because not everyone has these and also there's no reason for him/her to know this if they're acting lawfully. If they're looking for first name/last name i doubt very much they're out their to protect me (or maybe the Garda simply isnt aware) because they use this name against you - its the only way they can enforce statutes.

What if the Garda was merely looking for the name because the person is a witness? Or if they suspected the person had been involved in a crime "Male, mid thirties, overweight, denim jacket" might be me or it might be the guy around the corner, the garda is only trying to work things out.

Ask them for their oath, if they cant recall give them one.

"Oathing" at gardaí has a bad reputation. :pac:

If you havent harmed anyone or if there is no claim against you this should not be a problem.

Exactly, but act in a buisance manner to the Garda when they are looking for someone?

Travelling community ring a bell? Some of them never gave up their freedom and applied (legal definition means 'beg' - blacks law dictionary) for a birth certificate for the benefits - welfare etc. This is the reason why Gardai have problems moving them from land etc.

And its not the Housing Acts or "possession is nine tenths of the law"?

blackcoat

i agree with much of what meditraitor and smccarrick have said.

to the OP - yes, a garda, like anybody else is entitled to stop and ask you questions but no you dont have to answer them (but i dont know why you wouldn't) and there may be repercussions if you dont. he may feel the need to search you etc.

personally i dont see ANY problem in answering such questions..whats your name etc..its hardly a major breach of your privacy.

regarding another posters story about state payouts worth 32m for wrongful arrests and searches, i wonder how much of these are brought about by people just being thick with the guards for no reason and refusing to answer questions/ making a simple situation a difficult one just for the sake of it.
they could be checking up on any number of situations and unless you have something to hide/ just want to start b**ching about something youd have no reason not to answer such simple questions.

if it was something of an extremely personal nature then fine but your name and a few other little details?? this is just another example of a post which brings out all the people with a chip on their shoulder about the guards just looking for an opportunity to give out about them. i dont know where some of you must live that ye have such cause to so ant-garda. any dealings ive ever had (breath checks, enquiries at the station etc etc) i have always found them to be very professional. something tells people with such a grudge have been caught for doing something illegal...
god some of you have little to worry about!

Mr Jinx

Croga wrote: »

Well if the garda is just looking for a name to what you're commonly known as that's fine but if they want a first name/last name (government created) thats a problem to me because not everyone has these and also there's no reason for him/her to know this if they're acting lawfully. If they're looking for first name/last name i doubt very much they're out their to protect me (or maybe the Garda simply isnt aware) because they use this name against you - its the only way they can enforce statutes.

Hear hear
I denounced my Government created name years ago. Im simply known as "Free bird dancing owl" now. Im off to burn bra's and the flag now:)